Islamic God Allah - must we believe it is the same as the God of Christianity?

[Lady Bug]

Hi, I am wondering if it is required belief of the EOC that we believe that Islam worships the same God as Christianity. I don't want drama to ensue on this, that is not my intent

I am really sorry if the question seems outrageous or idiotic but it didn't come out of nowhere

(I usually don't like to make another thread when I'm in the middle of another one but this issue is bothering me)

 

[eastcoast_bsc]

I think from a cursory analysis, that the Catholics don't necessarily state that Islam and Christianity worship the same God. I found this summary of Nostra Aetate:

Summary of the final text of Nostra Aetate

• The Declaration begins by describing the unity of the origin of all people, and the fact that they all return to God; hence their final goal is also one. It describes the eternal questions which have dogged men since the beginning, and how the various religious traditions have tried to answer them.

• It mentions some of the answers that Hindus, Buddhists, and members of other faiths have suggested for such philosophical questions. It notes the willingness of the Catholic Church to accept other religions in so much as they lead souls to the Christ.

• Part three goes on to say that the Catholic Church regards the Muslims with esteem, and then continues by describing some of the things Islam has in common with Christianity and Catholicism: worship of One God, the Creator of Heaven and Earth, Merciful and Omnipotent, Who has spoken to men; the Muslims' respect for Abraham and Mary, and the great respect they have for Jesus, whom they consider to be a Prophet and not God. The synod urged all Catholics and Muslims to forget the hostilities and differences of the past and to work together for mutual understanding and benefit.

• Part four speaks of the bond that ties the people of the 'New Covenant' (Christians) to Abraham's stock (Jews). It states that even though some Jewish authorities and those who followed them called for Jesus' death, the blame for this cannot be laid at the door of all those Jews present at that time, nor can the Jews in our time be held as guilty, thus repudiating an indiscriminate charge of deicide; 'the Jews should not be presented as rejected or accursed by God'. The Declaration also decries all displays of antisemitism made at any time by anyone.

I have not read Nostre Aetate in its entirety but I will. I look forward to hearing others thoughts.

 

[eastcoast_bsc]

I don't agree with this, I feel it contradicts scripture.

3. The Church regards with esteem also the Moslems. They adore the one God, living and subsisting in Himself; merciful and all- powerful, the Creator of heaven and earth,(5) who has spoken to men; they take pains to submit wholeheartedly to even His inscrutable decrees, just as Abraham, with whom the faith of Islam takes pleasure in linking itself, submitted to God. Though they do not acknowledge Jesus as God, they revere Him as a prophet. They also honor Mary, His virgin Mother; at times they even call on her with devotion. In addition, they await the day of judgment when God will render their deserts to all those who have been raised up from the dead. Finally, they value the moral life and worship God especially through prayer, almsgiving and fasting.

 

[someguy14]

Believe in God Himself. If any disagree with Love, they're religion is false. God bless!

 

[eastcoast_bsc]

This is from the CCC : It seems to further define what Nostra Aetate says.

843 The Catholic Church recognizes in other religions that search, among shadows and images, for the God who is unknown yet near since he gives life and breath and all things and wants all men to be saved. Thus, the Church considers all goodness and truth found in these religions as "a preparation for the Gospel and given by him who enlightens all men that they may at length have life."

 

[Lady Bug]

the problem is that it also says somewhere "together with US" they worship the one God...that IS implying the same God because that implies that we are worshipping what they worship and vice versa.

 

[someguy14]

God is Love!

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."

Seems pretty conclusive to me, straight from the catechism.

I don't think Orthodoxy even comes close to this thinking....

 

[mmksparbud]

Hi, I am wondering if it is required belief of the EOC that we believe that Islam worships the same God as Christianity. I don't want drama to ensue on this, that is not my intent

I am really sorry if the question seems outrageous or idiotic but it didn't come out of nowhere

(I usually don't like to make another thread when I'm in the middle of another one but this issue is bothering me)[/quote


Not idiotic question at all--I have a question, though. What is the Islamic view towards other faiths?? I am not Orthodox, but I was also asked this question some time ago. And a former follower of Islam said this: According to the Qoran, all who do not convert to their faith, are to be killed.----Is this true??? If it is, we can be as tolerant as we can be but if they feel that we have to be wiped out for not converting, how is it the same God?" Christ said if they don't listen to brush the dust off and go on to the next, not kill them!! Not looking for drama either--but I would like an honest answer as to what the Qoran says. I guess I could google this and see if I can read it for myself.

 

[Knee V]

They do not worship the One God. They worship a god of their own making. He is nothing like the God who is revealed in Christ. Just because they believe that their god created the earth and spoke through prophets such as Abraham does not mean that we all worship the same God.

 

[Joseph Hazen]

The Muslim God is not the Christian God. I don't believe I've ever met an Orthodox Christian who believes we worship the same God (though I'm positive there are some out there somewhere).

 

[Adam Warlock]

Rome's Catechism is wrong about this. 100% of the Orthodox whom I know would echo that statement.

 

[Lady Bug]

I do come from a Muslim background on my dad's side and I have a feeling that this wouldn't sit well with Orthodox Christians. (in real life)...I don't think it's very warm and fuzzy between the two parties.

 

[Joseph Hazen]

I do come from a Muslim background on my dad's side and I have a feeling that this wouldn't sit well with Orthodox Christians. (in real life)...I don't think it's very warm and fuzzy between the two parties.

What you are before one is Orthodox is not a consideration. Some of our greatest saints have been prostitutes, fornicators, thieves, and Communists. We've had converts from Judaism, Paganism, and yes, Islam. While one cannot become Orthodox and still claim allegiance to their old gods, the fact that they had them before is not a concern.

 

[Lady Bug]

ok. thanks for telling me.

 

[someguy14]

I do come from a Muslim background on my dad's side and I have a feeling that this wouldn't sit well with Orthodox Christians. (in real life)...I don't think it's very warm and fuzzy between the two parties.

God is all, friend.
Without God, none exist's.
God is above all and none exist without God.
God is the good that all desire and agree with.
Each and every one cannot go wrong with choosing God.

 

[gzt]

It depends on what you mean by "worshiping the same God". Under some definitions, I would say yes, others, no. But, historically, Islam is treated by some as a Christian heresy and "Allah" is just the Arabic word for "God".

The real questions are why is this important and what would it mean if the answer is "yes"?

 

[Living in the Light]

Are labels really important? "I am that I am" is how Yahweh referred to Himself to Moses. God is omnipresent and can be accessed by anyone who sincerely seeks Him through prayer and meditation. When I pray, I DON't begin with: Dear Christian God, etc, etc. God is also omniscient and knows our hearts.

 

[Christ's_Warrior]

Do not be fooled by the fruits of universalism, Muslims do not believe nor do they worship the same God that we worship. Jesus Christ is fully God and fully man and this major tenet of Christian theology is rejected by islam, simply praying to a 'god' and assuming that their prayers are directed to our God is universalism.

My people are being raped, tortured and murdered in iraq by those purporting to represent the religion of peace, how someone can claim that they worship the same God baffles me.

 

[Macarius]

It really depends on the definition. The name "Allah" is simply Arabic for God, so the Antiochean Orthodox Christians pray to Allah in their liturgy when they worship in Arabic.

However, the God of the Muslims and the God of the Christians cannot be the same God for one simple reason: the Cross.

It comes down to this: how do we know God? Where is God revealed? Where do we look when we need to know or understand something about God through HIS self-revelation? For Christians, this is the Cross. The Cross is the starting point, ground, and finishing ground of the faith (and by Cross here I mean to imply the whole Passion including His glorious Resurrection). The Cross is where God, through dying, reveals the full extent of His divinity AND humanity. Paul promised to know nothing EXCEPT Christ and Him Crucified. It is, in Irenaeus' terms, the "hypothesis" (first principle) of all real knowledge. Any OTHER first principle is unChristian (e.g. if my first principle is "viability under historical reconstruction" as for those who claim to pursue "the historical Jesus").

Our God is a God who not only would become Incarnate and Crucified, but is a God whom we can ONLY come to know THROUGH the Cross - that's the point of revelation that all other revelation must needs refer to.

For Islam, this is not so. Their God is NOT Incarnate, NOT Crucified. His ultimate revelation, like for the Jews, is through a text - through a medium rather than, as for the Christians, through the direct Word of God proceeding from the Profound Silence of the Cross. For Islam, the Koran is direct dictation (which distinguishes it from the Tanakh of the Jews) - God's literal words - but it is not an Incarnation of God; God remains apart.

This ultimately gets to HOW God answers evil: through transfiguration (Christianity) or through exhortation (Islam).

Those are two completely different answers, and two utterly different Gods.

The God of the Cross, who seeing the evil of the world entered into it to recapitulate the world to Himself; or the God of the Koran, who seeing the evil of the world, told it to stop being so evil.

Granted I am exceedingly biased.