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Featured Is water Baptism essential for salvation?

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by -57, Jun 19, 2017.

  1. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

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    OK - where does this text that you quoted say the fault was?

    NOT with "it" (the covenant) but with "them." (the people who did not keep it)
     
  2. StevenBelievin

    StevenBelievin Trust In God Supporter

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    Ok, that's a deflection. It doesn't matter who's at fault. The text says the covenant was not without fault, meaning it was faulty. Yes it's because they couldn't keep the law, but the text still says the covenant wasn't without fault.


    Do you believe that Jewish people can be saved through the first (Mosaic) covenant without accepting Christ?
     
  3. Galilee63

    Galilee63 Newbie

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    The Mission of John the Baptist
    (Isaiah 40:1-5; Mark 1:1-8; Luke 3:1-20; John 1:19-28)

    1In those days John the Baptist came, preaching in the wilderness of Judea 2and saying, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is near.” 3This is he who was spoken of through the prophet Isaiah:

    “A voice of one calling in the wilderness,

    ‘Prepare the way for the Lord,

    make straight paths for Him.’”a

    4John wore a garment of camel’s hair, with a leather belt around his waist. His food was locusts and wild honey. 5People went out to him from Jerusalem and all Judea and the whole region around the Jordan. 6Confessing their sins, they were baptized by him in the Jordan River.

    7But when John saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his place of baptism, he said to them, “You brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? 8Produce fruit worthy of repentance. 9And do not presume to say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ For I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham. 10The ax lies ready at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire.

    11I baptize you withb water for repentance, but after me will come One more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire. 12His winnowing fork is in His hand to clear His threshing floor and to gather His wheat into the barn; but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.”

    The Baptism of Jesus
    (Mark 1:9-11; Luke 3:21-22; John 1:29-34)

    13At that time Jesus came from Galilee to the Jordan to be baptized by John. 14But John tried to prevent Him, saying, “I need to be baptized by You, and do You come to me?”

    15“Let it be so now,” Jesus replied. “It is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness in this way.” Then John permitted Him.

    16As soon as Jesus was baptized, He went up out of the water. Suddenly the heavens were opened,c and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and resting on Him. 17And a voice from heaven said, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased!”
     
  4. Galilee63

    Galilee63 Newbie

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    Gods Holy Covenant and Holy Word is not faulty nor wrong, Gods Holy Scriptures of His are never wrong nor faulty in The Holy Spirit of Truth. God our Holy Divine Majesty's Holy Truth both in His Old Testament and New Testament and Old and New Covenant are correct in Him and by Him.
     
  5. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    In other words, you believe the Bible.

    See how easy that was?
     
  6. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

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    At this point in time? No.
    Before the cross? Yes.

    But please tell me how this is on-topic with baptism.
     
  7. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    Can we think of any who were?
     
  8. Galilee63

    Galilee63 Newbie

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    Yes completely thankyou Albion.
     
  9. Archivist

    Archivist Senior Veteran Supporter

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    But the earlier statement was that the Bible is the source of the Truth. That is wrong. The Bible only tells us of the Truth. It is Jesus who is the source of the Truth. John 14:6: Jesus replied, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life." Jesus is the Word. Jesus is not the Bible. Jesus was before the Bible. Jesus will be after the Bible.

    In other words, you have the Truth, and anyone who disagrees with you does not have the Truth.

    Of course you are entitled to your interpretation of scripture. But this is just interpretation. Most Christians practice infant baptism and would disagree with you.

    Logical fallacy as you cannot empty a can without opening it.

    If I were to say that if you don't drive or fly then to get to Chicago you have to take a train and a bus, that does not in any way imply which you would take first. "He that believes and is baptized" likewise dose not imply that one must believe before being baptized.

    Of course you are entitled to your interpretation of scripture. But this is just interpretation. Most Christians practice infant baptism and would disagree with you.

    Of course you are entitled to your interpretation of scripture. But this is just interpretation. Most Christians practice infant baptism and would disagree with you.

    Of course you are entitled to your interpretation of scripture. But this is just interpretation. Most Christians practice infant baptism and would disagree with you.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2017
  10. Archivist

    Archivist Senior Veteran Supporter

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    Just a few posts ago you said that babies were sinless. Now you are saying that no one is sinless.

    Which is it?
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2017
  11. -57

    -57 Well-Known Member

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    Doesn't the Bible say the kingdom is in our mist?
     
  12. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    Why would you say so, considering that sprinkling and cloth soaking aren't common either?
     
  13. -57

    -57 Well-Known Member

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    I hope for your/our sake God allows a third, fourth, fifth...etc avenue.
    One can instantly see your "feel good" or "feel right" gospel has many holes.

    You still didn't answer the question....what gave you the ability to believe? Your superior intelligence? Your location of birth? You had a great youth leader? What?
     
  14. -57

    -57 Well-Known Member

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    Wrong. How else would one get it?
     
  15. PropheticTimes

    PropheticTimes Lord Have Mercy Supporter

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    TheSeabass said:
    The idea that man can only have faith if God gives it to him is to be rejected

    "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him."
    John 6:44
     
  16. -57

    -57 Well-Known Member

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    I said EVERY INSTANCE OF SALVATION. Did you forget?

    I did notice you seem to try to earn, merit, your salvation. BTW, are you a JW?
     
  17. PropheticTimes

    PropheticTimes Lord Have Mercy Supporter

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    1 Corinthians 12:3 3Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, "Jesus be cursed," and no one can say, "Jesus is LORD," except by the Holy Spirit.

    I have not been baptized with water.
    I confess Jesus is Lord and Savior, the only begotten Son of God.
    My confession shows that the Holy Spirit indwells me, according to 1 Corinthians 12:3.
    The Holy Spirit indwells me, therefore I am a child of the Living God.
    Water baptism IS NOT a requirement for salvation.

    "I see more Pharisees among Christians than there were around Pilate." - Margaret of Cortona
     
  18. Dave-W

    Dave-W Welcoming grandchild #7, Arturus Waggoner! Supporter

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    Mist it by THAT much!
     
  19. Albion

    Albion Facilitator

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    But here's the issue that is often missed in these kinds of debates--

    Baptism is not absolutely essential to salvation. Any of the major denominations that practice and value baptism will admit to that. There are exceptions caused by unusual and unavoidable circumstances.

    But neither does this mean that any believer does right to purposely, intentionally, avoid Baptism.
     
  20. -57

    -57 Well-Known Member

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    I would add, is not even a little bit essential to salvation.
     
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