IS THIS GROUP ARMINIANISTIC?

[Si_monfaith]

What is Arminianism?

 

[Mark Quayle]

What is Arminianism?

Google monergism vs synergism.

The dead can not grasp ahold of the offer of salvation, and I say, because they will not. They are spiritually dead. Only God can regenerate them.

The Reformed acrostic, TULIP, is an answer to the Arminian five points; Arminiansm claims that man is so corrupt in nature, that God must help him accept the Gospel. Reformed theology says that man is so corrupt in nature that he is unable to to choose the Gospel (though it does not deny that man can fool himself, complying with the tenets as he understands them). See "Human Free Will" compared to Calvinism's "Total Depravity", below. Notice the graphic highlighted in this link:
synergism vs monergism - Google Search:

Arminianism's five points, simplified:

• Human Free Will--This states that though man is fallen, he is not incapacitated by the sinful nature and can freely choose God. His will is not restricted and enslaved by his sinful nature.
• Conditional Election--God chose people for salvation based on His foreknowledge where God looks into the future to see who would respond to the gospel message.
• Universal Atonement--The position that Jesus bore the sin of everyone who ever lived.
• Resistable Grace--The teaching that the grace of God can be resisted and finally beaten so as to reject salvation in Christ.
• Fall from Grace--The Teaching that a person can fall from grace and lose his salvation.

Here's another representation, compared to Calvinism's TULIP

Calvinism and Arminianism comparison

 

[GaveMeJoy]

What is Arminianism?

It’s what happens when a bunch of Christians get together and start an argument with a bunch of other Christians about free will and predestination, which can never be solved, has no practical reflection on the Christian life, and causes disunity.

God resists the proud but gives grace to the humble

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

All I know is that I was able to understand the gospel of Christ, and I was given the faith to receive Christ as my Saviour. On the basis of that, I know that I was predestined before the foundation of the world that I would be able to believe and receive the gospel and have the faith to embrace Christ as my Saviour, and that I am predestined to conform to His image as I grow in grace and in the knowledge of Him. That means that I am part of the elect for salvation in Christ. I just rejoice that God chose me to receive His great and wonderful salvation.

So, I am beyond quibbling about predestination and election, because I am secure in my election and therefore it is a non-issue to me now.

 

[GodsGrace101]

It’s what happens when a bunch of Christians get together and start an argument with a bunch of other Christians about free will and predestination, which can never be solved, has no practical reflection on the Christian life, and causes disunity.

God resists the proud but gives grace to the humble

The member in post no. 4 states that it is no longer important for him to understand the difference.

This is well for that one poster.

But the problem with predestination is that:

1. It changes the nature of God and so He cannot be properly understood by new Christians or persons in general.

2. It takes away the incentive to search for God since it is believed that it's useless since God will choose whom He will.

3. What is the point of missionary work? The reformed have an answer for this, but it makes no sense coupled with the fact that they believe God IS sovereign over all...so why missionaries??

4. It makes the sacrifice of Jesus of null effect since there was no reason for Him to die since we cannot freely choose to be saved and believe in Him.


So, it's not so much what I believe or feel, but God should be represented properly by our Christian faith.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

The member in post no. 4 states that it is no longer important for him to understand the difference.

This is well for that one poster.

But the problem with predestination is that:

1. It changes the nature of God and so He cannot be properly understood by new Christians or persons in general.

2. It takes away the incentive to search for God since it is believed that it's useless since God will choose whom He will.

3. What is the point of missionary work? The reformed have an answer for this, but it makes no sense coupled with the fact that they believe God IS sovereign over all...so why missionaries??

4. It makes the sacrifice of Jesus of null effect since there was no reason for Him to die since we cannot freely choose to be saved and believe in Him.


So, it's not so much what I believe or feel, but God should be represented properly by our Christian faith.

The reality is that when a person understands the gospel though hearing it preached (and that is where evangelism comes in - "How can they hear without a preacher?"), and is able to exercise faith to receive Christ as Saviour, then he or she knows that they have been predestined and elected to salvation.

Most of the confusion comes with human wisdom questioning, and not concentrating on what Jesus told us to do - Go into the world and preach the gospel to every person - not engage in useless and confusing debates about who is predestined or not.

The bottom line is to preach the gospel and accept that those who believe it and respond by receiving Christ as Saviour are actually predestined for salvation and therefore part of the elect. Trying to anticipate who is predestined before we share the gospel with them is putting the cart before the horse. Let's preach the gospel and get souls saved, and then worry about predestination afterward.

If a person is not predestined, then they won't believe the gospel and will reject it. It is not up to us to question why some will believe and others will not. God hasn't given us that information, and it is being arrogant toward God to require Him to give us any explanation or justification.

We are not in any place to tell God what He should or should not do, so let's just get on with sharing the gospel in the role that the Holy Spirit has given us, and if people believe it, then we rejoice. If people won't believe it, then we mourn for them; but we don't insult God by criticising Him for allowing one person to believe the gospel and be saved and another to reject it and be lost.

 

[GodsGrace101]

The reality is that when a person understands the gospel though hearing it preached (and that is where evangelism comes in - "How can they hear without a preacher?"), and is able to exercise faith to receive Christ as Saviour, then he or she knows that they have been predestined and elected to salvation.

Most of the confusion comes with human wisdom questioning, and not concentrating on what Jesus told us to do - Go into the world and preach the gospel to every person - not engage in useless and confusing debates about who is predestined or not.

The bottom line is to preach the gospel and accept that those who believe it and respond by receiving Christ as Saviour are actually predestined for salvation and therefore part of the elect. Trying to anticipate who is predestined before we share the gospel with them is putting the cart before the horse. Let's preach the gospel and get souls saved, and then worry about predestination afterward.

If a person is not predestined, then they won't believe the gospel and will reject it. It is not up to us to question why some will believe and others will not. God hasn't given us that information, and it is being arrogant toward God to require Him to give us any explanation or justification.

We are not in any place to tell God what He should or should not do, so let's just get on with sharing the gospel in the role that the Holy Spirit has given us, and if people believe it, then we rejoice. If people won't believe it, then we mourn for them; but we don't insult God by criticising Him for allowing one person to believe the gospel and be saved and another to reject it and be lost.

I'm not the one insulting God by criticizing Him for allowing one person to believe the gospel and be saved and another to reject it and be lost (and for no apparent reason)...

It's the reformed faith that does the above.

I don't insult God because I believe in free will,,,the person is able to accept the gospel or reject it.

God has given us enough information to know that IF we want to be saved,,,we CAN BE.
1 Corinthians 15:1-2
1Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand,
2by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.

IF we hold fast the word we are saved....
It does not say that we are to do nothing...
Being saved means accepting the gospel and IF we hold on to it.....

The conditional word IF means we have a choice to be saved or not be saved.
If we have a choice, it means we have free will.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

I'm not the one insulting God by criticizing Him for allowing one person to believe the gospel and be saved and another to reject it and be lost (and for no apparent reason)...

It's the reformed faith that does the above.

I don't insult God because I believe in free will,,,the person is able to accept the gospel or reject it.

God has given us enough information to know that IF we want to be saved,,,we CAN BE.
1 Corinthians 15:1-2
1Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand,
2by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.

IF we hold fast the word we are saved....
It does not say that we are to do nothing...
Being saved means accepting the gospel and IF we hold on to it.....

The conditional word IF means we have a choice to be saved or not be saved.
If we have a choice, it means we have free will.

Who said you were?
Not all Reformed believers are tarred with the brush you are tarring them with. The English Puritans were very strong in preaching the gospel to the unsaved and right up front in their pleading for the unsaved to embrace Christ.

The point I am making is that we are required to share the gospel with all who cross our path, and let God worry about who is predestined or not. It is not up to us to determine who is elected. Our responsibility before God is to tell people about Christ and what He did on the cross, and that He rose from the dead to give whosoever may come to Him eternal life.

Also the English Puritans were very strict concerning living a life of holiness before God. In fact, they believed that true conversion to Christ is a total transformation of the heart and life that only the Holy Spirit could do, and therefore it must be sought of God with all one's heart. I don't see that as sitting on one's spiritual acre doing nothing!

English Puritanism is the basis of my theology and contains the most sound doctrine concerning the gospel. If one gets saved the Puritan way, they are well and truly saved, because they follow Christ's instruction to "strive to enter the narrow gate", and that one must seek God with all their heart, soul and strength to be able to find Him.

This is a far cry from someone sauntering up to the front in a meeting, praying a sinner's prayer and saying, "I am a Christian now."

 

[renniks]

What is Arminianism?

http://evangelicalarminians.org

 

[GaveMeJoy]

The member in post no. 4 states that it is no longer important for him to understand the difference.

This is well for that one poster.

But the problem with predestination is that:

1. It changes the nature of God and so He cannot be properly understood by new Christians or persons in general.

2. It takes away the incentive to search for God since it is believed that it's useless since God will choose whom He will.

3. What is the point of missionary work? The reformed have an answer for this, but it makes no sense coupled with the fact that they believe God IS sovereign over all...so why missionaries??

4. It makes the sacrifice of Jesus of null effect since there was no reason for Him to die since we cannot freely choose to be saved and believe in Him.


So, it's not so much what I believe or feel, but God should be represented properly by our Christian faith.

1) there are many scriptures on the nature of God and predestination that reformed people can give that are equally (or honestly better defense) than Arminians have. However both positions can be effectively and rationally defended by scripture.

2) the Reformed or Calvinist would say there is no human will based incentive to search for God ever, the elect are incentivized Directly by God and that’s why the come to Christ.

3) God uses missionaries to accomplish his sovereign plan and will. He calls those missionaries to share the gospel and minister to others and they do so in obedience to him.

4) this is a characterization of the reformed position And it doesn’t make any sense. a rephrasing would be “Jesus died for nothing because people can’t choose. What does human will have to do with Christ’s death on the cross.


But none of this discussion is valuable or relevant. A scripture believing Christian on either side is called to obedience and the same fruit of the spirit, actions, and responsibilities. Both sides believe in the gospel, prayer, evangelism, missions, the scripture, it’s all the same.


This is not directed at you specifically, but many Christians argue about this stuff because it makes them feel informed and superior. I’ve spoken with so many Christians who have pride dripping off them when arguing about this, I certainly was during and after bible college...now that I am more in touch with my own depravity my perspective has shifted, but I realize some people think this discussion has value, I just don’t see it.

 

[Si_monfaith]

It’s what happens when a bunch of Christians get together and start an argument with a bunch of other Christians about free will and predestination, which can never be solved, has no practical reflection on the Christian life, and causes disunity.

God resists the proud but gives grace to the humble

So you can't answer?

 

[Si_monfaith]

Can arminians answer a question of mine?

 

[GaveMeJoy]

So you can't answer?

LOL google is your friend

 

[jiminpa]

They're both wrong, and Col 2:8 applies to them.