Is this an official Roman Catholic Position?"

[AndOne]

Is it really that you don't agree with what he said (which really isn't very contraversial if you strip away the extra connotations one might assume it has) or is it really that he has not said what you would like him to have said? Or is it that any hint that God might actually use something we do in his plan for salvation is taken as a challenge to the idea that salvation comes from him alone, when those two ideas are not actually incompatible at all?

If we draw false dichotomies and make people choose between things that should - indeed must- be both/ands not either/ors then we are creating disagreements where they should be mutual learning.

See post 79...

 

[ebia]

I agree with the text from Isaiah 55 that was put up in response to Staples statement. It is scripture - what Staples says isn't.

Sorry, but I can't find the quote in question. What in Isaiah 55 do you think is incontradiction with his quote and why?

His point being that striving to be like Christ and observing moral law in an effort to gain salvation or merit favor with God - is a waste of time. We do these things as a result of salvation - not a means to it. Hence the difference between us.

It seems that part of your problem might be in seeing salvation as entirely a past event, loosing the scriptural tension of both now and not-yet.

 

[AndOne]

Sorry - I meant Isaiah 52. Here is the text -

Isa 52:13–53:11

““Look, my servant will succeed! He will be elevated, lifted high, and greatly exalted– (14) (just as many were horrified by the sight of you) he was so disfigured he no longer looked like a man; (15) his form was so marred he no longer looked human– so now he will startle many nations. Kings will be shocked by his exaltation, for they will witness something unannounced to them, and they will understand something they had not heard about. (1) Who would have believed what we just heard? When was the LORD’s power revealed through him? (2) He sprouted up like a twig before God, like a root out of parched soil; he had no stately form or majesty that might catch our attention, no special appearance that we should want to follow him. (3) He was despised and rejected by people, one who experienced pain and was acquainted with illness; people hid their faces from him; he was despised, and we considered him insignificant. (4) But he lifted up our illnesses, he carried our pain; even though we thought he was being punished, attacked by God, and afflicted for something he had done. (5) He was wounded because of our rebellious deeds, crushed because of our sins; he endured punishment that made us well; because of his wounds we have been healed. (6) All of us had wandered off like sheep; each of us had strayed off on his own path, but the LORD caused the sin of all of us to attack him. (7) He was treated harshly and afflicted, but he did not even open his mouth. Like a lamb led to the slaughtering block, like a sheep silent before her shearers, he did not even open his mouth. (8) He was led away after an unjust trial– but who even cared? Indeed, he was cut off from the land of the living; because of the rebellion of his own people he was wounded. (9) They intended to bury him with criminals, but he ended up in a rich man’s tomb, because he had committed no violent deeds, nor had he spoken deceitfully. (10) Though the LORD desired to crush him and make him ill, once restitution is made, he will see descendants and enjoy long life, and the LORD’s purpose will be accomplished through him. (11) Having suffered, he will reflect on his work, he will be satisfied when he understands what he has done. “My servant will acquit many, for he carried their sins.” —New English Translation​

 

[ebia]

Sorry - I meant Isaiah 52. Here is the text -

Isa 52:13–53:11

““Look, my servant will succeed! He will be elevated, lifted high, and greatly exalted– (14) (just as many were horrified by the sight of you) he was so disfigured he no longer looked like a man; (15) his form was so marred he no longer looked human– so now he will startle many nations. Kings will be shocked by his exaltation, for they will witness something unannounced to them, and they will understand something they had not heard about. (1) Who would have believed what we just heard? When was the LORD’s power revealed through him? (2) He sprouted up like a twig before God, like a root out of parched soil; he had no stately form or majesty that might catch our attention, no special appearance that we should want to follow him. (3) He was despised and rejected by people, one who experienced pain and was acquainted with illness; people hid their faces from him; he was despised, and we considered him insignificant. (4) But he lifted up our illnesses, he carried our pain; even though we thought he was being punished, attacked by God, and afflicted for something he had done. (5) He was wounded because of our rebellious deeds, crushed because of our sins; he endured punishment that made us well; because of his wounds we have been healed. (6) All of us had wandered off like sheep; each of us had strayed off on his own path, but the LORD caused the sin of all of us to attack him. (7) He was treated harshly and afflicted, but he did not even open his mouth. Like a lamb led to the slaughtering block, like a sheep silent before her shearers, he did not even open his mouth. (8) He was led away after an unjust trial– but who even cared? Indeed, he was cut off from the land of the living; because of the rebellion of his own people he was wounded. (9) They intended to bury him with criminals, but he ended up in a rich man’s tomb, because he had committed no violent deeds, nor had he spoken deceitfully. (10) Though the LORD desired to crush him and make him ill, once restitution is made, he will see descendants and enjoy long life, and the LORD’s purpose will be accomplished through him. (11) Having suffered, he will reflect on his work, he will be satisfied when he understands what he has done. “My servant will acquit many, for he carried their sins.” —New English Translation
​

And why do you think what he said contradicts that?

 

[plmarquette]

As Rush Limbauh would say, for those in Rio Linda Ca.

we are still on the hook for our life, our sins, our detours from the faith....

Jesus bought our ticket....punched the clock on the way in....we have been given potential, what we do with it, is up to us, and will be evaluated in the last days, like the parable of the talents...

it ain't all downhill....carte blanch....thing....

 

[bbbbbbb]

As Rush Limbauh would say, for those in Rio Linda Ca.

we are still on the hook for our life, our sins, our detours from the faith....

Jesus bought our ticket....punched the clock on the way in....we have been given potential, what we do with it, is up to us, and will be evaluated in the last days, like the parable of the talents...

it ain't all downhill....carte blanch....thing....

So how many of your sins did Jesus die for and how many do you need to die for?

 

[Gregory Thompson]

So how many of your sins did Jesus die for and how many do you need to die for?

Jesus died for our sin .

the root of our multitude of sins

so in the same way love fulfills the many laws

and covers over a multitude of sins

so does addressing the root heal the whole tree .

 

[PilgrimToChrist]

So how many of your sins did Jesus die for and how many do you need to die for?

In regards to both -- all of them.

 

[SpiritualAntiseptic]

Is this an official Roman Catholic Position?"

Nope, that seems to be his position. That's why it is a good idea to quote stuff from official sources rather than folks on the interwebs.

 

[Korah]

Nope, that seems to be his position. That's why it is a good idea to quote stuff from official sources rather than folks on the interwebs.

I'm still wondering how you get away with not having to identify yourself with a faith icon that identifies you as a Roman Catholic.

 

[PilgrimToChrist]

I'm still wondering how you get away with not having to identify yourself with a faith icon that identifies you as a Roman Catholic.

I didn't know that faith icons were required. Many people use the generic "Christian" or "Non-Denominational" icon anyway.

 

[laconicstudent]

I didn't know that faith icons were required. Many people use the generic "Christian" or "Non-Denominational" icon anyway.

Um, they aren't. As like me, a lot of people probably aren't sure when it is appropriate to switch faith icons anyways, and so we get to use the generic one. You are not at all required to use a specific one. It is purely an optional thing.

 

[SpiritualAntiseptic]

I'm still wondering how you get away with not having to identify yourself with a faith icon that identifies you as a Roman Catholic.

Why would I?

 

[Gregory Thompson]

If someone chooses to be labelless .. let them .

bless .

 

[bbbbbbb]

In regards to both -- all of them.

So, your answer is that Jesus died for all of your sins, but you need to die for all of your sins? When is your execution scheduled?

 

[PilgrimToChrist]

So, your answer is that Jesus died for all of your sins, but you need to die for all of your sins? When is your execution scheduled?

daily.

 

[bbbbbbb]

daily.

How many deaths are there for an individual (hint, the answer is found in Revelation 20:14)?

 

[Secundulus]

How many deaths are there for an individual (hint, the answer is found in Revelation 20:14)?

Metaphorically you die everytime you refuse the sin that the flesh demands.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

1 Corinthians 15:31
I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.

Bless .