Is there consciousness after death? Is the doctrine of 'soul sleep' true?

TruthSeek3r

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What are the best arguments for consciousness persisting after death?

What are the best arguments against consciousness persisting after death (i.e. for the doctrine of Christian Mortalism or 'Soul sleep')?

Which side has the upper hand? Which side has the best arguments?

Are there any debates, either in written form or in video, that are a must read/watch if one wants to dive deep into this controversial topic?
 
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disciple Clint

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What are the best arguments for consciousness persisting after death?

What are the best arguments against consciousness persisting after death (i.e. for the doctrine of Christian Mortalism or 'Soul sleep')?

Which side has the upper hand? Which side has the best arguments?

Are there any debates, either in written form or in video, that are a must read/watch if one wants to dive deep into this controversial topic?
Life after death experiences would be one form of evidence for the continuation of consciousness after death
 
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disciple Clint

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RDKirk

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Except for those denominations that believe in the continuous activities of the saints in heaven...what difference does it really make. If your decision to follow Jesus does not hinge on the answer...what difference does it make?

There are such things, as Paul told us, as "disputable matters."

You die, next thing you know, you're seeing Jesus. What difference did the interval make?

Are you going to turn around and go back if it turns out you were wrong either way?
 
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HTacianas

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What are the best arguments for consciousness persisting after death?

What are the best arguments against consciousness persisting after death (i.e. for the doctrine of Christian Mortalism or 'Soul sleep')?

Which side has the upper hand? Which side has the best arguments?

Are there any debates, either in written form or in video, that are a must read/watch if one wants to dive deep into this controversial topic?

"Soul sleep" is not a part of Christianity. It is a later idea developed by some protestant groups as a counter to the Roman Church's teaching of purgatory. Reading the account of the martyrs of Revelation:

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:

These are Christians who have been slain for their faith and have gone on into the presence of God.
 
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ewq1938

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Some people believe the soul is asleep after death and some believe the soul is dead when the body is dead. Both are unsorrted by the bible:



The soul is not dead nor sleeping when the body dies. No souls literally or symbolically sleep after death. Both good and bad, saved and unsaved are fully alert after death.

Souls do not sleep. Sleep is only something a mortal body does. Even when a person's body is asleep their mind (soul and spirit) are not asleep. Even someone in a coma is not asleep in mind or spirit.


The Sadducees believed like some, that when a person dies nothing is left living...only difference is the soul death/soul sleep people believe in a future resurrection while they didn't.

Christ rebuked the idea that a person was fully dead after physical death here:

Mat 22:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.
Mat 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
Mat 22:31 But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying,
Mat 22:32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.


Abraham, Isaac and Jacob were ALIVE despite having died physically.

Mar 12:27 He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.

Ye therefore do greatly err anyone who believes in this soul sleep false doctrine.

Luk 20:38 He is not a God of dead, but of living men, for to Him are all living."





2Co 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
2Co 5:9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.

No one is dead or sleeping in heaven with the Lord.

Luk_23:46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.

The spirit goes to God!


Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Every eye shall see him, even those that had pierced him though they died long ago. If they were asleep or dead they couldn't witness his return!

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

Here John seeing a future event in heaven and he sees the souls of the dead and they are fully alert and talking. They are not sleeping nor are they dead!

Isa 14:9 Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations.
Isa 14:10 All they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us?


How can the dead ask such a pertinent question if they are asleep?



At physical death only the body is dead, nothing else is dead at that time. The counter argument is a remnant of the old errant Sadducee belief that everything was dead when a person bodily died. Christ spoke against that belief and corrected their error yet their belief still exists today.



All scriptures that speak of the spirit/soul of the dead show them to be fully awake.

A great article on this subject:

Soul sleep problems and questions

What is soul sleep?

by Matt Slick

Soul sleep is the teaching that when a person dies, his soul "sleeps" until the time of the future resurrection. In this condition, the person is not aware or conscious. The Jehovah's Witnesses and the Seventh-day Adventists hold to this doctrine. But the Jehovah's Witnesses teach annihilation. This means that after death, a person ceases to exist. At the future resurrection they maintain that the soul is made again. Basically, it is a re-creation of the individual. The Seventh-day Adventists teach that the soul is simply inert and resides in the memory of God.

The primary verses used to support soul sleep are found in Ecclesiastes:

Eccl. 9:5, For the living know they will die; but the dead do not know anything, nor have they any longer a reward, for their memory is forgotten."
Eccl. 12:7, "then the dust will return to the earth as it was, and the spirit will return to God who gave it."

Ecclesiastes must be understood in the context of its own commentary, which says at the opening of the book, "The words of the Preacher, the son of David, king in Jerusalem. 2 “Vanity of vanities,” says the Preacher, “Vanity of vanities! All is vanity.” 3 What advantage does man have in all his work which he does under the sun?" (Eccl. 1:1-3). The writer is telling us how things are from the human perspective from "under the sun." He is not telling us doctrinal statements about whether or not the soul continues after death. Besides, it's a mistake to use the Old Testament to interpret the New Testament. It is the New Testament that sheds light on the Old Testament.

In the New Testament we see Paul say in 2 Cor. 5:8, "we are of good courage, I say, and prefer rather to be absent from the body and to be at home with the Lord." Paul is clearly telling us that when he dies, he will go and be with the Lord. Furthermore, at the Transfiguration of Jesus (Matt. 17:1-8), we see Moses and Elijah who were alive. There was no soul sleep with them.

Therefore, the doctrine of soul sleep is incorrect. The soul continues on after death. The wicked face the judgment of God, and the Christians will dwell in His presence.

Both groups are in error about soul sleep.
 
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sandman

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No consciousness after death….when your dead, your are dead until Christ returns.

Soul sleep is a good term for when we go to bed at night. But the Bible is clear… when you take your last breath, your soul life, which is breath life from the blood …ceases.
 
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TruthSeek3r

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No consciousness after death….when your dead, your are dead until Christ returns.

Soul sleep is a good term for when we go to bed at night. But the Bible is clear… when you take your last breath, your soul life, which is breath life from the blood …ceases.

What about @ewq1938's arguments at post #10?
 
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Petros2015

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What are the best arguments for consciousness persisting after death?

Rocky V. Sylvester Stallone passed away in 1988 2 years prior to the filming.
Mind you, it's not a *great* film, but it's still better than Weekend at Bernie's.
 
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sandman

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What about @ewq1938's arguments at post #10?

It will take a bit for me to go over @ewq1938's post which I don’t have time for right now, but briefly going through, I do agree that the spirit goes back to God …but soul and spirit are not the same.

1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

Since soul life is in the blood it cease at death.

Lev 17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.

The word translated life is the Hebrew word nephesh = soul
 
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ewq1938

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It will take a bit for me to go over @ewq1938's post which I don’t have time for right now, but briefly going through, I do agree that the spirit goes back to God …but soul and spirit are not the same.

1Co 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

Since soul life is in the blood it cease at death.

Lev 17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.

The word translated life is the Hebrew word nephesh = soul


Sure but the word has many many different meaning. It doesn't only mean "soul".


Lev 17:11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul.


Also, it's a bit awkward for the soul in the blood being able to atone for itself. I think "life" is the correct meaning which is why Hebrew experts choose it instead of "soul" in the first part of the verse. "soul" is appropriate for the two other times the word appears. So life is in the blood but the soul is not. When we bleed, we are not losing some of our soul.
 
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Aussie Pete

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What are the best arguments for consciousness persisting after death?

What are the best arguments against consciousness persisting after death (i.e. for the doctrine of Christian Mortalism or 'Soul sleep')?

Which side has the upper hand? Which side has the best arguments?

Are there any debates, either in written form or in video, that are a must read/watch if one wants to dive deep into this controversial topic?
The story of the rich man and Lazarus declares that there is consciousness after death. That's enough for me. God is outside of time. Once we pass from this life to the next, we are in God's realm.
 
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Saint Steven

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What are the best arguments for consciousness persisting after death?
A Bible search for the term "realm of the dead" finds 29 results in the NIV translation. 27 are in the OT, 2 are in the NT, appearing in the 2nd chapter of Acts. One of them appears in Ecclesiastes 9:10 which is five verses after the MAJOR "proof-text" for soul sleep in Ecclesiastes 9:5

A scan through these references show consciousness in the afterlife.

BibleGateway - Keyword Search: realm of the dead
 
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Saint Steven

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A Bible search for the term "realm of the dead" finds 29 results in the NIV translation. 27 are in the OT, 2 are in the NT, appearing in the 2nd chapter of Acts. One of them appears in Ecclesiastes 9:10 which is five verses after the MAJOR "proof-text" for soul sleep in Ecclesiastes 9:5

A scan through these references show consciousness in the afterlife.

BibleGateway - Keyword Search: realm of the dead
Here's an excerpt that is very interesting. An indication of consciousness in the realm of the dead. (more in the chapter)

Isaiah 14:9-10 NIV
The realm of the dead below is all astir
to meet you at your coming;
it rouses the spirits of the departed to greet you—
all those who were leaders in the world;
it makes them rise from their thrones—
all those who were kings over the nations.
10 They will all respond,
they will say to you,
“You also have become weak, as we are;
you have become like us.”
 
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Petros2015

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Are there any debates, either in written form or in video, that are a must read/watch if one wants to dive deep into this controversial topic?

Lilith, by George Macdonald
1895

upload_2022-1-12_8-30-38.png
 
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You can base your understanding on (1) tortured interpretations of obscure Bible verses that your denomination insists you must accept or (2) the literal mountain of evidence from across multiple fields of human experience and research indicating consciousness survives death. These fields include Near Death Experiences, After-Death Communications, Deathbed Apparitions, mediumship research, and others. The genuinely serious research dates back to the founding of the Society for Psychical Research (of which I've been a member) in 1880 and continues today. I myself have been the recipient of a number of After-Death Communications that leave no doubt in my mind.

A good place to start would be the 29 prize-winning essays on the best evidence for life after death recently made available at the Bigelow Institute for Consciousness Studies: Bigelow Institute.
 
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