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Is the "Secret Rapture" Biblical?

Discussion in 'Baptists' started by AFPJ, Oct 6, 2014.

  1. AFPJ

    AFPJ Newbie

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    I haven't personally found strong Biblical evidence supporting a secret pre-trib rapture and I'm curious why people support it. I'm not looking for a debate, I just wanted to know some supportive or non-supportive arguments.
     
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  2. dysert

    dysert Member

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    Of course there's strong biblical evidence to support a pre-trib rapture; otherwise there wouldn't be dozens of arguments over in the Eschatology forum about it.
     
  3. AFPJ

    AFPJ Newbie

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    Ah, sorry I'm a bit new here. What catagory is that under?
     
  4. dysert

    dysert Member

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    No problem. It isn't always easy to find things. Just go to:
    Theology -> Theology -> General Theology -> Eschatology
     
  5. dysert

    dysert Member

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    or click here: http://www.christianforums.com/f14/
     
  6. 1watchman

    1watchman Overseer Supporter

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    The Lord says He will come for His Bride "...in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye", so that is very sudden. There will be no announcement for the world, for God wants all to come now by faith and not by command, or just looking for a safe course to escape judgment.

    No argument here, but just noting Scripture, which we all should do.
     
  7. AFPJ

    AFPJ Newbie

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    Much appreciated, I'll be sure to check out that page first.
     
  8. OzSpen

    OzSpen Regular Member

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    AFP,

    Why don't you take a read of this article from the Journal of the Evangelical Theological Society by Vern Poythress, '2 Thessalonians 1 supports amillennialism'?

    This will give you an alternate view. I'm not persuaded by the pre-trib rapture arguments, but do find some post-trib possibilities that are expounded in some of the writings of George Eldon Ladd such as, The Blessed Hope (Eerdmans 1956), and Robert H Gundry, The Church and the Tribulation (Zondervan 1973). Ladd's commentary on the Book of Revelation also has post-trib insights.

    Oz
     
  9. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    I do not see any mention of the Bride of Christ, or His Bride in that passage. Can you give any scripture that references the Bride you mention here?

    I Corinthians 15
    50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
    51 ¶ Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
    52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
    53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
    Paul, talking to the brethren, states there is an instantaneous raising of the dead. We are told of two resurrections in the Revelation, and this refers to the first resurrection. Notice it happens at the LAST TRUMP. If the events of the Tribulation Period, and Great Tribulation, happen after this (hence, pre-trib. rapture) how many trumpets are to be blown after the last trump?
    .
     
  10. 1watchman

    1watchman Overseer Supporter

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    Certainly God is speaking of the Bride, Avid, for that is who He is speaking to ---not to the unsaved souls. the "Bride of Christ" is all true "born again" believers.
     
  11. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    Just asking for the scripture that states that. Where is it found in the Bible?
    .
     
  12. Alithis

    Alithis Disciple of Jesus .

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    i read it.. the only thing secret about the "catching up" of the bride...to meet the lord in the air when he comes ,is the exact hour and day it will occur.

    it occurs when he comes back in glory.
    some things have to be fullfilled before he returns ... ie the son of perdition(beast,man of sin) is first revealed.
     
  13. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    It is not unknown that this is believed by many people. I have simply asked for scripture that states that. It must then be assumed to merely be opinion, since there has been no scripture cited that shows this to be true. In fact, "Bride of Christ" is not found in the scripture, is it?

    Revelation 19
    9 And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God.
    Many may be called to a marriage supper, but there is a bride for the bridegroom, and this scripture does not state clearly who or what that is.

    Also, it must be purely conjecture that the verses cited in I Cor.15 refer to a Pre-Trib. Rapture, since there has been no response concerning how many trumpets are to be blown after the LAST TRUMP (I Cor.15:52) has been blown.
    .
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2014
  14. JM

    JM pre·des·ti·nar·i·an Supporter

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    The PreTrib rapture finds its roots in Dispensationalism. Dispensationalism is a hermeneutic. The so-called evidence is only evidence to those who hold to the Dispensational hermeneutic.
     
  15. MrJim

    MrJim Legend 3/17/05

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    ^this
     
  16. OzSpen

    OzSpen Regular Member

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    What is 'only evidence to those who hold to' a covenant theology hermeneutic regarding the rapture?
     
  17. OzSpen

    OzSpen Regular Member

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    Revelation 19:7-9 states:
    7 Let us rejoice and exult
    and give him the glory,
    for the marriage of the Lamb has come,
    and his Bride has made herself ready;
    8 it was granted her to clothe herself
    with fine linen, bright and pure”—

    for the fine linen is the righteous deeds of the saints.
    9 And the angel said to me, “Write this: Blessed are those who are invited to the marriage supper of the Lamb.” And he said to me, “These are the true words of God.” (ESV)
    Who is the 'Bride' in attendance at 'the marriage of the Lamb' of v. 7 if the Lamb is not Christ and the Bride is not the Bride of Christ?
     
  18. JM

    JM pre·des·ti·nar·i·an Supporter

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    :blush:
     
  19. Avid

    Avid A Pilgrim and a Sojourner...

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    Thank you. You are getting very close to answering by scripture. Trying to engage in lively dialogue on spiritual matters, but some either don't know the scriptures, or are not interested in exerting any effort.

    Keep these scriptures in mind, though:

    Revelation 21
    2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
    --- etc.---
    9 ¶ And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
    10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
    11 Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;


    Here we have something described as the Bride. There is a simple way to understand BOTH passages without doing violence to either. Let me know what you think.
    .
     
  20. pilgrim42

    pilgrim42 Newbie

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    Yes, the Lord is coming back in the twinkling of an eye, but i'm not sure that it will be a secret. The Bible says that the Lord is going to return at the Last Trump. It also states that He is coming with His angels. The picture is set up for us in the first few verses of Matthew 25. His return is pictured as a Jewish wedding. The Bride is waiting for the Groom to return. The Groom has gone to be with His Father and the rest of the family. As soon as the father tells him when the wedding will be he will go and get His bride. He will go the edge of the Bride's town or village will his friends (angels) and they will sound their trumpets. At that point the bride and her maids (the ones who's lamps are ready) will go out and meet the Groom and His party. They will then go to the Father's House. Before they get there there is going to be a judgment (after all that is why Jesus is coming back). The sheep and goats will be separated and the sheep will go to the Marriage Supper of the Lamb. After that it could be the Millennium or Heaven (or both).

    Yes, we will be changed. When does that happen. I'm not sure, but it could be as I Thess 4:16 tells us. The Lord comes back and there will be a resurrection. We will be snatched up to meet Him in the air, but then its off to the judgment (as I said above). Nothing is said in Thess that we are going directly to Heaven. I'm not dogmatic about prophecy, but this is how I see it.

    Ken :bow:
     
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