Is the Great Flood of the Bible literal or symbolic.

[Duane Morse]

I am speaking of all the events that transpired at Babel.
God confounded the language and speech of the people to segregate them. God also turned the world upside down to further segregate them geographically.
Before that, there was only one continent and one race of men. Those that came from Adam were a single race. The seperate races like the Chinese and the North American Indians did not exist prior to Babel.
So in one fell swoop, God gave us the races, God evolved the populace, in groups each going a separate path. They were probably separated along the lines of the different families mentioned in Genesis chapter 9.
And they were split up geographically so they would be forced to develope their own cultures within their own environment.

And if God could change the people so easily, God could change the animal life just as easily. And the data shows that species have died out suddenly and others have appeared just as suddenly. But there is nothing to show any true transitions from one group to the next.

The events at Babel combined with the flood can answer so many of these little nagging questions.

 

[Morat]

  Problems with Duane's 'explanation':

  Let's start simple:

  1) While there is plenty of evidence for a magnetic pole shift (it's happened several times throughout history, and we're somewhat overdue for another one), there is none for a 'physical' pole shift. Not only is there no such evidence for it, there's no real mechanism either.

 

 

[RufusAtticus]

Not to mention that a physical poll shift would not explain how people became scattered.

 

[Corey]

...and add...

2) Clovis people

 

[TheBear]

Originally posted by Duane Morse
God did not erase the evidence, God simply jumbled it up with a pole shift at the time of Babel.
Everyone seems to want to ignore what happened at Babel. Why?
To frightened to think of the earth actually turning over?
Because it might happen again, like the Bible indicates?
Does it answer too many questions?
About continental drift and evolution all at once?

Too bad nobody really wants to think about exactly what the Bible says.
The parts you can not understand are the parts you do not want to take literally. On both sides of the issue, the creationists and the so-called scientists.

You creationists, how can you ever hope to understand the creation as it was created if you do not even use the tools at hand to gain understanding?

Oh give me a break, Duane. I thought you had better insight on things than most.

When you say, "so-called scientists", exactly what group of people are you referring to?

 

[Sky]

Duane, can you think about this logically? That verse in the Bible about turing the world upside down is probably figurative, not literal. Also, a physical pole shift would obliterate life, not just change it. Also, how could a pole shift explain different races of people? That's genetics, not geology!

Lets just say that a physical pole shift were to happen today. People would just be going about their daily buisness when all of a sudden, the earth turns over and people fall out into space, buildings come off their foundation and fall into the sky, the oceans sp[ill out into space, the atmosphere either dissolves or is dispersed into space, suffocating any survivors. Every living thing dies, it's truly the end of the world.

That will never happen, and it hasn't happened in the past. If it did, you would not be here today, because there would be no life on earth.

 

[TheBear]

Let me ask this. The people who developed electronics theories, making it possible for you to read this, are they real scientists, or are they merely "so-called" scientists?

 

[TheBear]

Come on, Duane. What is your meaning of "so-called" scientists? People who's outcome and results go contrary to what you personally believe?

 

[Duane Morse]

Give me a minute here, I am actually working today.
I was taking a jab at the scientists because they refuse to even consider a different point of view.
The mechanism I do not know, but the pole shift is what is responsible for the splitting of the single continent into many. That is how the people got scattered.
No evidence? I have it in that ice core from Greenland. It clearly shows a dramatic increase in the dust content of the atmosphere at that precise point in time.
But since the scientists do not put the graph on the same time scale they do not see it. And they refuse to do so for fear of showing their theories incorrect and the Bible correct. So I say they are so-called because they refuse to consider a different way of looking at the data that shows a different picture than what they want.

 

[Sky]

Not true. I think you are the one who refuses to look at a different point of view because it might not tell you what you want.

The dust could be from a comet or a volcanic eruption or even a normal, everyday duststorm.

 

[TheBear]

I was taking a jab at the scientists because they refuse to even consider a different point of view.

What scientist, in their right mind, refuses to change positions, or look at things from a different perspective? I can tell you this, the people who have this kind of attitude and stuborneness, won't have jobs as scientists for very long.

 

[Duane Morse]

Could be this, could be that.
But the fact is it lines up precisely when the Bible says the earth was turned upside down, and at the precise time the Chinese calander begins.
Such coincidence.
And further along on the graph is the dust event of 535 A.D., the eruption of the volcano Krakatoa, the largest known eruption and the second tallest spike on the graph. The tallest spike is just after that, and the latest tree ring evidence shows that there WAS a double dust event at that time.

This lines up too well to be just coincidence. I do not refuse to look at a different point of view, but I have one that answers the questions and sticks with the data.

 

[Sky]

I just don't understand how a Flood could send up a dust cloud. As for the pole shift, it's symbolic. Life would not exist doday if a pole shift happened thousands of years ago.

 

[TheBear]

Originally posted by Duane Morse
Could be this, could be that.

What is this... Is this your answer to my questions about "so-called" scientists?

You are 180 degrees from the truth, when you imply that scientists, by and large, are a stuborne bunch, clinging to erroneous notions, in the light of new evidence. This accusation is flat wrong. Advances are not arrived at by erroneous notions.

I hope you understand.

John

 

[Duane Morse]

The flood did not send up the dust, the pole shift did. It is not symbolic, it is literal.
And as life did survive, it was not quite as destructive as you are imagining.

 

[Duane Morse]

Sorry Bear, #69 was my response to that.

 

[TheBear]

Huh?

 

[Sky]

Post number 69

 

[Duane Morse]

Post #69 was my response as to why I said so-called.
They put a time scale of 110,000 years to that ice core. That is a choice between three different best guess methods for determining the dates to assign to the ice core.
None of them is even close to 6000 years. I have not come across anyone that will even consider putting it on a 6000 year scale, so yes, they refuse to look at a different way of looking at the data that might disprove the dating methods they want to use.

 

[TheBear]

Originally posted by Duane Morse
... so yes, they refuse to look at a different way of looking at the data that might disprove the dating methods they want to use.

Okay. If that's the way you see it. I don't see it that way.