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Featured Is sex before premarital sex really sinful?

Discussion in 'Christian Philosophy & Ethics' started by TommySoda, Apr 14, 2018.

  1. Cement

    Cement Active Member

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    Sometimes I wonder why God didn’t let us have inbuilt off switches for fleshly desires. I think what we need to understand is that the material world is never fulfilling because it is all passing away the only thing that matters is the things of the spirit which don’t pass away.
     
  2. fat wee robin

    fat wee robin Newbie

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    I think God had to be very clear on certain subjects until humanity had become truly aware of 'the larger picture ' ,which means that we will automatically love God and others s ourselves . It is very clear that while many try to do that ,so many who call themselves christians are still quite simple .If not there would be no Christians who allowed such things as bombing people who have done them no harm .
    Only a day ago the US pressured so called christian nations ,England ,and France caused hell on earth to people in Syria, based on lies told by their government (I am certain that Trump is being lied to also ,as he was against such murder ).
    So it is evident that people who are still quite primitive in their attitude to others in general, have to stick to the rules which are really there to keep order in family life and society .Spiritually ,when we have grown enough there will be no more need for rules, for Jesus' two laws will come
    automatically , and we will be above the Law .
    That is why He said few will make it , because until we stop being destructive
    towards others , always putting ourselves first ,then we need to be married and lawful like young children . Since so many marriage in churches are a disaster, and so many long term relationships
    can be holy and full of love and respect , makes you wonder .
    The word sin is tossed around a great deal ,but it means 'off the path ' ,and yes it is better to get married , but mass murder which is ignored , is more than 'off the path ',it Is SIN .
     
  3. fat wee robin

    fat wee robin Newbie

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    This is something I dispute greatly,and it is coming from Paul,a man riddled with fleshly desires . It does'nt matter whether you are married or not , if you have unhealthy desires like pornography or such ,
    and many married do , then is better to be unmarried and faithful and pure minded .
     
  4. Blade

    Blade Veteran Supporter

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    Man is the only one that makes this confusing. The word makes it very clear. Does one have to ware something/take something to STOP something as in sperm/egg to have this " premarital sex "?

    So WHOM do you want to please? Is HIS way or ours period. A He is NOT going to EVER change on this.

    "For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh."
     
  5. hedrick

    hedrick Senior Veteran Supporter

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    The Greek word translated “fornication” was originally prostitution.

    In the OT it is used to translate a range of terms, including having intercourse, being unfaithful, and being a harlot. My impression from a long article is that it was typically used for unfaithfulness, including (metaphorically) unfaithfulness of Israel to God.

    In post-OT usage it broadened to include anything inappropriate.

    TDNT says that in the NT it means all extra-marital intercourse. It’s not used very often by Jesus, more by Paul. For Paul there are places where it’s obviously prostitution, but some of his statements imply wider implication.

    Looking at all uses of porneia (searching in the Greek) I see
    Mat 5:3 adultery
    Mat 15:19 sin list, unspecified meaning
    Mat 19:9 adultery
    Mark 7:21 sin list, unspecified meaning
    John 8:41 metaphorical
    Acts 15:20, 28 unspecified
    Acts 21:25 unspecified
    1 Cor 5:1 incest
    1 Cor 6:13 & 18 prostitute, though that could be an example of something broader
    1 Cor 7:2 people should be married to avoid porneia; probably refers to sex among unmarried people; cf 7:8-9, which doesn’t use the term porneia
    2 Cor 12:21 sin list, unspecified meaning
    Gal 5:19 ditto
    Eph 5:3 unspecified
    Col 3:5 sin list, unspecified meaning
    Rev: several references, but all metaphorical

    Nowhere is there an explicit treatment of sex between two unmarried people, probably because it would rarely be an issue. Decent unmarried women would be protected. Non-decent ones would be prostitutes.

    The logic of 1 Cor 7:2, however, seems to be aimed at unmarried people.

    The general Jewish views of the time would include sex among unmarried people.

    The question of how 1st Cent standards apply to modern Christians is one that can't be discussed in CF. I do think it's something people need to think about.
     
  6. CosmicOsmo

    CosmicOsmo New Member

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    Short answer: yes, having sex without the intention to spend the rest of your life with that person is missing the mark and not God's original plan. It is sin and it is destructive.

    Long answer: don't listen to the fools who use the word "fornication" as a synonym to premarital sex. Fornication doesn't mean premarital sex, but sexual sin in general. The bible talks almost nothing about premarital sex and the only place where it does mention it, it says you should get married if that happens (Exodus 22:16).

    The spirit of the word is that marriage = becoming one flesh = sex. In fact, that is how marriage is defined in the book of Genesis: "and they shall be one flesh" (Genesis 2:24). The special bonding between man and woman is what is to be kept sacred and the other things like pieces of paper and rings and such are cultural and secondary.

    The devil has had great success deceiving - through movies, books, laws of the nations etc. - even the church into believing that sex and marriage are somehow separate... that you can have all the sex you want but until you find the "special one" its "just sex" (look for that oft' repeated mantra in the next worldly movie you watch: this brainwashing phrase is all over the place!). This is totally contrary to the Word for God.

    The flipside of this issue is divorce. A woman will say that she has a piece of paper from the judge saying she is no longer someone's wife and is therefore free to marry someone else. Not so. First of all, Jesus clearly says no man should separate a married couple (Mark 10:9), annulling that judge's piece of paper. Secondly no worldly court is qualified to judge such issues to begin with (1 Corinthians 6:4)

    You can take your chances and go do whatever and try to explain it to God later, perhaps even repent later, but it is sin. God can forgive all sin so I'm not condemning you to hell or anything like that, but all those partners before marriage will chip away at your ability to bond with your partner later.

    You can look for what you can get away with and still be saved "by the skin of your teeth", but if you want to know God's heart on this issue, look at the higher standards (not the ones given because of the "hardness of their heart"), such as "And he shall take a wife in her virginity" (Leviticus 21:13).
     
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  7. CosmicOsmo

    CosmicOsmo New Member

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    "And if a man entice a maid that is not betrothed, and lie with her, he shall surely endow her to be his wife." (Exodus 22:16)
     
  8. fat wee robin

    fat wee robin Newbie

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    A huge difference .It is because of this kind of hyperbole that christians are confused . The same kind of
    nonsense which says all sins are equal when they are patently not . Some people are totally irrational
    and dirty minded, so they see the world through their narrow lense .If you are not already a child of God
    you will not be able to discern why one day some will live outside the law .Some have arrived, and are given 'adult status ',because their hearts are pure ,but those who are bad in their hearts see only bad ,
    and yes they must continue until they are purified at death .
     
  9. salt-n-light

    salt-n-light Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I am a child of God, so now that's out of the way, can you actually answer the question? Lol!

    In fact while you're at please point to me in the Bible, where God gives 'adult status'? That is a new term.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018
  10. fat wee robin

    fat wee robin Newbie

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    Thankyou for this clear and considerate way of putting things . The greatest problem for people was the complete lack of any dialogue whatsoever on relationships ,feelings, never mind sex, which was for some like me ,a very upsetting subject ,which I closed down, and had no one of any sense to help develop ones emotions and thoughts .
    This was the fault of a society which went from wild licence ,in Pauls day, to a suppressed and totally negative attitude to all sex ,married or not .
    We can blame the larger churches for the over reaction of the 60's onwards, when a little bit of freedom gave way to total outright rebellion .The hypocrisy of the 'christian 'who would sleep with a woman , and having 'spoiled her in his hypocritical eyes ', would not then marry her ,as he was still looking for a virgin .

    Those hypocrites still exist and on this site ,and married or not they will pay the price ,not of having sex with a loved one ,but using a woman for his pleasure and then rejecting her .Why are there prostitutes , because men make them .The percent of women who chose this lifestyle freely ,is minscule as
    it is mostly girls who have been used by men ,who then feel worthless afterwards who fall into it .

    So any man who has woman treated any woman with contempt, is guilty as they have had all the Power both morally and physically until ,recently and have abused it .
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018
  11. fat wee robin

    fat wee robin Newbie

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    It is in the bible ,but you cannot see it ;you have to be born again, literally .
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018
  12. salt-n-light

    salt-n-light Well-Known Member Supporter

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    You failed to answer a simple question. You even failed more to recognize a sibling in Christ. Your lifetime of studies makes no difference to me if you can't explain anything.

    That's fine keep your pearls,but next time before you make such a judgement do your research on me.
     
  13. fat wee robin

    fat wee robin Newbie

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    Was it not you who said that people who are in a loving relationship ,but not 'married ', are no different from prostitutes ?
     
  14. Petros2015

    Petros2015 Well-Known Member

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    If pre-marital sex is sinful then I think you are really crossing a line with pre-pre-marital sex.
     
  15. salt-n-light

    salt-n-light Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Nope, my opinion is that premarital sex and prostitution are of the same mindset, selling your body. It may be pitched differently, seen differently, phrased differently, but in hindsight it's doing the same thing.

    You're argument is that they are totally different. All yet, you haven't explained that.
     
  16. dreadnought

    dreadnought Lip service isn't really service. Supporter

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    The Lord's commandments stand forever and with good reason. Sexual lust is a powerful force, and people will always be trying to justify having sex outside of marriage. Sin always leads to trouble, though.
     
  17. Isaac Varghese

    Isaac Varghese New Member

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    God condemns fornication, simple as that
     
  18. Smidlee

    Smidlee Veteran

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    They are claiming "fornication" in scripture doesn't refer premarital sex but idolatry but they fail to realize in a lot of cases those are the same thing. This generation has been deceive into thinking they started something new with the sex revolution when it ancient. Idolatry and having sex outside of marriage went hand to hand.
    In Exodus 32:6 They "sat down to eat and to drink and rose up to play." They surely wasn't playing Monopoly or Poker.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2018
  19. hedrick

    hedrick Senior Veteran Supporter

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    Your response has implications you may want to reconsider. If ancient premarital sex was linked with idolatry, that supports the case that the NT prohibitions don't apply to all modern situations. I'm not so sure that it's true, however.
     
  20. salt-n-light

    salt-n-light Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Keep in mind that idolatry wasn't only subjected to carven images, "gods" was also to describe one of authority,( it's probably was what they mainly were referring to, still looking into it),so kings for example were also considered gods. Idolatry also pertains to worship of people, it would still apply today.
     
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