Is music a 'thing of this world' or can it be proven to be 'Holy'?

[AarontheStudent]

So, I ask: "Is music a 'thing of this world?" Or can you PROVE to me that there is ONE song that was directly inspired by God?

Well, there's 151 of them in the Book of Psalms, but something tells me you'd only agree 150 of them are inspired..

 

[Imagican]

Concerning the Last Supper:

"And after they (Jesus and his disciples) sang a hymn..."

You ARE joking, right?

Blessings,

MEC

 

[Imagican]

The structure of music proves there is a God.

Really? And how so?

Couldn't I say just the opposite? that the structure of music proves there is a Devil?

Blessings,

MEC

 

[Imagican]

God is the world's greatest mathematician. Nearly everything that lives and moves has a mathematical formula and equasion behind it. God created music, man discovered it.

And all 'that' is certainly 'Biblical'......................

Blessings,

MEC

 

[Imagican]

But we were able to see patterns and create mathematical formulas like E+mc^2 thanks to our intellect

Nope. We, (man), didn't create E=MC squared. It was merely discovered by man.

Blessings,

MEC

 

[AarontheStudent]

You ARE joking, right?

Blessings,

MEC

No, he isn't joking. He's quoting Matthew 26:30.

To be specific, Jesus and the disciples might have sung the Hillel (Psalms 113 through 118)

 

[Strong in Him]

You ARE joking, right?

That's what Scripture says; why would it be a joke?

 

[Imagican]

Revelation 15:3 and sang the song of God's servant Moses and of the Lamb: "Great and
marvelous are your deeds, Lord God Almighty. Just and true

Revelation 14:3 And they sang a new song before the throne and before the four living creatures
and the elders.

Revelation 5:9 And they sang a new song, saying: "You are worthy to take the scroll and to open
its seals, because you were slain, and with your blood you purchased for God .

Nice try.

Now, show me 'the song' or 'songs' mentioned. What is the name of the song, it's lyrics, the melody, etc.................

Not the mere mention of 'song', but WHICH song.

Blessings,

MEC

 

[Imagican]

Well, there's 151 of them in the Book of Psalms, but something tells me you'd only agree 150 of them are inspired..

I have specifically mentioned the NT. There is now a NEW covenant and those 'things' of the OT have been altered according to the New.

How much of the OT we can defend in our present beliefs is most certainly 'debatable'. While I'm sure it's of a particular 'value', the OLD covenant between Israel and God has no bearing on a relationship with God through Christ.

Blessings,

MEC

 

[Imagican]

Music in heaven....
Revelation 5:8,9
And when he had taken the book, the four beasts and four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps, and golden vials full of odors, which are the prayers of saints.
Nave's Topical Index

Revelation 14:2,3
And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
Nave's Topical Index

Revelation 15:2,3
And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God.
Nave's Topical Index

Ok, but relevance does this have to music here on Earth?

Blessings,

MEC

 

[Imagican]

Ok, lots of comments. Tried to address the ones that seemed pertinent to the topic.

Yet I noticed no one addressed the MAIN question I asked in the opening. Asked it more than once, in fact.

"Is music a 'thing of this world'? Is it WORLDLY in it's very nature.

No, not whatever songs may have been sung by the apostles. We have absolutely NO IDEA what those songs were or may have been. Most likely 'psalms'.

And since we have NO IDEA, other than psalms, (from the OT), what songs were ever sang by those of the OT or the New.

So all we have to go by are the songs that exist TODAY. So, obviously I'm not speaking about that which we CANNOT identify, I'm referring to that which we CAN.

I would have thought this obvious from the beginning of the conversation.

And let me ask this: Suppose I worshiped Satan as my God. Couldn't I sing any psalm to HIM instead of God? If I chose Satan as MY GOD, wouldn't anything I offered so far as praise or service be to him?

So show me the difference between Holy 'music' and any other type of music.

But more importantly, answer the question: Is music a 'thing of this world'? Is it 'worldly' in it's very NATURE?

Go watch the video of AC/DC down in Brazil performing 'Highway to Hell". Then tell me that it's 'just music'.

So far I find it absolutely amazing that no one has commented about music that is clearly EVIL. Only a couple of comments indicating that it's about 'intent'.

Evil music cannot be turned into righteous music. You can't make Satan Holy no matter how hard you TRY.

Blessings,

MEC

 

[Imagican]

Oh, and the Bible does not say "After they ate they sang a song". After they ate, we have no idea WHEN they sang other than the ORDER of the event. What was offered indicating it was a quote was NOTHING of the sort. that is why I asked if the person were 'joking'.

Did they sing an hour later? In that same place? Two hours later? Did they make any preparations between heading out the Mount? Were they singing out loud or were the melody and lyrics in their hearts?

That would be like me making comments indicating quotes about who baked the bread they ate or made the wine. There are not such quotes.

Blessings,

MEC

 

[AarontheStudent]

I don't think anyone is going to argue AC/DC is wholesome Christian music.

But the Psalms? I don't see why they wouldn't be, even if they are a bit aged. Several are considered prophetic of Jesus.

 

[Strong in Him]

Nice try.

Now, show me 'the song' or 'songs' mentioned. What is the name of the song, it's lyrics, the melody, etc.................

Not the mere mention of 'song', but WHICH song.

Blessings,

MEC

The song is,

Revelation 15:3 and sang the song of God's servant Moses and of the Lamb: "Great and
marvelous are your deeds, Lord God Almighty. Just and true

Just because it's a song you don't recognise or is available with details of the tune, doesn't make it any less a song.

 

[Strong in Him]

Oh, and the Bible does not say "After they ate they sang a song". After they ate, we have no idea WHEN they sang other than the ORDER of the event. What was offered indicating it was a quote was NOTHING of the sort. that is why I asked if the person were 'joking'.

Did they sing an hour later? In that same place? Two hours later? Did they make any preparations between heading out the Mount? Were they singing out loud or were the melody and lyrics in their hearts?

Doesn't matter.
You wanted evidence of Jesus and/or his disciples singing; that verse shows it. If they had all sung in their hearts, how would anyone have known that they had sung?

 

[Imagican]

The Bible warns us that those things appealing to the flesh, those things 'sensual' are 'of the Devil'. I have never read a single line of the Bible that refers to God appealing to the "flesh".

Yet that is exactly what we can see when fifty thousand people attend a Grateful Dead concert. Or the Rolling Stones, etc.........

Please don't tell me that no one here can discern the difference between something 'Holy' and The Grateful Dead???

But, if you can, show me HOW. Explain to me HOW 'you' can tell the difference.

As I previously pointed out, couldn't I take something 'Holy', and according to MY intent, turn it into something UN-Holy?

Is it any different than "Christ versus ANTI-Christ"?

Blessings,

MEC

 

[Strong in Him]

Ok, lots of comments. Tried to address the ones that seemed pertinent to the topic.

Yet I noticed no one addressed the MAIN question I asked in the opening. Asked it more than once, in fact.

"Is music a 'thing of this world'? Is it WORLDLY in it's very nature.

No.
The very nature of music is sound - eight notes on a scale, plus sharps and flats. Those notes, sounds, are arranged in various ways to make tunes - whether two line jingles or magnificent symphonies.
Sound can be neither secular nor sacred. I've already said that

 

[Imagican]

Is it POSSIBLE that we have so little 'direct instruction' about 'music' for the same reason we have NO idea of Christ's actual birth date? That in order to preserve that which is pure it must be HIDDEN from the enemy? If we were given information pertaining to 'Holy music' versus 'evil music', that instruction could be USED for 'evil purposes'? So God has left it to 'influence instead of instruction'? We are warned about that which is evil and it's up to us to recognize it????

We are given no instructions about 'witchcraft' other than it's existence. Those that would choose such a path must learn to do it 'on their own'. They must seek influence other than God in order to practice it. God ONLY warns us of it's existence. He doesn't offer instructions on how to practice it.

Is it any different with 'music'?

Wait a second, let's see a 'show of hands' before we go any further.

Can music BE EVIL? Can music have a NEGATIVE influence on those that hear it if it IS evil? I need to know where each person I respond to 'stands'.

For I have discussed this with people that insist that there is 'no such thing' as EVIL music. That whether evil exists or not, is merely a matter of perspective of the person making the judgement.

But that would no different than believing that Satan is a matter of 'judgement'. That he ONLY exists in the imagination of the one contemplating the issue.

And if you believe THAT, then it would be no different than approaching the subject of God i the same perspective: He only exists in the imagination of those that 'dream Him up'.

Blessings,

MEC

 

[Rick Otto]

A graven image is an image that is worshipped as a god. Do not confuse this with things which are used in the worship of the true God.

Instead of "singing" look up "sing" and "song".

Honest question... where does that distinction ("as a god") take place? What I mean is, is it ok for me to kiss a statue if I know the statue isn't God(?).

 

[Beorh]

You ARE joking, right?

Blessings,

MEC

Why would I be joking about King Jesus singing a hymn?