Is land restoration a part of the new covenant?

[pasifika]

God promised to give the land of Israel to Abraham and his offspring.

Genesis 12:3,7 I will bless those who bless you, and him who dishonors you I will curse, and in you all the families of the earth shall be blesse. Then the Lord appeared to Abram and said, “To your offspring I will give this land

Genesis 15:18 On that day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying, “To your offspring I give this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the river Euphrates,

Genesis 17:6-8 I will make you exceedingly fruitful; I will make nations of you, and kings will descend from you. I will establish My covenant as an everlasting covenant between Me and you and your offspring after you, to be your God and the God of your offspring after you. And to you and your offspring I will give the land where you are residing—all the land of Canaan—as an eternal possession; and I will be their God.”

We know all the promises of God find there yes in Jesus.

1 Corinthians 1:20 For all the promises of God find their Yes in him

And Paul specifically states that the promises spoken to Abraham and his offspring were to Jesus. As promises is plural, that would include the land of Israel.

Galatians 3:16 Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, “And to offsprings,” referring to many, but referring to one, “And to your offspring,” who is Christ.

At Christ's death, resurrection, and ascension, He was given all authority over Earth and placed above all authority, dominion, and power at his ascension to the right hand. The NT very clearly testifies that Christ is the heir of all things. And as He is the "offspring" spoken of in Genesis, according to Paul, then the land is His as well.

Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me

Ephesians 1:20-21 that he worked in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places, far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and above every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come

Hebrews 1:2 in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world.

The land was promised to the offspring of Abraham. The offspring is Jesus. At Jesus' death, resurrection, and ascension, he was given all authority over earth. The earth is his, and this includes the present land of Israel. This fulfills the promise to Abraham according to NT scripture.

Hello, some questions;

1. Is the offspring (seed) in Genesis 12, Genesis 15 etc is in what form Spirit or man (flesh )?
2. If All the promises are for Abraham and Christ Alone, then;

• how about you and me or the Body of Christ (Church)? Aren't we (church ) also heir with Him on the same promise?
• How can you interpret Galatians 3:29..."If you belong to Christ then you(plural) are Abraham's seed (singular ) and heirs(plural ) according to the promise...
• Romans 8:17..Now if we are Children, then we are heirs of God, co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his suffering in order that we may share in his glory...

 

[claninja]

Is the offspring (seed) in Genesis 12, Genesis 15 etc is in what form Spirit or man (flesh )?

Both, as Jesus was fully man and fully God.

Colossians 2:9 For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity dwells in bodily form.

2. If All the promises are for Abraham and Christ Alone, then;

• how about you and me or the Body of Christ (Church)? Aren't we (church ) also heir with Him on the same promise?

yes, we are also heirs with Christ.

Romans 8:17 Now if we are Children, then we are heirs of God, co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his suffering in order that we may share in his glory

2. If All the promises are for Abraham and Christ Alone, then;

• How can you interpret Galatians 3:29..."If you belong to Christ then you(plural) are Abraham's seed (singular ) and heirs(plural ) according to the promise...

The inheritance that I will receive from my father, that is promised to me, when he passes away, my wife will also inherit. This inheritance was promised to me PRIOR to marrying my wife. My wife does NOT inherit from my father outside of me. My wife only inherits because she is married to me, she is one flesh with me. I am the head and she is the body. If my wife was not married to me, she would receive no inheritance from my father.

Ephesians 5:31-32 For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh. "This mystery is profound, but I am speaking about Christ and the church.

Ephesians 5:28-29 In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ does the church,

Colossians 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church

So it is with Christ. The offspring to whom the promises were spoken to was Jesus (galatians 3:16). Jesus is the heir of all things (Hebrews 1:2). He is the head of the body. The body is the church. The 2 are one, just as a man and wife are one. the head (Jesus) is the inheritor. the body (the church) only inherits because it is one with the head (Jesus). If the body (church) was not one with the head (jesus) it would inherit nothing.

The offspring remains singular. Anyone (plural) who belongs to the body is one with the singular offspring (Jesus), as a man and wife are one.

2. If All the promises are for Abraham and Christ Alone, then;

• Romans 8:17..Now if we are Children, then we are heirs of God, co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his suffering in order that we may share in his glory...

I agree with Paul's words in Romans 8:17

Now, if you can answer 2 questions of mine:
Where did Jesus receive the kingdom?

Where was Jesus when he was placed above all authority, power, and dominion?

 

[keras]

Our heritage; the promises of God:

Ephesians 1:11-14 In Christ we have been given our share in the heritage, as was decreed in His design …for it was God’s will that we, who were the first to set our hope on Jesus and to praise His glory.
And, in Christ, you Christians also, once you believed and received the Holy Spirit, the promise of the inheritance that will be ours, when God has redeemed all of His own, to His glory and praise.


Ephesians 3:6 Through the Gospel, the Gentiles are joint heirs with the Jews, part of the same body, sharers together in the promises made through Jesus.


Romans 8:16-17 The Spirit of God affirms that we are His children and if children, then also the heirs of God and fellow heirs with Jesus, but we must share His suffering if we are to share His glory.

Romans 8:19 The Created universe is waiting with eager expectation for God’s sons to be revealed.


Our greatest heritage as born again Christians is the promise of eternal life. John 3:16,Titus 3:5-7, + But we also inherit the Land promises, Psalms 37:29, Ezekiel 36:8-12, Ezekiel 34:11-31 It is we Christians, from every tribe, race, nation and language, that are the vast multitude seen waving palm branches in Jerusalem. Revelation 7:9 The ones who have passed thru the great ordeal of the Sixth Seal disaster and have earned the white garments by standing firm in our faith. Revelation 7:14


Note: in Romans 8:19, that God’s true children are not yet made known, Jesus will come with His winnowing fork and sift the wheat from the chaff. Matthew 3:12 Those Christians who stood strong in their faith when He comes in fire, Luke 12:49, 2 Thessalonians 1:7-8, are the wheat that will be gathered into the granary of the holy Land. The chaff of the ungodly peoples will be as ashes under our feet. Isaiah 66:17, Malachi 4:3, 2 Peter 3:7

 

[One Son]

Thank you One Son for the input. Are you implying that it is not the land, but the Lord himself who is our inheritance?

Hi

2Cor.1:20(NKJ) For all the promises of God in Him are Yes, and in Him Amen, to the glory of God through us. 21 Now He who establishes us with you in Christ and has anointed us is God, 22 who also has sealed us and given us the Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.


The Holy Spirit is the guarantee.



2Cor.5:5 Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.


The Holy Spirit is the guarantee.




Eph.1:12 that we who first trusted in Christ should be to the praise of His glory.
13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.


The Holy Spirit is the guarantee of our future inheritance.




Acts2:32 This Jesus God has raised up, of which we are all witnesses. 33Therefore being exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He poured out this which you now see and hear.


The promise is the future inheritance.


The Holy Spirit is the guarantee ...of the... promise.



Col.1:19(ASV) For it was the good pleasure of the Father that in him should all the fulness dwell; 20 and through him to reconcile all things unto himself, having made peace through the blood of his cross; through him, I say , whether things upon the earth, or things in the heavens.


2Cor.5:18 But all things are of God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ, and gave unto us the ministry of reconciliation; 19 to wit, that God was in Christ reconciling the world unto himself, not reckoning unto them their trespasses, and having committed unto us the word of reconciliation.


Jn.7:37(KJV) In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink. 38 He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water. 39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)


the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)


Jn.17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do. 5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.


with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.



Acts2:32 This Jesus God has raised up, of which we are all witnesses. 33Therefore being exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He poured out this which you now see and hear.


The promise is our future inheritance.



Rev.21:22 (NAS) I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb are its temple.

23 And the city has no need of the sun or of the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God has illumined it, and its lamp is the Lamb.



for the glory of God has illumined it, and its lamp is the Lamb.



The Lamb is the lamp.



Rev.22:3(N.A.S) There will no longer be any curse; and the throne of God and of the Lamb will be in it,(her)* and His bond-servants will serve Him;
4 they will see His face, and His name will be on their foreheads.
5 And there will no longer be any night; and they will not have need of the light of a lamp nor the light of the sun, because the Lord God will illumine them; and they will reign forever and ever.


No need of the light of the Lamb.


the Lord God will illumine them…….Is.60:19



glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.


1Jn.1:5 This is the message we have heard from Him and announce to you, that God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness at all.


*Jer.3:16(KJV) And it shall come to pass, when ye be multiplied and increased in the land,(earth) in those days, saith the LORD, they shall say no more, The ark of the covenant of the LORD: neither shall it come to mind: neither shall they remember it; neither shall they visit it; neither shall that be done any more.

17 At that time they shall call Jerusalem the throne of the LORD; and all the nations shall be gathered unto it, to the name of the LORD, to Jerusalem: neither shall they walk any more after the imagination of their evil hearts.


Jerusalem is the Throne.


Throne(City) of God and of the Lamb will be in it,(her)#


# αὐτῇ (autē)
Personal / Possessive Pronoun - Dative Feminine 3rd Person Singular


Tree of Life....Wisdom.



Prov.3:18(KJV) She(Wisdom) is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her.
19 The LORD by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens.


Heb.12:22(KJV) But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels, 23 To the general assembly ...and... church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,



2Cor.5:18 But all things are of God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ, and gave unto us the ministry of reconciliation; 19 to wit, that God was in Christ reconciling the world unto himself, not reckoning unto them their trespasses, and having committed unto us the word of reconciliation.


I am thy portion and thine inheritance……(Num.18:20+Deut.10:9+Josh.13:33+Eze.44:28).



Peace to you.





Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come.(2Cor.5:17).

 

[Nige55]

God promised to give the land of Israel to Abraham and his offspring.

Genesis 12:3,7 I will bless those who bless you, and him who dishonors you I will curse, and in you all the families of the earth shall be blesse. Then the Lord appeared to Abram and said, “To your offspring I will give this land

Genesis 15:18 On that day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying, “To your offspring I give this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the river Euphrates,

Genesis 17:6-8 I will make you exceedingly fruitful; I will make nations of you, and kings will descend from you. I will establish My covenant as an everlasting covenant between Me and you and your offspring after you, to be your God and the God of your offspring after you. And to you and your offspring I will give the land where you are residing—all the land of Canaan—as an eternal possession; and I will be their God.”

We know all the promises of God find there yes in Jesus.

1 Corinthians 1:20 For all the promises of God find their Yes in him

And Paul specifically states that the promises spoken to Abraham and his offspring were to Jesus. As promises is plural, that would include the land of Israel.

Galatians 3:16 Now the promises were made to Abraham and to his offspring. It does not say, “And to offsprings,” referring to many, but referring to one, “And to your offspring,” who is Christ.

At Christ's death, resurrection, and ascension, He was given all authority over Earth and placed above all authority, dominion, and power at his ascension to the right hand. The NT very clearly testifies that Christ is the heir of all things. And as He is the "offspring" spoken of in Genesis, according to Paul, then the land is His as well.

Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me

Ephesians 1:20-21 that he worked in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places, far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and above every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come

Hebrews 1:2 in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world.

The land was promised to the offspring of Abraham. The offspring is Jesus. At Jesus' death, resurrection, and ascension, he was given all authority over earth. The earth is his, and this includes the present land of Israel. This fulfills the promise to Abraham according to NT scripture.

ok, so stemming from this, - what do think or understand to come from the land itself belonging to Jesus (especially considering that the land of Israel is the specific land mentioned) ? I agree that the land is his.

 

[pasifika]

Both, as Jesus was fully man and fully God.

Colossians 2:9 For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity dwells in bodily form.



yes, we are also heirs with Christ.

Romans 8:17 Now if we are Children, then we are heirs of God, co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his suffering in order that we may share in his glory



The inheritance that I will receive from my father, that is promised to me, when he passes away, my wife will also inherit. This inheritance was promised to me PRIOR to marrying my wife. My wife does NOT inherit from my father outside of me. My wife only inherits because she is married to me, she is one flesh with me. I am the head and she is the body. If my wife was not married to me, she would receive no inheritance from my father.

Ephesians 5:31-32 For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh. "This mystery is profound, but I am speaking about Christ and the church.

Ephesians 5:28-29 In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ does the church,

Colossians 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church

So it is with Christ. The offspring to whom the promises were spoken to was Jesus (galatians 3:16). Jesus is the heir of all things (Hebrews 1:2). He is the head of the body. The body is the church. The 2 are one, just as a man and wife are one. the head (Jesus) is the inheritor. the body (the church) only inherits because it is one with the head (Jesus). If the body (church) was not one with the head (jesus) it would inherit nothing.

The offspring remains singular. Anyone (plural) who belongs to the body is one with the singular offspring (Jesus), as a man and wife are one.



I agree with Paul's words in Romans 8:17

Now, if you can answer 2 questions of mine:
Where did Jesus receive the kingdom?

Where was Jesus when he was placed above all authority, power, and dominion?

Hello, thank you for your reply...then, since both the church and the land (land promise to Abraham or Israel ) belong to Christ then you could say that the land of Israel is as much important in the New covenant but also the old covenant...

Where did Jesus receive the kingdom?
In this world...Revelation 11: 15..The seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, which said: " The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Messiah, and He will reign for ever and ever."

Where was Jesus when He was placed above all authority, power and dominion?

During His ministry...John 3:35...The Father loves the Son and has placed everything in his hands. Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God's wrath remains on them...

 

[claninja]

ok, so stemming from this, - what do think or understand to come from the land itself belonging to Jesus (especially considering that the land of Israel is the specific land mentioned) ? I agree that the land is his.

The point being that the Abrahamic promises are fulfilled in Jesus, and not in modern day Israel becoming an independent nation in 1948. The NT clearly states Christ is the heir of all things, Christ is the seed of Abraham to whom the promises were spoken, Christ is the fulfillment of the law, psalms, and prophets, and all the promises of God find their yes in Him. There is no NT scripture that states Israel returning to the land fulfills the abrahmic promises.

 

[claninja]

Hello, thank you for your reply...then, since both the church and the land (land promise to Abraham or Israel ) belong to Christ then you could say that the land of Israel is as much important in the New covenant but also the old covenant...

What NT scripture mentions the land as part of the new covenant?

Where did Jesus receive the kingdom?
In this world...Revelation 11: 15..The seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, which said: " The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Messiah, and He will reign for ever and ever."

The verse states that the kingdom of the world becomes the kingdom of God and the messiah. Not when Christ receives the kingdom.

I would argue, Christ received the kingdom at his ascension to the Father.

Daniel 7:13-14 “I saw in the night visions, and behold, with the clouds of heaven there came one like a son of man, and he came to the Ancient of Days and was presented before him. And to him was given dominion and glory and a kingdom

Luke 19:12 He said therefore, “A nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom and then return.

Where was Jesus when He was placed above all authority, power and dominion?

During His ministry...John 3:35...The Father loves the Son and has placed everything in his hands. Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God's wrath remains on them...

According the the author of Ephesians, Christ was placed above all authority, power, and dominion at his resurrection and ascension to the Father.

Ephesians 1:20-21 That he worked in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places, far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and above every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come.

While Christ was in the flesh, He was lower than the angels.

Hebrews 2:9 But we see him who for a little while was made lower than the angels, namely Jesus, crowned with glory and honor because of the suffering of death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone.

 

[pasifika]

What NT scripture mentions the land as part of the new covenant?



The verse states that the kingdom of the world becomes the kingdom of God and the messiah. Not when Christ receives the kingdom.

I would argue, Christ received the kingdom at his ascension to the Father.

Daniel 7:13-14 “I saw in the night visions, and behold, with the clouds of heaven there came one like a son of man, and he came to the Ancient of Days and was presented before him. And to him was given dominion and glory and a kingdom

Luke 19:12 He said therefore, “A nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom and then return.



According the the author of Ephesians, Christ was placed above all authority, power, and dominion at his resurrection and ascension to the Father.

Ephesians 1:20-21 That he worked in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places, far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and above every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come.

While Christ was in the flesh, He was lower than the angels.

Hebrews 2:9 But we see him who for a little while was made lower than the angels, namely Jesus, crowned with glory and honor because of the suffering of death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone.

Hello, there's lots of NT scriptures mentioned God's promises to Abraham and his descendants you have already quoted some in your previous post ie; galatians 3, Romans 4, Ephesians 2&3, Hebrews 2 etc...you can go back to Genesis and write down all the promises because the new Testament writer always refers back to Gods covenant with Abraham...this includes land, people and God Himself...

I agree that Jesus is the heir of all things But He also provide you and me or the those who belong to Him to be co-heirs with Him regarding those same promises...

You can say that He (Jesus ) enabled ALL promises of God to be Absolute guaranteed to ALL Abraham's Descendants (You and me or "church") as in 2 Corinthians 1:20....

CHRIST did not come to this world to fulfilled those promises for Himself BUT for Abraham's Descendants...

Hebrews 2:14-16..." Since the children have flesh and blood, he too shared in their humanity so that by His death He might break the power of him who holds the power of death, that is the devil, and free those who all their lives were held in slavery by their fear of death. For surely is not angels He helps But Abraham's Descendants. For this reason He had to be made like them, fully human in every way.....etc

Christ doesn't need to be made human in order to be heir of all things since all things were created through Him...Psalm 24:1..." The earth is the Lord's, and everything in it, the world and All who live in it"....

But, as the writer of Hebrews said above (Hebrews 2:14-)...is the descendants of Abraham that He came down to help, and these are Children who belong to God, or the children Gods promise to give to Abraham back in His covenant with him in Genesis 17:4..."As for me this is my covenant with you: You will be father of Many Nations.."

 

[Nige55]

The point being that the Abrahamic promises are fulfilled in Jesus, and not in modern day Israel becoming an independent nation in 1948. The NT clearly states Christ is the heir of all things, Christ is the seed of Abraham to whom the promises were spoken, Christ is the fulfillment of the law, psalms, and prophets, and all the promises of God find their yes in Him. There is no NT scripture that states Israel returning to the land fulfills the abrahmic promises.

Whilst what you've written is not incorrect, it's avoiding much of what we read in the NT. There is no confusion in understanding how God has mapped out Israel's future and the future of the church. The two both have roles to fulfil, and there are events still yet to happen.

 

[Contenders Edge]

What other major river is in Egypt?

Good point.

 

[Contenders Edge]

[I take this thread must be a sequel to this one: "Is the land restoration to the nation of Israel found in the new covenant?"]


The question of whether not land restoration is a part of the New Covenant would be better phrased as to whether or not the promise of land restoration carries over into the New Covenant.

The New Covenant does not list promise of land restoration as being among the things done away with when the Old Covenant passed away and because the NT does not say that it has ever been done away with, then neither can we. If anything at all, there is indication that the promise of land restoration is still in effect. The Apostle Paul believed that if the nation of Israel did not continue to remain in unbelief, that they could be restored. (Rom. 11:11-12, 15) counting them to be, in spite of their unbelief “beloved for the fathers’ sakes”, (Rom. 11:28) meaning they remained beloved of the Father for the sake of their ancestors. He had not forsaken them entirely then; He still has not now.

Promises were made to the people of Israel that were made to no other people and among those promises made, according to the prophet Ezekiel is that in spite of all that had happened to them due to their disobedience and rejection of their Maker, a day would come in which they would be restored as a nation once more and not only that, never again to be removed from the land that God had promised to them. (Ezek. 37:26)

When we read Deuteronomy chapter 30, we notice that the Israelites were rewarded with certain blessings for faithful devotion and obedience to God, curses and judgment which included being exiled from the land given to them if they turned away from the Lord, and a restoration of those blessings which included being returned to their homeland if they repented of their sins and turned back to the Lord.

But what is interesting is that the prophet Ezekiel, in chapter 37, places land restoration before their spiritual restoration. Why is that? No one really knows except that their salvation and the receiving of the Messiah whom they had once rejected (Zech. 12) will be the end result of their restoration as a nation. One likely possibility is that their final spiritual restoration which is tied with their restoration as a nation in their own land was foretold to take place under the terms of a covenant better than the covenant made with their fathers.

The prophet Jeremiah foretold:



“Behold, the days come saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord: But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. (Jer. 31:31-33).”



This restoration foretold by Ezekiel is not a restoration in which God is waiting for the nation of Israel to repent and turn to Him as in times past, but it is a restoration that God Himself initiates and to which the nation of Israel eventually responds by repentance which can only mean one thing: It is destined to take place under a covenant different and better than the covenant made with their ancestors. There is only one covenant superior to that covenant made with the Israelites who were brought out of Egypt and that is the covenant established by the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ our Lord in whom we find forgiveness of sins and salvation.

Granted that the Jews were punished and judged for having rejected their Messiah, but now by an act of grace and to fulfill prophecy and promise, God has restored Israel to her land; the next thing to follow is their acceptance of her Messiah. The next thing to follow is their eventual acceptance of the Messiah they once rejected.

The Old Covenant with its requirements, which is was only meant to be temporary, may have been done away with, but unlike laws which can be cancelled and made obsolete, promises and prophecy are never cancelled. They are fulfilled.

God promised the Jews that He would never cast them off (Jer. 31:35-37, Mal. 3:6 ) and He has declared that they will be saved (Rom. 11:26) and made into the exalted nation and people that He has desired for them to be in the first place. (Zech. 8:20-23, 14:16-21)


The integrity of our Lord is tied to the fact that He fulfills all that has been written and foretold exactly as written. If His promises to Israel are fulfilled in accordance to what scripture says, we can be certain that He will fulfill all promises to all of us who are in Christ whether Jew or Gentile, but if His promises to one group of people are subject to cancelization, then so are any promises made to the Church, leaving us without any certainty as to whether or not they will be fulfilled.

 

[keras]

God promised the Jews that He would never cast them off (Jer. 31:35-37, Mal. 3:6 ) and He has declared that they will be saved (Rom. 11:26) and made into the exalted nation and people that He has desired for them to be in the first place. (Zech. 8:20-23, 14:16-21)

Your exegesis is sloppy and inaccurate.
Malachi 3:6 refers to all the descendants of Jacob.
Jeremiah 31:37 and Romans 11:26 refer to the whole people of Israel.
NOT just the Jewish people and certainly not those who falsely call themselves Jews.

The exalted nation will be the new nation of Beulah, Isaiah 62:1-5, all the faithful Christian people, Jacobs descendants from the 12 tribes and all the people grafted in by their faith.
John sees then in the holy Land soon after the Sixth Seal has depopulated that entire area. Rev 7:9

 

[Contenders Edge]

Your exegesis is sloppy and inaccurate.
Malachi 3:6 refers to all the descendants of Jacob.
Jeremiah 31:37 and Romans 11:26 refer to the whole people of Israel.
NOT just the Jewish people and certainly not those who falsely call themselves Jews.

The exalted nation will be the new nation of Beulah, Isaiah 62:1-5, all the faithful Christian people, Jacobs descendants from the 12 tribes and all the people grafted in by their faith.
John sees then in the holy Land soon after the Sixth Seal has depopulated that entire area. Rev 7:9

Every descendant of Jacob, whether of the tribe of Judah or any of the other tribes of Israel is called a Jew; granted that there was a distinction made between Judah and the rest of the tribes before their exile at the hands of the Assyrian and Babylonians empires, but that distinction disappeared from scripture after the seventy year captivity ended. From that day forth, Israelites and Jews have been regarded as one and the same in fulfillment of Ezekiel chapter 37 who foretold that Judah and the rest of Israel would be united again as one people and one nation and no longer divided.

And though scripture does foretell of some Gentiles living among the Jews in the land of Israel during the forthcoming reign of our Lord, Isaiah's prophecy is directed primarily towards the Jewish people since they will be the predominant residents in the land.

 

[keras]

Every descendant of Jacob, whether of the tribe of Judah or any of the other tribes of Israel is called a Jew; granted that there was a distinction made between Judah and the rest of the tribes before their exile at the hands of the Assyrian and Babylonians empires, but that distinction disappeared from scripture after the seventy year captivity ended. From that day forth, Israelites and Jews have been regarded as one and the same in fulfillment of Ezekiel chapter 37 who foretold that Judah and the rest of Israel would be united again as one people and one nation and no longer divided.

And though scripture does foretell of some Gentiles living among the Jews in the land of Israel during the forthcoming reign of our Lord, Isaiah's prophecy is directed primarily towards the Jewish people since they will be the predominant residents in the land.

I still call that designation; sloppy and totally inaccurate.
The other tribes are NOT called Jews. Some did join Judah in ancient times and may still do so today. But the great prophesied rejoining, Ezekiel 37, has not yet taken place. This is proved by the Promised Blessings not yet received.

Your theory, held by all who have the fanciful notion of going to live in heaven, is not biblical as the Prophets carefully distinguish between the House of Judah and the House of Israel, in over 160 scriptures.
It is every faithful Christian person, who will be the people God always wanted in the holy Land. Isaiah 62:1-5, Ezekiel 34:11-16, Romans 9:24-26 John sees them there in Revelation 7:9.

 

[Contenders Edge]

I still call that designation; sloppy and totally inaccurate.
The other tribes are NOT called Jews. Some did join Judah in ancient times and may still do so today. But the great prophesied rejoining, Ezekiel 37, has not yet taken place. This is proved by the Promised Blessings not yet received.

Your theory, held by all who have the fanciful notion of going to live in heaven, is not biblical as the Prophets carefully distinguish between the House of Judah and the House of Israel, in over 160 scriptures.
It is every faithful Christian person, who will be the people God always wanted in the holy Land. Isaiah 62:1-5, Ezekiel 34:11-16, Romans 9:24-26 John sees them there in Revelation 7:9.

That Israel exists as one people and one nation is proof enough that the rejoining foretold by Ezekiel has already come to pass. Is there more pertaining to Israel that has yet to be fulfilled? Yes there is, but their reunification and re-establishment as a nation has already come to pass, as is made plain by their existence as one nation and one people.

The scriptures distinguishing between the house of Judah and the house of Israel pertain to the pre-exile divided nation, but as I have already stated previously, that distinction disappeared after the seventy-year captivity. From that day forth, both history and scripture have declared Israelites and Jews as being one and the same, irrespective of what tribe each Israelite hails from.

The cited passages contextually pertain only to the people of Israel who will be dwelling in the Holy Land. Granted that the only Israelites who will be living there will be they who have repented and received their Messiah, but scriptures makes it very clear that they will be the descendants of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob nonetheless. They make no mention of the land being given to anyone else. For as it is written, "And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant...and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children forever." (Ezek. 37:25)

As for what John saw, these were the multitude of saints who will have died during the tribulation that is to come upon the world. They are standing and worshipping before the throne of Christ in Heaven, not in Israel.​

 

[jgr]

That Israel exists as one people and one nation is proof enough that the rejoining foretold by Ezekiel has already come to pass. Is there more pertaining to Israel that has yet to be fulfilled? Yes there is, but their reunification and re-establishment as a nation has already come to pass, as is made plain by their existence as one nation and one people.

The scriptures distinguishing between the house of Judah and the house of Israel pertain to the pre-exile divided nation, but as I have already stated previously, that distinction disappeared after the seventy-year captivity. From that day forth, both history and scripture have declared Israelites and Jews as being one and the same, irrespective of what tribe each Israelite hails from.

The cited passages contextually pertain only to the people of Israel who will be dwelling in the Holy Land. Granted that the only Israelites who will be living there will be they who have repented and received their Messiah, but scriptures makes it very clear that they will be the descendants of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob nonetheless. They make no mention of the land being given to anyone else. For as it is written, "And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant...and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children forever." (Ezek. 37:25)

As for what John saw, these were the multitude of saints who will have died during the tribulation that is to come upon the world. They are standing and worshipping before the throne of Christ in Heaven, not in Israel.​

How many molecules of Jewish DNA do I need to qualify as a Jew?

Answer from Scripture.

 

[Contenders Edge]

How many molecules of Jewish DNA do I need to qualify as a Jew?

Answer from Scripture.

How many DNA molecules do you need to qualify as a Gentile? Answer from scripture.

 

[jgr]

How many DNA molecules do you need to qualify as a Gentile? Answer from scripture.

Will God do for the Gentiles what He will do for the Jews?

 

[keras]

That Israel exists as one people and one nation is proof enough that the rejoining foretold by Ezekiel has already come to pass.

But it hasn't; as the promised blessings that will happen when they rejoin, remain unfulfilled.

The Jewish State of Israel, is a nation far from the Godly principals required to be the people of God.
They are basically; the fake Israel - a nation founded on communistic ideals and who rely on their own strength for protection. Many prophesies predict their demise and only a remnant will survive.
Thinking the Israelis are a homogeneous people is plainly wrong and shows your error. They are in fact; just like all other nations; made up from many races and ethnicities.

As for what John saw, these were the multitude of saints who will have died during the tribulation that is to come upon the world. They are standing and worshipping before the throne of Christ in Heaven, not in Israel.[FONT="Verdana",Arial,sans-serif] [/FONT]​

​

Heaven is never mentioned in Revealtion 7. You add that, to your discredit.
God's Throne is a Spiritual entity and can be anywjere and everywhere. The vast multitude of people in Revelation 7:9 are on earth, praising God for their protection and deliverance of the Day of fiery wrath, the just happened Sixth Seal event.