Is it too much to ask?

[IzzyPop]

So I've been single for about a year and have been dating for around 4 months. I guess I spent too much time on a therapist's couch because actually using the skills I picked up there scare women off. See, the problem is that I communicate.

I actually tell a woman what I want. I have the gall to explain that I want her to do the same. I don't want to hear "Can we go into that store?", I want to hear "I want to go into that store." Is that too much to ask? Why pass the choice off to me? If it is something that I truly don't want to do, I won't go, but why should my general distaste of whatever is in there preclude her from looking around? I'm a big boy, I can entertain myself for the 15 minutes she is away from my side.

If I am talking on the phone with a woman and she says something and I don't respond immediately, it means that I am thinking, not that I took offense. I cannot count the number of times I have had a woman apologize for the brief silence as I form my thoughts. If I took offense, I will say so. Believe me, I'm not shy about it. Likewise, if I say something out of line, I expect her to TELL ME! There is nothing I like more than finding out three days later that I angered someone that I am dating. Is that too much to ask?

I'm 35. I date age appropriate women. But there are times when it feels like I'm back in high school with the facades women are putting up for me. I don't want to know the person she thinks I want her to be. I want to know her. Is that too much to ask?

[/rant]

 

[white dove]

I'd tell you exactly what I want. And I'd expect you to comply.


I'm kidding... kind of.


I think many women are conditioned (hate to say it) to be more apologetic than men and to place other's needs ahead of their own.. or even to question their own thoughts/desires. (Remember when you were younger and girls typically had a little lilt at the end of their sentences.. as if to ask a question when they were actually making a statement?) I don't really know what else to say except that some women are actually pretty good at both - knowing what they want/achieving it and placing others ahead of their own needs at times.

 

[Sapphyre]

I think it just depends on the person. I hate it when guys get all apologetic when I don't respond IMMEDIATELY to something they said, too. Especially in instant messaging. Just because it's instant doesn't mean I'm going to respond within a second! So I'm with you there, lol.

About the store thing...that may just be her being polite. I would find it more polite to ask "Can we go into that store?" to take the other person's desires into consideration rather than just demanding to go in. But it would depend on the situation. If it was a date, I would definitely ask. If it was just two people hanging out, or occurring in a more established relationship, I might just say I'm going in.

 

[Inkachu]

No, it isn't too much to ask. I'm a lot like you. I expect age-appropriate intelligence, tact, honesty, and maturity from a man.

The only rebuttal I have is: I would say "Can I go into that store" to be polite and not sound demanding. That's just good manners to me, has nothing to do with being mealy-mouthed or indecisive. But since I'd follow you into a tool store that might hold zero interest for me, just to be kind, I'd hope you'd go into a store with me even if you didn't want to shop there.

 

[Thunder Peel]

The thing that bugs me the most is unreliability. I cannot count the number of times just in the past week when someone said that they'd give me a call, we'd hang out, or that they'd get back to me and never did. I'm a hard guy to make angry but being left hanging out to dry is one of my boiling points and I find it happening more and more with people I know. If you say you're going to do something, then DO IT. If you can't follow through then at least let me know and give me a reason.

All I ask is that people make their word count for something. If I can't rely on someone to follow through and be honest then I won't waste my time. Life is too short to sit around and wait on someone who has no intention of doing what they say they'll do. It all goes back to the original post: be honest.

 

[Inkachu]

Thunder has tasted a bit of The Disappearing Act! See why we women hate it so much??

 

[PassionFruit]

I agree with white dove, women are brought up to behave in a way where we won't come off as being controlling or assertive.

I cannot count the number of times I have had a woman apologize for the brief silence as I form my thoughts. If I took offense, I will say so. Believe me, I'm not shy about it. Likewise, if I say something out of line, I expect her to TELL ME! There is nothing I like more than finding out three days later that I angered someone that I am dating. Is that too much to ask?

As I pointed women aren't brought up like that. And if a woman does this, she's seen as being mean or *gasp* an evil fe-muh-nest!! Like it's an insult.

Personal anecdote
This happened to me before, a guy I knew said something that I found to be incredibly sexist and the issue was I was polite about it, but at the same time I was direct. He didn't seem to like that, and muttered something about me being an angry feminist, and I told him flat out whatever he had to say he could have said it to my face. And he went quiet.

I understand what you're saying IzzyPop, because I dated a guy who required the same, he actually told me on the first date that "I like when a woman is upfront."

So no, it's not too much to ask. As a woman I feel we do ourselves a great disservice when we're not upfront or when we don't tell people what we want.

 

[IzzyPop]

No, it isn't too much to ask. I'm a lot like you. I expect age-appropriate intelligence, tact, honesty, and maturity from a man.

The only rebuttal I have is: I would say "Can I go into that store" to be polite and not sound demanding. That's just good manners to me, has nothing to do with being mealy-mouthed or indecisive. But since I'd follow you into a tool store that might hold zero interest for me, just to be kind, I'd hope you'd go into a store with me even if you didn't want to shop there.

I understand what you are saying about the politeness of it, but it is still putting my decision over yours and not being clear about what you want. I can infer it from that interrogative, but inferences can be wrong. And, for what it is worth, I'd follow along to go purse shopping or whatever to be kind, as well.

 

[GoodNewsJournalist]

Is that too much to ask?

[/rant]

Yes it is.

 

[Im_A]

So I've been single for about a year and have been dating for around 4 months. I guess I spent too much time on a therapist's couch because actually using the skills I picked up there scare women off. See, the problem is that I communicate.

I actually tell a woman what I want. I have the gall to explain that I want her to do the same. I don't want to hear "Can we go into that store?", I want to hear "I want to go into that store." Is that too much to ask? Why pass the choice off to me? If it is something that I truly don't want to do, I won't go, but why should my general distaste of whatever is in there preclude her from looking around? I'm a big boy, I can entertain myself for the 15 minutes she is away from my side.

If I am talking on the phone with a woman and she says something and I don't respond immediately, it means that I am thinking, not that I took offense. I cannot count the number of times I have had a woman apologize for the brief silence as I form my thoughts. If I took offense, I will say so. Believe me, I'm not shy about it. Likewise, if I say something out of line, I expect her to TELL ME! There is nothing I like more than finding out three days later that I angered someone that I am dating. Is that too much to ask?

I'm 35. I date age appropriate women. But there are times when it feels like I'm back in high school with the facades women are putting up for me. I don't want to know the person she thinks I want her to be. I want to know her. Is that too much to ask?

[/rant]

I particularly really like the last part of your rant, as well as the whole rant. This is why I want a blunt woman. I'm not meaning offensive or profane even though some of that is really a turn on for me for some reason, but blunt meaning, an unapologetic female. She is who she is, and she doesn't play the facade of "good girl" because she thinks I want that and she doesn't try to make herself to be a "bad girl" because she thinks I want that. She wants to go shopping and she wants me to go, she comes and says, "Get ready, we're going shopping and I want you to come with me", because she'll have to deal with me coming to her and saying, "I want you to come golfing with me and we're going to do 18 holes, so get ready".

The find out later that oops I screwed up kind of thing? I must admit, I haven't had it a lot, but I've had times that it happened and the few times I've had, was bad enough. I agree with you. If I upset a woman, come and tell me, argue with me if you have to, or explain in great, wonderous female type of detail....anything but silence because I want to know and two problems get worse as time goes on...they never just "go away" or "get better" which then some women don't like that because they need their "time alone" to get over whatever I did, and I suppose I need to be more "understanding" and that'll come when the next woman comes along.

Yes, women need to remember, don't worry about us...we're big boys. If we don't like something, they are going to hear it, and maybe hear it more than they want just as we're going to hear that they don't like something more than what we really want to hear, yet I'd rather have than an overly apologetic woman walking on egg shells.

Nice rant man!

 

[radhead]

I wouldn't mind her asking as long as she didn't stop and turn to me, waiting for my response, and just walked in. The wording wouldn't matter, not unless we were possibly going to be late for something.

 

[Llauralin]

Sometimes women are just shy, as a personality thing. Or have a different communication style (one where a silence *does* mean disapproval for some reason). If that's not OK, then discuss your differences or find an assertive woman to go out with.

 

[HoosierCanuck]

If I'm shopping and want to go into a store, I say "I wanna go in here". I HAVE to be that way because I have different shopping tastes than pretty much anyone I go with shopping (my mum and one friend). I don't like shopping per se, so I'm there for a reason.

Maybe too many women, especially those raised in Christian homes, are taught to be meek and this and that. It's such a bummer that so many people come out messed up with mixed signals about what they 'should' and 'shouldn't' do or say because of legalism. Just be yourself.

I've kind of always thought that in my past relationships, I've been more shy than normal and that was always a bad sign. I think the person that I'm "meant to be with" (if there IS such a thing....), is someone I will be comfy just saying what's on my mind regardless of the subject matter. I'm a naturally crazy person (both the good and bad kinds) and anyone who ends up with me better be able to handle it!

 

[Inkachu]

I understand what you are saying about the politeness of it, but it is still putting my decision over yours and not being clear about what you want. I can infer it from that interrogative, but inferences can be wrong. And, for what it is worth, I'd follow along to go purse shopping or whatever to be kind, as well.

I'm not putting your decision over mine. I'm showing you that YOUR feelings matter to me. It's a polite gesture, it's not meant to start a deep, profound discussion on whether I should go into a store or not, lol. A nice girlfriend asks if he minds, and a nice boyfriend will say sure, go ahead. And vice versa if the guy wants to stop in a "manly" store. Inferences are part of life; you can't do away with them completely, that's just part of human nature. To just say "I'm going to do this and if you don't like it, to heck with you"...not very ladylike or nice. And by my asking if you mind if I stop in a particular store, I'm being very clear about what I want; I want to stop in that store.

I'm not insisting that you agree with me. I'm just explaining how I see it.

 

[Inkachu]

I understand what you are saying about the politeness of it, but it is still putting my decision over yours and not being clear about what you want. I can infer it from that interrogative, but inferences can be wrong. And, for what it is worth, I'd follow along to go purse shopping or whatever to be kind, as well.

And if it makes you feel any better, I am NOT a shopping kind of girl, and you would never be taken purse shopping with me, lol. I'm a tomboy. Get in, buy it, get out.

 

[Inkachu]

She wants to go shopping and she wants me to go, she comes and says, "Get ready, we're going shopping and I want you to come with me", because she'll have to deal with me coming to her and saying, "I want you to come golfing with me and we're going to do 18 holes, so get ready".

Am I weird that I would never demand my boyfriend or husband go anywhere with me? What kind of hooey is that? I'm not his mama, he can come with me if he wants to and stay home if he doesn't want to. And vice versa; a man who says "get ready, you're coming with me cause I say so" would be living sans Inkabink in about 5 seconds lol. I guess I'm really big on letting people make their own choices and not thinking it's all about me and what I want.

 

[Jerimi]

Am I weird that I would never demand my boyfriend or husband go anywhere with me? What kind of hooey is that? I'm not his mama, he can come with me if he wants to and stay home if he doesn't want to. And vice versa; a man who says "get ready, you're coming with me cause I say so" would be living sans Inkabink in about 5 seconds lol. I guess I'm really big on letting people make their own choices and not thinking it's all about me and what I want.

It is just the type of relationship you have with someone. I used to have a girl like that. She was very demanding but also willing to give in to my demands.

But the truth behind this entire thread is that everyone communicates differently and you have to learn the other person. That is the whole point.

 

[Inkachu]

I guess so.

 

[radhead]

A woman shouldn't need to buy a purse in the first place. I'd make her one out of a paper bag reinforced with duct tape.

 

[IzzyPop]

Am I weird that I would never demand my boyfriend or husband go anywhere with me? What kind of hooey is that? I'm not his mama, he can come with me if he wants to and stay home if he doesn't want to. And vice versa; a man who says "get ready, you're coming with me cause I say so" would be living sans Inkabink in about 5 seconds lol. I guess I'm really big on letting people make their own choices and not thinking it's all about me and what I want.

Bingo!

I don't see a couple as a single entity. I see two discrete individuals that where their common interests intersect, they opt to do those things together and where they diverge, they don't. Hopefully, one of their common interests would be spending time with the other.

Of course, my last two relationships ended because they were cheating on me, so maybe my approach to this is wrong...