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Featured is it peter the rock? or is it jesus?

Discussion in 'Christian Philosophy & Ethics' started by lambofgod43985889, Sep 3, 2019.

  1. Yeshua HaDerekh

    Yeshua HaDerekh Men can dream of truth, but then cant live with it

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    Yeah, I switched the 2 and 4, was typing too fast I guess :)
     
  2. prodromos

    prodromos Senior Veteran Supporter

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    This statement is utterly contrary to history.
    Also contrary to history.
    You really need to read actual history and stop relying on Catholic apologetics.
    Honestly, that is three strikes. I hope you are not a baseball fan.
     
  3. JIMINZ

    JIMINZ Well-Known Member

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    Yeah I know what you mean I had to recheck my post when I saw yours that is how I noticed your being wrong.....You not alone. :doh:
     
  4. Kid Knox

    Kid Knox New Member

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  5. Kid Knox

    Kid Knox New Member

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    Then I would ask to provide evidence of your claim as it is contradiction to what I have read from Cyprian of Carthage.
     
  6. misput

    misput jimd

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    The bottom line is the Catholic church is just another religious organization established by man just like all the rest. The one true church is Spiritual and has The Messiah for its foundation and head and those that are being saved as His Spiritual body. Those who follow after a physical visible church are going to be surprised.
     
  7. prodromos

    prodromos Senior Veteran Supporter

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    Christ gave His Church authority to teach, to correct and to discipline. A 'spiritual' church can do none of that.
     
  8. misput

    misput jimd

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    Spoken like a total literalist.
     
  9. JIMINZ

    JIMINZ Well-Known Member

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    So you saying, given the choice, you would rather be a part of the Church that possesses the Physical Authority to teach, correct, discipline, rather than the Spiritual Church of Christ because you cannot wittiness it's Physical workings?
     
  10. prodromos

    prodromos Senior Veteran Supporter

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    No, I am saying that what is claimed to be the 'spritual church of christ' is not the Church as described by the Scriptures.
     
  11. JIMINZ

    JIMINZ Well-Known Member

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    Therefore the only valid Church is the Physical Church of Christ, and the Spiritual Church of Christ cannot exist?
     
  12. prodromos

    prodromos Senior Veteran Supporter

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    There is only one Church. It is both physical and spiritual.
     
  13. tz620q

    tz620q Regular Member Supporter

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    That is the logical fallacy of the false dichotomy. Your statement is based on the false assumption that if the Church is Physical, it cannot be Spiritual.
     
  14. tz620q

    tz620q Regular Member Supporter

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    That Simon is referred to as Peter throughout the Gospels could easily come from the fact that they were written years after the events at a time when Simon was referred to as Peter or Simon Peter more than just Simon.

    I was rather dismayed by your second point. I often get arguments from Orthodox about wanting something to remain a mystery and I can see that form of argument; but rarely do I have an Orthodox Christian use an argument from silence, especially one that is related in another book of scripture.

    This topic, like trying to talk to people who do not believe in the Real Presence, is often a discussion in futility; because neither side is willing to come out from behind their carefully constructed apologetics. I'll make you a deal, if you admit that Jesus was addressing solely Peter in Matthew 16. I'll admit that all of the apostles were given the same mission and the same Holy Spirit to help them carry that mission out. I don't know if there is scripture to back up all of them getting the keys as in Matthew; but all other gifts were given them.
     
  15. JIMINZ

    JIMINZ Well-Known Member

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    Not quite, that is what your saying.
     
  16. mkgal1

    mkgal1 His perfect way sets me free. 2 Samuel 22:33 Supporter

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    I'm posting blindly - as I have only read your OP. I apologize if this has already been answered.
    When Jesus asked Peter....."But who do YOU say I am?" and Peter answered, “You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.” That was the foundation the church was built upon. Not on Peter, but on what Peter had testified.
     
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