Is it OK for Christians to protest against their political leaders?

Hank77

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I agree with what you have said.

It should also be understood, anyone protesting against the Political Powers is Protesting against God Himself, and His Will for us.

Rom. 13:1
Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.

1Ti.2:1
I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
1Ti 2:2 For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
When we protest we are doing what is considered a right by our government, therefore, we are not breaking any laws or even going against our government. WE are our government, that is what made our country the envy of people living in other countries and why democracy has spread around the world. It is blessing that God bestowed on this country and people are quickly forgetting that.

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
 
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JIMINZ

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When we protest we are doing what is considered a right by our government, therefore, we are not breaking any laws or even going against our government. WE are our government, that is what made our country the envy of people living in other countries and why democracy has spread around the world. It is blessing that God bestowed on this country and people are quickly forgetting that.

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

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But wasn't our Country, and Government, begun by our Rebellion against the God Ordained King over the English Colony's.

Canada, Australia, India were all under the English Ruler just as we were, they did not Rebel, but have become Autonomous nonetheless, wouldn't the same have happened to the USA if we had not rebelled.
 
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RDKirk

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But wasn't our Country, and Government, begun by our Rebellion against the God Ordained King over the English Colony's.

Canada, Australia, India were all under the English Ruler just as we were, they did not Rebel, but have become Autonomous nonetheless, wouldn't the same have happened to the USA if we had not rebelled.

Yeah, but it would have required abandoning slavery early on.
 
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Hank77

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But wasn't our Country, and Government, begun by our Rebellion against the God Ordained King over the English Colony's.
Yes, it was. England chose not to give the colonies representation in the government.
Would it have succeeded if God had not been in it? I really can't answer that question, can you?

What we are talking about is the government of the people that we have today and our rights under that government. The right to peacefully assemble and freedom of speech are clear.
 
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S.O.J.I.A.

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we are to love our neighbor as ourselves, take care of widows and orphans, imitate the Samaritan example, follow the commands of God, and make disciples of all nations.

doing this consistently is going to run a foul of derelict governments, as it did in the biblical narrative of acts and was more or less the MO of the apostles.
 
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RDKirk

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Yes, it was. England chose not to give the colonies representation in the government.
Would it have succeeded if God had not been in it? I really can't answer that question, can you?

What we are talking about is the government of the people that we have today and our rights under that government. The right to peacefully assemble and freedom of speech are clear.

With regard to the mission of Christ given to the Church, there was no need for rebellion against England. Christians in America had the freedom they needed to worship as they pleased, and that was not a grievance. Therefore, their prayers in accordance with 2 Timothy 2 had been fulfilled--the king had done his part as required by God.

The grievances the American colonialists had with the king were totally about money, absolutely about money, and about nothing else but money. It was a tax revolt, pure and simple.

God never, ever said that Christians should have "representation in government" (and it's not strictly accurate to say that they did not even then). That was the invention of men who wanted more power to make more money.

With regard to tax revolts, scripture records one such instance, in 2 Chronicles 10. That was the revolt of the northern tribes of Israel against the tax policy of Rehoboam, son of Solomon. Scripture records that Solomon had taxed the nation cruelly (which is why he was so rich). The people pleaded with Rehoboam to relieve them of Solomon's heavy tax burden. Rehoboam responded by increasing the tax burden even further.

As scripture records it, Solomon's taxes were heavy and burdensome, and Rehoboam was being deliberately cruel when he increased them.

But God never said the taxes imposed by kings would be fair and light--God prophesied just the opposite. And yet, God never, ever gave permission not to pay whatever taxes the king levied. Never, not even in the New Testament did the Lord ever say, "You don't have to pay unfair taxes."

So the only tax revolt recorded in scripture ended with ultimate disaster for the rebels--those tribes were swept away in history.

And that's what scripture has to say about tax rebellions and God's attitude toward them.

If tax rebels seem to be doing okay, it's only because no Tower of Siloam happens to have fallen on them...yet.
 
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Hank77

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With regard to the mission of Christ given to the Church, there was no need for rebellion against England. Christians in America had the freedom they needed to worship as they pleased, and that was not a grievance. Therefore, their prayers in accordance with 2 Timothy 2 had been fulfilled--the king had done his part as required by God.

The grievances the American colonialists had with the king were totally about money, absolutely about money, and about nothing else but money. It was a tax revolt, pure and simple.

God never, ever said that Christians should have "representation in government" (and it's not strictly accurate to say that they did not even then). That was the invention of men who wanted more power to make more money.

With regard to tax revolts, scripture records one such instance, in 2 Chronicles 10. That was the revolt of the northern tribes of Israel against the tax policy of Rehoboam, son of Solomon. Scripture records that Solomon had taxed the nation cruelly (which is why he was so rich). The people pleaded with Rehoboam to relieve them of Solomon's heavy tax burden. Rehoboam responded by increasing the tax burden even further.

As scripture records it, Solomon's taxes were heavy and burdensome, and Rehoboam was being deliberately cruel when he increased them.

But God never said the taxes imposed by kings would be fair and light--God prophesied just the opposite. And yet, God never, ever gave permission not to pay whatever taxes the king levied. Never, not even in the New Testament did the Lord ever say, "You don't have to pay unfair taxes."

So the only tax revolt recorded in scripture ended with ultimate disaster for the rebels--those tribes were swept away in history.

And that's what scripture has to say about tax rebellions and God's attitude toward them.

If tax rebels seem to be doing okay, it's only because no Tower of Siloam happens to have fallen on them...yet.
Would you say that Christians shouldn't vote?
 
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RDKirk

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Would you say that Christians shouldn't vote?

I would say that a Christian vote is exceedingly difficult.

The problem with popular elections is this:

Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it. -- Matthew 7

You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world means enmity against God? Therefore, anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God. -- James 4

It's impossible for an uncompromising Christian to win a popular election in this fallen world. It's impossible to win a popular election in this fallen world without becoming a friend of the world.
 
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Hank77

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I would say that a Christian vote is exceedingly difficult.

The problem with popular elections is this:

Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it. -- Matthew 7

You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world means enmity against God? Therefore, anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God. -- James 4

It's impossible for an uncompromising Christian to win a popular election in this fallen world. It's impossible to win a popular election in this fallen world without becoming a friend of the world.
So Christians shouldn't vote because if they do they are voting for someone who is a friend of the world.
 
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JIMINZ

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Yes, it was. England chose not to give the colonies representation in the government.
Would it have succeeded if God had not been in it? I really can't answer that question, can you?

What we are talking about is the government of the people that we have today and our rights under that government. The right to peacefully assemble and freedom of speech are clear.

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As far as God being in it, that would be up for debate.

Because God did give the Israelite's a King, even when He told them what he would be like, they insisted.......Oh well we got what we got.
 
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JIMINZ

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Would you say that Christians shouldn't vote?

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Most definitely they should not vote.

Our position given to us by God is to PRAY For our Government, and if we had there is not telling what Laws that are not on the books would never have made it in the Courts.

We as Christians have been given the Authority, we just don't use it, we Protest,
we can protest till the cows come home, that doesn't give us a voice, but when we Pray, then we go directly to the Thrown Room of God and lay our petitions at our Fathers feet.

If we are the least bit entangled at all with Government, and that even means voting, then our Prayers will not be heard, because we have already chosen who we serve.
 
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Shiloh Raven

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We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Let's not forget the real history of this country and I'm not talking about the perpetuated and disingenuous facade of how America was founded upon freedom, liberty and justice for all or the popular facade among many Christians that this country was founded upon Christian principles.

I'm talking about the history that includes the U.S. government violating every single treaty it signed with tribal nations. This history includes the Indian Removal Act and the Native Americans who being either brutally slaughtered for or forcibly removed from their tribal lands just so white people could have that land for themselves; the 148 years Native Americans were denied U.S. citizenship until the Indian Citizenship Act of 1924; the 202 years Native Americans were denied the freedom of religion until the American Freedom of Religion Act of 1978; the Trail of Tears and the other Native American death marches, the countless massacres of Native Americans, such Sand Creek and Wounded Knee; and the "Kill the Indian, Save the Man" cultural genocide in the American Indian Boarding Schools.

I'm also talking about the history that includes the 89 years of legalized slavery and the 99 years thereafter when the descendants of those freed slaves were legally segregated and systematically denied civil rights and equality to white people until the Civil Rights Movement in 1964. But my disagreement with the facade of "We the People" and Americanism doesn't just include the history of racism and racial injustices in this country. It also includes the social injustice issues that minorities still face in this country today, such as the impunity of police brutality against Native Americans, African Americans and other minorities, the continued treaty violations concerning Standing Rock, Oak Flat, Keystone, and the continued dire need for Civil Rights groups and Social Justice groups (like the NAACP and the American Indian Movement) that still exist in the United States of America today.
 
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JIMINZ

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I hope you were OK with the Tea Party then.

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The Indians weren't invited to the Tea Party, the white men dressed up like Indians so if there was any repercussions, guess who would catch it?
 
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Sketcher

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The Indians weren't invited to the Tea Party, the white men dressed up like Indians so if there was any repercussions, guess who would catch it?
I'm talking about the 2009-2010 protests. I'm unaware of anyone not being welcome to any of them on a basis of race.
 
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JIMINZ

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I'm talking about the 2009-2010 protests. I'm unaware of anyone not being welcome to any of them on a basis of race.

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The person you were answering had just made a post with a liteny of things which have been done against the Indian Peoples, then you make a referenct to the Tea Party, ergo, History takes over. :doh: :sorry:
 
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Shiloh Raven

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The Indians weren't invited to the Tea Party, the white men dressed up like Indians so if there was any repercussions, guess who would catch it?

The 'Sons of Liberty' disguised themselves as Mohawk NDNs. These cowards were too afraid to show up at their own protest as themselves. It's pathetic how they dressed up like Mohawks and pretended to be NDNs, so they could avoid retaliation. Public Protest 101- If you're going to publicly protest against a social or political injustice that you feel very passionate about, at least have the courage to show up to the public demonstration as yourself and not hide who you are behind some disguise.
 
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RestoreTheJoy

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Correct, but injustice must be properly defined. Injustice is not just anything with which you disagree. Others cannot be required to sublimate their religious beliefs to your desires, nor do we permit violation of public policy.

For example, one could (and will eventually) argue "Injustice!" because he can't marry two women at the same time. It's "unjust" that he has to choose, but oh well. It violates public policy for a lot of reasons.
 
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RestoreTheJoy

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...or they aren't and He does. :wave:
tulc(just thought that should be pointed out) :)
Substantiate your assertion. How are screaming rallies and protests NOT flesh displays when they violate scripture?


Romans 13: 1-7 Every person is to be in subjection to the governing authorities For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God. Therefore whoever resists authority has opposed the ordinance of God; and they who have opposed will receive condemnation upon themselves. For rulers are not a cause of fear for good behavior, but for evil. Do you want to have no fear of authority? Do what is good and you will have praise from the same; read more.

1 Timothy 2:1-3
First of all, then, I urge that entreaties and prayers, petitions and thanksgivings, be made on behalf of all men, for kings and all who are in authority, so that we may lead a tranquil and quiet life in all godliness and dignity. This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,

Titus 3:1

Remind them to be subject to rulers, to authorities, to be obedient, to be ready for every good deed,

1 Peter 2:13-14
Submit yourselves for the Lord's sake to every human institution, whether to a king as the one in authority, or to governors as sent by him for the punishment of evildoers and the praise of those who do right.
 
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