Is it Biblical to separate the moral law from the other parts of the Law?

[Ken Rank]

I hope you are planning on finishing this discussion. That is only proper since you have said I was in error.

Him and I were having our own discussion. I don't mind continuing with you but my gosh, you make it difficult. I give you two verses that outright say without question that Aaron was a Levite and you come up with some article that trumps what the bible is saying? Aaron is a Levite.... the Aaronic Priesthood and the Levitical Priesthood are the SAME PRIESTHOOD.

Finish that before jumping back to remnant. And before coming back to remnant... go look it up in all the dictionaries because apparently you didn't trust when I shared what appeared in the lexicons early... all of which say "residue, that which is left, etc."

 

[Ken Rank]

Why haven't these 500 million people, the one's you call the 'remnant' not returned to Israel then?

Where are they? Not following God I imagine.

Because it isn't time... Yeshua hasn't returned yet... this is all part of God's end time plan.

 

[Ken Rank]

Where are they? Not following God I imagine.

And no... they are called Christians.

 

[ToBeLoved]

It is like you just want to argue and you are doing it from a copy and paste what others think position. I gave you the definition of remnant in English, Greek and Hebrew. Ever sew? Crochet? Buy carpet? Go to the store and find a brand new 100 yard roll and buy 1 yard... leaving 99 yards. The 99 yards is the remnant... that which is left over.

Sweetie, I got this off of Biblehub.

I'll link the pages so you know it's not just 'my' thinking but actually Biblical/Bible. Please follow the 'links' so you can see for yourself. This might be a good way for you to study from now on so I will show you.

Go to this page/link
Isaiah 10:22 Interlinear: For though thy people Israel be as the sand of the sea, A remnant doth return of it, A consumption determined, Overflowing with righteousness. (Hebrew of Isaiah 10:22 )

detail on the link for this word. The word, šə·’ār (not the nuber 7605) Note the (e) in parentheses

7605 [e]
šə·’ār
שְׁאָ֖ר
[yet] a remnant
Noun

That will take you to this page Hebrew Concordance: šə·’ār -- 8 Occurrences

Now, notice on the left side that the original word šə·’ār — 8 Occurrences, while on the left side is the root word as well as all the forms of the root word, which is Strong's Hebrew 7605 26 Occurrences

 

[ToBeLoved]

Because it isn't time... Yeshua hasn't returned yet... this is all part of God's end time plan.

I wonder how much time it will take to get 500 million of God's remnant to Israel? The Palestinians are still there, right?

I'll go look for the numbers, BRB

 

[Ken Rank]

I wonder how much time it will take to get 500 million of God's remnant to Israel? The Palestinians are still there, right?

I'll go look for the numbers, BRB

Not long if God is behind it. And 500 million was just a number... the seed is one no man can count. I actually think the idea of the amount of a tithe would seem in harmony with other things God has done... so maybe 700 million out of 7 billion? Just my own guess.

 

[ToBeLoved]

And no... they are called Christians.

lol.

So let me get this right. A remnant of the original Hebrews/Israel are Christians? I don't think the DNA shows that and I don't think all the Hebrew Jews would even consider such a thing.

I think God called them His chosen people and they were part of the chosen bloodline.

 

[ToBeLoved]

I just gave you two verses that say Aaron is a Levite. Your reasoning... that "Aaronic" and "Levitical" have to be two would mean that what... "son of God" and "Son of man" are two different people? Scripture often has more than one word that means the same thing. There are a score of examples, probably more, where "Moses" is used for "God's law." It is an idiom.... and Aaron is a Levite... so I am not impressed with your article, respectfully. I am impressed with what God says.

God had ALL of Aaron son's as priests.

The Levitical priesthood, was NOT ALL of the Levite son's as priests.

The Levitical priesthood also references back to Levi (as explained in that article that shows you what God said) not Aaron, and that parallel has been established in the name Levi-tical.

If you are not interested fine, just don't say that we (gentiles) have been woven into Israel. You guys walk in here and start saying those things and then run as soon as it doesn't support your agenda.

 

[Ken Rank]

Sweetie, I got this off of Biblehub.

I'll link the pages so you know it's not just 'my' thinking but actually Biblical/Bible. Please follow the 'links' so you can see for yourself. This might be a good way for you to study from now on so I will show you.

Go to this page/link
Isaiah 10:22 Interlinear: For though thy people Israel be as the sand of the sea, A remnant doth return of it, A consumption determined, Overflowing with righteousness. (Hebrew of Isaiah 10:22 )

detail on the link for this word. The word, šə·’ār (not the nuber 7605) Note the (e) in parentheses

7605 [e]
šə·’ār
שְׁאָ֖ר
[yet] a remnant
Noun

That will take you to this page Hebrew Concordance: šə·’ār -- 8 Occurrences

Now, notice on the left side that the original word šə·’ār — 8 Occurrences, while on the left side is the root word as well as all the forms of the root word, which is Strong's Hebrew 7605 26 Occurrences

I understand.... but against, the word remnant means "that which is left." In our very modern dictionaries we have the idea of "a small amount" but that is recent... like "gender" becoming a sexual designation rather than just a grammatical term or "gay" meaning homosexual and not just "happy." Remnant means "that which is left" and if you go outside of just the one lexicon and start comparing... you'll see what I am saying is true. I also already posted the Hebrew and Greek and English definitions and all say "that which is left."

You're not going to change my mind because the word means what it means. Its synonyms are: remains, remainder, leftovers, residue, rest. I don't know what else to say.... you keep giving me the Hebrew word with the word "remnant" attached, but remnant doesn't mean what you think it does.

 

[Ken Rank]

God had ALL of Aaron son's as priests.

The Levitical priesthood, was NOT ALL of the Levite son's as priests.

The Levitical priesthood also references back to Levi (as explained in that article that shows you what God said) not Aaron, and that parallel has been established in the name Levi-tical.

The Aaronic priesthood and the Levitical priesthood are the same priesthood. They are the priests to the Temple and to Israel. One and the same.... just as "son of man" and "son of God" are one and the same.

If you are not interested fine, just don't say that we (gentiles) have been woven into Israel.

I am interested but you are insisting on something that is only supported by a very small minority of people. Aaron is a Levite, end of story. I don't care what the article says... if it divides Aaron from the Levites it is wrong. And... by the way... if you have been 'woven into Israel' then you are now part of Israel and no longer a gentile (pagan). That is why Paul said in Eph. 2 that you WERE a gentile in the flesh and WERE an alien of the Commonwealth of Israel but are NOW a "fellow citizen." That is what you are NOW.

Be blessed.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Him and I were having our own discussion. I don't mind continuing with you but my gosh, you make it difficult. I give you two verses that outright say without question that Aaron was a Levite and you come up with some article that trumps what the bible is saying? Aaron is a Levite.... the Aaronic Priesthood and the Levitical Priesthood are the SAME PRIESTHOOD.

Finish that before jumping back to remnant. And before coming back to remnant... go look it up in all the dictionaries because apparently you didn't trust when I shared what appeared in the lexicons early... all of which say "residue, that which is left, etc."

I didn't say Aaron was not a Levite. I am explaining how the Aaronic priesthood is distinguished and different from the Levitical priesthood.

Otherwise they would both have the same name, but God in His wisdom divided the two priesthoods in His Word.

 

[ToBeLoved]

The Aaronic priesthood and the Levitical priesthood are the same priesthood. They are the priests to the Temple and to Israel. One and the same

Are all the son's and desendents of Levi, Levitical priests?

Now, if you can show that (and you cannot), then ... not the same priesthood. God Himself named them and called them separately. This is in the Torah. I can find it for you.

 

[ToBeLoved]

I understand.... but against, the word remnant means "that which is left." In our very modern dictionaries we have the idea of "a small amount" but that is recent... like "gender" becoming a sexual designation rather than just a grammatical term or "gay" meaning homosexual and not just "happy." Remnant means "that which is left" and if you go outside of just the one lexicon and start comparing... you'll see what I am saying is true. I also already posted the Hebrew and Greek and English definitions and all say "that which is left."

You're not going to change my mind because the word means what it means. Its synonyms are: remains, remainder, leftovers, residue, rest. I don't know what else to say.... you keep giving me the Hebrew word with the word "remnant" attached, but remnant doesn't mean what you think it does.

Because you look at the root word which has 22 occurances, rather than looking at and evaluating the actual word which has 8 occurances. Is this how you guys study the Bible?

 

[ToBeLoved]

"
You're not going to change my mind because the word means what it means. Its synonyms are: remains, remainder, leftovers, residue, rest. I don't know what else to say.... you keep giving me the Hebrew word with the word "remnant" attached, but remnant doesn't mean what you think it does.

I don't need to change your mind. I want to show people that we gentiles are not a part of Israel, a grafting in. We are grafted into God's family, but Israel is one sheep pen and gentiles are the other sheep pen. So stop saying that and I won't bring it up again.

So then Hebrew word has no meaning, and those who wrote Interlinear Hebrew know much less than you do?

You speak and write perfect English, what is your background in reading and writing Hebrew?

 

[Ken Rank]

lol.

So let me get this right. A remnant of the original Hebrews/Israel are Christians? I don't think the DNA shows that and I don't think all the Hebrew Jews would even consider such a thing.

I think God called them His chosen people and they were part of the chosen bloodline.

I didn't say anything about DNA....

 

[Ken Rank]

I don't need to change your mind. I want to show people that we gentiles are not a part of Israel, a grafting in. We are grafted into God's family, but Israel is one sheep pen and gentiles are the other sheep pen. So stop saying that and I won't bring it up again.

So then Hebrew word has no meaning, and those who wrote Interlinear Hebrew know much less than you do?

You speak and write perfect English, what is your background in reading and writing Hebrew?

Paul said you >>WERE<< a gentile and you want to show people you ARE a gentile. You are at odds with Scripture. A gentile as a word when first used in our bibles meant "anyone not a Christian or Jew, a pagan, a heathen." It was anyone who didn't belong to God. NOW it means any believer who isn't Jewish. So you can, in modern terms, be a gentile... but Scripturally speaking, you are NOT a gentile. It is not possible, Scripturally speaking, to be a gentile and a child of God at the same time.

 

[Ken Rank]

Because you look at the root word which has 22 occurances, rather than looking at and evaluating the actual word which has 8 occurances. Is this how you guys study the Bible?

The root word isn't always what drives the definition. AND... again... if the seed is a number no man can count, then the "remnant" isn't a small amount. No matter how you try to take that apart, that fact remains.

 

[Ken Rank]

Are all the son's and desendents of Levi, Levitical priests?

Now, if you can show that (and you cannot), then ... not the same priesthood. God Himself named them and called them separately. This is in the Torah. I can find it for you.

The tribe of Levi are the priests... that is what the bible says. If your theology can't reconcile that, then that isn't my problem, it is yours. Sorry, just being honest.

Deuteronomy 18:1 The priests, the Levites--all the tribe of Levi--shall have no part nor inheritance with Israel; they shall eat the offerings of the Lord made by fire, and His portion.

Yes, all of them.

Numbers 3:32 And Eleazar the son of Aaron the priest was to be chief over the leaders of the Levites, with oversight of those who kept charge of the sanctuary.

So, the line from Aaron remains the leader over the Levites... a separate priesthood? No... the same.

Again... are the son of man and the son of God two different people? Of course not.... but because two different words are used for the priesthood they have to be different?

 

[Vicomte13]

I didn't say Aaron was not a Levite. I am explaining how the Aaronic priesthood is distinguished and different from the Levitical priesthood.

Otherwise they would both have the same name, but God in His wisdom divided the two priesthoods in His Word.

The Aaronic priesthood is indeed distinct. Specifically: only one family, the Aaronites, could serve at the altar, light incense and fire before the Lord, and enter the Holy of Holies. Only the (single) reigning High Priest wore the ephod and had the Urim and Thummin in his possession, whereby be could directly consult God.

THE High Priest was essentially the Pope of the Judaic priesthood. He was part of the family line of Aaron, who were the High Priests who served directly at the Jerusalem altar, and the altar of the Tabernacle during the time in the Wilderness.

The Levites were a whole clan, living all over the kingdoms of Israel and Judah. It was their job to act as administrators - to collect and distribute the tithes, to take and distribute the first fruits, to act as judges, to purify houses and the unclean.

Thrice per year the whole of Israelite maledom was to go to Jerusalem to festivals presided over by the High Priest, but the rest of the time, in their villages and towns, it was the local Levitical priests - the kohanim - who performed the various local rituals, especially acting as judges.

 

[klutedavid]

Hello Ken.

I need some clarification from you.

Isaiah 10:22, which is what Paul quotes in Romans 9:27, has a form of shuv in Hebrew and I don't see any of the top translations (KJV, NKJV, NIV, RVS, NASB, NLT, etc.) using any other English word than "return" in that Isaiah verse. Since THAT IS what Paul is quoting, then that is what should appear in Romans 9:27.

Are you saying that the text (Romans 9:27) should be translated as below?

Romans 9
27 Isaiah cries out concerning Israel, “Though the number of the sons of Israel be like the sand of the sea, it is the remnant that will RETURN (be saved)."