Is it a sin to divide into denominations?

[sunlover1]

Bible as standard for this thread please.

Id like us to consider if this is "sin".

IF sin, how to remedy?

 

[Ken Rank]

Bible as standard for this thread please.

Id like us to consider if this is "sin".

IF sin, how to remedy?

My answer is no AS LONG AS the denominations themselves do not create bylaws that cause separation in "brotherhood" from other denominations. We are supposed to be one body of Christ, one House if you will... but we also shouldn't expect to agree on every single detail. And, we all have different callings... so the idea that we might have a sect isn't unbiblical, unless that sect develops a superiority complex and divides from others believers. THEN it is not only a sin, it is something God HATES! (see Proverbs 6:16-19 with the weight on vs. 19)

 

[Albion]

If ones church goes into error, there is hardly any choice but to find or create an alternate assembly. The New Testament requires no less.

 

[Kevin Snow]

Yes we are called to be in agreement over every single detail. When it says that we are to be of one mind, how else are we to accomplish this? Factionalism in the church is a defeat for the church because the true church is fully united in Christ. What the factionalism means is this: we do not yet know enough about the revelation of Jesus Christ to unite all our differences. But when this scripture is fulfilled then we will know.

For the earth will be filled with the knowledge of the glory of the LORD as the waters cover the sea. ~Habakkuk 2:14

We see that a sharp disagreement arose between Paul and Barnabas about whether they should receive John Mark back into the work that they were doing. He left them at some point and then wanted to come back and Paul and Barnabas could not agree with each other about what to do, so they split up. This is the basis for all denominations. We do the same exact thing. We cannot agree so we split up. But it's not to say that a different gospel is preached because of this. Paul and Barnabas still brought the gospel message of Jesus Christ to the world. So this is where we get the idea of essentials vs non essentials in the church. There are core beliefs which we all must have to be called a church of Christ but then there are things which we differ in simply because we don't have the fullness of understanding. When this understanding comes however, will we unite? I believe that just as Jesus Christ was unknown to the Jews when he came, even though he was written of in the scriptures, so also will the church by and large not recognize what the fullness of understanding is when it comes. But there will be some from every corner who do recognize it.

 

[Sanoy]

1 Corinthians 11:17-20

"17In the following directives I have no praise for you, for your meetings do more harm than good. 18In the first place, I hear that when you come together as a church, there are divisions among you, and to some extent I believe it. 19No doubt there have to be differences among you to show which of you have God’s approval."

(Further context to be safe. "20So then, when you come together, it is not the Lord’s Supper you eat, 21for when you are eating, some of you go ahead with your own private suppers. As a result, one person remains hungry and another gets drunk. 22Don’t you have homes to eat and drink in? Or do you despise the church of God by humiliating those who have nothing? What shall I say to you? Shall I praise you? Certainly not in this matter!)

So I think division is part of the situation, but we should not be a divided body. We can be Baptists, Methodists, Catholics etc, but we still be one body.

 

[com7fy8]

"Now I plead with you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment." (1 Corinthians 1:10)

This was written to the Corinthians who had major sin problems; yet, God expected even them to become able to "speak the same thing" . . . which is possible with God, and if He commands this He knows this is a realistic expectation to have for us. And He is so able to make us "perfectly joined together".

But if I am doing well in a church which is part of a denomination, I can be perfectly joined to any others who are God's way.

I think of a few things >

It is clear how we Jesus people are "members of one another" (Romans 12:5, Ephesians 4:25). And we minister to each other, using our gifts > 1 Peter 4:9-10. So, it is not good to have nearby churches with their people away from each other so they are not ministering their gifts to each other.

Also, if we have a number of different buildings . . . this can take up money to maintain more buildings than needed for the Christians in a certain area. And there are various groups who have become small in large and old buildings which they have to pay to take care of.

And there can be a big expense for heating meeting spaces which have high ceilings where the heat can accumulate up where people do not even get it; and that costs a bit to pay for the fuel.

And the members who are especially qualified to care for buildings might be spread out in different churches so that certain places might not get the benefit of their abilities.

So, God in the Bible says we need to be good stewards.

But people can get into preferences for ideas and who is preaching in their churches. And Paul, after he says to speak the same thing, then says how the Corinthians were picking favorite ministers. So, the divisions might not be an issue mainly about ideas, but what is maybe especially wrong is to follow a favorite minister and exalt that person over others. Then can come comparison of people, instead of dealing with how we are in comparison with Jesus.

"For we dare not class ourselves or compare ourselves with those who commend themselves. But they, measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves with themselves, are not wise." (2 Corinthians 10:12)

So, again, I consider that divisions that make a big deal out of some one person over others is a bigger problem than having different ideas.

"nor as being lords over those entrusted to you, but being examples to the flock." (1 Peter 5:3)

So, I would say make sure a church knows what they are doing with their money and property and they have people who are taking care of those things. And help them, but be careful about letting yourself become the only one who is helping.

And do not get tangled in worldly church people's stuff > 2 Timothy 2:4. But keep free to make sure with God and go with how He leads you. I understand a Christian group will welcome you to keep testing with God about what He wants > after all, we grow and mature, then discover what our Father has us doing; so I do not think it is smart for you as a young Christian to make commits now for who you will become as a mature person later

 

[sunlover1]

cant wait to read these!
Have to get ready for sons wedding.
Blessings!

 

[sunlover1]

Yes we are called to be in agreement over every single detail. When it says that we are to be of one mind, how else are we to accomplish this? Factionalism in the church is a defeat for the church because the true church is fully united in Christ. What the factionalism means is this: we do not yet know enough about the revelation of Jesus Christ to unite all our differences. But when this scripture is fulfilled then we will know.

For the earth will be filled with the knowledge of the glory of the LORD as the waters cover the sea. ~Habakkuk 2:14

We see that a sharp disagreement arose between Paul and Barnabas about whether they should receive John Mark back into the work that they were doing. He left them at some point and then wanted to come back and Paul and Barnabas could not agree with each other about what to do, so they split up. This is the basis for all denominations. We do the same exact thing. We cannot agree so we split up. But it's not to say that a different gospel is preached because of this. Paul and Barnabas still brought the gospel message of Jesus Christ to the world. So this is where we get the idea of essentials vs non essentials in the church. There are core beliefs which we all must have to be called a church of Christ but then there are things which we differ in simply because we don't have the fullness of understanding. When this understanding comes however, will we unite? I believe that just as Jesus Christ was unknown to the Jews when he came, even though he was written of in the scriptures, so also will the church by and large not recognize what the fullness of understanding is when it comes. But there will be some from every corner who do recognize it.

Hello Kevin, I so agree with that last sentence.
I believe that those who are filled with His Spirit, DO agree, already.
Any person that I meet, regardless of race creed or color, who's filled
up with the Spirit of God, speaks the same thing!

 

[sunlover1]

My answer is no AS LONG AS the denominations themselves do not create bylaws that cause separation in "brotherhood" from other denominations. We are supposed to be one body of Christ, one House if you will... but we also shouldn't expect to agree on every single detail.

I don't think we can agree on every single detail either, because we're all at different levels
and stages in our walks.
As we mature, you'd think that we'd come into more and more
wisdom/truth of God's ways. imo

And, we all have different callings... so the idea that we might have a sect isn't unbiblical, unless that sect develops a superiority complex and divides from others believers. THEN it is not only a sin, it is something God HATES! (see Proverbs 6:16-19 with the weight on vs. 19)

But isn't that what a sect is to begin with?
A dividing away over feeling they're right(er)?

 

[sunlover1]

If ones church goes into error, there is hardly any choice but to find or create an alternate assembly. The New Testament requires no less.

IMO (again, just my opinion)every church has some error.
Men, human men lead churches, interpret Scripture etc.
So imo...

 

[Desires Light]

Bible as standard for this thread please.

Id like us to consider if this is "sin".

IF sin, how to remedy?

NIV
I appeal to you, brothers and sisters, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another in what you say and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be perfectly united in mind and thought.

 

[Albion]

IMO (again, just my opinion)every church has some error.
Men, human men lead churches, interpret Scripture etc.
So imo...

That is probably so. My view is that it is when the error treads upon essential beliefs or practices that leaving is called for. Obviously, I would say, stalking off because you disagree with something trivial would not be right to do

 

[sunlover1]

That is probably so. My view is that it is when the error treads upon essential beliefs or practices that leaving is called for. Obviously, I would say, stalking off because you disagree with something trivial would not be right to do

I could be wrong here (again) but wouldn't a group that gets it so wrong that you'd have
to disfellowship, be a non Christian group?
I mean, what would it take to fellowship with any group?
For me, it would be that they worship the Jesus of the Bible.
And how to know? The Jesus they worship would have the
Biblical attributes, but beyond that and maybe even more
important than that, I would "know".
Those who are led by the Spirit of God will be called
the sons of God.
We MUST be able to "hear" our Shepherd's voice.

IMO

 

[Albion]

They would certainly be Christian.

I used to attend a non-denominational congregation, but although I respected the people and a lot of the teachings, and liked the sermons, I could not in good conscience accept their beliefs that Baptism by immersion is required for salvation (and that mine was invalid), that all other Christians are marginally non-Christians, and that the Holy Communion was just a symbol.

I was not a member, so the situation was somewhat different from what we have been talking about, but I would never have been able to justify joining that church (which amounts to about the same situation, I guess).

 

[sunlover1]

They would certainly be Christian.

I used to attend a non-denominational congregation, but although I respected the people and a lot of the teachings, and liked the sermons, I could not in good conscience accept their beliefs that Baptism by immersion is required for salvation (and that mine was invalid), that all other Christians are marginally non-Christians, and that the Holy Communion was just a symbol.

I was not a member, so the situation was somewhat different from what we have been talking about, but I would never have been able to justify joining that church (which amounts to about the same situation, I guess).

I also disagree with that mandate for salvation (water immersion)
I disagree with calling any others "marginal" in any way when it comes to salvation.
And I don't care how other's view Communion. (within reason)
In my simple mind, I believe (opinion obviously) that if we were to stand 20 of us
side by side and each give our paraphrase of what/how of the body and blood.. that
there would be more than 2 different explanations of it.
Also don't believe that mine is necessarily correct and yours wrong or vice versa lol.

So many things i "think" become things I once thought and make room for RENEWED
thoughts... as I grow in Christ.

My thoughts on "joining" churches as in memberships are kind of mixed.
Do we "need" to be a member of any.. "club" (Just using a different term
for denomination, could use group, tribe, family, community etc)
But is there a thing wrong with being a "Bible believing Christian" who let's God
lead where he should be moment by moment day by day?.. so not necessarily
card carrying, but still part of the family or familieS?
Shrug.

 

[bbbbbbb]

They would certainly be Christian.

I used to attend a non-denominational congregation, but although I respected the people and a lot of the teachings, and liked the sermons, I could not in good conscience accept their beliefs that Baptism by immersion is required for salvation (and that mine was invalid), that all other Christians are marginally non-Christians, and that the Holy Communion was just a symbol.

I was not a member, so the situation was somewhat different from what we have been talking about, but I would never have been able to justify joining that church (which amounts to about the same situation, I guess).

Church membership has been a rather moot question in modern Christianity. In most denominations membership carries few, if any, privileges and non-membership carries few, if any, penalties.

My brother and sister-in-law attended a church that heavily emphasized membership for several years. My sister-in-law is a wonderful singer. When they began attending she was asked to perform in the Sunday evening services and was told that when she became a member then she would be permitted to perform in the Sunday morning service. As she was doing this for free she had no strong compulsion. After a time the screws were put on them to join the church, although they had been faithfully attending the services and had become active in other ways. The pastor then informed her that she would be only permitted to perform for the little children in Sunday School until they joined. They left the church when it became such a divisive issue for them.

 

[Albion]

My brother and sister-in-law attended a church that heavily emphasized membership for several years. My sister-in-law is a wonderful singer. When they began attending she was asked to perform in the Sunday evening services and was told that when she became a member then she would be permitted to perform in the Sunday morning service. As she was doing this for free she had no strong compulsion. After a time the screws were put on them to join the church, although they had been faithfully attending the services and had become active in other ways. The pastor then informed her that she would be only permitted to perform for the little children in Sunday School until they joined. They left the church when it became such a divisive issue for them.

I'm sorry to learn that this happened. I am assuming that it is characteristic of certain denominations because, in my experience, a wide range of churches have welcomed me, invited me into their choirs, and considered me to be an unofficial member of their community, even though I never said that I was thinking of joining but simply had an interest in their faith, style of worship, or something along those lines.

 

[Ken Rank]

I don't think we can agree on every single detail either, because we're all at different levels
and stages in our walks.
As we mature, you'd think that we'd come into more and more
wisdom/truth of God's ways. imo

I always ask folks this question because it usually helps them take it a little easier on those who aren't where they are... YET. I ask, "do you have the same understanding today that you had 5 years ago?" And then follow that up with, "Do you believe in 5 years you will have grown more or have you reached a complete understanding of all things now?" Understanding that question(s) reveals to us that not only are we in a process... but so is everyone else.

But isn't that what a sect is to begin with?
A dividing away over feeling they're right(er)?

Perhaps in some cases. I don't think we can fix that, I thing God will in His time. But if we can at least get to a point where we can not demean another brother who happens to come to a different understanding on a non-salvation issue (which is most issues) then we'll be ok. For example... if you read a certain verse and see a vertical rapture and life in heaven... and I read a horizontal rapture (like the one Phillip had after being with the Eunuch) and life in a Kingdom on Earth... are we at a point where we can't work together? Can't co-exist? Don't consider ourselves brothers? We both believe we going to be with the Lord, we both believe we'll be perfected, that it will be a time of peace and restoration... so who cares if we disagree on that? Maybe we're both wrong! But, therein lies another problem... we're an insecure people who can't handle be wrong too much.

Be blessed.
Ken

 

[Inkfingers]

Bible as standard for this thread please.

Id like us to consider if this is "sin".

IF sin, how to remedy?

Denominations are actually an attempt to unify, its just that people disagree as to what they should be unifying around....

 

[sunlover1]

I always ask folks this question because it usually helps them take it a little easier on those who aren't where they are... YET. I ask, "do you have the same understanding today that you had 5 years ago?" And then follow that up with, "Do you believe in 5 years you will have grown more or have you reached a complete understanding of all things now?" Understanding that question(s) reveals to us that not only are we in a process... but so is everyone else.



Perhaps in some cases. I don't think we can fix that, I thing God will in His time. But if we can at least get to a point where we can not demean another brother who happens to come to a different understanding on a non-salvation issue (which is most issues) then we'll be ok. For example... if you read a certain verse and see a vertical rapture and life in heaven... and I read a horizontal rapture (like the one Phillip had after being with the Eunuch) and life in a Kingdom on Earth... are we at a point where we can't work together? Can't co-exist? Don't consider ourselves brothers? We both believe we going to be with the Lord, we both believe we'll be perfected, that it will be a time of peace and restoration... so who cares if we disagree on that? Maybe we're both wrong! But, therein lies another problem... we're an insecure people who can't handle be wrong too much.

Be blessed.
Ken

Indeed!
I wish we could all be one.