Is Gandhi going to hell?

makeupgirl

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eternal torment is a lie.

Eternal torment is not a lie. I say that because Hell isn't meant for humans but for Satan and his demons but, but we were born with a sinful nature and even though it's not our fault, God has given each and every one of us a way to be free from that and to live with him eternally in heaven. It is his will that no one perish. If you reject Jesus as your Lord and Savior then I'm sorry you've just rejected eternal life. You have chosen to go to Hell based on the fact that you've rejected Christ. He's the only way to eternal life, to the Father, to Heaven so if anyone of us died today, then there is only 2 places to go, Heaven or Hell. IF you have chosen Christ and accepted him as Your Lord and Savior then you're going to Heaven. If not, then you have chosen to go to Hell. It's not about God being a cruel God because he's not. He sat conditions and provisions in his word to let us know how to get to Heaven, how to be reconcile back to him and the bible does say that in so many words that sin = death. If you still live in sin and you've rejected Christ, then you've chosen death, hell, and the grave the very thing that Christ conquered for us.
 
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stormdancer0

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And this line of thinking is the result of the idea of eternal torment. Leaving us to either 1. Write of God as a cruel tyrant, which many people have done & or 2. Lower the standards God has set.

People will therefore conclude
1. God is a saddist/cruel tyrant, and not want anything to do with such a being.
2. God is good. A good being would not torture such and such a person for eternity therefore they must be in heaven.

people can conclude whatever they will. A good being, God or not, would not torture people for eternity. But if the torture is there, a good being WOULD provide a way out. This He has done. But if people insist on walking off a cliff that God has pointed out time and time again, how can you say God is torturing them? People who choose not to believe God are CHOOSING hell, whether they want to believe it or not.

He died a horrible, painful death, one totally undeserved, to provide this way. It is ridiculously unfair to expect anything more than that, especially since God could have easily destroyed everything and created a new race of man who follow Him unquestioningly.
 
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capnator

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Eternal torment is not a lie. I say that because Hell isn't meant for humans but for Satan and his demons but, but we were born with a sinful nature and even though it's not our fault, God has given each and every one of us a way to be free from that and to live with him eternally in heaven. It is his will that no one perish. If you reject Jesus as your Lord and Savior then I'm sorry you've just rejected eternal life. You have chosen to go to Hell based on the fact that you've rejected Christ. He's the only way to eternal life, to the Father, to Heaven so if anyone of us died today, then there is only 2 places to go, Heaven or Hell. IF you have chosen Christ and accepted him as Your Lord and Savior then you're going to Heaven. If not, then you have chosen to go to Hell. It's not about God being a cruel God because he's not. He sat conditions and provisions in his word to let us know how to get to Heaven, how to be reconcile back to him and the bible does say that in so many words that sin = death. If you still live in sin and you've rejected Christ, then you've chosen death, hell, and the grave the very thing that Christ conquered for us.

Don't missunderstand me, Hell is a certainty but it doesn't last for eternity. And you are correct it is prepared for the devil and his angels.

However I have just highlighted in your own post why it doesn't last forever. Sin = death, nowhere does the bible promise eternal life for those who have rejected Christ. Not even eternal life of misery in hell. I already quoted in Malachi 4 the wicked are as stubble and are burned up, burned to ashes that can be walked on.
 
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makeupgirl

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Don't missunderstand me, Hell is a certainty but it doesn't last for eternity. And you are correct it is prepared for the devil and his angels.

However I have just highlighted in your own post why it doesn't last forever. Sin = death, nowhere does the bible promise eternal life for those who have rejected Christ. Not even eternal life of misery in hell. I already quoted in Malachi 4 the wicked are as stubble and are burned up, burned to ashes that can be walked on.

Forgive me if I misunderstood you. Hell is actually eternal, just like Heaven is eternal. Those who are not in Christ (and I should have posted this before) names are not written into the book of life. Once you receive Christ, your name is written in the book of life. Rev 20:15 says thus "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death, so it is scary and frightening for those who haven't given their life to Christ and I now see why he left us here after we got saved to spread his gospel so that everyone could be saved. Rev 20:11 says " And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whoese face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was no found place for them. vs. 12 - and I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God and the books were opened, which is the book of life and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. vs. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them; and they were judged every man according to their works. vs. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. vs. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. Vs. 27 of Rev 21 calls the book of life, the Lambs book of life. It will be a sad day indeed for those who rejected Christ and have to stand before the White throne Judgement. If their names aren't in the book of life, then they have rejected Christ and will unfortuntely be cast into the lake of fire.

The verse that I meant to write regarding sin = death thing is James 1:15 Then when last hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin; and sin when it is finished, bringeth forth death. I didn't mean sin = death. I was just typing so fast and working at the same time. But the verse in James kinda makes it seem that way.
 
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Godlife

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Lets get back to the fundemental truth of salvation. Even the nicest, most honorable, sweetest, uprigt, spiritual, etc. (add ALL the words you can think of) person still falls short of the glory of God.

Romans 3:22-24
"This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus."

As Angus Buchan a famous preacher in SA says, "Good people don't go to heaven, BELIEVERS DO"

We cannot put God in a box and attribute human sensibilities to Him. We can only bow down and tremble at the AWSOMENESS of the GREAT IAM.:bow:

I don't hereby say that you can go on sinning because you believe, because if you truely believe and live in a close relationship with Jesus, you will repent and and turn from your sinful ways. We will want to do works that is acceptable to God. The works however is BECAUSE we were saved and NOT to BE saved!!
 
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capnator

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Forgive me if I misunderstood you. Hell is actually eternal, just like Heaven is eternal. Those who are not in Christ (and I should have posted this before) names are not written into the book of life. Once you receive Christ, your name is written in the book of life. Rev 20:15 says thus "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death, so it is scary and frightening for those who haven't given their life to Christ and I now see why he left us here after we got saved to spread his gospel so that everyone could be saved. Rev 20:11 says " And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whoese face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was no found place for them. vs. 12 - and I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God and the books were opened, which is the book of life and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. vs. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them; and they were judged every man according to their works. vs. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. vs. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. Vs. 27 of Rev 21 calls the book of life, the Lambs book of life. It will be a sad day indeed for those who rejected Christ and have to stand before the White throne Judgement. If their names aren't in the book of life, then they have rejected Christ and will unfortuntely be cast into the lake of fire.

The verse that I meant to write regarding sin = death thing is James 1:15 Then when last hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin; and sin when it is finished, bringeth forth death. I didn't mean sin = death. I was just typing so fast and working at the same time. But the verse in James kinda makes it seem that way.

Exactly so even in the destruction of the wicked God is merciful. They are thrown into hell and die. This death is eternal, wickedness ceases to exist. There is no eternal torture of people in hellfire, the bible calls it the second death. The earth is also cleansed with fire and in the next chapter of revelation we read about the earth being made new.

God means it when He tells us that the wages of sin is death.
 
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Gregory Thompson

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people who dont believe in jesus are going to hell according to the bible. so i decided to pick the posterboy for peace...mohandas gandhi. he wasnt christian...so according to the christian tradition that kid in the video states...gandhi is going to hell...

true or false? comments, opinions are appreciated.

Romans 14:4
Who are you to judge someone else's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. And he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.

He was exposed to the gospel from what i understand . and then got turned off from the church because they were nothing like Jesus

so only God really knows what happened to that seed .

i know because of his influence on hinduism and its modern offshoots . i have more to talk about to hindus .

so really . who can say except God?
 
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Aeyamar

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Romans 14:4
Who are you to judge someone else's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. And he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand.
<snip>
so really . who can say except God?

I approve of the above. :thumbsup:

I would also like to point out that if you interpret works as a reflection of faith. as the book of James suggests. (Good works come from allowing the Holy Spirit to work through you, while bad works come from not doing this.) Then, Ghandi does have the faith and likely in abundance.
 
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stormdancer0

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I approve of the above. :thumbsup:

I would also like to point out that if you interpret works as a reflection of faith. as the book of James suggests. (Good works come from allowing the Holy Spirit to work through you, while bad works come from not doing this.) Then, Ghandi does have the faith and likely in abundance.
Works is not a reflection of faith. It is a result of faith. There are some very "good" people, who do good works, who will go to hell because they have refused to humble themselves before the Lord. Reject Christ, go to hell. Accept Christ, live with Him for eternity. Only two choices, folks. It makes me sad that people like Gandhi may go to hell. But it isn't my world.
 
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Gregory Thompson

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Sorry, just occurred to me,

can someone tell me how the subject of hell falls under the category of edification?

" Please sign in for an introduction to deeper fellowship forum."

Edification means uplifting enlightment.

So we ask that it be kept to that.

We ask that debatable material be left on the debate forums, no intimadation that causes others to leave the forum to give place to bully tactics, and that a peaceful, safe environment be maintained.

Welcome to the forum and God bless your time here. Please abide by this in Jesus' love."

This statement has been approved and stickied by The Princess Bride , Supervisor over Edification. :)
 
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Aeyamar

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Works is not a reflection of faith. It is a result of faith. There are some very "good" people, who do good works, who will go to hell because they have refused to humble themselves before the Lord. Reject Christ, go to hell. Accept Christ, live with Him for eternity. Only two choices, folks. It makes me sad that people like Gandhi may go to hell. But it isn't my world.

The argument still stands if you use "result" instead "reflection" (In terms of connotation in this sentence, the meaning remains the same.). It's the logical equivalent of "where there's smoke there's fire". Good works come from allowing God to work through you. Allowing God to work through you is a part of Faith. So where there are good works there is faith.
 
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stormdancer0

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The argument still stands if you use "result" instead "reflection" (In terms of connotation in this sentence, the meaning remains the same.). It's the logical equivalent of "where there's smoke there's fire". Good works come from allowing God to work through you. Allowing God to work through you is a part of Faith. So where there are good works there is faith.

I agree - except that last statement. Man in his natural state is capable of doing good works.

It is man's purpose to glorify God. If someone does a good work, and then tries to glorify Satan, that act, no matter how good, is counted evil - not because of the act, but because of the motive.

And no, hell is not an "edification" topic. This post is, perhaps, in the wrong forum.
 
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Aeyamar

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I agree - except that last statement. Man in his natural state is capable of doing good works.

It is man's purpose to glorify God. If someone does a good work, and then tries to glorify Satan, that act, no matter how good, is counted evil - not because of the act, but because of the motive.

And no, hell is not an "edification" topic. This post is, perhaps, in the wrong forum.

I think I agree with you in that a good thing done for an evil cause would not be a good work, but when I said good work I meant a good thing motivated by an intention to do good. Whether or not you intend to glorify God, I believe that performing a good work will invariably glorify your (good) creator because whether you know it or not you are allowing God to work through you. The ability to be and do good is one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit, it is not something man can do on his own. (Though obviously doing a good work to glorify God makes it even better.)

And smoke is an indication of heat and chemical reaction. I've seen both smoke without fire, and fire with very little discernible smoke.

;)

Yeah, yeah. I realized it wasn't a perfect metaphor, but I thought it was the close enough to the point I was trying to get across.
 
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capnator

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Bad people still do some good things.

There are a lot of non christian people around working for humanitarian causes. There are a lot of people around of whom people that know them would say they are good people, and yet these same good people do not want to surrender the will to Jesus Christ. The world is full of so called "good" people.

Maybe the rich young ruler was a Ghandi. He said all these things have I done from my youth. I am sure he had led an exemplary life, probably a leader in the community, an all round nice bloke, maybe no one had a bad word to say about him. Surely he would be on his way to the kingdom! did he lack anything?

Matt 19:20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?

Jesus tells him

vs 21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go [and] sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come [and] follow me.

Give up your way of life, and follow me.

So maybe our rich young ruler was a Ghandi to his community, we could ask.... will the rich young ruler be in heaven.

Matt 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? [there is] none good but one, [that is], God:.............
 
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capnator

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John 3:2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.

Did Jesus say this to Nicodemus , Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man do a bunch of good stuff, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

I don't think so

vs 3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

How can a man be born again he asks.... Is it by living a Ghandi like life we are born again?
 
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Gregory Thompson

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nay but trusting in Jesus . is one born again .

since i have no access to whether he did or not to God's satisfaction . i just reserve judgment . even if it doesn't quack like a duck . one's eternal state is God's call . not mine .
 
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makeupgirl

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John 3:2 The same came to Jesus by night, and said unto him, Rabbi, we know that thou art a teacher come from God: for no man can do these miracles that thou doest, except God be with him.

Did Jesus say this to Nicodemus , Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man do a bunch of good stuff, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

I don't think so

vs 3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

How can a man be born again he asks.... Is it by living a Ghandi like life we are born again?

A man can only be born again by believing, trusting, and accepting Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior. Romans 10:9-10,

That If thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shall be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

So no. The word says that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of heaven. We must be born again. Romans 10:9-10 shows us how. Romans 10:13 also says Whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

It didn't say if we be good or do good things. We were all born with the sinful nature that's why Jesus came to earth took on human flesh, died for our sins so that we can be reconcile back to God. If we reject Christ, you choose Satan. You may not know you've choosen him but you outright rejected Jesus.

There are going to be a lot of people on the day we have to stand before the Lord and say hey I did this and that in your name and he's going to say I never knew you, depart from me, you that work iniquity. This is in Matthew 7:22-23.

So back to the original OP, if Gandhi has not accept Christ as Lord and Savior, then didn't go to heaven.
 
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