Is faith enough?

[justbyfaith]

If anyone desires to be a pastor, he desires a good work.

I believe that if the desire is there, there is very likely also a calling. If the person trains to become a pastor but it never comes to fruition, i.e. they only are allowed to minister in lay-capacity, well, at least their gifts and talents were usable by God in lay-ministry. One can operate as a pastor and not officially be a pastor.

 

[Wordkeeper]

I understand all of that...not sure why you think I don't but cool. Even you talk here about praying about our ministry's as in praying for our daily bread...so I still don't know what your point is.

As a servant, we need to have something to serve. A tongue, a prophesy, etc. That's what we should pray for.

The Israelites drank from the Rock and some were edified, some were not. Those who are built up enter God's rest.

Isn't that a great way to be a blessing to the world? Helping other believers to enter God's rest?

 

[Wordkeeper]

I understand all of that...not sure why you think I don't but cool. Even you talk here about praying about our ministry's as in praying for our daily bread...so I still don't know what your point is.

As a servant, we need to have something to serve. A tongue, a prophesy, etc. That's what we should pray for.

The Israelites drank from the Rock and some were edified, some were not. Those who are built up enter God's rest.

Isn't that a great way to be a blessing to the world? Helping other believers to enter God's rest?

 

[razzelflabben]

As a servant, we need to have something to serve. A tongue, a prophesy, etc. That's what we should pray for.

The Israelites drank from the Rock and some were edified, some were not. Those who are built up enter God's rest.

Isn't that a great way to be a blessing to the world? Helping other believers to enter God's rest?

not sure that clarifies what you said but thanks anyway

 

[Wordkeeper]

not sure that clarifies what you said but thanks anyway

Moses knew it would be difficult to persuade Israel to step out of Egypt, cross the desert and enter the Promised Land. God gave Him help, manna from Heaven, to convince Israel that God could be depended on.

Why do you think Jesus asked us to pray for DAILY bread? Hint: He wasn't talking about the floury stuff, He said not to ask for THAT.

 

[razzelflabben]

Moses knew it would be difficult to persuade Israel to step out of Egypt, cross the desert and enter the Promised Land. God gave Him help, manna from Heaven, to convince Israel that God could be depended on.

Why do you think Jesus asked us to pray for DAILY bread? Hint: He wasn't talking about the floury stuff, He said not to ask for THAT.

again, not sure how this answers my question of clarification but let me give you a hint...the reason God fet the children of Israel manna was to teach them that man does not live by bread alone. IOW's scripture directly states the reason and it wasn't so they would learn to depend on God it was so that they would learn that the flesh isn't the only part of man. Now with that comes a reliance or trust in God but before you change what scripture says you need to make sure you know what it says.

 

[Wordkeeper]

again, not sure how this answers my question of clarification but let me give you a hint...the reason God fet the children of Israel manna was to teach them that man does not live by bread alone. IOW's scripture directly states the reason and it wasn't so they would learn to depend on God it was so that they would learn that the flesh isn't the only part of man. Now with that comes a reliance or trust in God but before you change what scripture says you need to make sure you know what it says.

Well don't you agree that the bones of the Israelites were scattered across the desert because they did not keep God's revelations, His demonstrations of His power and willingness to save, in their heart, but refused to risk their lives and clamoured to return to Egypt?

Deuteronomy 32:18
"You neglected the Rock who begot you, And forgot the God who gave you birth.

Psalm 78:11
They forgot His deeds And His miracles that He had shown them.

Psalm 106:7
Our fathers in Egypt did not understand Your wonders; They did not remember Your abundant kindnesses, But rebelled by the sea, at the Red Sea.

Psalm 106:13
They quickly forgot His works; They did not wait for His counsel.

Isn't the fault the refusal to believe the signs that confirmed the authenticity of the message?

Matthew 16:4
"An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign; and a sign will not be given it, except the sign of Jonah." And He left them and went away.

 

[razzelflabben]

Well don't you agree that the bones of the Israelites were scattered across the desert because they did not keep God's revelations, His demonstrations of His power and willingness to save, in their heart, but refused to risk their lives and clamoured to return to Egypt?

Deuteronomy 32:18
"You neglected the Rock who begot you, And forgot the God who gave you birth.

Psalm 78:11
They forgot His deeds And His miracles that He had shown them.

Psalm 106:7
Our fathers in Egypt did not understand Your wonders; They did not remember Your abundant kindnesses, But rebelled by the sea, at the Red Sea.

Psalm 106:13
They quickly forgot His works; They did not wait for His counsel.

Isn't the fault the refusal to believe the signs that confirmed the authenticity of the message?

what I believe doesn't amount to a hill of beans, all that matters is what scripture says....Deuteronomy 8:3

 

[Wordkeeper]

what I believe doesn't amount to a hill of beans, all that matters is what scripture says....Deuteronomy 8:3

Man does not live unless he lives to fulfil the purpose he was created for, to subdued the earth, to work with God, be His partner, be IN Him as Christ was in unity with Him.

John 17
20“I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word; 21that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me.

 

[razzelflabben]

Man does not live unless he lives to fulfil the purpose he was created for, to subdued the earth, to work with God, be His partner, be IN Him as Christ was in unity with Him.

John 17
20“I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word; 21that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me.

and? What does this have to do with anything currently being discussed...you were asked to clarify something you said, instead of clarifying you tried to belittle me with something about manna. I corrected you as per scripture and now you are off about unity with Christ...

 

[Wordkeeper]

and? What does this have to do with anything currently being discussed...you were asked to clarify something you said, instead of clarifying you tried to belittle me with something about manna. I corrected you as per scripture and now you are off about unity with Christ...

Yes, but what does "man does not live by bread alone" mean? Millions of men have lived by bread alone, so the words that comes out of God's mouth must be doing something else.

 

[razzelflabben]

Yes, but what does "man does not live by bread alone" mean? Millions of men have lived by bread alone, so the words that comes out of God's mouth must be doing something else.

God cares for every aspect of man as I previously said...whereas bread feeds only the flesh....

 

[Wordkeeper]

God cares for every aspect of man as I previously said...whereas bread feeds only the flesh....

Therefore bread from heaven gives the only life worth living, Eternal Life, which is life knowing God. Knowing, in the Hebrew sense, means being in union with:

Matthew 1:25
25And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS.

John 17:3
3Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

 

[razzelflabben]

Therefore bread from heaven gives the only life worth living, Eternal Life, which is life knowing God. Knowing, in the Hebrew sense, means being in union with:

Matthew 1:25
25And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS.

John 17:3
3Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

Please tell me without all the riddles you are trying to use what any of this has to do with the clarification I previously asked for and at this point no longer even remember what I didn't understand?

Seriously, of course Jesus is our bread of life but that was never in question. In addition the topic you brought up does not limit us to Jesus as I previously pointed out to you a couple of times. So you are being more vague and more confusing then simply answering the question asked of you for clarification purposes and quite frankly I am tired of playing this game with you when you refuse to say anything significant, profound, or relevant. Not to mention on topic or different from what I just told you based on scripture and your misrepresentation of what it said.

 

[Wordkeeper]

Please tell me without all the riddles you are trying to use what any of this has to do with the clarification I previously asked for and at this point no longer even remember what I didn't understand?

Seriously, of course Jesus is our bread of life but that was never in question. In addition the topic you brought up does not limit us to Jesus as I previously pointed out to you a couple of times. So you are being more vague and more confusing then simply answering the question asked of you for clarification purposes and quite frankly I am tired of playing this game with you when you refuse to say anything significant, profound, or relevant. Not to mention on topic or different from what I just told you based on scripture and your misrepresentation of what it said.

I'm answering the two issues raised in the original post:

1. Will God give something He doesn't wish you to have?

Using calling for ministry is a wrong topic: everyone is called to ministry.

2. Are there things He wants you to ask for?

He wants you to ask for authenticating signs for the ministry you do, prising people out of Egypt.

ALL OTHER WANTS ARE THINGS HE HAS WARNED NOT TO DESIRE, INCLUDING BREAD WHICH DOES NOT SATISFY.

John6:27
27
"Do not work for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you, for on Him the Father, God, has set His seal."

Matthew 6:25-33
25Why are you worried about your life, as to what you will eat or what you will drink; nor for your body, as to what you will put on. Is not life more than food, and the body more than clothing?26“Look at the birds of the air, that they do not sow, nor reap nor gather into barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not worth much more than they? 27“And who of you by being worried can add a single hour to his life? 28“And why are you worried about clothing? Observe how the lilies of the field grow; they do not toil nor do they spin, 29yet I say to you that not even Solomon in all his glory clothed himself like one of these. 30“But if God so clothes the grass of the field, which is alive today and tomorrow is thrown into the furnace, will He not much more clothe you? You of little faith! 31“Do not worry then, saying, ‘What will we eat?’ or ‘What will we drink?’ or ‘What will we wear for clothing?’ 32“For the Gentiles eagerly seek all these things; for your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. 33“But seek first His kingdom and His righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.

Now give an example of a prayer that asks for things that God has decided you should be better of not having.

 

[razzelflabben]

I'm answering the two issues raised in the original post:

1. Will God give something He doesn't wish you to have?

Using calling for ministry is a wrong topic: everyone is called to ministry.

2. Are there things He wants you to ask for?

He wants you to ask for authenticating signs for the ministry you do, prising people out of Egypt.

ALL OTHER WANTS ARE THINGS HE HAS WARNED NOT TO DESIRE, INCLUDING BREAD WHICH DOES NOT SATISFY.

John6:27
27
"Do not work for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you, for on Him the Father, God, has set His seal."

Matthew 6:25-33
25Why are you worried about your life, as to what you will eat or what you will drink; nor for your body, as to what you will put on. Is not life more than food, and the body more than clothing?26“Look at the birds of the air, that they do not sow, nor reap nor gather into barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not worth much more than they? 27“And who of you by being worried can add a single hour to his life? 28“And why are you worried about clothing? Observe how the lilies of the field grow; they do not toil nor do they spin, 29yet I say to you that not even Solomon in all his glory clothed himself like one of these. 30“But if God so clothes the grass of the field, which is alive today and tomorrow is thrown into the furnace, will He not much more clothe you? You of little faith! 31“Do not worry then, saying, ‘What will we eat?’ or ‘What will we drink?’ or ‘What will we wear for clothing?’ 32“For the Gentiles eagerly seek all these things; for your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. 33“But seek first His kingdom and His righteousness, and all these things will be added to you.

Now give an example of a prayer that asks for things that God has decided you should be better of not having.

so there are two things here that we can then take to the bank so to speak....1. you refuse to clarify things you say that are not clear and 2. you refuse to accept clarifications to the OP as given.

Not very satisfying but at least that is clear now. thanks for clearing it us for us.

 

[Wordkeeper]

so there are two things here that we can then take to the bank so to speak....1. you refuse to clarify things you say that are not clear and 2. you refuse to accept clarifications to the OP as given.

Not very satisfying but at least that is clear now. thanks for clearing it us for us.

I have no idea what these items mean!

1. you refuse to clarify things you say that are not clear and
2. you refuse to accept clarifications to the OP as given.

 

[razzelflabben]

I have no idea what these items mean!

1. you refuse to clarify things you say that are not clear and
2. you refuse to accept clarifications to the OP as given.

at this point it is obviously not worth the time trying to explain the problem