Is faith a gift that only God can give us? (Note: I have an answer, but I would like input).

Is faith a gift that only God can give to us?


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BBAS 64

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So does God force faith upon a person? Or is faith something naturally all mankind has the capacity to exercise or initiate himself? I believe faith today comes by hearing the Bible because without the Bible we would not be able to have any kind of faith.


Good Day,

So you are saying the Bible is the cause of the hearing, and then the hearing is the cause of Faith?

Lets expand the context a bit... then seeing he refers back to OT passages lets investigate Paul's commentary on them:

Rom 10:14 How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching? And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!” But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?” So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ. But I ask, have they not heard? Indeed they have, for “Their voice has gone out to all the earth, and their words to the ends of the world.” But I ask, did Israel not understand? First Moses says, “I will make you jealous of those who are not a nation; with a foolish nation I will make you angry.”
Then Isaiah is so bold as to say, “I have been found by those who did not seek me; I have shown myself to those who did not ask for me.”

The astounding part is that God uses the preaching to make His nation Jealous of those (gentiles like me) who are not a nation at all.

In Him,

Bill
 
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SkyWriting

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So you establish faith without the Bible? So throw away your Bible, and what do you got? Nothing. You cannot make up your own faith or version of Jesus without the Bible. The faith is everything in your Bible. For what exactly are you believing in if you don't have the Bible?
What no scripture?
The Bible says exactly that:

Psalm 19:1
To the choirmaster. A Psalm of David. The heavens declare the glory of God, and the sky above proclaims his handiwork.

Psalm 8:3
When I look at your heavens, the work of your fingers, the moon and the stars, which you have set in place,

Romans 1:19
For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them.

Romans 1:20
For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.

Acts 14:16-17
In past generations he allowed all the nations to walk in their own ways. Yet he did not leave himself without witness, for he did good by giving you rains from heaven and fruitful seasons, satisfying your hearts with food and gladness.”

Psalm 19:1-6
To the choirmaster. A Psalm of David. The heavens declare the glory of God, and the sky above proclaims his handiwork. Day to day pours out speech, and night to night reveals knowledge. There is no speech, nor are there words, whose voice is not heard. Their voice goes out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them he has set a tent for the sun, which comes out like a bridegroom leaving his chamber, and, like a strong man, runs its course with joy.

Acts 17:23-30
For as I passed along and observed the objects of your worship, I found also an altar with this inscription, ‘To the unknown god.’ What therefore you worship as unknown, this I proclaim to you. The God who made the world and everything in it, being Lord of heaven and earth, does not live in temples made by man, nor is he served by human hands, as though he needed anything, since he himself gives to all mankind life and breath and everything. And he made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined allotted periods and the boundaries of their dwelling place, that they should seek God, in the hope that they might feel their way toward him and find him. Yet he is actually not far from each one of us,

Isaiah 40:26o
Lift up your eyes on high and see: who created these? He who brings out their host by number, calling them all by name, by the greatness of his might, and because he is strong in power not one is missing.

Jeremiah 10:10-13
But the Lord is the true God; he is the living God and the everlasting King. At his wrath the earth quakes, and the nations cannot endure his indignation. Thus shall you say to them: “The gods who did not make the heavens and the earth shall perish from the earth and from under the heavens.” It is he who made the earth by his power, who established the world by his wisdom, and by his understanding stretched out the heavens. When he utters his voice, there is a tumult of waters in the heavens, and he makes the mist rise from the ends of the earth. He makes lightning for the rain, and he brings forth the wind from his storehouses.

Jeremiah 31:31-34
“Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah, not like the covenant that I made with their fathers on the day when I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, my covenant that they broke, though I was their husband, declares the Lord. But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my law within them, and I will write it on their hearts. And I will be their God, and they shall be my people. And no longer shall each one teach his neighbor and each his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they shall all know me, from the least of them to the greatest, declares the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.”

Is the Bible even mentioned? Even inferred? I used to agree with you, but sculpture doesn't support it.

Romans 2:15
They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them

Ezekiel 36:26
And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh.

The writers don't even want to write!

2 John 1:12
Though I have much to write to you, I would rather not use paper and ink. Instead I hope to come to you and talk face to face, so that our joy may be complete.






 
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2BeholdHisGlory

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If so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
So does God force faith upon a person? Or is faith something naturally all mankind has the capacity to exercise or initiate himself? I believe faith today comes by hearing the Bible because without the Bible we would not be able to have any kind of faith.

What?
 
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Good Day,

So you are saying the Bible is the cause of the hearing, and then the hearing is the cause of Faith?

Lets expand the context a bit... then seeing he refers back to OT passages lets investigate Paul's commentary on them:

Rom 10:14 How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching? And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!” But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?” So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ. But I ask, have they not heard? Indeed they have, for “Their voice has gone out to all the earth, and their words to the ends of the world.” But I ask, did Israel not understand? First Moses says, “I will make you jealous of those who are not a nation; with a foolish nation I will make you angry.”
Then Isaiah is so bold as to say, “I have been found by those who did not seek me; I have shown myself to those who did not ask for me.”

The astounding part is that God uses the preaching to make His nation Jealous of those (gentiles like me) who are not a nation at all.

In Him,

Bill

The Bible is inspired by the Holy Spirit and Jesus is one with the Spirit because they are part of the triune God we worship. So according to 2 Timothy 3:16, the Bible is the very words of God. Jesus is God. So Romans 10:17 is referring to either the Bible or the words of Jesus and His apostles (Which makes up the sum of the New Testament we have). For Jesus says in Matthew 10:40 that, “He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.” You cannot say that other parts of the Bible is not a part of the faith that Jesus gave us. Jesus always referred to the authority of even Old Testament Scriptures. Jesus is one with the Father. Jesus did everything that His Father commanded Him to do. This account is recorded for us by the divine inspiration of the Holy Word (The Bible). There is a connection between the living Word and the Communicated Word.

The Symbiotic Relationship Between
The Living Word, & the Communicated Word:


  1. Christ is good (John 10:11, John 10:14), and the word is good (1 Kings 2:42).

  2. Christ is the truth (John 14:6), and the word is the truth (John 17:17).

  3. Christ is called Faithful and True (Revelation 19:11), and the word is called faithful and true (Revelation 22:6).

  4. Christ is pure (1 John 3:3), and the word is pure (Proverbs 30:5).

  5. Christ is incorruptible (Acts of the Apostles 2:27), and the word is incorruptible (1 Peter 1:23).

  6. Christ abides forever (John 12:34), and the word abides forever (1 Peter 1:23).

  7. Christ’s name: “Jesus” is above all names (Which would include God’s name) (Philippians 2:9-10), and the word is above God’s name (Psalms 138:2).

  8. Christ has flaming eyes of fire (Revelation 19:12), and the Word is like a fire (Jeremiah 23:29).

  9. Christ can burn things like a fire (Matthew 3:12), and the word can burn things like a fire (Luke 24:32).

  10. Christ can be eaten (John 6:57), and the word can be eaten (Jeremiah 15:16).

  11. Christ is like the discovery of treasure (Matthew 13:44-46, cf. 2 Corinthians 4:7-10), and the word is like the discovery of treasure (Psalms 119:162).

  12. Christ is the light (John 8:12), and the word is light (Psalms 119:105).

  13. Christ is life (John 14:6, 1 John 5:12), and the word is life (John 6:63).

  14. Christ is the living bread (John 6:51), and the word is the living bread (Matthew 4:4).

  15. Christ is eternal life (Romans 6:23, 1 Timothy 6:16, 1 John 5:20) and the word is eternal life (John 6:68) (cf. Matthew 24:35, John 6:63).

  16. Christ quickens (makes alive) (John 5:21), and the word quickens (makes alive) (Psalms 119:50).

  17. It is by Christ which makes the gospel possible (1 Corinthians 15:1-4), and it is by the word which makes the gospel possible (1 Peter 1:25).

  18. Christ is near to men (Acts of the Apostles 17:27) (Revelation 3:20) (Psalms 145:18), and the word is near to men (Romans 10:8).

  19. Christ discerns the heart (Matthew 9:4, Luke 9:47), and the word discerns the heart (Hebrews 4:12).

  20. Christ can get men through a storm (Mark 4:35-41), and the word can get men through a storm (Matthew 7:24-25).

  21. Christ sanctifies (John 17:19), and the word sanctifies (John 17:17).

  22. A person can stumble over Christ (Romans 9:33, 1 Peter 2:5-8), and a person can stumble over the word (1 Peter 2:8).

  23. Christ will judge men (John 5:22), and the word will judge men (John 12:48).

  24. Christ’s bones were never broken (John 19:36 cf. Psalms 34:20), and the word is never broken (John 10:35).

  25. Believers are told to seek after Christ (Matthew 28:5, Mark 16:6), and believers are told to seek after the word (Isaiah 34:16).

  26. Christ is our hope (1 Thessalonians 1:3, Colossians 1:27, 1 Timothy 1:1), and the word is our hope (Psalms 130:5).

  27. Believers are to have the mind of Christ (1 Corinthians 2:16), and believers are to meditate (use their mind) upon the word (Psalms 119:148, 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV).

  28. Christ is to be heard and obeyed (Matthew 7:24), and the word is to be heard and obeyed (James 1:22).

  29. The love of God is within Christ (Romans 8:39), and keeping the word places the love of God within us (1 John 2:5) (Also see John 14:23).

  30. Christ is the way to the living waters, which is the Holy Spirit (John 7:37-39), and the washing of the water of the word (Ephesians 5:25-27) (which is obedience to God) is the way to having the Spirit (Acts of the Apostles 5:32).

  31. Christ is like the foundation that is a part of a house (1 Corinthians 3:9, 1 Corinthians 3:11), and He is like a rock (1 Corinthians 10:4), and the obeying the word is like a house built upon the rock (Matthew 7:24).

  32. Believers are to follow after the steps of Christ (1 Peter 2:21), and believers are to order their steps in the word (Psalms 119:133).

  33. Christ breathed the Spirit upon his faithful chosen (John 20:22), and the word is “inspired by God” (i.e. God breathed) for the benefit of his faithful chosen (2 Timothy 3:16-17).

  34. Christ is the way to having the fruits of righteousness (Philippians 1:11), and the word is the way to being instructed in righteousness so to be perfect unto all good works (fruits) (2 Timothy 3:16-17).

  35. Christ can abide in us (John 15:4-7) (Ephesians 3:17) (Philippians 4:13), and the word can abide in us (John 15:7, Psalms 119:11).

  36. Christ dwells in our hearts (Ephesians 3:17), and the word dwells in our hearts (Colossians 3:16).

  37. Believers can be hidden in Christ (Colossians 3:3), and the word can be hidden in believers (Psalms 119:11).

  38. Christ is always with us (Matthew 28:20), and the word is always with us (Psalms 119:98).

  39. Christ can make our joy full (John 15:11), and the word can make our joy full (1 John 1:4).

  40. Believers’ hearts rejoice with Christ (John 16:22), and believers’ hearts rejoice with the word (Jeremiah 15:16).
..41. Christ is called a seed (Galatians 3:16), and the word is called a seed (1 Peter 1:23, Luke 8:11) (Note: See my post below here for further details).


The communicated word of God that we have today is the Bible.

“So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.” (Isaiah 55:11).​

Jesus (the Living Word) was sent by the commandment (mouth) of the Father. Jesus said and did everything the Father told Him to do (John 12:49) (John 14:31).

What is interesting is that the Living Word accomplished that which the Father commanded Him to do and to prosper (accomplish) that thing He sent to do (i.e. Jesus suffered on the cross, and said, “It is finished” and died for man’s sins). Jesus was risen three days later, and ascended to the Father. God’s Word (the living Word) did not return void by whom the Father sent.

The communicated Word can also be sent out and not return void, as well. For many have believed and have stayed faithful to what God’s Word says.

In the creation: The Word made flesh (John 1:1, John 1:14) (i.e. Christ) created everything. In the beginning God spoke words to bring forth the creation in six days (Genesis 1:1-31).

So in the beginning was the Living Word, and the communicated Word.

In the end of this sinful world: Christ will return (Revelation 19:11-21) and a sharp sword will proceed from His mouth. This sword could be the “sword of the Spirit,” (Which is the Word of God) or it could be symbolic of such (Ephesians 6:17).

So in the end there will be the Living Word, and the communicated Word.

For at Christ’s return: His name is called The “Word of God.” (Revelation 19:13) (Living Word).

On His thigh, and vesture is a name written (words) “KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.” (Communicated Word).

Jesus was beaten to a pulp and crucified on a tree.

The Word we have today (the Bible) is a result of pulp made from a tree.

Jesus was the Word made flesh (covered in skin).

The Word we have today (the Bible) is popular to be available covered in skin (leather).

Words on the page hang on this tree (paper) (the Bible),
just like the Living Word hung on a tree (the cross).
 
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SkyWriting

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So you establish faith without the Bible? So throw away your Bible, and what do you got? Nothing. You cannot make up your own faith or version of Jesus without the Bible. The faith is everything in your Bible. For what exactly are you believing in if you don't have the Bible?

The writers don't even want to write!

2 John 1:12
Though I have much to write to you, I would rather not use paper and ink. Instead I hope to come to you and talk face to face, so that our joy may be complete.
 
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BBAS 64

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No. 2 Thessalonians 2:10 does not say that they are perishing because they did not have the capacity to receive the love of the truth because they were not elected or chosen. It says they received not the love of the truth that they MIGHT BE SAVED. Again, not sure how those three words fit in your worldview.



Well, if you are saying Calvinism is the gospel, then you are preaching another gospel then. 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 is the gospel. It's surely not Calvinism.



Oh, and so now the Bible is in error if it does not agree with what we believe or have been taught?


Good Day,

Oh boy I never said any thing about capacity, the fact is it (Faith) was not granted and they do not have it to exercise.

Yes the Gospel is nicknamed Calvinism, Jesus died for the sins of the Church at Corinth.... Yes that is the Gospel he died for His church... exclusively. I would recommend Surgeons ( the Prince of Preachers) work on that passage.


In Him

Bill
 
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The writers don't even want to write!

2 John 1:12
Though I have much to write to you, I would rather not use paper and ink. Instead I hope to come to you and talk face to face, so that our joy may be complete.

This is taking a verse out of context. All Scripture is given by inspiration of God. This is all the Bible. Even the verse you quote. Again, can you be saved without hearing about Jesus? How do we know about Jesus? From the Holy Bible, right?
Can you imagine them saying they did not want to write about Jesus?
 
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SkyWriting

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  1. Christ is good (John 10:11, John 10:14), and the word is good (1 Kings 2:42).

  2. Christ is the truth (John 14:6), and the word is the truth (John 17:17).

  3. Christ is called Faithful and True (Revelation 19:11), and the word is called faithful and true (Revelation 22:6).

  4. Christ is pure (1 John 3:3), and the word is pure (Proverbs 30:5).

  5. Christ is incorruptible (Acts of the Apostles 2:27), and the word is incorruptible (1 Peter 1:23).

  6. Christ abides forever (John 12:34), and the word abides forever (1 Peter 1:23).

  7. Christ’s name: “Jesus” is above all names (Which would include God’s name) (Philippians 2:9-10), and the word is above God’s name (Psalms 138:2).

  8. Christ has flaming eyes of fire (Revelation 19:12), and the Word is like a fire (Jeremiah 23:29).

  9. Christ can burn things like a fire (Matthew 3:12), and the word can burn things like a fire (Luke 24:32).

  10. Christ can be eaten (John 6:57), and the word can be eaten (Jeremiah 15:16).

  11. Christ is like the discovery of treasure (Matthew 13:44-46, cf. 2 Corinthians 4:7-10), and the word is like the discovery of treasure (Psalms 119:162).

  12. Christ is the light (John 8:12), and the word is light (Psalms 119:105).

  13. Christ is life (John 14:6, 1 John 5:12), and the word is life (John 6:63).

  14. Christ is the living bread (John 6:51), and the word is the living bread (Matthew 4:4).

  15. Christ is eternal life (Romans 6:23, 1 Timothy 6:16, 1 John 5:20) and the word is eternal life (John 6:68) (cf. Matthew 24:35, John 6:63).

  16. Christ quickens (makes alive) (John 5:21), and the word quickens (makes alive) (Psalms 119:50).

  17. It is by Christ which makes the gospel possible (1 Corinthians 15:1-4), and it is by the word which makes the gospel possible (1 Peter 1:25).

  18. Christ is near to men (Acts of the Apostles 17:27) (Revelation 3:20) (Psalms 145:18), and the word is near to men (Romans 10:8).

  19. Christ discerns the heart (Matthew 9:4, Luke 9:47), and the word discerns the heart (Hebrews 4:12).

  20. Christ can get men through a storm (Mark 4:35-41), and the word can get men through a storm (Matthew 7:24-25).

  21. Christ sanctifies (John 17:19), and the word sanctifies (John 17:17).

  22. A person can stumble over Christ (Romans 9:33, 1 Peter 2:5-8), and a person can stumble over the word (1 Peter 2:8).

  23. Christ will judge men (John 5:22), and the word will judge men (John 12:48).

  24. Christ’s bones were never broken (John 19:36 cf. Psalms 34:20), and the word is never broken (John 10:35).

  25. Believers are told to seek after Christ (Matthew 28:5, Mark 16:6), and believers are told to seek after the word (Isaiah 34:16).

  26. Christ is our hope (1 Thessalonians 1:3, Colossians 1:27, 1 Timothy 1:1), and the word is our hope (Psalms 130:5).

  27. Believers are to have the mind of Christ (1 Corinthians 2:16), and believers are to meditate (use their mind) upon the word (Psalms 119:148, 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV).

  28. Christ is to be heard and obeyed (Matthew 7:24), and the word is to be heard and obeyed (James 1:22).

  29. The love of God is within Christ (Romans 8:39), and keeping the word places the love of God within us (1 John 2:5) (Also see John 14:23).

  30. Christ is the way to the living waters, which is the Holy Spirit (John 7:37-39), and the washing of the water of the word (Ephesians 5:25-27) (which is obedience to God) is the way to having the Spirit (Acts of the Apostles 5:32).

  31. Christ is like the foundation that is a part of a house (1 Corinthians 3:9, 1 Corinthians 3:11), and He is like a rock (1 Corinthians 10:4), and the obeying the word is like a house built upon the rock (Matthew 7:24).

  32. Believers are to follow after the steps of Christ (1 Peter 2:21), and believers are to order their steps in the word (Psalms 119:133).

  33. Christ breathed the Spirit upon his faithful chosen (John 20:22), and the word is “inspired by God” (i.e. God breathed) for the benefit of his faithful chosen (2 Timothy 3:16-17).

  34. Christ is the way to having the fruits of righteousness (Philippians 1:11), and the word is the way to being instructed in righteousness so to be perfect unto all good works (fruits) (2 Timothy 3:16-17).

  35. Christ can abide in us (John 15:4-7) (Ephesians 3:17) (Philippians 4:13), and the word can abide in us (John 15:7, Psalms 119:11).

  36. Christ dwells in our hearts (Ephesians 3:17), and the word dwells in our hearts (Colossians 3:16).

  37. Believers can be hidden in Christ (Colossians 3:3), and the word can be hidden in believers (Psalms 119:11).

  38. Christ is always with us (Matthew 28:20), and the word is always with us (Psalms 119:98).

  39. Christ can make our joy full (John 15:11), and the word can make our joy full (1 John 1:4).

  40. Believers’ hearts rejoice with Christ (John 16:22), and believers’ hearts rejoice with the word (Jeremiah 15:16).
..41. Christ is called a seed (Galatians 3:16), and the word is called a seed (1 Peter 1:23, Luke 8:11) (Note: See my post below here for further details).

You missed an important part. The Word is Jesus. Not any particular writings.
It's covered in the beginning. Jesus is the manifestation of The Father. Word up.
 
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Good Day,

Oh boy I never said any thing about capacity, the fact is it (Faith) was not granted and they do not have it to exercise.

Yes the Gospel is nicknamed Calvinism, Jesus died for the sins of the Church at Corinth.... Yes that is the Gospel he died for His church... exclusively. I would recommend Surgeons ( the Prince of Preachers) work on that passage.


In Him

Bill

The gospel is not a part of the five points of Calvinism. They may try to add it in later as some kind of sub thing, but they say Calvinism is the gospel and it is not. 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 is not mentioned as one of the five points of Calvinism.
 
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You missed an important part. The Word is Jesus. Not any particular writings.
It's covered in the beginning.

The Bible warns against false Christs or another Jesus. So how do we get the correct Jesus? How can we tell? Do we just follow our hearts and minds? No. We follow the Bible to tell which is the true Jesus vs. the false Jesus.
 
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SkyWriting

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This is taking a verse out of context. All Scripture is given by inspiration of God. This is all the Bible. Even the verse you quote. Again, can you be saved without hearing about Jesus? How do we know about Jesus? From the Holy Bible, right?
Can you imagine them saying they did not want to write about Jesus?

That's what he wrote....that writings are inferior.
2 John 1:12
Though I have much to write to you, I would rather not use paper and ink. Instead I hope to come to you and talk face to face, so that our joy may be complete.
 
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The Bible is inspired by the Holy Spirit and Jesus is one with the Spirit because they are part of the triune God we worship. So according to 2 Timothy 3:16, the Bible is the very words of God. Jesus is God. So Romans 10:17 is referring to either the Bible or the words of Jesus and His apostles (Which makes up the sum of the New Testament we have). For Jesus says in Matthew 10:40 that, “He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.” You cannot say that other parts of the Bible is not a part of the faith that Jesus gave us. Jesus always referred to the authority of even Old Testament Scriptures. Jesus is one with the Father. Jesus did everything that His Father commanded Him to do. This account is recorded for us by the divine inspiration of the Holy Word (The Bible). There is a connection between the living Word and the Communicated Word.

The Symbiotic Relationship Between
The Living Word, & the Communicated Word:


  1. Christ is good (John 10:11, John 10:14), and the word is good (1 Kings 2:42).

  2. Christ is the truth (John 14:6), and the word is the truth (John 17:17).

  3. Christ is called Faithful and True (Revelation 19:11), and the word is called faithful and true (Revelation 22:6).

  4. Christ is pure (1 John 3:3), and the word is pure (Proverbs 30:5).

  5. Christ is incorruptible (Acts of the Apostles 2:27), and the word is incorruptible (1 Peter 1:23).

  6. Christ abides forever (John 12:34), and the word abides forever (1 Peter 1:23).

  7. Christ’s name: “Jesus” is above all names (Which would include God’s name) (Philippians 2:9-10), and the word is above God’s name (Psalms 138:2).

  8. Christ has flaming eyes of fire (Revelation 19:12), and the Word is like a fire (Jeremiah 23:29).

  9. Christ can burn things like a fire (Matthew 3:12), and the word can burn things like a fire (Luke 24:32).

  10. Christ can be eaten (John 6:57), and the word can be eaten (Jeremiah 15:16).

  11. Christ is like the discovery of treasure (Matthew 13:44-46, cf. 2 Corinthians 4:7-10), and the word is like the discovery of treasure (Psalms 119:162).

  12. Christ is the light (John 8:12), and the word is light (Psalms 119:105).

  13. Christ is life (John 14:6, 1 John 5:12), and the word is life (John 6:63).

  14. Christ is the living bread (John 6:51), and the word is the living bread (Matthew 4:4).

  15. Christ is eternal life (Romans 6:23, 1 Timothy 6:16, 1 John 5:20) and the word is eternal life (John 6:68) (cf. Matthew 24:35, John 6:63).

  16. Christ quickens (makes alive) (John 5:21), and the word quickens (makes alive) (Psalms 119:50).

  17. It is by Christ which makes the gospel possible (1 Corinthians 15:1-4), and it is by the word which makes the gospel possible (1 Peter 1:25).

  18. Christ is near to men (Acts of the Apostles 17:27) (Revelation 3:20) (Psalms 145:18), and the word is near to men (Romans 10:8).

  19. Christ discerns the heart (Matthew 9:4, Luke 9:47), and the word discerns the heart (Hebrews 4:12).

  20. Christ can get men through a storm (Mark 4:35-41), and the word can get men through a storm (Matthew 7:24-25).

  21. Christ sanctifies (John 17:19), and the word sanctifies (John 17:17).

  22. A person can stumble over Christ (Romans 9:33, 1 Peter 2:5-8), and a person can stumble over the word (1 Peter 2:8).

  23. Christ will judge men (John 5:22), and the word will judge men (John 12:48).

  24. Christ’s bones were never broken (John 19:36 cf. Psalms 34:20), and the word is never broken (John 10:35).

  25. Believers are told to seek after Christ (Matthew 28:5, Mark 16:6), and believers are told to seek after the word (Isaiah 34:16).

  26. Christ is our hope (1 Thessalonians 1:3, Colossians 1:27, 1 Timothy 1:1), and the word is our hope (Psalms 130:5).

  27. Believers are to have the mind of Christ (1 Corinthians 2:16), and believers are to meditate (use their mind) upon the word (Psalms 119:148, 2 Timothy 2:15 KJV).

  28. Christ is to be heard and obeyed (Matthew 7:24), and the word is to be heard and obeyed (James 1:22).

  29. The love of God is within Christ (Romans 8:39), and keeping the word places the love of God within us (1 John 2:5) (Also see John 14:23).

  30. Christ is the way to the living waters, which is the Holy Spirit (John 7:37-39), and the washing of the water of the word (Ephesians 5:25-27) (which is obedience to God) is the way to having the Spirit (Acts of the Apostles 5:32).

  31. Christ is like the foundation that is a part of a house (1 Corinthians 3:9, 1 Corinthians 3:11), and He is like a rock (1 Corinthians 10:4), and the obeying the word is like a house built upon the rock (Matthew 7:24).

  32. Believers are to follow after the steps of Christ (1 Peter 2:21), and believers are to order their steps in the word (Psalms 119:133).

  33. Christ breathed the Spirit upon his faithful chosen (John 20:22), and the word is “inspired by God” (i.e. God breathed) for the benefit of his faithful chosen (2 Timothy 3:16-17).

  34. Christ is the way to having the fruits of righteousness (Philippians 1:11), and the word is the way to being instructed in righteousness so to be perfect unto all good works (fruits) (2 Timothy 3:16-17).

  35. Christ can abide in us (John 15:4-7) (Ephesians 3:17) (Philippians 4:13), and the word can abide in us (John 15:7, Psalms 119:11).

  36. Christ dwells in our hearts (Ephesians 3:17), and the word dwells in our hearts (Colossians 3:16).

  37. Believers can be hidden in Christ (Colossians 3:3), and the word can be hidden in believers (Psalms 119:11).

  38. Christ is always with us (Matthew 28:20), and the word is always with us (Psalms 119:98).

  39. Christ can make our joy full (John 15:11), and the word can make our joy full (1 John 1:4).

  40. Believers’ hearts rejoice with Christ (John 16:22), and believers’ hearts rejoice with the word (Jeremiah 15:16).
..41. Christ is called a seed (Galatians 3:16), and the word is called a seed (1 Peter 1:23, Luke 8:11) (Note: See my post below here for further details).


The communicated word of God that we have today is the Bible.

“So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.” (Isaiah 55:11).​

Jesus (the Living Word) was sent by the commandment (mouth) of the Father. Jesus said and did everything the Father told Him to do (John 12:49) (John 14:31).

What is interesting is that the Living Word accomplished that which the Father commanded Him to do and to prosper (accomplish) that thing He sent to do (i.e. Jesus suffered on the cross, and said, “It is finished” and died for man’s sins). Jesus was risen three days later, and ascended to the Father. God’s Word (the living Word) did not return void by whom the Father sent.

The communicated Word can also be sent out and not return void, as well. For many have believed and have stayed faithful to what God’s Word says.

In the creation: The Word made flesh (John 1:1, John 1:14) (i.e. Christ) created everything. In the beginning God spoke words to bring forth the creation in six days (Genesis 1:1-31).

So in the beginning was the Living Word, and the communicated Word.

In the end of this sinful world: Christ will return (Revelation 19:11-21) and a sharp sword will proceed from His mouth. This sword could be the “sword of the Spirit,” (Which is the Word of God) or it could be symbolic of such (Ephesians 6:17).

So in the end there will be the Living Word, and the communicated Word.

For at Christ’s return: His name is called The “Word of God.” (Revelation 19:13) (Living Word).

On His thigh, and vesture is a name written (words) “KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.” (Communicated Word).

Jesus was beaten to a pulp and crucified on a tree.

The Word we have today (the Bible) is a result of pulp made from a tree.

Jesus was the Word made flesh (covered in skin).

The Word we have today (the Bible) is popular to be available covered in skin (leather).

Words on the page hang on this tree (paper) (the Bible),
just like the Living Word hung on a tree (the cross).


Good Day,

Umm yes I agree with most of that stuff, but you failed to address the text of Romans at all...

https://www.etsjets.org/files/documents/Chicago_Statement.pdf
 
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That's what he wrote....that writings are inferior.
2 John 1:12
Though I have much to write to you, I would rather not use paper and ink. Instead I hope to come to you and talk face to face, so that our joy may be complete.

Do you even know the Bible talks about false Christ's? How can a Christian tell the real Christ from a false one? Is it by the Bible or what you feel is true?
 
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2BeholdHisGlory

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You missed an important part. The Word is Jesus. Not any particular writings.
It's covered in the beginning. Jesus is the manifestation of The Father. Word up.

Says to abide in both

John 15:7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

Jesus doctrine was not His but the Father's but we are to abide in the same to have both the Father and the Son

2 John 1:9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.

Him and his words

Luke (;26 For whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my words, of him shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he shall come in his own glory, and in his Father's, and of the holy angels.
 
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HosannaHM

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Hello again BHL, I haven't gotten back to your comments on my other thread yet. But in the meantime:

Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ John 3:5-7

I find the doctrine of regeneration or being born again to help with the idea of faith. So if faith is not a gift, it seems like Jesus would tell Nicodemus to "just believe" right here. But that's not what He says:

"The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit.”" John 3:8

Huh... the wind blows where it wants? Sounds like we have to born again BEFORE we believe, which would also make it sound like faith (at the very minimum of trusting in Christ) is a gift.
 
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2BeholdHisGlory

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Heb 2:1 Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let them slip.

Heb 2:2 For if the word spoken by angels was stedfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward;

Heb 2:3 How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;

Heb 2:4 God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?

Also as the doctrine pertains to godliness as well, here for example

1 Ti 6:3 If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;

1 Ti 6:4 He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,

1 Ti 6:5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.

1 Ti 6:6 But godliness with contentment is great gain.
 
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Hello again BHL, I haven't gotten back to your comments on my other thread yet. But in the meantime:

Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ John 3:5-7

I find the doctrine of regeneration or being born again to help with the idea of faith. So if faith is not a gift, it seems like Jesus would tell Nicodemus to "just believe" right here. But that's not what He says:

"The wind blows where it wishes, and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. So it is with everyone who is born of the Spirit.”" John 3:8

Huh... the wind blows where it wants? Sounds like we have to born again BEFORE we believe, which would also make it sound like faith (at the very minimum of trusting in Christ) is a gift.

If John 3 was the only chapter in the Bible, you might be on to something. But we have to look at the whole counsel of God's Word. Peter says repent and be converted in Acts of the Apostles 3:19.

Again, think about how dumb it is to say that God forces faith upon a person. This would mean Jesus was amazed at what God the Father does even though He is one with God the Father. For Jesus marveled at the greatness of the Centurion's faith. Faith comes by HEARING the Word of God (Romans 10:17). The Word of God is Jesus or the Bible. So if we hear (obey) Jesus's words we get faith.

But lets look at John 3:

In John 3:18-19 it says:

“...he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.”
(John 3:18-19).

Jesus says he that does not believe is condemned because....

(a) Calvinist says because God did not Elect Him to salvation.
(b) Jesus says becaue HE HAS NOT BELIEVED IN THE NAME OF THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON of GOD.

Jesus says that the condemnation is that men loved darkness because their deeds were evil.
Jesus DID NOT SAY that the condemnation is that men loved darkness because God did not Elect them.
 
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