Is democracy under threat in the USA?

[mindlight]

LOL The truth is that the hard left is seeking destruction of the God given rights that our nation was founded upon. Marxism will create an elite ruling class with the poor as slaves.

As someone who has seen a Marxist state while a missionary in Communist Poland I can safely say you do not know what you are talking about.

The Democrats may be deceived by the Woke rubbish they spew out but: their climate policy; desires for health reforms; investment in the broad mass of the people rather than just the elite; and attempts to re-kickstart social mobility have nothing to do with Marxism.

 

[LockeeDeck]

You have answered your own objections, asset forfeiture is a legal process, it is therefore not robbery which is an illegal process. The court placed a juvenile in solitary confinement that is a lawful duty of the court. I see legal processes you see unfairness where there is not unfairness and then you call it something that it is not.

It's beyond unfairness though, it's unconstitutional. You were going on about god given rights and Marxists taking over but here you are supporting government agents violating constitutional rights.

 

[disciple Clint]

It's beyond unfairness though, it's unconstitutional. You were going on about god given rights and Marxists taking over but here you are supporting government agents violating constitutional rights.

OK how exactly are they violating the constitution, what is your specific reason for making that statement, what is your legal basis, can you justify what you are asserting?

 

[cow451]

There is only one God.

That would mean the framers were mostly deists.

 

[Valletta]

As someone who has seen a Marxist state while a missionary in Communist Poland I can safely say you do not know what you are talking about.

The Democrats may be deceived by the Woke rubbish they spew out but: their climate policy; desires for health reforms; investment in the broad mass of the people rather than just the elite; and attempts to re-kickstart social mobility have nothing to do with Marxism.

I have spoken with a number of people actually imprisoned by Communists, I have some idea how they operate.
Critical race theory is a spinoff from the Communist critical theory, which included the class warfare Marxists use to gain control. It promotes class warfare in order to divide the people, pits them against one another. Critical race theory uses racism, that what the hard left promotes, oppose their policies and you are a white supremacist.

 

[Pommer]

No what I find troubling is people making those accusations without any legitimate evidence that they exist.

Like “election fraud”?

 

[mindlight]

Critical race theory is a spinoff from the Communist critical theory, which included the class warfare Marxists use to gain control. It promotes class warfare in order to divide the people, pits them against one another. Critical race theory uses racism, that what the hard left promotes, oppose their policies and you are a white supremacist.

Critical race theory is meant to be addressing why there are persistent inequalities between minority communities and white people. To put it under a Marxist label is going too far because it is not essentially guided by a Marxist view of dialectical materialism.

CRT prioritizes social constructs and institutions as being the reason for the perpetuation of inequalities between racial communities. It seeks to address the symptoms rather than the real reasons for the problems in my view. There is no equivalence between loser cultures and ones that work. There is no equivalence between false religion and a true one. Native Americans were displaced because their cultures could not compete with those of the invaders and, to be honest, did not deserve to survive. Muslim countries are poor because they subscribe to a false religion, because their cultures concentrate wealth into the hands of people who do not deserve it. North American Black cultures can include criminal gang memberships, drugs, and single mums with kids from multiple fathers, and their poverty results from the incarceration and the lack of the extra wage earner and some really bad habits.

CRT experts need to unlearn many of their premises about equality and be guided by truth. A black man like Obama or Africans in the Early church like Augustine, or Tertullian are already evidence that there is nothing intrinsically inferior about Africans. But redistributing wealth and guiding institutions to endorse groups with bad habits affirms the dark side not the side of the angels.

All that said it should be possible for a poor black man to rise and become a billionaire or a president. There is something wrong with America if that does not happen and it needs to be addressed

 

[rjs330]

4th
LAW ENFORCEMENT SEIZED MORE FROM PEOPLE THAN BURGLARS STOLE LAST YEAR

There was a case just recently where the police robbed a veteran of his life savings.

Watch Nevada Highway Patrol Officers Seize a Veteran's Life Savings Through Asset Forfeiture

5th
Berghuis v. Thompkins - Wikipedia

You must actively declare you are exercising your 5th amendment rights when being questioned by the police for your silence to not be used in court, which they will never tell you.

6th
Kalief Browder - Wikipedia

A boy spent 3 years in solitary confinement without trial for a false accusation of petty theft. He committed suicide afterwards.

8th
Basically every police shooting BLM marched over but also every beat down the police do where they yell stop resisting at someone who is not resisting.

There are MANY but here is a link to a group of cops beating up a teenager for shoplifting.

SEE IT: California cops seen on video beating teen accused of shoplifting are placed on leave

13th
The Uncounted Workforce : The Indicator from Planet Money

Nowadays they pay prisoners pennies as to not call them slaves but they are still compelled to work to make the prison money or face consequences.

15th
Hofeller Files - Stephanie's Copy
Justice Department sues Texas over new redistricting maps | AP News

The Republicans literally brag about gerrymandering, the race element was suspected but leaked with the files from the dead campaign manager.

Now, why do you support all this?

Well he did ask for a tiny bit of evidence and you provided just that. A tiny piece.

However your "evidence" tinier than tiny. You first link proves the cops did nothing wrong. They didn't steal anything. Theft is against the law. Forfeiture is NOT against the law. It's legal. You may not like it, you may not agree with it, but it's law. Now here is where we probably do agree. I would like to see the laws changed. I don't like forfeiture laws myself. I believe that a person should be convicted before their ppl is forfeited. But the courts have ruled that forfeiture is legal and the laws stand. Therefore NO theft has taken place. You are being dishonest.

Your second point is also a dishonest one. The supreme court has ruled. This they have determined the Constitutional rights of Miranda are as they say. Just as they said Miranda is law, so they also define the perimeters of Miranda. And that's what they did. Point number two fails.

You third point is valid. In NY. Most states would not allow such actions and the hose actions DO violate speedy trial. That boy should not have spent those years in jail. It WAS wrong in my opinion.

Your 4th point is also a very tiny point. It does happen, but it happens so few times as to be tiny. There have been protests over incidents years that were absolutely NOT unlawful force. The force used was lawful and acceptable. They matched for a false reason. Police do not go around willy nilly killing people and beating them. When it does happen they should be fired and prosecuted. And that IS happening. Which is perfectly acceptable and should be done. But again it is a tiny percentage of incidents.

Your next point is completely invalid and opinion only. Imprisonment is not slavery. It is punishment for committing CRIME. Your argument is ridiculous. In fact, prisoners ought to be working harder than they do. They have far too much time on their hands.

You last point is also valid that Gerry mandating does occur. However as another poster pointed out the Democrats also do it. I don't really like gerry mandating and I wish BOTH parties wouldn't do it.

So in total you have provided a TINY bit of evidence for three if your claims and the others were completely invalid and opinion based only. I would even call them gas lighting.

So your evidence is even tinier.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

somehow without coming out of his basement and while avoiding taking a position on several important issues, Biden got more votes than even Obama, nothing unusual about that, Right?

I can tell you as one who voted for Biden that no other issue was on my mind more than stopping Trump and making him a one term president. It’s not hard to understand that a lot of people probably felt the same way.

 

[LockeeDeck]

Well he did ask for a tiny bit of evidence and you provided just that. A tiny piece.

However your "evidence" tinier than tiny. You first link proves the cops did nothing wrong. They didn't steal anything. Theft is against the law. Forfeiture is NOT against the law. It's legal. You may not like it, you may not agree with it, but it's law. Now here is where we probably do agree. I would like to see the laws changed. I don't like forfeiture laws myself. I believe that a person should be convicted before their ppl is forfeited. But the courts have ruled that forfeiture is legal and the laws stand. Therefore NO theft has taken place. You are being dishonest.

The fourth amendment is about unreasonable searches and seizures. Having armed men stop your car and take all your cash without warrant or cause should be a clear violation but it makes the police and city money. As it is we have LITERAL highway robbery in all but name.

Your second point is also a dishonest one. The supreme court has ruled. This they have determined the Constitutional rights of Miranda are as they say. Just as they said Miranda is law, so they also define the perimeters of Miranda. And that's what they did. Point number two fails.

That one is a bit narrow but the court determined that silence can be used against you if you do not claim 5th amendment protections if under questioning by the police. The police do not give Miranda warnings for questioning people, only when arresting people.

You third point is valid. In NY. Most states would not allow such actions and the hose actions DO violate speedy trial. That boy should not have spent those years in jail. It WAS wrong in my opinion.

I'm not sure why you believe this doesn't happen in other states. Most legal actions end in plea deals not because of established guilt but because a lack of speedy trials. If you have no money for bail then you would wait months for a trial in jail whereas you could get out on probation for many offenses if you just plead guilty, regardless of guilt.

Your 4th point is also a very tiny point. It does happen, but it happens so few times as to be tiny. There have been protests over incidents years that were absolutely NOT unlawful force. The force used was lawful and acceptable. They matched for a false reason. Police do not go around willy nilly killing people and beating them. When it does happen they should be fired and prosecuted. And that IS happening. Which is perfectly acceptable and should be done. But again it is a tiny percentage of incidents.

We shouldn't be OK with police killing and beating as much as they do. In proportion our police do it WAY more than any other country with money.

Also there are entire departments that are corrupt to look the other way when it does happen
Rampart scandal - Wikipedia

Your next point is completely invalid and opinion only. Imprisonment is not slavery. It is punishment for committing CRIME. Your argument is ridiculous. In fact, prisoners ought to be working harder than they do. They have far too much time on their hands.

The point is about prisons and others making money off the labor of the prisoners. That creates perverse incentives to have more prisoners and to compel them to work.

You last point is also valid that Gerry mandating does occur. However as another poster pointed out the Democrats also do it. I don't really like gerry mandating and I wish BOTH parties wouldn't do it.

Indeed, and the leaked files show that the Republicans had a targeted campaign to disenfranchise minorities.

So in total you have provided a TINY bit of evidence for three if your claims and the others were completely invalid and opinion based only. I would even call them gas lighting.

So your evidence is even tinier.

The post is about the erosion of constitutional rights, you are not exactly protected from unwarranted search and seizures if the police can just pull you over and take your cash.

You are not given a speedy trial if you have to wait months, potentially years, in jail to prove your innocence.

And not everyone has equal representation if groups are actively colluding to disenfranchise them.

 

[rjs330]

Like “election fraud”?

Yes, there is little evidence that a massive fraud caused Biden to win. There was fraud, but it was small and not enough to change the results.

In Democrat areas they changed rules without legislative action which I believe may have changed the results had they not made those changes. But we don't really know how much it effected things.

But it's plain now there wasn't enough fraud to change the he results. Biden won.

 

[SimplyMe]

Yes, there is little evidence that a massive fraud caused Biden to win. There was fraud, but it was small and not enough to change the results.

In Democrat areas they changed rules without legislative action which I believe may have changed the results had they not made those changes. But we don't really know how much it effected things.

But it's plain now there wasn't enough fraud to change the he results. Biden won.

Why do you say that they change rules in "Democrat areas?" They change the rules in many states, without the legislature, including Republican controlled states like Texas and Utah.

 

[rjs330]

The fourth amendment is about unreasonable searches and seizures. Having armed men stop your car and take all your cash without warrant or cause should be a clear violation but it makes the police and city money. As it is we have LITERAL highway robbery in all but name.



That one is a bit narrow but the court determined that silence can be used against you if you do not claim 5th amendment protections if under questioning by the police. The police do not give Miranda warnings for questioning people, only when arresting people.



I'm not sure why you believe this doesn't happen in other states. Most legal actions end in plea deals not because of established guilt but because a lack of speedy trials. If you have no money for bail then you would wait months for a trial in jail whereas you could get out on probation for many offenses if you just plead guilty, regardless of guilt.



We shouldn't be OK with police killing and beating as much as they do. In proportion our police do it WAY more than any other country with money.

Also there are entire departments that are corrupt to look the other way when it does happen
Rampart scandal - Wikipedia



The point is about prisons and others making money off the labor of the prisoners. That creates perverse incentives to have more prisoners and to compel them to work.



Indeed, and the leaked files show that the Republicans had a targeted campaign to disenfranchise minorities.



The post is about the erosion of constitutional rights, you are not exactly protected from unwarranted search and seizures if the police can just pull you over and take your cash.

You are not given a speedy trial if you have to wait months, potentially years, in jail to prove your innocence.

And not everyone has equal representation if groups are actively colluding to disenfranchise them.

As I said, much of this is opinion. And you are entitled to it. But you opinion doesn't make you correct. There are things in your list I agree with. But they ARE legal and are so by the Supreme Court. So, making a claim of "theft" is false because you can't steal something the courts have made legal. It's an opinions not a fact.

Again you make a claim that is false. Most court cases are not settled because of speedy trial issues. Most are settled for other reasons, not because the person day in jail too long. And there is NOTHING wrong with sitting in jail cause you can't post bail. It's been that way forever. The courts have ruled on this matter. As long as the bail is deemed reasonable then that's it. You can appeal a bail ruling. You are talking about legal process and offering an opinion. But I and the Supreme Court disagrees with your opinion on the possibility of violation if the Constitution. Bond or bail is not a constitutional violation.

No one is OKAY with Police unlawful use of force. No one. I am merely saying it's not a crisis. It doesn't happen very often. It's rare. Extremely rare. And when it does happen the officer should be punished.

And prisoners should be working more. Your opinion is noted, but it wrong. You have no evidence that people are being thrown in prison just so the state can make money. Once again an insupported attack.

As I said Republicans and Democrats Gerry mander. It's PERFECTLY legal to do so in most cases. I disagree with it, but both sides do it.

Opinions, everybody has them. But please base them on facts not rhetoric.

 

[perplexed]

Mark Meadows just released the crazy conspiracy theory going around the
Whitehouse on January 6.


Election Fraud, Foreign Interference & Options for 6 JAN (archive.org)
https://web.archive.org/web/2021071...om/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/voter-fraud.pdf

 

[LockeeDeck]

As I said, much of this is opinion. And you are entitled to it. But you opinion doesn't make you correct. There are things in your list I agree with. But they ARE legal and are so by the Supreme Court. So, making a claim of "theft" is false because you can't steal something the courts have made legal. It's an opinions not a fact.

The supreme court hasn't ruled on asset forfeiture. Also petty semantics doesn't take away from the fact that armed people sanctioned by the government can, and do on a frequent basis, take your property with little recourse.

Again you make a claim that is false. Most court cases are not settled because of speedy trial issues. Most are settled for other reasons, not because the person day in jail too long. And there is NOTHING wrong with sitting in jail cause you can't post bail. It's been that way forever. The courts have ruled on this matter. As long as the bail is deemed reasonable then that's it. You can appeal a bail ruling. You are talking about legal process and offering an opinion. But I and the Supreme Court disagrees with your opinion on the possibility of violation if the Constitution. Bond or bail is not a constitutional violation.

It creates two legal systems for the poor and for those who can pay.

No one is OKAY with Police unlawful use of force. No one.

It's not hard to find people who cheer the police when they beat minorities. To say NO ONE is pleased by the police in their use of force is a lie.

I am merely saying it's not a crisis. It doesn't happen very often. It's rare. Extremely rare.

It's rare to hear about it because most of the time nothing comes of it. It's normalized for a suspect to come in beat up because "they were resisting" or for the body cam to stop working when the shooting happened.

And when it does happen the officer should be punished.

Should be, but that is not the norm.

And prisoners should be working more. Your opinion is noted, but it wrong. You have no evidence that people are being thrown in prison just so the state can make money. Once again an insupported attack.

Kids for cash scandal - Wikipedia

A judge was caught selling kids to a prison. Most corruption isn't that explicit but the incentives are there for prisons to be filled and for prisoners to work to make other people money.

As I said Republicans and Democrats Gerry mander. It's PERFECTLY legal to do so in most cases. I disagree with it, but both sides do it.

It's not legal to gerrymander on racial grounds and the republicans do that.

Opinions, everybody has them. But please base them on facts not rhetoric.

That's just it isn't it. My world view is based on things that have actually happened, from what I've seen on here a lot of people are worried about vague "Marxists" or other bogymen. So in this sentiment I agree.

 

[Subduction Zone]

It's not legal to gerrymander on racial grounds and the republicans do that.

No, no, no, they just do it on an economic basis. By some odd coincidence that they totally had not planned on the poor usually have high percentages of racial minorities

 

[rjs330]

OK how exactly are they violating the constitution, what is your specific reason for making that statement, what is your legal basis, can you justify what you are asserting?

No he can't because the Supreme Court has ruled the constitutionality of the issues.

 

[Valletta]

Which “God”? And nobody of note is promoting Marxism. Although EX President Trump and some of his strongest supporters do seem to bring the Marx brothers to mind.

CRT is Marxist or neo-Marxist and is being taught around the country.

 

[cow451]

CRT is Marxist or neo-Marxist and is being taught around the country.

The Trump inner circle resembles the Marx brothers.

CRY and BLM are primarily conservative boogeymen.

Carry on.

 

[cow451]

Biden won.

QFT