Is Christianity Bad News for Women?

[Paidiske]

A public lecture organised by the Centre for Public Christianity. Thought that others might appreciate it also:

Is Christianity Bad News for Women?

 

[timewerx]

In the the **non-canonical** Gospel of Mary, Mary Magdalene is the mysterious "beloved disciple" in the Book of John and was tasked by Christ to lead the twelve disciples.

It is a very interesting read as the ancient literature also discussed the dilemma of gender equality in a period that is heavily patriarchal.

They were arguing on a very modern concept of gender equality thousands of years ago! They made it clear one thing that set Christianity apart from other religions is the gender equality it espoused.

The founding fathers of Orthodox Christianity however is quick to extinguish the idea of gender equality in the religion and many scriptures didn't made it to canon Bible for other reasons as well.

 

[Chaplain David]

A public lecture organised by the Centre for Public Christianity. Thought that others might appreciate it also:

Is Christianity Bad News for Women?

The woman I am closest to, my wife, has thrived in every way since becoming a Christian. Although she is an independent-minded and strong woman, she submits to God through Christ. We also have an egalitarian relationship and we submit to each other but always to God first. I am the head of the household but I am not ruler of the household. We take turns leading and helping each other and I thank God for her every day.

 

[Paidiske]

Do you find, though, David, that the church has ever created problems for her, as a woman?

It's not Christ that's the issue (which is the point of the lecture), it's often the entrenched powers in the church.

 

[Joshua_5]

Is Christianity Bad News for Women?

What a question? Salvation from an eternity in hell fire, and someone wonders whether its bad news for women? Good news for all of mankind who believe in Christ, male or female, no?

When I see the question, I immediately doubt the priority Christ takes in the life of the author of the referenced article. Perhaps the author subscribes to a feminist religion moreso than a Christian one?

 

[HereIStand]

Considering the rights of women in Muslim countries versus historically Christian countries, Christianity has been good for the rights of women. Further, in ancient times, women were simply part of the family unit, like everyone else. Individual rights and property rights only came about because of Christianity. See the book, Inventing the Individual.

 

[Paidiske]

What a question? Salvation from an eternity in hell fire, and someone wonders whether its bad news for women? Good news for all of mankind who believe in Christ, male or female, no?

When I see the question, I immediately doubt the priority Christ takes in the life of the author of the referenced article. Perhaps the author subscribes to a feminist religion moreso than a Christian one?

Did you watch the lecture? Because when I did, the priorities of the lecturer were very clear to me...

 

[JRichard68]

I didn't listen to the whole talk, maybe about 20 minutes or so. I don't doubt that women have been "restricted to spheres" as she says. I may come back to the lecture to listen a bit more, though. It was interesting making a point about women "being painted as seducers to be feared", and linking the scapegoating of women to the story of Eve as the "iconic story". There does seem to be an element of scapegoating in the narrative, as Adam places blame on Eve, and (ultimately) God for his failing, but the responsibility ultimately comes back to him.
What also stood out was a statement toward the beginning, that the speaker was framing the question as a "moral issue" as opposed to a religious/Christian one. Of course, Christianity has much to do with moral and ethical questions, so this might be her frame of reference.
I'll save judgment/opinion on the over-arching question itself until I've listened a bit more.

 

[Joshua_5]

Did you watch the lecture? Because when I did, the priorities of the lecturer were very clear to me...

To be fair, I didn't. The title turned me off.

 

[Paidiske]

I suspect the title was chosen by the group who organised it, who aim to foster discussion of Christian ideas with a wider audience. If you actually listen to her, it's very clear that she proclaims Christ as good news.

 

[Chaplain David]

Do you find, though, David, that the church has ever created problems for her, as a woman?

It's not Christ that's the issue (which is the point of the lecture), it's often the entrenched powers in the church.

I've seen some bullheaded churches and they really need prayer. I'm also one of the first to suggest a person look for another church if the are having problems in the one that they go to.

In regards to my wife, I've watched for any problems she's had but have not seen any. And I learn from how she has approached various things in scripture, prayer, and thoughts about God.

I think that any Christian can have problems maturing in the faith. I've certainly had mine. Yet our Jesus teaches us all without making distinctions regarding the most important topics.

I cannot even imagine being married to a nonbeliever. I don't think it would be possible for me. But I love being married to a fellow believer and look forward to continuing our respective, individual, and also joint growth in Christ Jesus.

 

[JackRT]

In the the **non-canonical** Gospel of Mary, Mary Magdalene is the mysterious "beloved disciple" in the Book of John and was tasked by Christ to lead the twelve disciples.

It is a very interesting read as the ancient literature also discussed the dilemma of gender equality in a period that is heavily patriarchal.

They were arguing on a very modern concept of gender equality thousands of years ago! They made it clear one thing that set Christianity apart from other religions is the gender equality it espoused.

The founding fathers of Orthodox Christianity however is quick to extinguish the idea of gender equality in the religion and many scriptures didn't made it to canon Bible for other reasons as well.

From the gospels it would seem that Jesus was gender blind and the early church certainly was egalitarian. However by the time the Pastoral Epistles were written @ AD 120 you can see that patriarchy has moved right back in and women are being forced back into their subservient roles.

 

[timewerx]

From the gospels it would seem that Jesus was gender blind and the early church certainly was egalitarian. However by the time the Pastoral Epistles were written @ AD 120 you can see that patriarchy has moved right back in and women are being forced back into their subservient roles.

I think it was Apostle Paul who set it back. It makes sense because Paul used to be anti-Christian and a Pharisee. Paul must have kept some of his bad culture, the Jewish Orthodox culture as a Pharisee since he didn't walked with the original disciples when Christ was here.

I don't think Paul's epistles should have been included in the Bible Canon anyway, including books regarded as Jewish Orthodox (due to Pharisaic origins). The ancient scriptures Christ mentioned is definitely not the Bible. Our Bible is actually missing many of these ancient scriptures and Jesus also warned against adding/subtracting to the Word and we probably don't need a Bible anyway as the Holy Spirit alone will guide us to the Truth -- John 16:13.

 

[JackRT]

Greek dualistic thinking, which was accepted uncritically by the early church once it had lost its Jewish roots, portrayed men as naturally spiritual and intellectual while women were thought of as carnal and simple. In some circles this sort of thinking is still present in Christianity.

 

[Tolworth John]

It's interesting that Jesus allowed a women to have the place of honour when he was teaching. Mary sat at his feet. It was woen who were the first witnesses of the resuirection, at a time when there testimony was not accepted in a law court.
Paul also valued women, look and see how often he mentions them and never in a hurtfull way.
It is Christianity that has raised the status of women not any other set of ideas.

 

[Dave-W]

The ancient scriptures Christ mentioned is definitely not the Bible.

Actually, it is. HE often mentioned "Moses and the prophets;" 2 of the 3 major divisions of the Hebrew OT. On one occasion HE also mentioned the 3rd:

Luke 24:44
Now He said to them, “These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things which are written about Me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled.”

 

[hedrick]

I think it was Apostle Paul who set it back.

I don't think Paul set anything back. He recognized women leaders. The issue is with pseudo-Paul in the Pastorals.

 

[Dave-W]

The issue is with pseudo-Paul in the Pastorals.

???

You think someone OTHER than Paul wrote Timothy and Titus?

 

[hedrick]

???

You think someone OTHER than Paul wrote Timothy and Titus?

Of course.

 

[Paidiske]

It's pretty well agreed mainstream Biblical scholarship across the board.