Is BTK Killer a Lutheran?

[GW]

I have been trying to learn about Luther's view of sin as it relates to BTK Killer Dennis Rader (a leader of a Lutheran Church).

From a recent CNN article, the mass murderer stated, "People will say that I'm not a Christian, but I believe I am." About his long-term plans, he said, "I expect to heal and have light and then, hopefully, someday, God will accept me." (CNN: "BTK Sentenced to 10 Life Terms" - August 18, 2005)

Now, Rader is a Lutheran, and I couldn't help but think of some of Luther's head-turning statements about grave sin and justification:

"Be a sinner, and let your sins be strong, but let your trust in Christ be stronger, and rejoice in Christ who is the victor over sin, death, and the world. ...No sin can separate us from Him, even if we were to kill or commit adultery thousands of times each day." ('Let Your Sins Be Strong, from 'The Wittenberg Project;' 'The Wartburg Segment', translated by Erika Flores, from Dr. Martin Luther's Saemmtliche Schriften, Letter No. 99, 1 Aug. 1521.)

AND ALSO...

"I know I have committed many sins, and I continue to sin daily. But that does not bother me. You have got to shout louder, Mr. Law. I am deaf, you know. Talk as much as you like, I am dead to you. If you want to talk to me about my sins, go and talk to my flesh. Belabor that, but don’t talk to my conscience. My conscience is a lady and a queen, and has nothing to do with the likes of you, because my conscience lives to Christ under another law, a new and better law, the law of grace." -- Martin Luther, A Commentary on St. Paul’s Epistle to the Galatians, Chapter 2, Verse 19.
​

On the face of it, it appears that the BTK Killer might actually be within the bounds of Luther's ideas on justification. Certainly, BTK did not commit 100 murders, much less 1000 in a single day as Luther said a Christian could do. And, BTK claims to be a Christian who hopes to be accepted by God.

Is it me, or is BTK a good Lutheran, theologically speaking? BTK appears to have "faith alone" as Luther taught, and he also seems to suffer within his "flesh." But Luther dicotomized these so that one's grave sins didn't matter so long as one professed Christ in word, as BTK clearly does. Help me understand if Luther really believed that stuff he said about sinning boldly and committing 1000 murders a day and still being firmly in Christ.

 

[Protoevangel]

The life he lead certiany seemed to not be in keeping with the fruit of the Spirit. I wonder myself if he was a wolf among sheep, but, how do I judge another man's salvation? He is certianly not beyond God's ability to save. I pray for him, his victims and all the families involved.

 

[Jim47]

His deeds are dark and ugly, but I pray that he may find true repentance faith and forgiveness. God takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but wants all to come to repentance.

I pray for him and all his vicitims families, may God grant healing to all.

 

[ByzantineDixie]

From the Smalcald Articles

43 It is therefore necessary to know and to teach that when holy people, aside from the fact that they still possess and feel original sin and daily repent and strive against it, fall into open sin (as David fell into adultery, murder, and blasphemy),2 faith and the Spirit have departed from them. 44 This is so because the Holy Spirit does not permit sin to rule and gain the upper hand in such a way that sin is committed, but the Holy Spirit represses and restrains it so that it does not do what it wishes. If the sin does what it wishes, the Holy Spirit and faith are not present,
2 Cf. II Sam. 11.
Tappert, T. G. (2000, c1959). The book of concord : The confessions of the evangelical Lutheran church. Philadelphia: Fortress Press.

Lutherans would say no one can commit premeditated murder in faith. However, as St. Paul was converted even after he murdered Christians, so, too, can the BTK be reconverted.

 

[SPALATIN]

The question I have is did he come to faith before he killed someone or after?

 

[GW]

Hi Luther's Rose. Thanks for the reply. Could you show me where Luther himself taught that? From a few of the statements I have read by Luther, it appears that he actually dichotomized faith and the works of the flesh so that one could *at the same time* do heinous sins and retain the proper love of God and man by "faith alone."

For example:

"Be a sinner, and let your sins be strong, but let your trust in Christ be stronger ...No sin can separate us from Him, even if we were to kill or commit adultery thousands of times each day." ('Let Your Sins Be Strong, from 'The Wittenberg Project;' 'The Wartburg Segment', translated by Erika Flores, from Dr. Martin Luther's Saemmtliche Schriften, Letter No. 99, 1 Aug. 1521.)
​

Note there that Luther admonishes men to sin boldy (including repeat murders and adulteries) as long as they have a mental assent to Christ's work (i.e., they have "faith alone"?). BTK seems to qualify perfectly.

AND ALSO...

"I know I have committed many sins, and I continue to sin daily. But that does not bother me. You have got to shout louder, Mr. Law. I am deaf, you know. Talk as much as you like, I am dead to you. If you want to talk to me about my sins, go and talk to my flesh. Belabor that, but don’t talk to my conscience. My conscience is a lady and a queen, and has nothing to do with the likes of you, because my conscience lives to Christ under another law, a new and better law, the law of grace." -- Martin Luther, A Commentary on St. Paul’s Epistle to the Galatians, Chapter 2, Verse 19.
​

Note there that Luther said he wasn't bothered by sinfulness (contrary to warnings of scripture against sinfulness), and he specifically says that his conscience could be perfectly just while his actual deeds were perfectly sinful. Again, BTK seems to fit this perspective.

How did Luther arrive at such a perspective? I don't think scripture allows for this "split personality"/Jekyl & Hyde approach to justification, but maybe Luther was just being flippant here?

 

[filosofer]

Not directly related, but the man I have been car-pooling with for the past 4 years was close the situation. He and his wife lived in Wichita while all that was going on, living in fear every day. A woman down the street was an intended victim, Rader had already marked her. But she happened to be unexpectedly out of the house that day that Rader came. So my friend and his wife have followed the story very closely.

 

[LilLamb219]

Even Christians can fall from faith according to scripture. I pray this man repents of his sins and is reconciled to God.

 

[SPALATIN]

Not directly related, but the man I have been car-pooling with for the past 4 years was close the situation. He and his wife lived in Wichita while all that was going on, living in fear every day. A woman down the street was an intended victim, Rader had already marked her. But she happened to be unexpectedly out of the house that day that Rader came. So my friend and his wife have followed the story very closely.

Speaking of Murder convicts or in this case a former convict. Have you heard anything of Tom Bird lately? He has now been out of prison for over a year and has about a year left on his parole.

 

[GW]

Hi Lillamb 219.

The point I'm making is that I don't think BTK "fell from faith" within Luther's view of justification. If I understand Luther's statements correctly, one doesn't "fall" unless one ceases to "believe." Murders, rapes, adulteries and the like aren't "falls" in Luther's theology if one has "faith." Read Luther's admonition to "sin boldly." BTK was following that admonition.

 

[filosofer]

Have you heard anything of Tom Bird lately? He has now been out of prison for over a year and has about a year left on his parole.

I think he is serving as an assistant to a pastor (I know the pastor) Tom is doing very well, and good things for the Lord.

 

[Protoevangel]

Hi Luther's Rose. Thanks for the reply. Could you show me where Luther himself taught that? From a few of the statements I have read by Luther, it appears that he actually dichotomized faith and the works of the flesh so that one could *at the same time* do heinous sins and retain the proper love of God and man by "faith alone."

For example:

"Be a sinner, and let your sins be strong, but let your trust in Christ be stronger ...No sin can separate us from Him, even if we were to kill or commit adultery thousands of times each day." ('Let Your Sins Be Strong, from 'The Wittenberg Project;' 'The Wartburg Segment', translated by Erika Flores, from Dr. Martin Luther's Saemmtliche Schriften, Letter No. 99, 1 Aug. 1521.)
​

Note there that Luther admonishes men to sin boldy (including repeat murders and adulteries) as long as they have a mental assent to Christ's work (i.e., they have "faith alone"?). BTK seems to qualify perfectly.

AND ALSO...

"I know I have committed many sins, and I continue to sin daily. But that does not bother me. You have got to shout louder, Mr. Law. I am deaf, you know. Talk as much as you like, I am dead to you. If you want to talk to me about my sins, go and talk to my flesh. Belabor that, but don’t talk to my conscience. My conscience is a lady and a queen, and has nothing to do with the likes of you, because my conscience lives to Christ under another law, a new and better law, the law of grace." -- Martin Luther, A Commentary on St. Paul’s Epistle to the Galatians, Chapter 2, Verse 19.
​

Note there that Luther said he wasn't bothered by sinfulness (contrary to warnings of scripture against sinfulness), and he specifically says that his conscience could be perfectly just while his actual deeds were perfectly sinful. Again, BTK seems to fit this perspective.

How did Luther arrive at such a perspective? I don't think scripture allows for this "split personality"/Jekyl & Hyde approach to justification, but maybe Luther was just being flippant here?

He was not being flippant, he was being entirely serious. The problem is, the quotes are being read and understood out oftheir context. I will try to prepare an answer for you later today, but I don't have most of my material here at work, so please be patient.

 

[SPALATIN]

I think he is serving as an assistant to a pastor (I know the pastor) Tom is doing very well, and good things for the Lord.

Despite his conviction I do not believe that he did that for which he was convicted. I think Lorna Anderson was the culprit.

 

[IowaLutheran]

Here's a pretty good explanation on the Lutheran view of justification and an explanation of the "sin boldly" quote:

http://members.aol.com/mjsawyer/lutheran.html

"Luther and Lutheranism after him have recognized that even in a state of regeneration the believer still lives in the world and still in fact does commit acts of sin. Lutheranism in no way minimizes this fact. There is no attempt to redefine sin to make it anything less than what it is. Rather there is a stark recognition of the dialectic of the Christian's acceptance before God and the fact that he still sins. Luther's phrase to describe this condition was that the state of the Christian between regeneration and ultimate glorification is simul iustus et peccator, at once just (or justified) and sinner. This is not a condition that will ever be transcended in this life. Rather, the believer must always rely on the finished work of Christ for his/her acceptance before God.

* * * *
In contrast to some of the later perfection teachings on sanctification Lutheranism has embraced the stark reality of the dilemma of living simultaneously in two worlds. It is in this context that Luther's admonition to "Sin boldly!" must be understood. Lutheranism in no way condones sin. Rather it recognizes "that where sin abounded, grace did much more abound."


Such a perspective seems strange to the ears of the Wesleyan who assert that sin and holiness cannot co-exist simultaneously. The more righteousness, the less sin. Forde critiques the common evangelical understanding showing its pitfalls the bottom line to which is that it is a practical denial of grace. This denial places the whole weight of sanctification back on the back of the individual.

* * * *
Lutheranism sees the believer living in two worlds and as unable to full step into the new as long as he is encumbered by the flesh. By the grace of God the new life implanted does manifest itself, and the believer must struggle with evil. But the mindset is different than with either the Reformed or the Wesleyan. This is because the Lutherans at bottom define sin in terms of life orientation and faith, rather than in terms of specific acts or deeds done.


In contrast to other Protestant Traditions the Lutherans eschew the idea of progress in sanctification as being an progressive upward movement toward perfection/holiness/maturity/full sanctification. Sanctification is not "our part of the bargain, a willing response to God's final verdict, or a making of that verdict to be true in our lives. This thinking is really a reassertion of the old life, a life governed by law. A life which produces "civil righteousness" but not a righteousness which is reflective of the divine life being wrought within. While this kind of thinking and activity is necessary in the world, when imported into the Christian Life it is disaster. It undermines grace and places the "self" again in control rather than looking to divine grace and mercy for what the self cannot produce."

 

[LilLamb219]

The point I'm making is that I don't think BTK "fell from faith" within Luther's view of justification. If I understand Luther's statements correctly, one doesn't "fall" unless one ceases to "believe." Murders, rapes, adulteries and the like aren't "falls" in Luther's theology if one has "faith." Read Luther's admonition to "sin boldly." BTK was following that admonition.

I read that the killer thought he had a demon inside him. How can a person with faith have a demon? I didn't think that was possible. Anyone know?

 

[Protoevangel]

Not a comprehensive answer, but a couple of points:

Augsburg Confession, Article VI: Of New Obedience.
1] Also they teach that this faith is bound to bring forth good fruits, and that it is necessary to do good works commanded by God, because of God's will, but that we should not rely on those works to merit justification before God.


Augsburg Confession, Article VIII: What the Church Is.
1] Although the Church properly is the congregation of saints and true believers, nevertheless, since in this life many hypocrites and evil persons are mingled therewith, it is lawful to use Sacraments administered by evil men, according to the saying of Christ: The Scribes and 2] the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat, etc. Matt. 23, 2. Both the Sacraments and Word are effectual by reason of the institution and commandment of Christ, notwithstanding they be administered by evil men.


Just because one is in the congregation of the faithful, does not make that one "of the church", nor does the mere claim that one has faith mean that faith is truly present.

 

[Tetzel]

So according to your church, how much sin is forgiven by God? What's the limit?

 

[GW]

Hi IowaLutheran:

I read that article you listed. It appears that the issue hinges on Luther's idea of "forensic," "imputed" justification and sanctification. It appears that Luther *always* rejected a view of justification/sanctification that defined such as tied to one's actual deeds. As that article points out, Luther did not believe that sinfulness could be transcended, and so a man's actual sins should in no way factor in to a discussion on salvation. From what I can tell, that's where Luther is way out of step with scripture. Scripture teaches that Christ's taking away man's sins means Christ takes away his actual sinfulness. Thus, progressive sanctification to actual holiness is the biblical view, not a mere "forensic" and "imputed" declaration of such.

The article you listed states that "In contrast to other Protestant Traditions the Lutherans eschew the idea of progress in sanctification as being an progressive upward movement toward perfection/holiness/maturity/full sanctification." That is, truly, a radical departure from scriptural teaching. It appears that both Catholics and Wesleyan teachers would agree that sanctification is, in fact, a progressive upward movement toward perfection/holiness/maturity.

 

[LilLamb219]

Scripture teaches that Christ's taking away man's sins means Christ takes away his actual sinfulness.

Lutherans believe we are 100% saint and 100% sinner at the same time. It is scriptural.

 

[GW]

Hi LilLamb219.

I think this is what's being disputed by many. As one becomes saint, one *must* at the same time be sinning less and less. The teaching of 1 John is perfectly clear: 1 John 1:6, 2:3-11, 2:29, 3:5-12, 3:15, 4:8, 5:18.

The problem, as I see it, is that Luther denied this fact.