Is baptism neccesary for salvation?

[eldermike]

Unless one beleives that faith is also a gift. If I give you a locked box and the key, you add nothing. If I give you locked box and tell you to make a key then you add something. Is faith something we muster?

 

[The Bible is Right]

Originally posted by Thunderchild
Baptism as a commandment means that something is added to the all sufficient sacrifice of Jesus. Baptism as a commandment means that something is added to salvation by faith alone.

Faith would be futile without the sacrifice of the messiah. (something has been added to salvation by faith alone already - the sacrifice of the messiah.)

The sacrifice of the messiah is of no benefit to a person who does not believe (something has been added to the all sufficient sacrifice of the messiah already - the need for faith.)

The only criticism raised against stating that baptism is a requirement? the concept violates the concept of the free and unconditional gift of salvation through faith. The fact is, it is not the doctrine of the requirement for baptism that is flawed, but the interpretation of "free and unconditional"

 

[The Bible is Right]

BAPTISM is what Jesus commanded the apostle to do to those who believed, once a person come to the knowledge of who Jesus is, and how Jesus died for our sins, and that our sins can be washed away by the blood of the lamb in baptism Acts 22:16 that's how a person is saved.

 

[The Bible is Right]

What does the bible say that baptism is?

 

will someone help me?  How do I type under quotes, I made a mistake in the above post, I was trying to comment on.

 

[Thunderchild]

http://pub43.ezboard.com/fwayrunnersfrm16.showMessage?topicID=10.topic

Part of the answer is given there, Larry.

 

[The Bible is Right]

will someone help me?  How do I type under quotes, I made a mistake in the above post, I was trying to comment on.

What I'm asking is how, if I wanted to quote you do I make the shaded areas then type under them?

 

[Miss Shelby]

Larry,

JJust hit the quote button on the person's post that you want to quote. It will bring it up for you and you can edit it or whatever.. then type under that.

Or you could just type [ quote ] insert text here [ /quote ] ....only don't put spaces between the brackets and the words quote. Am I making sense?

 

[DaveKerwin]

Originally posted by The Bible is Right
will someone help me?  How do I type under quotes, I made a mistake in the above post, I was trying to comment on.

What I'm asking is how, if I wanted to quote you do I make the shaded areas then type under them?

at the top right of every post is the quote button, click that to quote them. You will notice after doing that, you are taken to a screen to reply. The text is automatically quoted in the reply box. You know when the quoted post is done after you see " {/quote} " That is just coding that tells the board what to do. So after you see that, go ahead and type away for your reply to the quote, thats all there is to it. I always preview my posts to make sure the quote worked right, and that my post looks good. I hope this helps.

 

[The Bible is Right]

Yes, and thank you very much.

 

[The Bible is Right]

Thank you too. DaveKerwin

 

[The Bible is Right]

Let's come straight from the bible.

Romans 6:3-7
Col 2:12-13

Baptism is a burial in water, as simple as that.
The other part is a resurrection, when you come up out of the water Col 3:1
"If ye then be risen with Christ"

Romams 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that LIKE as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we ALSO should walk in newness of Life.

This is where new life begins. 
Eph 2:6 "And hath raised us up together and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

Without a resurrection you are still dead in sins, this is why baptism is so important.

 

[LouisBooth]

"What does the bible say that baptism is?"

depends...Spiritual baptism is part of salvation and happens at the moment of belief. the water baptism is just a ritual to show you are a christian. Read John 3.

 

[LightBearer]

What really matters in the end is Baptism is an absolute requirement to become a christian. Jesus himelf commanded it at Matthew 28:18-20 "Go therefore and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded YOU. And, look! I am with YOU all the days until the conclusion of the system of things.”

One of the taught things that were to be passed on infinitum was the command to Baptise

How important is it to be obedient to the lord. These words should have serious import for all christians. John 14:15; 20-21 “If YOU love me, YOU will observe my commandments; He that has my commandments and observes them, that one is he who loves me. In turn he that loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and will plainly show myself to him.”

And again. 1 John 5:1-4 ”Everyone believing that Jesus is the Christ has been born from God, and everyone who loves the one that caused to be born loves him who has been born from that one. By this we gain the knowledge that we are loving the children of God, when we are loving God and doing his commandments. For this is what the love of God means, that we observe his commandments; and yet his commandments are not burdensome.

Obedience is better than sacrifice.  Of this Christ was the greatest example.  "More than that, when he found himself in fashion as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient as far as death".  (Phil 2: 8)

 

[The Bible is Right]

Originally posted by LightBearer
[What really matters in the end is Baptism is an absolute requirement to become a christian. Jesus himelf commanded it at Matthew 28:18-20 "Go therefore and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded YOU. And, look! I am with YOU all the days until the conclusion of the system of things.”

One of the taught things that were to be passed on infinitum was the command to Baptise

How important is it to be obedient to the lord. These words should have serious import for all christians. John 14:15; 20-21 “If YOU love me, YOU will observe my commandments; He that has my commandments and observes them, that one is he who loves me. In turn he that loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and will plainly show myself to him.”

And again. 1 John 5:1-4 ”Everyone believing that Jesus is the Christ has been born from God, and everyone who loves the one that caused to be born loves him who has been born from that one. By this we gain the knowledge that we are loving the children of God, when we are loving God and doing his commandments. For this is what the love of God means, that we observe his commandments; and yet his commandments are not burdensome.

Obedience is better than sacrifice.  Of this Christ was the greatest example.  "More than that, when he found himself in fashion as a man, he humbled himself and became obedient as far as death".]  (Phil 2: 8)

 

I agree with you on this post!

 

[LouisBooth]

"What really matters in the end is Baptism is an absolute requirement to become a christian. "

I'm not so sure about that. He didn't seem to mention that in John 3. He only mentioned to believe. He talked about baptism, but it was of the spirit NOT of water.

 

[Azeotroper]

I have a question.  I know for sure that Church of Christ members believe baptism is itself salvific (if that's a word).  What other denominations hold to this belief? 

 

[LightBearer]

Originally posted by LouisBooth
"What really matters in the end is Baptism is an absolute requirement to become a christian. "

I'm not so sure about that. He didn't seem to mention that in John 3. He only mentioned to believe. He talked about baptism, but it was of the spirit NOT of water.

The proper rendering of that verse is “For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life. (John 3:16) 

 It's not just belief, it's exercising faith that counts. To exercise is an activity.

‘Exercising faith’ in Jesus means more than simply saying “I believe.” It means doing something about it; it means becoming active, for “faith without works is dead,” it being alone. (Jas. 2:26) It means that we believe him so much that we do what he says. We do not do just some things and not others. We do all the things he says. That includes getting Baptised in water as he did, setting for us the example to follow. "In fact, to this [course] YOU were called, because even Christ suffered for YOU, leaving YOU a model for YOU to follow his steps closely" (1 Peter 2:21). And we do them because we really want to.

 

[The Bible is Right]

Originally posted by LouisBooth
"What really matters in the end is Baptism is an absolute requirement to become a christian. "

[I'm not so sure about that. He didn't seem to mention that in John 3. He only mentioned to believe. He talked about baptism, but it was of the spirit NOT of water.] 

 

Jesus is talking about entering into the kingdom of God.  He said you MusT be born of the water AND the spirit to enter in.  There is only one meaning of the text, that is to be baptize for the remission of sins.

We know Nicodemus didn't understand what Jesus was talking about, but the message is clear in the text.  The apostles understood what Jesus was saying, this is why on the day of Pentecost Peter preach one of the greatest sermons ever, which prick the hearts of the hearers and caused them to ask "What shall we DO"?  Peter's answer was to REPENT AND BE BAPTIZED FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS!

There is NO other answer to that question.

 

[eldermike]

Bible,

We are all born of water. Jesus was talking about a second birth in answer to a question about being born more than once. "How can a man be born twice". Your first birth was water, your second is Spirit. We lived 9 months surrounded by water. We were all born of water naturally.

Again, I beleive in obediance to God. Batisim is the right thing to do, no doubt about it. But as Jesus said, "you must be born of Water and Spirit = 2 births, totally consistent with being "born again". To be saved you must be born twice. Another reason for the significances of this text is this: I didn't control my first birth either.

Blessings

 

[The Bible is Right]

Originally posted by Azeotroper
I have a question. [ I know for sure that Church of Christ members believe baptism is itself salvific (if that's a word).  What other denominations hold to this belief?] 

The Church of Christ believe!

Hearing the word of God the gospel Romans 10:17.

Believing the word the gospel John 20:30,31 Heb 11:6

Repenting of all sins Luke 13:3,5

Confessing the name of Jesus Christ Matt. 10:32,33

Baptized for the remission of sins Acts 2:38;22:16 Mark 16:16

Living a faithful life Rev. 2:10

We do not believe that baptism all by itself saves!