Incompetent State Governments Slowing Vaccine

[Redwingfan9]

Priorities are more complex than you acknowledge:

* One big problem is treating the sick people. Protecting health workers protects our ability to deal with the illness, which isn’t going away immediately.

* Old people die more, but we also need to stop the spread. For that, it’s more important to get people who by the nature of their jobs have to be out and in contact with others.

So you’re seeing compromises. Health workers first, then jobs with lots of contact, and people over 80 and in nursing homes.

States have had a long time to do some planning, but specifics of how vaccine is going to be distributed weren’t known until recently. It’s always harder to coordinate lots of different groups. States have to coordinate their own health departments, the Feds who are making some decisions, the vaccine suppliers, shippers, and various places that are administering the vaccine. State health departments don’t have the staff to do any of this themselves. In fact because of the large number of organizations involved, there are delays in reporting how many people have been vaccinated.

The Federal government could do logistics and vaccination themselves, coordinating additional local resources where needed, and make the problem a lot less complex. State health departments weren’t designed for a massive project like this.

The fact that every state is having the same problems makes it very hard to claim incompetence. Except for ideologues who think that all government are incompetent at everything. If you want to be political a more likely story is that Trump doesn’t want to risk being responsible for anything.

If they're all having problems it's because they're incompetent. The history of government shows us their involvement makes everything less efficient and more costly.

Trump and the Feds aren't really involved in the vaccine rollout. Federalism prevents mass Federal involvement in these matters. Biden would have done little different and I suspect would have had his own disagreements with flip flop Fauci.

It isn't young people filling hospitals, it's old people. Sure, there have been some hospitalized medical workers. They're few and far between compared to older people. Vaccinate the old and the number of hospitalizations will steadily drop as will deaths.

As for stopping spread, the spread doesn't matter if people aren't getting hospitalized and dying. For those under 60, death his highly unlikely. Getting physically ill is a 50/50 proposition. Flu spreads every winter and kills 30-90k without anyone noticing. With the Coronavirus vaccine in place the quicker it becomes comparable to flu in terms of spread the better. If anyone expects the spread to become zero we're looking at decades of lockdowns, masks and other nonsense.

 

[JohnDB]

If they would simply stop delivering it to the state governments and begin to deliver it to places like doctors offices and regular medical clinics...not a big deal.

 

[Redwingfan9]

If they would simply stop delivering it to the state governments and begin to deliver it to places like doctors offices and regular medical clinics...not a big deal.

I they just delivered it to CVS and Walgreens it would be administered quicker. Even better, send it to the Chick-fil-A. They manage to routinely deliver efficient and friendly service.

 

[JohnDB]

I they just delivered it to CVS and Walgreens it would be administered quicker. Even better, send it to the Chick-fil-A. They manage to routinely deliver efficient and friendly service.

Wife said that yesterday too looking at the brisk business each one of them does.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

I they just delivered it to CVS and Walgreens it would be administered quicker. Even better, send it to the Chick-fil-A. They manage to routinely deliver efficient and friendly service.

I don't know where you live, but CVS and Walgreens are receiving the vaccines here in MA. They are administering it inside nursing homes to healthcare workers and the elderly.

Hospitals too are directly receiving the vaccines and giving it to their doctors and nurses.

That being said, despite 300,000 vaccines being slated for MA and the governor saying they're on track to receive them, they will not be enough to cover those in phase 1.

 

[JohnDB]

I don't know where you live, but CVS and Walgreens are receiving the vaccines here in MA. They are administering it inside nursing homes to healthcare workers and the elderly.

Hospitals too are directly receiving the vaccines and giving it to their doctors and nurses.

That being said, despite 300,000 vaccines being slated for MA and the governor saying they're on track to receive them, they will not be enough to cover those in phase 1.

They are shipping more out on an ongoing basis.

They have been shipping Pfizer primarily but some Moderna as well. Not everyone can use Pfizer's as storage is an issue.

But just in the rare chance that one Vaccine or type of Vaccine becomes a problem they are spreading the risk of these highly tested Vaccines across various different ones. So in the one in a billion chance that one of these Vaccines proves itself to be dangerous in some fashion.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

The main problem they're having is, there are not enough people to give the vaccine. The firefighters union wants the firefighters to be trained, so they can give it to each other when it arrives.

The pharmacy my wife and myself use, the pharmacist told us they would only get the Moderna Vaccine as their freezers can't handle the Pfizer Vaccine.

 

[JohnDB]

The main problem they're having is, there are not enough people to give the vaccine. The firefighters union wants the firefighters to be trained, so they can give it to each other when it arrives.

The pharmacy my wife and myself use, the pharmacist told us they would only get the Moderna Vaccine as their freezers can't handle the Pfizer Vaccine.

That's a worthless claim of insufficient personel.
Nursing students can give it... just about anyone with first aide training can do it. It's not complicated.

 

[Arcangl86]

That's a worthless claim of insufficient personel.
Nursing students can give it... just about anyone with first aide training can do it. It's not complicated.

I have first aid training. They do not train you on how to give a shot. And any trained health care worker they pull to do this is one that isn't doing something just as important.

 

[JohnDB]

I have first aid training. They do not train you on how to give a shot. And any trained health care worker they pull to do this is one that isn't doing something just as important.

It's not difficult.
Several million diabetics do it on a regular basis.

 

[Toro]

I they just delivered it to CVS and Walgreens it would be administered quicker. Even better, send it to the Chick-fil-A. They manage to routinely deliver efficient and friendly service.

Why stop there?

Put it on their menu it's only side effects would be not enough tea and way too much yum to not over eat.

It also wouldnt be a problem to recieve the second dose a week or two later.

 

[hedrick]

I don't know where you live, but CVS and Walgreens are receiving the vaccines here in MA. They are administering it inside nursing homes to healthcare workers and the elderly.

Hospitals too are directly receiving the vaccines and giving it to their doctors and nurses.

That being said, despite 300,000 vaccines being slated for MA and the governor saying they're on track to receive them, they will not be enough to cover those in phase 1.

Yes, that's the way NJ is doing it too. Apparently CVS wanted nursing homes to enter information, and it took a bit longer than expected to get it all.

 

[Redwingfan9]

Why stop there?

Put it on their menu it's only side effects would be not enough tea and way too much yum to not over eat.

It also wouldnt be a problem to recieve the second dose a week or two later.

I'll take the spicy chicken sandwich with a side of Pfizer vaccine.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

That's a worthless claim of insufficient personel.
Nursing students can give it... just about anyone with first aide training can do it. It's not complicated.

Well, being here in MA which probably has more medical staff and hospitals than most states, I don't believe it's a false accusation.

Nursing students may be able to give it, under strict supervision.

I don't know, I'm just going by what they're saying on the news.

 

[JohnDB]

Well, being here in MA which probably has more medical staff and hospitals than most states, I don't believe it's a false accusation.

Nursing students may be able to give it, under strict supervision.

I don't know, I'm just going by what they're saying on the news.

How about the fact that they had six months to prepare for the vaccine arrival?
Everyone knew from the janitor to the Governor knew it was coming.

 

[Toro]

I'll take the spicy chicken sandwich with a side of Pfizer vaccine.

Be sure to wash it down with a nice cold 32oz of Moderna for good measure.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

How about the fact that they had six months to prepare for the vaccine arrival?
Everyone knew from the janitor to the Governor knew it was coming.

They didn't know if the vaccines would be approved and didn't know how they'd be delivered.

Remember, it was Gen. Gus Perna, who Trump placed in charge of Operation Warp Speed.

Anyone who served in the military knows that "hurry up and wait," was the norm.

 

[Archivist]

How about the fact that they had six months to prepare for the vaccine arrival?
Everyone knew from the janitor to the Governor knew it was coming.

Except six months ago no one knew when the vaccine would be coming. Nothing had been approved at that point.

 

[hedrick]

I've been reading a bit more. As far as I can tell, states aren't doing much vaccination. Instead they've arranged for vaccines to be sent to hospitals to handle medical people and CVS / Walgreens for nursing homes.

It's also not clear how well we know the number of vaccinations that have been done. They have to be reported to the states, but people are probably concentrating more on vaccinating people rather than reporting. You'd think it would only take 5 minutes to send a count, but that's not what reporting means. They need to report every individual. The concern is that these all take two doses, and they need to make sure that people get the second dose at the right time, with the same vaccine as the original one. Reports are supposed to be within 72 hours, but there's reason to believe that they aren't.

It looks like the delays aren't with the states, but with the organizations actually doing the vaccinations.

States will get involved later, when broader populations are involved. Then they'll use large vaccination sites, with apps to let you make reservations.

I don't think they can ship it to the local pharmacy for several reasons:
* They don't have cold storage
* They probably can't handle huge numbers of people with reservations, who have to queue outside in their cars
* They don't have doctors to be available for 30 min after the shot

When they get to the large sites, the numbers will surely go up, but there will also be very long waiting lines.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

I've been reading a bit more. As far as I can tell, states aren't doing much vaccination. Instead they've arranged for vaccines to be sent to hospitals to handle medical people and CVS / Walgreens for nursing homes.

It's also not clear how well we know the number of vaccinations that have been done. They have to be reported to the states, but people are probably concentrating more on vaccinating people rather than reporting. You'd think it would only take 5 minutes to send a count, but that's not what reporting means. They need to report every individual. The concern is that these all take two doses, and they need to make sure that people get the second dose at the right time, with the same vaccine as the original one. Reports are supposed to be within 72 hours, but there's reason to believe that they aren't.

States will get involved later, when broader populations are involved. Then they'll use large vaccination sites, with apps to let you make reservations.

I don't think they can ship it to the local pharmacy for several reasons:
* They don't have cold storage
* They probably can't handle huge numbers of people with reservations, who have to queue outside in their cars
* They don't have doctors to be available for 30 min after the shot

When they get to the large sites, the numbers will surely go up, but there will also be very long waiting lines.

Actually they do know exactly how many vaccinations have been given.

The nurse, pharmacist or doctor have to register at the time the vaccination is given. Also, they know exactly how many viles were delivered to begin with.

Also, I already checked with my pharmacist. He showed me the freezer which can handle the Moderna Vaccine, but not Phizer.

However, CVS and Walgreens have the freezers to handle them which is why they're distributing them to the nursing homes.