In the beginning was Calvinism

[Gamecock]

An interesting read from our Messianic friends:​

The Synagogue of Christ by Steve Schlissel​

Messianic Jewish pastor​

Messiah's Congregation, Brooklyn, New York.​

The church wasn't born at Pentecost. It was Bar Mitzvah'd. No small matter, this. The church had a long, albeit dotted, history by the time the Spirit in Christ's fullness fell, and a glorious, albeit difficult, future. By Pentecost, the church, because of its history, its providentially-ordained organization and the Holy Spirit's promised guidance, was well-prepared to fulfill its function in the world.


The Belgic Confession, in Article XXVII, states, "We believe and profess one catholic or universal Church...This Church has been from the beginning of the world, and will be to the end thereof..." It has not, however, always had the same form. In the Garden of Eden God identified and separated the church (then consisting of two) using the essential elements, Word and Sacrament, Promise and Token, which would be present throughout the church's history, in some form or another. Our first parents were created to understand themselves and all things else in terms of a word. They had received the defining Word of God; they had heard the anti-word of the serpent. Choosing the devil's definitions, they had broken covenant with their Creator and entered into league with the destroyer, becoming co-pretenders with him to the throne.


God was not about to forsake His purposes, or to quickly formulate a "Plan B." He graciously and forcefully took back Adam and Eve-He redeemed them-by placing hostility between them and their new master (the Antithesis), by promising in their hearing the incarnation of the conquering, suffering Messiah (the Protevangelium, first proclamation of the Gospel), and by clothing them with God-provided coverings (the "Sacrament"), indicating in the clearest terms that their fig leaves (their instinctive effort at self-atonement/covering) were wholly inadequate and unacceptable. It is God who saves. Calvinism did not originate in Geneva; it is found in Eden. God's people, the covenant line, would henceforth be the people redeemed by Him to live, once again, in terms of His Word.

• Calvinists are not the "church" founded by John Knox in Scotland. Knox founded no "church", but a Denomination.
• We are not the "church" founded by the Protestant Reformers. The Reformers founded no "church", but a Reformation.
• We are not the "church" founded by the Popes at Rome. No "pope" has founded any "church", just a (false) Administration.
• We are not the "church" founded by the Apostles at Pentecost. The Apostles founded no "church", but a Dispensation.
• We are not the "church" founded by Moses at Sinai. Moses founded no "church", but a covenanted Theonomic Congregation.

Calvinists are the Church founded by God in the very Garden of Eden.
We are the Covenant Line of God's People, redeemed by Him to live in terms of His Word. We have stood the test of Time.
And the Gates of Hell shall not prevail against us.

 

[Gamecock]

See, Calvinism really is for everyone!

 

[Wrigley]

God is sovereign in all things bump.

 

[CCWoody]

See, Calvinism really is for everyone!

Calvinism, established prior to 4000BC!​

A rousing cheer for that gospel with the nickname of Calvinism & John Knox from this McTavish Scotsman! It's time to break open the single malt and toast the great land which birthed John Knox.

"Better that Scotland were hacked by Claverhouse for cleaving to the Lord, than that she should be flattered by infidels for her gradual departure from the faith. Let not the blood of the Covenanters be spilt in vain.... Oh, that Scotland may stand fast in this evil day!" - C.H.Spurgeon.
​

And, better that we Calvinists today were hated by all for cleaving to the Lord and not compromising our faith than we should be excited to offer up Strange Fire. Let not the blood of all our Predestinarian forefathers be spilt in vain, whether the Covenanters or Huguenots or whatever name they may have bourne. Whether England should have put us in stocks and sawn off our ears, or we should have been burned alive while worshipping in our churches or hacked by the tens of thousands in the French countryside, let it be known that over a river of blood we march on to Zion.

And in nothing feare your aduersaries, which is to them a token of perdition, and to you of saluation, and that of God. For vnto you it is giuen for Christ, that not onely ye should beleeue in him, but also suffer for his sake,....
(Phi 1:28-29 GB)
​

Your friendly neighborhood Cordial Calvinist
Woody.

 

[CCWoody]

It is God who saves. Calvinism did not originate in Geneva; it is found in Eden. God's people, the covenant line, would henceforth be the people redeemed by Him to live, once again, in terms of His Word.

[snip]

Calvinists are the Church founded by God in the very Garden of Eden.
We are the Covenant Line of God's People, redeemed by Him to live in terms of His Word. We have stood the test of Time.
And the Gates of Hell shall not prevail against us.

BTW, I think it is interesting that we can see in Eden the natural progression in theology of our first parents from an anthroprocentric religion to one that is again where it should be by being God centered. Observe....

1. Adam & Eve rebel against the LORD God, trusting in the creation than over their creator.
2. They attempt their own reconciliation to the Lord on THIER terms by sewing together their own covering.
3. Adam blames everything on the LORD.
4. THEN, the LORD takes back what is His without even consulting with Adam and Eve or their vaunted "free will." by...
5. Proclaiming the gospel to Adam & Eve.
6. Cursing the Serpent.
7. Placing hostility between the serpent & the woman, between her Seed & his seed.
8. Cursing the groung FOR THE SAKE OF man.
9. Sending his sin laden body back to the earth from which it was sown.
10. Kicking them out of Eden lest they should take of the tree of life and live forever spiritually dead to the LORD.
11. Sacrificing with blood and making a temporary covering for them Himself until the Redeemer should make the one Perfect oblation.

The progression should be rather obvious from their own masquerade of the gospel and righteousness which many today identify with the masquerading anthroprocentric faith of many churches to the God centered gospel which is today known as Calvinism. And, it should be obvious that the only thing free will was used to accomplish was the FALL.

So, it does seem as if our first parents were given a Calvinistic theology. Go figure!

Your friendly neighborhood Cordial Calvinist
Woody.

 

[Wrigley]

BTW, I think it is interesting that we can see in Eden the natural progression in theology of our first parents from an anthroprocentric religion to one that is again where it should be by being God centered. Observe....

And, just to drive the point home, it was God who had to put it right. What Adam, a man, did wasn't even close.

 

[rnmomof7]

And, just to drive the point home, it was God who had to put it right. What Adam, a man, did wasn't even close.

Mark
For later read

 

[Gamecock]

And, just to drive the point home, it was God who had to put it right. What Adam, a man, did wasn't even close.

So once Adam fell, there was nothing he could do to save himself?

 

[Wrigley]

So once Adam fell, there was nothing he could do to save himself?

Not a thing he could do.

 

[nobdysfool]

BTW, I think it is interesting that we can see in Eden the natural progression in theology of our first parents from an anthroprocentric religion to one that is again where it should be by being God centered. Observe....

1. Adam & Eve rebel against the LORD God, trusting in the creation than over their creator.
2. They attempt their own reconciliation to the Lord on THIER terms by sewing together their own covering.
3. Adam blames everything on the LORD.
4. THEN, the LORD takes back what is His without even consulting with Adam and Eve or their vaunted "free will." by...
5. Proclaiming the gospel to Adam & Eve.
6. Cursing the Serpent.
7. Placing hostility between the serpent & the woman, between her Seed & his seed.
8. Cursing the groung FOR THE SAKE OF man.
9. Sending his sin laden body back to the earth from which it was sown.
10. Kicking them out of Eden lest they should take of the tree of life and live forever spiritually dead to the LORD.
11. Sacrificing with blood and making a temporary covering for them Himself until the Redeemer should make the one Perfect oblation.

The progression should be rather obvious from their own masquerade of the gospel and righteousness which many today identify with the masquerading anthroprocentric faith of many churches to the God centered gospel which is today known as Calvinism. And, it should be obvious that the only thing free will was used to accomplish was the FALL.

So, it does seem as if our first parents were given a Calvinistic theology. Go figure!

Your friendly neighborhood Cordial Calvinist
Woody.

Let him who has eyes to see and ears to hear, read and understand....

 

[rnmomof7]

See, Calvinism really is for everyone!

Great article


The sovereign will of God is seen throughout the OT for those that choose to see :>)

 

[armothe]

When you are all through patting eachother on the back, I think we should petition to get the soteriology forum renammed to the Calvinist forum.

-A

 

[rnmomof7]

When you are all through patting eachother on the back, I think we should petition to get the soteriology forum renammed to the Calvinist forum.

-A

Most of the threads were begun by people wanting to argue the points of TULIP, not necessarily by Calvinists.

But I guess I would point out that the largest division in the doctrine of Salvation in the non Catholic Church today is between the doctrines of Calvinism and Arminianism.
So it seems a natural topic for the forum

Why don't you start one with another topic:>))

BTW I thought this was a well written article looking at how God delt with Adam and Eve..do you have another theology on this ?

 

[CCWoody]

When you are all through patting eachother on the back, I think we should petition to get the soteriology forum renammed to the Calvinist forum.

-A

The Reformation took place without the help of Arminianism and when she did finally enter the church, she did so as a troubler.

The Jesuit planting of the Arminian Construct into the Reformed Church

As early as 1613 the Oxford theologian Walter Browne (an associate of Laud) had a library with no English reformed writers, but contained 500 anti-Calvinist books, including the works of the leading Jesuits: Molina’s Concordia and Leonardus Lessius’ De Gratia as well as Arminius’ works. Robert Shelford, of Cambridge University, produced Five Pious and Learned Lectures which was so Arminian that it was used by the Jesuits in Ireland. The English situation was so serious that Sir Walter Earle urged Parliament to make religion the most vital issue above all other domestic matters because, ‘Popery and Arminianism [are] joining hand in hand.’

Vital testimony comes from the hand of the Archbishop Laud himself, a professed Jesuit. After his death, a letter was found in his effects which was endorsed by him and dated March 1628. The endorsement reads: 'A Jesuit letter, sent to the Rector at Bruxels, about the ensuing Parliament.' The letter gave the Superior of the Jesuits, then resident at Brussels, an account of church affairs in England. Part of it reads:

"Father Rector, let not the damp of astonishment seize upon your ardent and zealous soul, in apprehending the sodaine and unexpected calling of a Parliament. We have now many strings to our bow. We have planted that soveraigne drugge Arminianisme, which we hope will purge the Protestants from their heresie; and it flourisheth and beares fruit in due season. For the better prevention of the Puritanes, the Arminians have already locked up the Duke's (of Buckingham) eares; and we have those of our owne religion, which stand continually at the Duke's chamber, to see who goes in and out: we cannot be too circumspect and carefull in this regard. I am, at this time, transported with joy, to see how happily all instruments and means, as well great as lesser, co-operate unto our purposes. But, to return unto the maine fabricke: Our Foundation is Arminianisme. The Arminians and projectors, as it appeares in the premises, affect mutation. This we second and enforce by probable arguments."​

Your friendly neighborhood Cordial Calvinist
Woody.

 

[armothe]

BTW I thought this was a well written article looking at how God delt with Adam and Eve..do you have another theology on this ?

Actually, I didn't quite follow where the author was going with his article.
It sounded like he was stating that God had immediately redeemed Adam and Eve "then and there" in the midst of the garden by giving them fur coats and placing enmity between Eve and the serpent.

Whereas I thought He cast them out of the garden (sign of not being redeemed and seperation).
It was my understanding no man was redeemed until Christ finished his plan of redemption.

That is where I got lost.

My view is the following:

God created mankind in His image and likeness.
God created man to His liking (good/perfect).
God and man walked with eachother (signifying a relationship)
Adam chose to disobey God.
Adam is cast out of God's presence - breaking the relationship
Sin seperates man from God
-=skip=-
God sends Christ as the ultimate sacrifice to undo what Adam had done.
Christ bridges the gap between man and God by blotting out our sins.
Through Christ, God can now enjoy a relationship with His creation again.

-A

 

[Gamecock]

Actually, I didn't quite follow where the author was going with his article.
It sounded like he was stating that God had immediately redeemed Adam and Eve "then and there" in the midst of the garden by giving them fur coats and placing enmity between Eve and the serpent.

Whereas I thought He cast them out of the garden (sign of not being redeemed and seperation).
It was my understanding no man was redeemed until Christ finished his plan of redemption.

That is where I got lost.

My view is the following:

God created mankind in His image and likeness.
God created man to His liking (good/perfect).
God and man walked with eachother (signifying a relationship)
Adam chose to disobey God.
Adam is cast out of God's presence - breaking the relationship
Sin seperates man from God
-=skip=-
God sends Christ as the ultimate sacrifice to undo what Adam had done.
Christ bridges the gap between man and God by blotting out our sins.
Through Christ, God can now enjoy a relationship with His creation again.

-A

Ahhh, but God already had a plan of redemption for man. Those who lived by faith, unknowingly looking forward to Christ, were saved from that point forward.

We see the beginning of the Abrahamic Covenant, which was gradually unwrapped throughout the O.T. until it was fully exposed in the atoning death of Christ.

That is what I see from a reformed perspective.

 

[nobdysfool]

When you are all through patting eachother on the back, I think we should petition to get the soteriology forum renammed to the Calvinist forum.

-A

I wouldn't call it "patting each other on the back"...More like proclaiming the Truth, which for some strange reason seems to set Arminian teeth on edge....

But, if you want to petition to have the forum renamed, by all means, go ahead!

 

[armothe]

Those who lived by faith, unknowingly looking forward to Christ, were saved from that point forward.

So what you are saying is that even though David lived 1000 years before Christ he was already saved at that time?

-A

 

[armothe]

I wouldn't call it "patting each other on the back"...More like proclaiming the Truth, which for some strange reason seems to set Arminian teeth on edge....

Proclaiming to whom? Yourselves? (so far the only non-calvinist to reply is myself)

So when one of you posts a thread entitled "Calvinism Rules!" and the only people to reply are fellow Calvinists with replies like "hear hear!" and "amen!"- a back patting session it is.

Your zeal in regards to setting Arminian's on edge is duely noted.

-A

 

[nobdysfool]

Proclaiming to whom? Yourselves? (so far the only non-calvinist to reply is myself)

So when one of you posts a thread entitled "Calvinism Rules!" and the only people to reply are fellow Calvinists with replies like "hear hear!" and "amen!"- a back patting session it is.


-A

Ah, but we were expecting you!

Your zeal in regards to setting Arminian's on edge is duely noted.

Well, It IS fun.... ...and enlightening!