If you say "You swear", but lie to protect someone?

stanilovesGod

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Hi friends. I am new to this forum, i had some problems with intrusive thoughts, and thanks to people here i can now say that thanks to you friends and God i am getting rid of those. I also have to say, that for first time in my life, i really feel good connection with God. I've never been devoted Christian in the past, i am 27 years old, i believed in God but never really found myself for Him. Those intrusive thoughts that i have due to my OCD led me here, which i belive was God's plan for me to turn to Him :)
Now, i want to tell a story that popped into my mind recently. This happened really long ago 4-5 years ago or even maybe more. I was still a kid in a way back then. Again, i was never truly religious person, i believed in God, but never really paid attention to oaths, vows and so on, believing it was man made tools.
There was a secret that i had promised someone to keep. The secret was something personal, it was nothing bad, it was just something that i knew about someone, knew that was personal to him and didn't want to share it with someone else. Now friends of mine was suspecting about this thing and knew i was close to the person i knew this thing about.
So one they one of my so called "friends" conforted me about if i knew about this personal thing, that again had nothing to do with those people. I wanted to keep his secret private so i told them i dont. So he said something like "Do you swear". I dont really remember what happened but i think i said yes. I knew if i said no, i dont want to swear, for them it would if i confirm their suspictions. So in order to protect this person, i may have said Yes i swear. But in my mind, i never accepted that swear, i knew God knew this was the only way they will let go and i will protect the person by not revealing his secret. I think what they did was wrong and they had no right to make me swear, so in my mind the swear was not valid. Also, back than i wasn't that religious and in my mind swearing was a tool for them to find out something that
doesn't concern them so i felt its ok to not tell them the truth. And it passed and i forgot about it because i knew i did the right thing by protecting the person, i knew God would understand. Now, maybe 5 years later, and the fact i am still suffering from Obsessive Compulsive Disorder, i am trying to make steps to turn to God again and this thing popped out of nowhere? Do you think i did wrong back then? Should have i tell the truth of refuse to swear- which for those people would be as if i told them what they want to know. The secret i am talking about is nothing bad, its something personal that i dont think they have right to know? I didn't even ask God for forgivness back then because in my mind that wasn't valid because they were using this as tool for getting information which was wrong. Now i years later i feel i may have done wrong so i ask God for forgivness. Do you think that i should now contact those people, years later, and tell them i lied back then? I am certain they have long forgotten years ago, and also i dont want to bring back old things because they will reflect on the person that i was keeping secret about.
I will give you an example of what happened, because some may be confused about my post.

Lets say you have friends who's last name is Dumb (this is just example). You know his name is Dumb but you know if other find out about it they may make fun of him. So bunch of "friends" of yours suspect you know his real name because you are close to this person and ask you- "Is his last name really Dumb?", you ofcourse answer "No, his last name is Daniel (the name he prefers to use)". They say "Really, can you swear?". Now if i say "No, i can't", and since they know i am close to that person, in their heads it will signal that he really is named "Dumb" and will keep harrassing him for it. So i may have said "I swear", i really dont remember it was long ago, but even if i did, in my mind i was thinking "This is not valid, because they are using something Holly like making me swear for wrong purposes", so even if i said yes in my heart i didn't accept that swear. But somehow now, as i started to suffer from mental issues like OCD, it just popped out in my mind as if i did something wrong, and i wonder shall i reach to those people if i can find them and tell them "Do you remember about that person, yes his last name really was Dumb". I feel deep inside that would be wrong thing to do. What do you think friends?
I just want to point out, i wasn't really religious back then, so in my mind Oaths, Vows and other tools had no weight. For me those were just tools to trick someone into telling what others want to hear.
 

Acts2:38

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Scripture holds that we should let our "yes be yes and no be no" and not "swear by one hair on our heads" Matthew 5:36-37. Without going into a huge amount of detail, that is the briefest response I could do. Any questions feel free to dive in more.
 
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stanilovesGod

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I understand, but back in the days i was not aware of that scripture, and in my mind it was the better thing to protect the privacy of the person those people were willing to find out about. I now know this, but back then i thought it has no weight if its for a greater cause. I ask God for forgivness ofcourse, but just now. How shall i proceed, what do you think, i can reach to those people and tell them the truth, but it will be wrong because it's not their job and i will break the privacy ot the person kept the secret about.
 
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Acts2:38

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I understand, but back in the days i was not aware of that scripture, and in my mind it was the better thing to protect the privacy of the person those people were willing to find out about. I now know this, but back then i thought it has no weight if its for a greater cause. I ask God for forgivness ofcourse, but just now. How shall i proceed, what do you think, i can reach to those people and tell them the truth, but it will be wrong because it's not their job and i will break the privacy ot the person kept the secret about.

I would tell you to finally unravel this entire web of entanglement and start to be truthful. I would teach scripture as to why I cannot swear, and they will have to take my word for it. Lying will create web after web of entaglements that will be more and more difficult to escape and hit everyone much harder. It's best to break free of such things and start with the friend first. If they cannot accept your apology and get mad, its understandable but if they are a true friend, it will calm down after time.

I would also seek out fellow brothers and sisters in Christ and let them help with prayer for your situation.
 
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Acts2:38

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I understand, but back in the days i was not aware of that scripture, and in my mind it was the better thing to protect the privacy of the person those people were willing to find out about. I now know this, but back then i thought it has no weight if its for a greater cause. I ask God for forgivness ofcourse, but just now. How shall i proceed, what do you think, i can reach to those people and tell them the truth, but it will be wrong because it's not their job and i will break the privacy ot the person kept the secret about.

Secondly, if your friend is NOT in Christ, this repairing of relationship in truthful dealings, should they be a true friend and forgive, will go along way to maybe having them see your christian like actions and help bring them one day to Christ.
 
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stanilovesGod

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Thanks for your prayers friend. The friend i have is Christian, he is good person, unfortunate to have something in his life that he feels he dont want to share with other people. But you know people are curious about such things. I knew about his secret, and when i was confronted by people who wanted to know about his secret for no other reason but their own amusement, i didn't tell them the truth. They asked me to swear and i think i did, but in my mind and heart i didn't. I thought i was doing the right thing, because i know for fact that if i told them i won't swear, they will understand it as if i confirmed about the secret. So i sacrificed my word to protect this person's privacy. That was my choice back than, as i felt deep inside God wont be mad at me. I wasn't aware of most of the scriptures because i have to admit, i wasn't religious type of person. I am reading the Bible rihght now actually, and i want to be a better person right now. I asked God for forgivness about that and about the fact i was never religous in the past, i want to make the things right again. I think back than they had no authority to make me swear so for me it had no weight. Again i am sorry i was not aware of the scripure. Do you think i should do anything more than just ask for forgivness, shall i contact those people and tell them i spared them the truth back than to protect a friend? Or i should leave the matters as they are and just let it go.
 
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SkyWriting

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Hi friends. I am new to this forum, i had some problems with intrusive thoughts, and thanks to people here i can now say that thanks to you friends and God i am getting rid of those. I also have to say, that for first time in my life, i really feel good connection with God. I've never been devoted Christian in the past, i am 27 years old, i believed in God but never really found myself for Him. Those intrusive thoughts that i have due to my OCD led me here, which i belive was God's plan for me to turn to Him :)
Now, i want to tell a story that popped into my mind recently. This happened really long ago 4-5 years ago or even maybe more. I was still a kid in a way back then. Again, i was never truly religious person, i believed in God, but never really paid attention to oaths, vows and so on, believing it was man made tools.
There was a secret that i had promised someone to keep. The secret was something personal, it was nothing bad, it was just something that i knew about someone, knew that was personal to him and didn't want to share it with someone else. Now friends of mine was suspecting about this thing and knew i was close to the person i knew this thing about.
So one they one of my so called "friends" conforted me about if i knew about this personal thing, that again had nothing to do with those people. I wanted to keep his secret private so i told them i dont. So he said something like "Do you swear". I dont really remember what happened but i think i said yes. I knew if i said no, i dont want to swear, for them it would if i confirm their suspictions. So in order to protect this person, i may have said Yes i swear. But in my mind, i never accepted that swear, i knew God knew this was the only way they will let go and i will protect the person by not revealing his secret. I think what they did was wrong and they had no right to make me swear, so in my mind the swear was not valid. Also, back than i wasn't that religious and in my mind swearing was a tool for them to find out something that
doesn't concern them so i felt its ok to not tell them the truth. And it passed and i forgot about it because i knew i did the right thing by protecting the person, i knew God would understand. Now, maybe 5 years later, and the fact i am still suffering from Obsessive Compulsive Disorder, i am trying to make steps to turn to God again and this thing popped out of nowhere? Do you think i did wrong back then? Should have i tell the truth of refuse to swear- which for those people would be as if i told them what they want to know. The secret i am talking about is nothing bad, its something personal that i dont think they have right to know? I didn't even ask God for forgivness back then because in my mind that wasn't valid because they were using this as tool for getting information which was wrong. Now i years later i feel i may have done wrong so i ask God for forgivness. Do you think that i should now contact those people, years later, and tell them i lied back then? I am certain they have long forgotten years ago, and also i dont want to bring back old things because they will reflect on the person that i was keeping secret about.
I will give you an example of what happened, because some may be confused about my post.

Lets say you have friends who's last name is Dumb (this is just example). You know his name is Dumb but you know if other find out about it they may make fun of him. So bunch of "friends" of yours suspect you know his real name because you are close to this person and ask you- "Is his last name really Dumb?", you ofcourse answer "No, his last name is Daniel (the name he prefers to use)". They say "Really, can you swear?". Now if i say "No, i can't", and since they know i am close to that person, in their heads it will signal that he really is named "Dumb" and will keep harrassing him for it. So i may have said "I swear", i really dont remember it was long ago, but even if i did, in my mind i was thinking "This is not valid, because they are using something Holly like making me swear for wrong purposes", so even if i said yes in my heart i didn't accept that swear. But somehow now, as i started to suffer from mental issues like OCD, it just popped out in my mind as if i did something wrong, and i wonder shall i reach to those people if i can find them and tell them "Do you remember about that person, yes his last name really was Dumb". I feel deep inside that would be wrong thing to do. What do you think friends?
I just want to point out, i wasn't really religious back then, so in my mind Oaths, Vows and other tools had no weight. For me those were just tools to trick someone into telling what others want to hear.

#1. You have no obligation to respond to anyone, for any reason.
#2 If you do choose to respond, your answers should be honest.
But if you can't be honest....see rule #1.
 
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stanilovesGod

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It's just one of those situations that you just cant act the way you have to, that's how i felt it back then. Because imagine a situation where friend of yours is dying and ask's you "Will i be ok", shall i tell him "No, you won't" or i shall try to make him feel better by saying a lie? The situation was pretty much the same, if i had just washed my hands saying "I dont have to answer to you" or something they would at the second accepted it as YES and kept on harassing the person.
 
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Acts2:38

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Again i am sorry i was not aware of the scripure. Do you think i should do anything more than just ask for forgivness, shall i contact those people and tell them i spared them the truth back than to protect a friend? Or i should leave the matters as they are and just let it go.

Because a Christian is held to a higher standard, if contact was available, I would let them know that my truthful correct response should have been, that I cannot divulge that information to them, and that they should seek that info from your friend personally. If your friend didnt wish to say anything to them, well, thats between them. So long as you hold up to your end. "I am sorry for what I said before, the truth is basically that I cannot give that information and to ask him/her personally if you want that information" You say what you wish, I just use that as a shabby example.

To just let things go, to me, is like letting the lie continue. You are allowing people to believe the lie and doing nothing to correct it. To me, from what I read in scripture, I would have to make the wrong, right.

Now I don't have everyones contact information that I have wronged before, but the ones that I did have, I corrected. Like I said, Christians are held to a higher standard, whats to say that something like that wouldnt come back to bite you years later in a matter that could have resulted in someones salvation by your "christian" like conduct.

Edit: We can be forgiven if we so ask it
James 5:16
1 John 1:6-10
 
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stanilovesGod

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I got what you mean. Its a tricky situation. I really i am puzzeled on what to do. On top of that, i have obsessive compulsive disorder, which recently flare up after years of being gone, so i have this inner feeling to right the wrong things i've done in the past. I have no problem to contact the people, but depe inside me it feels wrong, to expose a person that trusted me a secret. I think, in a way, those that used something holly like "Swear that you know that or not" without having right to since it was not their job, as fellow forumer commented with "the dogs" and the "bone" were wrong because they used it as weapon for selfish reasons. If i tell them now i see it as i did what they asked and exposed a person's secret for their amusemnt. I don't know why this feels very wrong to my soul. Again it some sort of test but i don't know.
 
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stanilovesGod

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Those peoplpe were bullies, they were bulling and making fun of the person i am talking about. Something deep inside me was me to protect his privacy, even with the cost of a lie. Avoiding the question by refusing to answer for them was basically me confirming. It was very tricky situation. I am ready to pay the price of lying and ask forgivnes, but even today with me being more close to God i am not sure if i am going to expose this person's secret, i feel it would be more damaging than lying. Again i have no clue about it which is why i turn here for advice, and i take your advice with care, atleast for future similar situations.
 
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Acts2:38

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Those peoplpe were bullies, they were bulling and making fun of the person i am talking about. Something deep inside me was me to protect his privacy, even with the cost of a lie. Avoiding the question by refusing to answer for them was basically me confirming. It was very tricky situation. I am ready to pay the price of lying and ask forgivnes, but even today with me being more close to God i am not sure if i am going to expose this person's secret, i feel it would be more damaging than lying. Again i have no clue about it which is why i turn here for advice, and i take your advice with care, atleast for future similar situations.

From the sound of things, the bullies, they have already made up their minds even before they confronted you. They are going to do what they are going to do.

When I was in high school, there was a guy that just did not like me. He didn't go out of his way to harass me or anything though. One day, I met up with him and a group of his friends in their "hang out" spot, and was finally told directly from him, that he didn't like me (I never really spoken with him or been around him the entire high school years or anytime before) and that was a first for me. Even before knowing me or ever talking to me, he had his mind already made up about me, and he wasn't going to change it no matter what I could say or do.

That is what those "bullies" have probably done. They have already made up their mind truth or no truth, and your friend is the target of their amusement. I can almost be certain they still have their suspicions regardless of what you told them.

Still, God considers lying an "abomination" (Proverbs 12:22). Not that you have to tell them your friends "secret" but let them know that it is none of their business and they should ask your friend if they want to know. The bullies are still going to make their minds up about your friend no matter what you say even if they dont act upon it visually.

Protecting privacy by lying is overall a silly thing to do when faced with salvation that lasts an eternity. Eternal damnation or eternal life. Which is it that people should strive for, and which is it that is a preferred method to spend eternity?

Besides, you still are protecting his privacy by saying, "Go ask him yourself, it is not for me to say." You still would be holding your end of the bargain.
 
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stanilovesGod

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The bullies and the "last name" is example, the situation and the secret was way more severe. It was lot more than the name, i gave it to you as example. The thing is, althou i understand completely what you mean, saying them "To ask him, its not for me to say" was absolutely me confirming their suspicions. I know it completely well because i've been around these people. Their tool of getting the truth is to ask "Do you swear?", because they know if you don't say the truth you'll say i can't or something. They have asked me before for things that are true and i've said them "Yes i swear its the true" for things that was really true. So me refusing to do it for first time would be certain clue to them. I may have been wrong to swear at all in the past but again that was the enviroment i lived in. The secret i am talking is lot worse than just last time, it's a thing can go as far as cause this person's job. It's something similar to illness that he has. I won't go into any detail, but those people knew i know, they were certain, i also knew they knew that i know, so the only two choices i had was to either confrim their suspicitions, because i was the only one how could prove them whatever they were right or wrong. I've i've said the true, they would know for sure this person is having what they wanted to know. If i've said i cant tell you go ask him", it would have been the same trust me on this. So i had the choice either to lie or to doom this person by exposing his secret to those couple of bullies. The easiest to me was to tell them yes you are right he is having this or that. I would have felt lot guilty after that. But again i was far away for religion back than, i used more of a moral point of view. Do those people have the right to ask me to swear, i mean isn't that sin itself for them to seek the truth by asking someone the truth by swearing, knowing that refusing to swear would be as confirmation of their thinking? I think only the coourt have the right to ask for an oath.
 
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Acts2:38

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Well, only you know truly the situation, along with all parties involved.

The best advice I can give you on this matter, is what does scripture say?

Being a christian that is held to higher standards, knowing what God is pleased or displeased with, learning what the scriptures say, what should be done?

Now there may be some information that you are aware or unaware with that I will also display here for you. Something to consider.

Hebrews 10:
26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

1 Peter 3
12 For the eyes of the Lord are over the righteous, and his ears are open unto their prayers: but the face of the Lord is against them that do evil.

It comes back to what I said before. What does scripture say? Do we only obey scripture when it is convenient for us? Or should we obey it always?

John 15:
3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.

4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.

5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.

9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.

10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.

12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

Do those people have the right to ask me to swear, i mean isn't that sin itself for them to seek the truth by asking someone the truth by swearing, knowing that refusing to swear would be as confirmation of their thinking? I think only the coourt have the right to ask for an oath.

The way I see it, they can ask me all day long to "swear", but I will not. I cannot. If they wish to come to conclusions because I will not do that, then I don't sweat them.

As far as courts go, I am not sure how your system works, but here, they do not force you to "swear". We have the option to use a different method of processing sincerity of truth to the court arena.
 
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stanilovesGod

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26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

According to that scripture, back than i was not aware of the Truth, so whatever i said there with me believing it can be forgiven because for the greater good. Now years later, i am aware of this scripture, but the situation is already gone, i was thinking i was doing the right thing back than, maybe i was wrong according to the scriptures. But since the situation is gone, do you think i should dig in and willingly contact the people, telling them something, or i shall leave the matters be, if they ask again i'll simply refuce to answer. How would do act if you were on my place, considering the fact i was not opened to that scripture back then, like a child that never realized its sin. I was believing its ok to cover the truth back than, its not as if i knew its sin but still did it? Would you contact those people thaat you havent reached for years, or shall you leave the matters be, maybe it was part of God's plan, like Paul did in the past.
 
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Acts2:38

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26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

According to that scripture, back than i was not aware of the Truth, so whatever i said there with me believing it can be forgiven because for the greater good. Now years later, i am aware of this scripture, but the situation is already gone, i was thinking i was doing the right thing back than, maybe i was wrong according to the scriptures. But since the situation is gone, do you think i should dig in and willingly contact the people, telling them something, or i shall leave the matters be, if they ask again i'll simply refuce to answer. How would do act if you were on my place, considering the fact i was not opened to that scripture back then, like a child that never realized its sin. I was believing its ok to cover the truth back than, its not as if i knew its sin but still did it? Would you contact those people thaat you havent reached for years, or shall you leave the matters be, maybe it was part of God's plan, like Paul did in the past.

It really sounds like the situation is tugging on you. What first came to my mind just now...
James 4:17

and as I think more into it,

Matthew 5:23-24 and Colossians 3:13

In truth, there was one person I was still able to contact 2-3 years after I wronged them and once I came to this truth and had become a Christian. Most others I have no way of contact, but if I happened by them on the road of life, I would reconcile with them.

This is just what I would do, from what I have learned. So by no means to I oppose on you, but merely give you something to think about.
 
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stanilovesGod

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Thanks friend. Currently, i am leaving the matters be, if i done wrong, even unwillingly, God will decide what to do next. It had to happen that way, i will keep this person's privacy and leave the matters be because that was my choice. I ask for forgivness and let that be the end of it. God bless :)
 
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Acts2:38

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Its no problem. Really, the most important thing is to realize and know "okay God, I did wrong" seek out that forgiveness. Even to the point of asking fellow brothers in Christ James 5:16; Galatians 6:1; 1 John 1:6-10
 
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