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Featured If you keep sinning after you are saved are you still saved?

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by Neostarwcc, Jun 11, 2019.

  1. d taylor

    d taylor Well-Known Member

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    Is not a believer considered a son of God, being that believers and God are pictured as being a family.

    The term inherit is picturing the believer for their sinful life style not inheriting the Kingdom of God.

    Does this area in 1 Corinthians 6 say anything about the believer no longer being a son, or loosing their son-ship, it does not.

    1 Corinthians 6 is speaking to the unrepentant sinning believer loosing their inheritance part, of the kingdom of God.

    It is also true that a unbeliever will also not inherit the kingdom of God but that is because the unbeliever never became a believer, not because any actions of their lives.

    That does include what Paul list in 1 Corinthians 6:9, but also the average hard working law abiding person, will not inherit the kingdom of God, because they are also, not a believer.

    Simply in a family when a son or daughter losses their inheritance. They are loosing something handed down from the father or mother. But they are never being cast away and no longer are a son or daughter.

    Can you show an example in the Bible where a believer being a son of God. Can you show where God takes away this believers son-ship for a sinful life style.

    The Parable of the Lost Son is about a lost son, not a son who has been dis-soned.

    The son in the parable repents and comes home but in the parable. The son was never considered not a son.
     
  2. Oscarr

    Oscarr Senior Veteran Supporter

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    I must apologise for my toilet humour and making light of the second coming of Christ and the rapture. I had to repent for my willful sin!
     
  3. Danthemailman

    Danthemailman Well-Known Member

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    1 Corinthians 6:9 - Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. - (descriptive of children of the devil) 11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God. - (descriptive of children of God)
     
  4. RaymondG

    RaymondG Well-Known Member

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    I of my own self can do nothing.....It is the father that doest the work.... One who is working their own soul salvation in fear and trembling, has no time to watch and monitor the sinfulness/sinlessness of others. I would encourage you to try and focus more on the life of Jesus, and less on the lives of men.

    Your ability to point out error and heresy is second to almost none. I, however, find it more helpful to see and point out the truth and the good in others.
     
  5. eleos1954

    eleos1954 God is Love Supporter

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    I was thinking the same thing ;o) I'll do that.
     
  6. Hammster

    Hammster Buckeye Newshawk Award Winner Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Oh, the irony. :D
     
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  7. SavedByGrace3

    SavedByGrace3 Whoever calls on the name of Jesus will be saved Supporter

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    I understand Paul is talking about unsaved, unregenerate people who have the fallen spiritual nature of the children of satan. As Jesus said to the unsaved Pharisees, "you are of your father the devil...". Notice Paul never says "those who fornicate" will not inherit the kingdom of God. He specifically states the nature of these to be "fornicators." I think we are mistaken, in this case, to assume by using the term "fornicator" to mean "one who fornicates." In the realm of spiritual natures - parking in a garage does not make you a car. You are not in the garage as a result of being a car.

    In fact, Paul was concluding a discussion from chapter 5 where we see a "brother" (calls him a brother) had fornicated. Says the man was still "among you." He says the man was going to be turned over to satan and would have his flesh destroyed so that his spirit be saved on the last day. Judgement had not been passed upon him as of yet... Paul had to pronounce it. And this judgement was in the flesh, not the spirit, which was still saved.

    1 Corinthians 5:1-5
    "It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father's wife. And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you. For though absent in body, I am present in spirit; and as if present, I have already pronounced judgment on the one who did such a thing. When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord."

    IOWs he would reap the destruction of the flesh in accordance with the corruption he sowed in the flesh.

    Gal 6
    7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
    8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

    True, he committed fornication, but he was not a "fornicator" (one with the spiritual nature that defines him as a fornicator) as described in the above verses. Rather he was a born again believer who walked in the flesh and committed fornication. He was walking outside of his spiritual nature and was walking in the flesh. Paul uses the term "practiced" in 2 Corin.

    2 Corinthians 12:21
    "I fear that when I come again my God may humble me before you, and I may have to mourn over many of those who sinned earlier and have not repented of the impurity and fornication and lasciviousness that they have practiced."
     
  8. Grip Docility

    Grip Docility Well-Known Member

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    Oh no! I laughed pretty hard! Is that omission or commission!?! What if I don’t repent correctly?

    :D
     
  9. Kenny'sID

    Kenny'sID Well-Known Member Supporter

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    While some say they can and even do those things and they will remain saved. the guy here who said he would sleep around and tell the christian Girls it was OK because salvation is by faith alone or something like that. It's simply not allowed, yet they are so selfish they teach it to others.

    My point is always the danger of reaching that plane, just as some have. They do what is sin, while telling themselves they not only can but they no longer have to even ask for forgiveness, salvation is a done deal. One cannot pry their beliefs away from them with a crowbar, and it makes perfect sense they cannot, they very badly want their sin and heaven too so they work hard at convincing themselves they can have it their way.

    As I've said many times and you have probably seen for yourself here, they defend with some of the most bizarre, clearly untrue defenses, because that's what it takes to defend something untruthful. One can no longer reason with them, they cling so tightly to it.

    How can one not speak against such things?
     
  10. Grip Docility

    Grip Docility Well-Known Member

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    There are Christians that have major struggles with sin. The call to Love one another is real. When self righteousness is exalted, even if it is flesh that is washed by Christ, the struggling ones can become discouraged.

    I was involved in the ministry, second hand, and one thing that was certain... those who exalted their flesh and demanded others did so, had secret sin. I became so accustomed to discovering this, it became a rule of sorts. Those that burden others with the idea that their flesh should be pristine, had secret sin that they clutched and hid, all the while, while they discouraged others, sometimes to the point of losing faith (In reference to those they discouraged).

    I don't quote people often, of any flavor... but there is one quotation, I respect...

    “If you are a preacher of mercy, do not preach an imaginary but the true mercy. If the mercy is true, you must therefore bear the true, not an imaginary sin. God does not save those who are only imaginary sinners. Be a sinner, and let your sins be strong [or sin boldly], but let your trust in Christ be stronger, and rejoice in Christ who is the victor over sin, death, and the world. We will commit sins while we are here, for this life is not a place where justice resides. We, however, says Peter (2. Peter 3:13) are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth where justice will reign. It suffices that through God’s glory we have recognized the Lamb who takes away the sin of the world. No sin can separate us from Him, even if we were to kill or commit adultery thousands of times each day. Do you think such an exalted Lamb paid merely a small price with a meager sacrifice for our sins? Pray hard for you are quite a sinner.”

    Luther would literally go up and down stairs on his knees, to offer penitence to God for his sins. For a man that had carnally strived so fervently for God to have been converted to the sufficiency of Christ so staunchly was a miracle! For that man to then extend that offering of the sufficiency of Christ to literal sinners... it was clearly a result of this (Ephesians 1:13 ; Romans 8:9).

    If a Gospel workman doesn't have this type of courage in speech, the damned will feel no hope, and the self righteous leavening can destroy many within the BOC.

    Those who are so proud as to tie burdens of expectation onto a believer, or a searcher are no friend of Jesus. IMO

    These minions are identical pictures of those that literally attempted to entrap our Lord God, Jesus Christ, at every turn. When they realized they couldn't entrap Him, they led Him like a lamb to the slaughter.

    I have no time for people that profess imaginary atonement, as they bind the Gospel to Stone and cast it in the sea.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
  11. Grip Docility

    Grip Docility Well-Known Member

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    Biblically, fornication has always been the verbiage for infidelity to God. Reducing the scope of the effectiveness of the Gospel is indeed fornication with a whore (false gospel).

    I agree. I believe Paul wrote like this to allow the carnally exalted to be encouraged to draw near to Christ. The hope was that they be converted by the Holy Spirit to preach the Gospel to sinners... just as Christ preached the shadow of redemptive hope to sinners, before His DBR.

    This is my opinion, but a thorough reading of even "The Law" reveals this, as adultery and the like are assembled under the overarching subtext of IDOL WORSHIP.

    Truly, anything a man replaces Christ with for their salvation is their IDOL, even if it is their own flesh or the hope of carnal perfection, while trapped in these bodies of death.
     
  12. Servant of Yeshua

    Servant of Yeshua Member

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    I am really sick and did not read any of the other responses, so I am sorry if this is a repeat.

    You need to develop a relationship with the Lord and go to Him first and ask these questions. Honestly, the veil has been torn to symbolize that WE are now to go directly to the Lord of Lords and ask Him for wisdom. Be in the word daily and ask for wisdom. I know you are looking for man to give you wisdom, but God will bless you when you go to HIM. Repent (turn away ) from your sin and ask God for ways to make you accountable.
    Make the hard choices to do everything you can to avoid anything that will cause you to stumble.

    God knows your heart and He will know if you are truly trying or not. I am obese. I know gluttony is a sin. I struggle with it and never at any time thought it was ok. I try and I pray to God for help. I recognize that I am weak when I get overwhelmed and discouraged by life. But I have learned that this is exactly when I need to go to GOD for my strength and comfort and not food. For the glory of God, try to keep from sinning and run to Jesus and away from sin. I will pray for you. Peace.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
  13. Grip Docility

    Grip Docility Well-Known Member

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    This is a post of self disclosure and sincerity! It is heartfelt and beautiful!

    All Love to you in Jesus Christ, Servent of Yeshua!

    PS... Sorry you're sick, right now! Prayers on your behalf!
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
  14. Grip Docility

    Grip Docility Well-Known Member

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    Amen!

    How I believe Satan exploits the Gospel with the Leavening:

    Christians sin and doubt the sufficiency of Christ. These Christians that doubt their salvation are tormented by demons, day and night that they will be eternally lost.

    These Christians begin to associate their salvation with their flesh, instead of Jesus, and thusly, they start to rebuild their doctrine to help them save themselves through carnal effort. They unknowingly re-exalt the Law of Sin and Death, and begin to do so towards other believers.

    Throughout their journey, they believe that their teaching others to exalt their flesh as a matter of salvation, is helping them re-obtain salvation, that demons continually tell them they have lost.

    They continue to struggle all the while, and preach more fervently against salvational assurance, and seed leavening that not only discourages fellow believers, but "salts the earth".

    To put it more directly... they become defeated by the very thing that they had once been free of, through Christ. They make the gospel nothing more than salt that destroys entire crops, only good for men to trample.

    They go into battle without their "HELMET OF SALVATION" while trading their belt of truth for a belt of dishonesty, that has no power to buckle the breastplate of Christ's imputed righteousness.

    All Love in Jesus Christ to you, Danthemailman
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
  15. Kenny'sID

    Kenny'sID Well-Known Member Supporter

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    There y'all go again. :)

    Do you see what your doing there, you pick out something the bible doesn't say in one of thousands of comments in the bible and then say, if it doesn't say it/spell it out right there, then it's not a fact.

    You trick yourself there by forgetting there are places in the bible it is spelled out, unless you choose not to see it.

    Example:

    "In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth"

    Does it say anything at all about God creating man there? It does not. So we now conclude God did not create man? With pretzel logic as such, we do just that.

    Are you really trying to tell me that doesn't mean they won't go to heaven?
    You go on about the unsaved there but the scripture is not specific to anyone, it stated they won't inherit the Kingdom of god...period, no matter who we are or think we are.

    I'll continue once you answer the question, will those/anyone who does the following as a lifestyle still go to heaven?

    1 Cor 6:9-10 Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor homosexual offenders, nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And that is what some of you were.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
  16. Grip Docility

    Grip Docility Well-Known Member

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    Ephesians 2:8-10

    "Do you see what your doing there, you pick out something the bible doesn't say in one of thousands of comments in the bible and then say, if it doesn't say it/spell it out right there, then it's not a fact."

    :)
     
  17. d taylor

    d taylor Well-Known Member

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    You have the whole Bible, show me where in the Bible it states that a son (believer) looses their son-ship (eternal life)
     
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  18. bmjackson

    bmjackson Newbie

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    Yes I agree Grip with your interpretation of spiritual adultery and many are going to be shocked when they find out the words of God are applying to those who already belonged to Him but fell from their first love, and not the unsaved as so often falsely believed. The picture from the OT is of His people going astray.
     
  19. Grip Docility

    Grip Docility Well-Known Member

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    Amen!!!!!!

    But I will add, the Belong to Him isn't complete until they are faith to faith.

    If you speak of initial Gospel response.... believers... I can see this. If you speak of those who are faith to faith... I say none can snatch these from His Hand.

     
  20. SavedByGrace3

    SavedByGrace3 Whoever calls on the name of Jesus will be saved Supporter

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    Indeed. It took a miracle of resurrection to bring you into newness of life. It would take a miracle to reverse that...
     
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