If the soul forms at conception, then how do twins, triplets, etc. factor in?

[CrystalDragon]

It's said that we gain a soul the moment an egg is fertilized. Fair enough.

But I just had a thought: twins, triplets, etc. arise when the developing egg splits into several different ones. So if the soul forms at conception, does it suddenly split up into two or three souls as the twins or triplets develop? Did the initial egg suddenly contain multiple souls at conception so they multiple babies were alike in mind for a time until the split happens?

(Feel free to move this if it's in the wrong section, I posted it in Physical and Life sciences because, well, it's about the miracle of life. XD)

 

[Ygrene Imref]

I would really, really like to hear about this from a biblical standpoint.

I am a gemeni, and my mom also had VTS (vanishing twin syndrome.) I don't follow astrology (tropical or sidereal,) but I have been intrigued by this for a while... it is interesting.

 

[CrystalDragon]

I would really, really like to hear about this from a biblical standpoint.

I am a gemeni, and my mom also had VTS (vanishing twin syndrome.) I don't follow astrology (tropical or sidereal,) but I have been intrigued by this for a while... it is interesting.

I actually thought about posting it in the Controversal Christian Theology section because then more Christians would see it, but I decided to put it here instead.

 

[Robban]

It's said that we gain a soul the moment an egg is fertilized. Fair enough.

But I just had a thought: twins, triplets, etc. arise when the developing egg splits into several different ones. So if the soul forms at conception, does it suddenly split up into two or three souls as the twins or triplets develop? Did the initial egg suddenly contain multiple souls at conception so they multiple babies were alike in mind for a time until the split happens?

(Feel free to move this if it's in the wrong section, I posted it in Physical and Life sciences because, well, it's about the miracle of life. XD)

I don,t think the soul forms at conception,

rather the soul always was, a body is prepared for each soul.

 

[CrystalDragon]

I don,t think the soul forms at conception,

rather the soul always was, a body is prepared for each soul.

So if an egg ends up splitting into twins, each twin doesn't get a soul until they're fully separated?

 

[MustardSeeed]

It's said that we gain a soul the moment an egg is fertilized. Fair enough. But I just had a thought: twins, triplets, etc. arise when the developing egg splits into several different ones.

Well I wouldn't say that's true. For one there are monozygotes like me (I'm an identical twin) but also dizygotes which are fraternal twins ... so if we gain a soul the moment the egg is fertilized that would mean that me and my twin share the same soul? leaving dizygotes with different souls???

So if the soul forms at conception, does it suddenly split up into two or three souls as the twins or triplets develop? Did the initial egg suddenly contain multiple souls at conception so they multiple babies were alike in mind for a time until the split happens?

I'm going to take the easy way out and say that only God knows. I think God breathed life into each egg as it split giving the egg a soul

Genesis 2:7 "Then the LORD God formed man of dust from the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living being."

Job 33:4 "The Spirit of God has made me, And the breath of the Almighty gives me life."

As a twin ... I can say it's a common misconception that twins are alike in mind. Not to say they can't be ... but I much rather believe that we are similar because we are products of our environment and upbringing rather than because we were from the same egg or maybe it's a little bit of both

 

[Waggles]

It's said that we gain a soul the moment an egg is fertilized. Fair enough.

Souls are given to each baby when they are born alive and take in their first breath.

We are given insight of this truth in the verses pertaining to the formation of Adam
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils
the breath of life; and man became a living soul. Genesis 2:7

SOUL = H5315 nephesh From H5314; properly a breathing creature, that is, animal or
(abstractly) vitality; used very widely in a literal, accommodated or figurative sense (bodily or mental):

compare with
SPIRIT = H7307 rûach From H7306; wind; by resemblance breath, that is, a sensible
(or even violent) exhalation; figuratively life, anger, unsubstantiality; by extension a region of the sky;
by resemblance spirit, but only of a rational being (including its expression and functions):

 

[MustardSeeed]

Souls are given to each baby when they are born alive and take in their first breath.

Are you saying that an unborn child does not have life? I just want to clarify

 

[JackRT]

It is obvious that both the female egg and the male sperm have a form of life but no one would call either a person. When they unite to form a zygote it certainly is alive. There is a potential person there and a great many people would claim that it actually is a person. Let us grant for a moment that the zygote is a person and let us call that person Mary. I choose a female name since all embryos are female until about the sixth or seventh week.

Now, we all know that a zygote develops into an embryo through the process of cell division. Every now and again the first cell division does not produce a two celled embryo but rather a second zygote --- identical twins. Did Mary suddenly become two persons? Was Mary two persons to begin with? Was Mary even a person to begin with? Let us set those questions aside for the moment and grant that the second zygote is also a person whom we shall call Margaret. It is entirely possible that one or both of these zygotes could divide again to result in triplets, quadruplets, quintuplets etc. The same question applies as to whether one person can became two, three or more persons. When does a person become a person?

These questions might be difficult enough but now it becomes even more complex. Sometimes two eggs are fertilized to form non-identical twins. Once again, let us call them Mary and Margaret. Rarely the two zygotes merge together again to form a two celled embryo. This is called a chimera. Who is this new embryo? Is it Mary or is it Margaret? This new embryo, this chimera, let us call it Mary, develops to term and is born. There is now no question at all that Mary is indeed a person. But here is the odd thing, some of the organs of Mary carry her genes but other organs carry the genes of her twin sister Margaret. So Margaret continues to exist within Mary or perhaps it is Mary within Margaret. Do we have two persons within a single body?

These very serious questions of person-hood arise only if we assume that the soul is infused at conception and that the brand new zygote is fully a person. Is there a more reasonable understanding? I believe there is. Personally I believe that the developing fetus becomes a person only when it is able to survive outside the womb. Sentience occurs at about the same point in the pregnancy very late in the second trimester. For this reason I am against abortion beyond the twentieth week except in very rare extreme circumstances.. Otherwise I believe that abortion should be legal, it should be safe, it should be available and it should be the woman’s informed choice but most important of all --- it should be rare. In conclusion, we should always keep in mind that there is no more powerful abortifacient in the world than poverty.

 

[Robban]

So if an egg ends up splitting into twins, each twin doesn't get a soul until they're fully separated?

Jacob and Esau were twins, what did they have in common?

There is a teaching that says the soul enters not before 40 days after conception, it is rather a deep subject.

 

[Shemjaza]

I'm an atheist who doesn't believe in souls, but given Christian teachings this doesn't seem too difficult a problem.

Given that the Christians believe God to be omniscient with a complete knowledge of future events there wouldn't be a problem attaching two souls to whatever goo he knew would eventually become the two people, even one cell.

 

[-Hannah-]

Who knows if twins don't exist because two souls entered the same egg? This is highly speculative, I know...

 

[blackribbon]

If I were to make a guess, I'd guess the soul exists at conception and multiple souls is what starts the splitting process in identical twins...... All you have to do is meet a set of twins to know they don't both have 1/2 of the same soul...they are very unique and individual people.

 

[Another Lazarus]

Every body's souls is written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, which means God knows who will be born as mankind whether they do good or evil, or from decent marriage or from undecent adultery.

Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

then later erased one by one as each sinner reject Jesus.

Rev 3:5 He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life.....

 

[Mountainmanbob]

It's said that we gain a soul the moment an egg is fertilized. Fair enough.

Seems that I have read somewhere in the Bible that God knew us before conception?

Waiting on a body
then
Waiting on a glorified body
a lot of waiting
but
Time flies by so quickly.

M-Bob

 

[PollyJetix]

Not all twins come from split fertilized eggs. Only Maternal Twins. Identical ones.
Jacob and Esau were not identicals.

...This may be controversial, but...
What if the soul of a human is actually inherited from the parent, as in the sperm and egg each having a "seed" of a soul? And as soon as they join, perhaps the soul is generated...

And then, perhaps, if that fertilized egg immediately splits into two individuals... perhaps that new soul splits into two souls...?

(After all, the soul is usually thought of as the mind and emotions and will of a person... ever notice how identical twins have such similar souls?)


Levi paid tithes, being still in the loins of his great-grandfather Abraham. Hebrews 7:10
That's really weird, because it would have been the spiritual identity of Levi, contained within a sperm within a sperm, within a sperm!

At least that's how it looks to me.

 

[PollyJetix]

Seems that I have read somewhere in the Bible that God knew us before conception?

Jeremiah 1:5
Ephesians 1:4-5
and Romans 8:29

Just as Levi was paying tithes while still in the loins of his great-grandfather Abraham, even so we were foreknown "in Christ" before the foundation of the world.

 

[blackribbon]

My experience is identical twins don't have similar spirits or personalities at all.

Also identical twins can split at different stages of development....this is why there are some conjoined twins. Also identical twins can share an amniotic sac or have separate ones...also a factor of when the split took place. I still think that it would make sense that the presence of two (or more) souls at conception is what is the trigger that causes a cell to split.

 

[Waggles]

Are you saying that an unborn child does not have life? I just want to clarify

Not at all.
An unborn child has not as yet received the spirit of life to become a living soul -
a person is body and spirit.

 

[MustardSeeed]

Not at all.
An unborn child has not as yet received the spirit of life to become a living soul -
a person is body and spirit.

Wrong. According to science, life is inherent in anything that has biological processes occurring - which happens at the moment of conception i.e. DNA replication, etc. There are also chemical processes like angiogenesis ... so I don't know how you came to this conclusion. An unborn child has a soul. Lol. You mean to tell me a kicking baby is a soul-less creature?