If the Bible is so cut and dry why do no two Christians agree on doctrine?

Neostarwcc

We are saved purely by the work and grace of God.
Site Supporter
Dec 13, 2015
5,254
4,227
37
US
✟917,370.00
Country
United States
Faith
Calvinist
Marital Status
Married
Whether it's eternal security or some other basic truth of scripture how come no two Christians will agree with the Bible? I mean there are Christians out there that dont even believe that belief is good enough for salvation when the Bible clearly says "believe in Christ and you will be saved" in multiple spots. I mean its extremely difficult to get the truth out of scripture because everyone will interpret a particular verse differently. Why isn't there just one huge believe all belief that one can pick and say "Okay I believe that. Yay! I am saved now!"? Why all the divisions in the church and among Christians? What is the truth about scripture?
 

Chris V++

Associate Member
Site Supporter
Mar 16, 2018
1,628
1,439
Dela Where?
Visit site
✟673,703.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Maybe we are not meant to feel 100% secure all the time, or we might become arrogant or complacent. It's supposed to be humbling. We are told to work out our salvation with fear and trembling. Part of that work is thru studying and trying to reason thru these issues.
 
Upvote 0

Just Another User

Active Member
Nov 24, 2018
169
126
The United part
✟15,817.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Because we've forgotten what Paul said in 1 Timothy 3:15 that "God's household, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and foundation of the truth"

and

1 John 2:27 "As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit—just as it has taught you, remain in him."

These are all plural "you's" and refers to the local church not just one person.

So believe it or not, it isn't scripture and the people that support that idea (just look at all the Sola Scriptura Protestant churches and the thousands of denominations ) but the foundation of the truth is actually the local church.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Not David
Upvote 0

Tomm

Christian
Site Supporter
Jan 30, 2007
1,788
895
WS
✟278,556.00
Country
Brazil
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Private
Whether it's eternal security or some other basic truth of scripture how come no two Christians will agree with the Bible? I mean there are Christians out there that dont even believe that belief is good enough for salvation when the Bible clearly says "believe in Christ and you will be saved" in multiple spots. I mean its extremely difficult to get the truth out of scripture because everyone will interpret a particular verse differently. Why isn't there just one huge believe all belief that one can pick and say "Okay I believe that. Yay! I am saved now!"? Why all the divisions in the church and among Christians? What is the truth about scripture?

Very good question.
The answer is available already, since 2000 years ago. Truth never confuse people.
The problem is whether you want to accept it or not. If you reject it, you'll be filled with confusion all the time.
 
Upvote 0

A_Thinker

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Apr 23, 2004
11,911
9,064
Midwest
✟953,784.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Whether it's eternal security or some other basic truth of scripture how come no two Christians will agree with the Bible? I mean there are Christians out there that dont even believe that belief is good enough for salvation when the Bible clearly says "believe in Christ and you will be saved" in multiple spots. I mean its extremely difficult to get the truth out of scripture because everyone will interpret a particular verse differently. Why isn't there just one huge believe all belief that one can pick and say "Okay I believe that. Yay! I am saved now!"? Why all the divisions in the church and among Christians? What is the truth about scripture?

How could a document with 700,000 - 800,000 words be "cut and dry" ?

My recommendation (other than consistent study led by the spirit of God) ... is to try and pick up the MAJOR THEMES in the Bible.

For instance ... "What would you say is the major message of God to humankind from the Bible ... if you had to put it into a sentence or so ?"
 
  • Like
Reactions: JackRT
Upvote 0

JackRT

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Oct 17, 2015
15,722
16,445
80
small town Ontario, Canada
✟767,295.00
Country
Canada
Faith
Unorthodox
Marital Status
Married
I want you to sit down and imagine a society far different from ours. How different? Perhaps more different than most of us can even imagine.

It is a society without mass media. There is no radio, no television, no telephones, no cell phones, no telegraph, not even a printing press. Even if the printing press existed, it would be of little worth since the great majority of people were illiterate. Only the rulers, court officials, military officers, the rich, the merchants and the priests but very very few of the common people could read or write. Most news or information had to be transmitted orally person to person.

To send a message over a distance a scribe might be employed to write it and another to read it upon arrival. It would have had to be carried by a person on foot, or horseback, or camelback or by ship at sea. All of these were by no means certain. A message from Jerusalem to Rome might take weeks even months to arrive if at all.

What about the people themselves? As mentioned earlier, most were illiterate. This is not surprising for a society in which most lived a hand to mouth existence. Mere survival was of utmost importance. Few people traveled any more than a few dozen kilometers from their native town. Few people were ever exposed to thoughts from anyone more distant than that.

Is it possible to even translate these conditions into the present day? Imagine, if you will, trying to describe an event that happened in the 1960's, say, the assassination of President Kennedy. There are no videotapes to view, no audio tapes, and not even any photographs. There might be written accounts but 95% of the population are illiterate. The story is passed down orally from person to person. Even in a society where oral transmission is valued and respected, the chance of getting the story straight is almost nil. This is the situation the author of the Gospel of Mark (whoever he was) was in. Remember we are only looking at 40 years. Add another 20 to 30 years and we have the situation of the author of the Gospel of John (whoever he was).

Can we trust these accounts? As literal history? No! As an embellished, allegorical, midrashic accounts? Yes! But we must always remind ourselves that they are embellished, allegorical and midrashic and deal with them as such. To grant these accounts more credence than that is to ignore the entire context of the times in which they were written.

Am I trashing scripture? By no means! I am respecting scripture by being realistic about it. Our Judeo-Christian scriptures were a very human endeavor in a certain context of history. When we lose sight of that context, then we also lose sight of the meaning and value of those scriptures. At this point, I have not even yet addressed the many other contexts of scripture ---- historical, scientific, economic, military, religious, literary and more! All of these contexts affect the interpretation of scripture. We ignore them at our peril.
 
Upvote 0

Handmaid for Jesus

You can't steal my joy
Site Supporter
Dec 19, 2010
25,594
32,980
enroute
✟1,401,658.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Others
The Bible is all about Lord Jesus and Father's will and plan for humanity. Take it at face value by faith. It is cut and dry. If you read it, meditate on it, your question will be answered. God is not the author of confusion. But satan hates humanity, is a liar and deceiver, and keeps humanity blind to the love of God.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

OldWiseGuy

Wake me when it's soup.
Site Supporter
Feb 4, 2006
46,773
10,981
Wisconsin
Visit site
✟960,122.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
So you believe the word of God could be altered?

The word of God can certainly be better understood. Misunderstanding or lack thereof doesn't change scripture. It always says what it says.
 
Upvote 0

OldWiseGuy

Wake me when it's soup.
Site Supporter
Feb 4, 2006
46,773
10,981
Wisconsin
Visit site
✟960,122.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Whether it's eternal security or some other basic truth of scripture how come no two Christians will agree with the Bible? I mean there are Christians out there that dont even believe that belief is good enough for salvation when the Bible clearly says "believe in Christ and you will be saved" in multiple spots. I mean its extremely difficult to get the truth out of scripture because everyone will interpret a particular verse differently. Why isn't there just one huge believe all belief that one can pick and say "Okay I believe that. Yay! I am saved now!"? Why all the divisions in the church and among Christians? What is the truth about scripture?

Understanding scripture is just like anything else that requires study. The longer you work at it the better you get. One reason for this is that your life experiences will validate much of what you didn't believe or accept in your younger days.

So keep studying...and take care of your health.
 
Upvote 0

FanthatSpark

LImited Understanding
Oct 3, 2013
2,143
579
✟78,811.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Simplified . Live life like this 1 Corinthians 13:4 -7 to mankind for, YOU know, God loves you like that, and this arises 1 John 4:16 inside self, which produces
Galatians 5:22-23 . All other concepts produce confusion.

Example: Reading Bible looking for contradictions to our experiences of life, leaving aside said concept was not meant for us but another . Remember, the Word reaches individuals as a truth to their lives through situational concepts. Its what makes the Word living in said contradiction to "our translation" is trying to fit knowledge alone inside of contradiction.

Try molding self (not another outside of self weather it be a person or situation of knowledge alone.), in the book of truth with God .

Hope this clears instead of muddying a mind. Blessings!!
 
Upvote 0

Handmaid for Jesus

You can't steal my joy
Site Supporter
Dec 19, 2010
25,594
32,980
enroute
✟1,401,658.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Others
What do you mean by the word of God?
I mean the scriptures recorded in our Bible.
What do you mean by the word of God?

And what do you mean by altered?
Altered means changed.

My question to you is what do mean when you say unequivocally that the Bible is not cut and dry?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

hid in him

Active Member
Dec 20, 2018
39
47
39
Eng
✟28,870.00
Country
United Kingdom
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
When fallen humanity gets in the way everything tends to become confusion and opinion. Thankfully God is not the god of confusion but truth and order. The key thing to understand the Bible and God’s will is that His revealed will is the Bible and it interprets itself; also the fact that ALL the Bible is FOR us but not all of it is TO us Christians.

When you can see that clearly and divide what is for us to learn from and what is to us for salvation the Bible becomes less muddled with human interference. The Law, the Prophets, the Writings and the Gospels and Hebrews - Revelation are directed at Jewish readers and preach the Gospel of the Kingdom and earthly inheritance. This is useful for us to see their history, to learn from their mistakes and how God deals with Israel over time.
Paul’s Letters are directed to Christian readers, our doctrine, salvation and heavenly inheritence.

To understand that Paul was the only Apostle to gentiles and the other Apostles and their letters are for Jews. To recognise our Gospel of Grace and what we need to do to be saved is important because it is distinct from the Gospel of the Kingdom and faith with works which is distinct for the Jews.

Christians need to be familiar with Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, 1st and 2nd Timothy, Titus and Philemon there lies our distinct doctrine of faith by grace not works. Then the Bible opens up to us and we can see how Paul in his other letters divides / separates Jewish doctrine of faith with works from ours and then the rest of the Bible opens up and the Bride of Christ (Jews) and the Body of Christ (Gentiles) is seen all the more clearly.

I hope this helps and brings comfort.
 
Upvote 0

StrivingFollower

Active Member
Oct 20, 2017
232
190
South
✟35,529.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
The Bible's cut and dry on some things, and very complex on other things. I would say God gets complex on the things he knows we wouldn't accept easily. If we are going to struggle to agree with God, we don't deserve the information quick. It's more fulfilling to learn it slowly and through hard analysis. Anyone can know what the right thing to do is.. you listen to the rudest people and even they know all about honor.. they simply lack the patience to pursue it. So God patiently develops our hearts.
 
Upvote 0

trophy33

Well-Known Member
Nov 18, 2018
9,116
3,649
N/A
✟148,622.00
Country
Czech Republic
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
I mean the scriptures recorded in our Bible.
Altered means changed.
Our 21st century Bible is a compilation. Of course it was altered here or there.
My question to you is what do mean when you say unequivocally that the Bible is not cut and dry?
Its hard to understand on many places, many places are ambigous, many places are written in ancient mindset we do not have and many places are not original.
 
Upvote 0

TuxAme

Quis ut Deus?
Site Supporter
Dec 16, 2017
2,422
3,264
Ohio
✟191,697.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Celibate
God has given us the free will to fully accept Him, to partially accept Him, or to reject Him completely. To try and make things easier, He has modeled the New Israel, the Church, after the Old Israel in that it is clearly identifiable in the world and has a visible hierarchy. Some choose to accept it, some only accept it partially, and some reject it totally.

People can come to different conclusions when reading because Scripture was never meant to stand alone. It is meant to be read in light of Apostolic tradition and the authoritative teaching of the New Israel.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

eleos1954

God is Love
Site Supporter
Nov 14, 2017
9,760
5,632
Utah
✟718,332.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
Whether it's eternal security or some other basic truth of scripture how come no two Christians will agree with the Bible? I mean there are Christians out there that dont even believe that belief is good enough for salvation when the Bible clearly says "believe in Christ and you will be saved" in multiple spots. I mean its extremely difficult to get the truth out of scripture because everyone will interpret a particular verse differently. Why isn't there just one huge believe all belief that one can pick and say "Okay I believe that. Yay! I am saved now!"? Why all the divisions in the church and among Christians? What is the truth about scripture?

satan. For every single one of God's truth ... satan has a lie (counterfeit teachings) ... every single one, always keep that in mind. It is satan's prime objective to lead as many people away from God as possible ... and he (satan) especially does that in regard to christians by distorting the Word of God through false teachings using church organizations as well (no surprise at all). This is why it is very important that each of us study the bible for ourselves.

Matthew 24:24

24 For false messiahs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect (believers in Christ).

false messiahs - towards the very end satan is even going to counterfeit the coming of Jesus, he (satan) will appear as an angel of light and deceive many. It will be so subtle ... many many many ... including christians ignorant of the truth of His word will be deceived thinking it is in fact Jesus.

2nd Corinthians 11:14
New Living Translation
But I am not surprised! Even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light.

May all continue to study Gods word for themselves and may He reveal the truth to them through it. Amen

God Bless.
 
Upvote 0