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If the Bible has errors or discrepancies how am I supposed to believe in Jesus?

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by Lord'sWarrior, Jul 15, 2017.

  1. Vicomte13

    Vicomte13 Well-Known Member

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    In private.

    Of course it was God. Who or what else can heal a severed spine?
     
  2. Paul of Eugene OR

    Paul of Eugene OR Finally Old Enough Supporter

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    Yes, and we can show the errors to you, and you will continue to believe there are no errors.
     
  3. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    Because I can explain them.
    I have never met a Bible contradiction I could not explain (given enough time).


    ...
     
  4. Steve Petersen

    Steve Petersen Senior Veteran

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    And enough acrobatics.
     
  5. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    Sorry, I do not ascribe to your universe of thoughts, my friend.

    There are Three Scriptural Reasons to Trust in A Perfect Word Today.

    #1. God's Word claims that it is perfect
    God's Word claims that it is perfect (Psalms 12:6) (Psalms 119:140) (Proverbs 30:5) and that it will be preserved for all generations (Psalms 12:7) and it will stand forever (Isaiah 40:8) (1 Peter 1:25). Therefore, seeing Scripture plainly states these facts, it then becomes an issue of a test of your faith in God's Word (See the test the devil gave to Eve in Genesis 3:1); For the Bereans were more noble because they compared the spoken Word of God with the written Word of God (Acts 17:11). In other words, if the Bereans thought the written Word was corrupt in some way they would have no way of really knowing if the spoken Word of God was true or not.

    #2. KJV vs. Modern Translations
    A simple side by side comparison of the KJV vs Modern Translations shows us that the devil tries to place his name in the Modern Versions. Have no idea what I am talking about?

    Well, many Bible versions say that it is the dragon who is standing on the sea shore in Revelation. This is just evil and wrong.

    See Parallel Version for Revelation 13:1 here.

    Revelation 13:1 The dragon stood on the shore of the sea. And I saw a beast coming out of the sea. It had ten horns and seven heads, with ten crowns on its horns, and on each head a blasphemous name.

    See, if you know anything about Bible language, standing on something means that you "own it"; And the devil wants to own you. In the King James, John is standing on the seashore. Yet in many Bible versions the dragon (i.e. the devil) is standing on the seashore.

    Why is this a problem?

    Let's look at...

    Genesis 22:17

    "That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the seashore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies;"

    Did you catch that? God says to Abraham that He will multiply his seed as the stars of the heaven and as the sand which is upon the seashore where he will then possess the gate of his enemies (i.e. the devil and his kingdom). The apostle John who wrote Revelation was Jewish and he was the promised seed of Genesis 22 standing on the seashore in Revelation 13. It was not the dragon or the devil standing on the seashore.

    For certain Modern Versions eliminate the part of the passage in Revelation 13:1 that says that John is standing on the seashore (When he refers to himself as "I").

    Also, the devil tries to take out key points in important discussions within the Bible (Which can affect doctrine). For example: In Romans 7 Paul talks from the Jew's perspective in keeping the Old Testament Law (Which leads to problems), and he gives us the climax or heart of his message as a solution in Romans 8:1. Now, certain modern translations have eliminated "who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit." Eliminating this passage destroys the whole thrust of Paul's argument. Walking in the Spirit is the key to being in Christ Jesus. You eliminate that and you destroy Paul's argument. Also, 1 John 5:7 is the only verse in the Bible that is the clearest and most concise teaching on the Godhead (i.e. the Trinity).

    #3. Biblical Numerics
    Bible Numbers that glorify God and His Word. (Note: These are not equidistant letter sequences or numbers that attempt to get one to have a special dream, or to divine the future in some way - Striving to foretell the future is forbidden in the Bible). Numbers are something that we deal with in our everyday life and all things glorify God. So obviously the numbers in God's Word would naturally glorify Him in some way. What am I talking about? Check out this video on Numbers in the Greek New Testament.

    Sevens in the Bible - Chuck Missler:


    Also, here is a video series by Mike Hoggard that talks about the number 7 in the King James.

    King James Code - Number 7 - Mike Hoggard (Part 1):



    King James Code - Number 7 - Mike Hoggard (Part 2):



    Now, while I may not agree with Mike on everything he teaches in the Bible nor on the way he teaches Bible numbers in every example, I have found that he has made some startling discoveries. Discoveries that do not appear in the modern translations but only in the King James.

    I believe the 1769 KJV is the Word of God for our world language (English) today. In 1611, the printing process was not perfected yet and there was no set standard in spelling yet, either.

    From my experience, I have discovered that there are two wrong extremes on this topic. One wrong extreme says the KJV is evil and to even use it is to be a part of a cult (That teaches that one must worship a book - Which is simply not true). The other wrong extreme says the same thing. For I have found that many KJV-Onlyists believe that you should only read the King James. Many other KJV-Onlyists will also say that the King James is not all that hard to understand, too. However, I disagree with both of these conclusions, though.

    Anyways, while I believe the KJV is the divinely inspired Word of God, I do not think one should stick to just reading it alone. For I have found Modern Translations to be very helpful in updating the language (From Old English); However, I do not put my entire trust in Modern Translations because the devil has placed his name all over them and key doctrines have been watered down and important messages within God's Word have been neutered.

    In other words, I read Modern Translations as if I am panning for gold. I have to sift thru the dirt or the garbage in order to get to the gold of the passage that lines up with the King James (and the original Hebrew and Greek).

    This gold that is found within the dirt of the translations can be very useful because it reflects what is in the King James. This is the gold that people hear and are saved when they hear the gospel message. For someone can be saved just by hearing a few Bible verses about the gospel message of Jesus Christ. This gold shines thru and penetrates their heart.

    Like the Parable of the Sower. Believers receive the Word of God into their heart from those passages that are talking about salvation. Words that line up with the King James. These words are sown in their heart. And if they let this Word take root in their heart by continually reading the Word of God, then they will have hidden His Word in their heart so they will not sin against Him. It will have taken root and they will not fall away due to persecution or the trials of this life.

    For it only takes a few Bible verses to get someone saved. However, washing yourself with the water of the Word is going to be a lot more effective if you use the pure Word of God.


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  6. Vicomte13

    Vicomte13 Well-Known Member

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    Ok. Was there one man with the Legion of demons, or two men?
     
  7. Steve Petersen

    Steve Petersen Senior Veteran

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    400px-Bible_cycle.jpg
     
  8. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    I ran into more complex contradictions than this before. If you have ever studied supposed Bible contradictions before and researched answers on what other believers have said, then it is really easy to see that God's Word is true and without any errors.

    Anyways, instead of having to reinvent the wheel in what somebody else has already said, here is one explanation:

    The events in Matthew, Mark, and Luke are the same event. This is a case of different gospel perspectives of the same event. This kind of thing is everywhere in the 4 gospels, especially in the Synoptic gospels, and yet there is not one contradiction in the 4 gospels. Praise and Glory to God. His Word is faithful and true.

    Now in Matthew 8:28, it is giving an extra information, that there was a second demon-possessed person. One was the leader of the two. Of course, one of the two was possessed by “Legion”. Yet, it is also possible that these “legion” of demons possessed both of the unfortunate men. Whatever the case, the thing is that only one of the two demon-possessed men responded to Jesus Christ after He set them free from the demons and cast the demons into the group of swine.

    Mark 5:18. And when he was come into the ship, he that had been possessed with the devil prayed him that he might be with him.
    19. Howbeit Jesus suffered him not, but saith unto him, Go home to thy friends, and tell them how great things the Lord hath done for thee, and hath had compassion on thee.

    Luke 8:38. Now the man out of whom the devils were departed besought him that he might be with him: but Jesus sent him away, saying,
    39. Return to thine own house, and shew how great things God hath done unto thee. And he went his way, and published throughout the whole city how great things Jesus had done unto him.

    This is why only Mark and Luke mention only one demon-possessed person because only he was of significance to the story. Only he gave thanks to Jesus Christ our Lord for setting him free from Satan’s minions. The other was not mentioned because he probably gave no thanks to Jesus Christ and ran off still stuck in his evil ways. Now look at the man who did respond to Jesus Christ.

    Luke 8:35. Then they went out to see what was done; and came to Jesus, and found the man, out of whom the devils were departed, sitting at the feet of Jesus, clothed, and in his right mind: and they were afraid.

    Luke adds this extra detail that he is “sitting at the feet of Jesus, clothed, and in his right mind”. Anyone who comes and sits at Jesus Christ’s feet will be fully clothed and be given a “sound mind” (2 Tim. 1:7). Trust in the Lord God our Shepherd, like this former demon-possessed man did, and you will never have to fear anything again because God will never leave you and will always be with you, even in your worst and most dangerous times. Read All of Psalm 23.


    Source:
    Demoniacs: One or Two?


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  9. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    All men are given a measure of faith in God by the creation.

    So when they hear God's Word by faith and are born again spiritually, this confirms the knowledge that they had of God by the creation.

    The Word of God is unlike any other human book in history.
    To deny that is divine in origin and unlike any other holy book is to not know the power of God's Word and all of the evidences that backs it up.

    Faith comes by hearing, and hearing the Word of God.
    So..... if you have faith and you believe the Word of God and that it has merit, then.... when it says that it is perfect and that it will be preserved for all generations, then you have a choice to either believe God's Word (which brings faith) or you have a choice to not believe in it (which is unbelief).

    Receiving God's Word will change you.
    So if you mock God's Word by saying that one cannot trust it alone as one's authority (circular reasoning), then where does that place your faith?
    On evidences?
    Hebrews 11 says without faith, it is impossible to please Him.
    Did not Christ change your life?
    Has not the Spirit shown you things within His Word and opened your eyes to what was once a dead book to you before?
    For faith comes by hearing the Word of God.

    There can only be one Word of God; And not many Words of God as your final word of authority. Otherwise you can be easily tossed back and forth by every wind of doctrine.

    The Bible is inerrant or perfect (i.e. the KJV).

    See, after I shortly got saved back in 1992, I was already quickly aware of the differences between the Modern Translations and the King James. I had seen that the changes were not for the better, but for the worse. I looked at a lot of the passages in the book titled, "New Age Bible Versions" and I did not need to be convinced any further.

    So I had come to believe from the very start that God's Word was perfect and without error and that has never changed. Yet, that does not mean God did not test me to see if I would trust His Word and continue to have faith in Him or not. For one day I read a book that pointed out a supposed contradiction in God's Word. At first, I appeared shocked and it felt like my faith was on the line here. But I had the awakening by the power of the Spirit and knew I was saved. So there was no turning back. I knew the truth. Yet I could not explain what I had seen in the King James.

    Now, do you know what I did way back then in the 90's when I discovered this? I basically said to the Lord that I did not have an answer for what I was seeing within His Word, but I was just going to trust Him and His Word was true regardless.

    And you know what happened after that? Well, I am glad I did trust the Lord's Word back then. For after I renewed my faith in 2010 after God brought a loving Christian woman into my life from half way around the world, I had began to study God's Word again and made a very interesting discovery about this supposed contradiction.

    So here it is:

    Did Solomon have 40,000 stalls for his horses (1 Kings 4:26), or 4,000 stalls (2 Chronicles 9:25)?

    Firstly, it should be noted that this “supposed contradiction” does not appear in the New International Version, which states that Solomon had “four thousand stalls” in both verses. However, the NIV translation mistakenly states that Solomon had twelve thousand horses, when in fact the original Hebrew text (and all other English translations of it) state that Solomon had twelve thousand horsemen. This error results in three horses per chariot (an unusually odd number) and three horses per stall (which seems a little crowded). Opening a lexicon, we see that the King James Version gives an accurate rendering of the Hebrew text (correctly translating the Hebrew parash as “horsemen”), and for this reason we know that this translation can be trusted in accurately explaining this “contradiction”.

    With that said, let’s examine these two verses. 1 Kings 4:26 states, “Solomon had forty thousand stalls of horses for his chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen” while 2 Chronicles 9:25 states “Solomon had four thousand stalls for horses and chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen”.

    1 Kings 4:26 counts only the horses that were intended to be used “for his chariots”. On the other hand, 2 Chronicles 9:25 counts both the horses “and chariots” together.

    1 Kings 4:26 states that Solomon had forty thousand stalls of horses, meaning that he had forty-thousand stalls with horses in them. 2 Chronicles 9:25 counts both horses and chariots together. If each chariot stall contains within it ten horse stalls (perhaps one stall for each horse that pulls the chariot) then there is no contradiction.

    Solomon had 40,000 stalls for his horses. Solomon had 4,000 chariots (three riders per chariot, since we know from both 1 Kings 4:26 and 2 Chronicles 9:25 that he had twelve thousand horsemen) and every chariot had its own stall. Chariots are pulled by multiple horses – in this case, ten horses. Each chariot stall had within it ten individual horse stalls – one for each horse that pulled that specific chariot.

    In fact, here is a similar one.

    Did David capture 1,700 of King Zobah's horsemen (2 Samuel 8:4), or was it 7,000 (1 Chronicles 18:4)?

    2 Samuel 8:4 says that David took 700 horsemen, while 1 Chronicles 18:4 says that David took 7000 horsemen. These verses are not in contradiction. The King James version correctly describes 1000 chariots in both 2 Samuel 8:4 and 1 Chronicles 18:4. Both verses also state that David reserved 100 chariots. Combining the information from these two verses we see that David took 700 horsemen for the chariots he kept, but he took a total of 7000 horsemen away from the enemy king. The two different numbers for the number of chariots provide us with a consistent 7:1 horseman-to-chariot ratio. This is reasonable, as seven horsemen could easily share the same chariot.

    So we can conclude that if one believes the Bible is not written entirely by God and reads something at face value like the above passages without the help of the Spirit teaching them, then one is only going to see errors in God's Word where none really exist.

    1 Thessalonians 2:13

    "For this cause also thank we God without ceasing, because, when ye received the word of God which ye heard of us, ye received it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually worketh also in you that believe."


    Source:
    http://biblocality.com/forums/attach...tachmentid=121
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017
  10. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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  11. jimmyjimmy

    jimmyjimmy Pardoned Rebel Supporter

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    "He solves all MY problems."
     
  12. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    Jesus says a good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, (and vise versa).

    There can be only one good tree of the Word.
    If you were to compare the KJV vs. the Modern Translations, the KJV wins out every time!

    Also, biblical numerics also confirm the KJV when such a thing is non existent with the Modern Translations.


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  13. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    One God.
    One baptism.
    One Word of God.
    One faith.



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  14. Steve Petersen

    Steve Petersen Senior Veteran

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  15. Steve Petersen

    Steve Petersen Senior Veteran

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    Balderdash.
     
  16. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    You sound like you don't believe in God's Word?
    Is this true?

    Also, I do not recall having any evidences given by Josh McDowell on my list of evidences for God's Word.
    Maybe if you were not so closed minded and you could possibly check out the evidences I provided within my link?


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    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017
  17. Bible Highlighter

    Bible Highlighter Law of the Lord is perfect, converting the soul. Supporter

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    So you are saying that every time the number 7 appears, it means absolutely nothing to you?
    The number 7 appears hundreds of times in Revelation.
    So it means nothing?
    How about the number 40?
    It means a time of testing.
    Surely do you just write the meaning of the number 7 and the meaning of the number 40 off as coincidences?
    • The rains (in Noah's day) fell for 40 days and nights (Genesis 7:4).
    • Israel ate Manna for 40 years (Exodus 16:35).
    • Moses was with God in the mount, 40 days and nights (Exodus 24:18).
    • Moses was again with God 40 days and 40 nights (Exodus 34:28).
    • The spies searched the land of Canaan for 40 days (Numbers 13:25).
    • Therefore, God made Israel wander for 40 years (Numbers 14:33-34).
    • 40 stripes was the maximum whipping penalty (Deuteronomy 25:3).
    • God allowed the land to rest for 40 years (Judges 3:11).
    • God again allowed the land to rest for 40 years (Judges 5:31).
    • God again allowed the land to rest for 40 years (Judges 8:28).
    • Israel did evil; God gave them to an enemy for 40 years (Judges 13:1).
    • Eli judged Israel for 40 years (1 Samuel 4:18).
    • Goliath presented himself to Israel for 40 days (1 Samuel 17:16).
    • Saul reigned for 40 years (Acts 13:21).
    • Solomon reigned same length as his father; 40 years (1 Kings 11:42).
    • Elijah had one meal that gave him strength 40 days (1 Kings 19:8).
    • Ezekiel bore the iniquity of the house of Judah for 40 days (Ezekiel 4:6).
    • Jehoash (Joash) reigned 40 years in Jerusalem (2 Kings 12:1).
    • Egypt to be laid desolate for 40 years (Ezekiel 29:11-12).
    • God gave Nineveh 40 days to repent (Jonah 3:4).
    • Jesus fasted 40 days and nights (Matthew 4:2).
    • Jesus was tempted 40 days (Luke 4:2, Mark 1:13).
    • Jesus remained on earth 40 days after resurrection (Acts 1:3).
    • Women are pregnant for 40 weeks (time of testing).
    "Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number." (Revelation 13:18).

    "I applied mine heart to know, and to search, and to seek out wisdom, and the reason of things,..." (Ecclesiastes 7:25).

    "Behold, this have I found, saith the preacher, counting one by one, to find out the account:" (Ecclesiastes 7:27).



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  18. jimmyjimmy

    jimmyjimmy Pardoned Rebel Supporter

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    I don't find those type of arguments compelling either, and they aren't at all practical for the average Christian to use.

    Doubt is not the lack of something. It's the presence of something. All people have faith. The problem is that most people's faith is placed on things other than The Living God. Exposing and exploding the object of one's misdirected faith is the work primarily of the Holy Spirit, but we can help. . .

    Men don't not believe because of a lack of information. In fact any new information given to them will be interpreted by their presuppositions, which in many cases, they don't even realize they have, as they are assumed. There is a humous story about a man who thought that he was dead that helps make the point that people interpret all data based on their presuppositions.
     
  19. Paul of Eugene OR

    Paul of Eugene OR Finally Old Enough Supporter

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    You know, this obsession with the number seven might make some sense if there was actually anything we could do about the number seven, or if it made any difference in anything.
     
  20. yeshuaslavejeff

    yeshuaslavejeff simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua

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    Believe Jesus INSTEAD of men.

    Follow Jesus, by faith, HE is PERFECTLY FAITHFUL,
    not men.

    His Word is Perfect and TRUTH - HE is the WAY, the TRUTH, and the LIFE.

    All the so-called discrepancies you've been lied to about, believe them if you want to not follow Jesus.

    If you want to follow Jesus, love the TRUTH, and always keep seeking the TRUTH.

    No one who comes to Jesus is ever disappointed in Him.
     
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