If no Bible translation is perfect then do we really have Gods word?

RDKirk

Alien, Pilgrim, and Sojourner
Site Supporter
Mar 3, 2013
39,273
20,267
US
✟1,475,501.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I think God has protected the Scriptures. A long time has passed and not that much changed. Even though they relied on scribes to write manuscriots etc.

I am focusding on reading other translations at the moment. I have not the time to learn greek and hebrew. One day maybe. Reading a few translations means we are able to get a broader understanding in places when the original word has a fuller meaning than what we have has it translated too.

And that's true of most of us. I studied Latin and Spanish in school. My daughter (at my urging) took Spanish all through junior high, high school, and college. Amusingly, she's now teaching formal Spanish to her new Latino husband. She's also teaching him how to Salsa (his grandmother said at their weeding, "Finally!")

But I've learned that really understanding a foreign language is not a hobby. I don't entertain for a moment the delusion that I'm going to learn to translate ancient Hebrew and koine Greek as well as those people who have spent a lifetime of study in them and work together to create translations that a group can agree on.

But I've also learned that translation is not a mechanical process, but an organic one (which is why speakers of any language still laugh at computer translations). That's why different translations of the Bible differ in minor aspects, and why it can be useful to compare different translations.

But, ultimately, we do have the Holy Spirit as well.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sam91
Upvote 0

Colter

Member
Nov 9, 2004
8,711
1,406
60
✟92,791.00
Faith
Other Religion
Marital Status
Married
Can we trust a Bible with mistakes?
Can we trust any Bible 100%?
Which Bible/s can we trust?
What does it mean when God said he will preserve his word?

What are your thoughts?


(no kjv onlyism)
God is the Living Word, seek his guidance in prayer. Not only are the translations inerrant but so is the content. I extract the spiritual teachings and take the Israelites nationalist historical stuff with a grain of salt.
 
Upvote 0

DeaconDean

γέγονα χαλκὸς, κύμβαλον ἀλαλάζον
Jul 19, 2005
22,183
2,677
61
Gastonia N.C. (Piedmont of N.C.)
✟100,334.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
I keep coming here to remind myself why I left Fundamentalist Christianity.

I wish I could count the times, I have said there is nothing wrong per se with the KJV. Oh wait, I can. 3!

Fact is, the essential "core doctrines" that Christianity stands upon, are inside the KJV. And by the same token, they are in the RSV, the ASV, the NKJV, NASV, NRSV, etc.

The one exception I would admit to is the NWT. New World Translation, the version used by Jehovah's Witnesses.

Evidently, its wrong to check the Greek (or even the Hebrew) against the King James version.

Oh well.

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
Upvote 0

DeaconDean

γέγονα χαλκὸς, κύμβαλον ἀλαλάζον
Jul 19, 2005
22,183
2,677
61
Gastonia N.C. (Piedmont of N.C.)
✟100,334.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
One person here has said:

The KJV is god’s perfectly preserved word!

Then I ask this: Why are you not Catholic?

In the 1611 Authorized version, we have this:

"Then Peter said vnto them, Repent, and be baptized euery one of you in the Name of Iesus Christ, for the remission of sinnes, and ye shal receiue the gift of the holy Ghost."

1611 Authorized King James Version

In the "modern" King James Version, we have:

"Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost." -Acts 2:38 (KJV)

Note: The version of the KJV quoted above comes from www.biblegateway.com. And they include: "The King James Version present on the Bible Gateway matches the 1987 printing."

Both versions, the 1611 Authorized Version and the more "modern" version of the KJV actually prove that Catholicism is correct in their view of sin and baptism!

Very plainly put, without baptism, you cannot have "remission of sins".

If you think hard about it, the 1611 and nearly all "modern" versions of it (KJV) confirm Catholicism's teaching on this subject.

So while accusations like: "scholar" and "intelligent" are thrown around, this is one time studying in the Greek is so very important.

Like so many other Greek words, some have several meanings. Like "sozo" (love). There are up to seven different ways this word can be rendered.

Here, "eis" rendered "for" is the same.

In Acts 2:38, the meaning is:

"1519 eis (a preposition) – properly, into (unto) – literally, "motion into which" implying penetration ("unto," "union") to a particular purpose or result."

Source

Or:

"1) into, unto, to, towards, for, among "

Source

Or:

"eis-in order to; with a view to; Mk. 1:38, et al."

The New Analytical Greek Lexicon, Wesley J. Pershbacher, Hendrickson Publishing Comp., Peabody, Mass., 01962, Copyright 1990, "eis" p 120-1

So we see that one must be baptized eis (in order to) the remission of sins". Which again, would seemingly confirm Catholicism.

But, in studying in the Greek, we find that B. H. Carroll is correct when he wrote:

"To illustrate the power of the local context in determining the meaning of the Greek preposition, eis (here we have the preposition with the accusative case after it), we now cite most pertinent New Testament examples: Matthew 12:41: "They repented eis the preaching of Jonah." Because eis ordinarily means in order to, must we so render it here? It is a fact, according to chapter 3 of Jonah, and did our Lord so mean it? If so, they failed in the object of their repentance, because Jonah never preached to them after they repented -- not a word. The only preaching he did preceded the repentance, and was the cause of the repentance. Therefore, Dr. Broadus teaches in his Commentary on Matthew that eis here must have its rare meaning - because of. They repented because of, eis, the preaching of Jonah."

The Theory of Baptismal Regeneration, B. H. Carroll

If the King James Version is "the perfectly preserved word of God" then those who advocate this position, must repent and turn to Catholicism, for no other reason than the KJV agrees with their teachings.

Sorry.

God Bless

Till all are one.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
Any true Bible, like the one left on a Pacific Island one day a few hundred years ago, is fine.
When that Island was visited again many years later, they had a "MORE OBEDIENT TRUE" life in CHRIST JESUS than almost anywhere else in the world, JUST FROM ONE BIBLE.
They did not (and obviously could not) become catholic, jw, buddhist, Lutheran, Baptist, Greek, Hebrew, Jewish, Charismatic, Independent, Methodist, CoG, or any other known sect
......

they were EKKLESIA just like the first believers in ACTS.

Born again, called and chosen by YHVH THE CREATOR SOVEREIGN, set apart and sanctified and redeemed IN JESUS MESSIAH SAVIOR KING....

AND (I think) they HAD NO DIVORCE, NO GREED, NO IDOLATRY, NO FORNICATION, NO STEALING, NO LYING NO SERVING FOREIGN /FALSE GODS ....

until AFTER white man visited.....
with white man's religion (called ............... "form of" without power) ......
 
Upvote 0

dreadnought

Lip service isn't really service.
Site Supporter
Aug 4, 2012
7,730
3,466
71
Reno, Nevada
✟313,356.00
Country
United States
Faith
United Methodist
Marital Status
Celibate
And the Lord, the Holy Spirit never contradicts what he has already spoken to us through his word, the bible.
The Holy Spirit would never contradict something God or Jesus said in the Bible.
 
Upvote 0

dreadnought

Lip service isn't really service.
Site Supporter
Aug 4, 2012
7,730
3,466
71
Reno, Nevada
✟313,356.00
Country
United States
Faith
United Methodist
Marital Status
Celibate
Exactly!

I wonder if Rita G knows what "napkin" meant in the early years of the first century?

"καὶ τὸ σουδάριον, ὃ ἦν ἐπὶ τῆς κεφαλῆς αὐτοῦ, οὐ μετὰ τῶν ὀθονίων κείμενον ἀλλὰ χωρὶς ἐντετυλιγμένον εἰς ἕνα τόπον." -Jn. 20:7 (GNT)

"And the napkin, that was about his head, not lying with the linen clothes, but wrapped together in a place by itself." -Jn. 20:7 (KJV)

God Bless

Till all are one.
Thank you.
 
Upvote 0

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
The Holy Spirit would never contradict something God or Jesus said in the Bible.
As written, as taught to all disciples of Jesus,
most messages in the world today can be eliminated by this simple test of truth.
 
  • Like
Reactions: dreadnought
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
The Holy Spirit would never contradict something God or Jesus said in the Bible.
Yes, GOOD !
Likewise , (due to recent post(s) by others)

YHVH never mocks nor opposes His set apart people , ever.

Yahshua (Jesus) always SHEPHERDS us, His Sheep, perfectly as HE SAYS.
 
Upvote 0

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
Your posts make absolutely NO sense AT ALL.
Are you a racist?
????!!!! no. What are you talking or thinking about ?
The posts make sense to those who have experienced them.
Who know what western/ greek / modern ways (white man's ways as they are universally called) have done to people and to 'faith' (i.e. ruined so many cultures, annihilated so many species of mammals and insects and in the soil destroyed so much that is needed )
 
Upvote 0

Rita G.

Active Member
May 29, 2017
144
34
42
Connecticut
✟19,922.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
????!!!! no. What are you talking or thinking about ?
The posts make sense to those who have experienced them.
Who know what western/ greek / modern ways (white man's ways as they are universally called) have done to people and to 'faith' (i.e. ruined so many cultures, annihilated so many species of mammals and insects and in the soil destroyed so much that is needed )
Chapter & verse please?
and what translation?
 
Upvote 0

Rita G.

Active Member
May 29, 2017
144
34
42
Connecticut
✟19,922.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
History.
Are you not aware of any history ?

(for example, babylon) Today and throughout the last several thousand years.
Tell us more . . this is interesting!
What is your source of information?
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

yeshuaslavejeff

simple truth, martyr, disciple of Yahshua
Jan 6, 2005
39,944
11,098
okie
✟214,996.00
Faith
Anabaptist
Tell us more . . this is interesting!
What is your source of information?
Why are you at all interested in the truth ? In the history of the USA ?
Are you a citizen? Are you in prison or treated badly by some group(s)?

It is more than interesting and true - it has been WIDE SPREAD and is well known publicly (world wide, also, as other countries are more aware than usa citizens are told usually, even for all the recent wars/ destruction) .

If you are UNable for some reason to use the
internet and all the resources, perhaps some agency or THE LIBRARY near where you live can help you.
 
Upvote 0

Rita G.

Active Member
May 29, 2017
144
34
42
Connecticut
✟19,922.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
If you are UNable for some reason to use the
internet and all the resources, perhaps some agency or THE LIBRARY near where you live can help you.
Thank you,
Maybe the guards will take me out to the library so I can use the internet.
 
Upvote 0

Rita G.

Active Member
May 29, 2017
144
34
42
Connecticut
✟19,922.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
????!!!! no. What are you talking or thinking about ?
The posts make sense to those who have experienced them.
Who know what western/ greek / modern ways (white man's ways as they are universally called) have done to people and to 'faith' (i.e. ruined so many cultures, annihilated so many species of mammals and insects and in the soil destroyed so much that is needed )
Do you feel like you've been victimized?
 
Upvote 0

he-man

he-man
Oct 28, 2010
8,891
301
usa
✟90,748.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
The Greek and Hebrew.
That is a good guess but a knowledge of Greek and Hebrew is also required. You cannot trust a particular verse just because some translator picked which word was actually the meaning. In 2 Thessolains 1:9 δικη in Greek means penalty; to incur the death penalty; PL.Ap. 39b; penalty awarded by the Judge; Hdt., Soph. Middle Liddle; LSJ. Then the verse reads who shall pay a penalty of destruction everlasting. [YLT] Also Matthew 25:46 G2849 Strong says κολασισ penal infliction; Thayer says Penalty κολασισ . You have to do your homework to pass the grade and do not let Orthodox ideas to influence you.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums