If homosexuality is proven to be biological . . .

[Merlin]

Catholic Church teaches such people are called to chastity.

and we all know the catholic church speaks for all...



not

 

[Merlin]

Allowing two consenting adults that love each other to marry is not a slippery slope,

redefining marriage is though.

A civil union does not grant the same rights as it still allows the biological family of one partner to override the rights of the other.

then why not fix that law?

 

[Merlin]

I have been a scientist for years and have researched your assertion that people have been re-programmed as you put it and that is a blatant lie.

it's not a lie.

 

[Caitlin.ann]

I keep wondering what that "multi-quote" button is for..

 

[Merlin]

One day homosexual marriage will be legal in all states,

sadly true

 

[Caitlin.ann]

sadly true

For you maybe, for my cousins and their long time partners a wonderful day of rejoicing. And for me this country will have become a better place.

 

[Beanieboy]

The Bible does define marriage.
and it ain't 2 men!
nonsense.
that's where the laws came from. the Bible.

And it ain't "1 man and 1 woman" either:

Exodus 21
10 If he marries another woman, he must not deprive the first one of her food, clothing and marital rights.

2 Samuel 5
13 After he left Hebron, David took more concubines and wives in Jerusalem, and more sons and daughters were born to him.

1 Chronicles 14
3 In Jerusalem David took more wives and became the father of more sons and daughters.

(David was the "Apple of God's Eye", remember, not living a "sinful lifestyle" of polygamy.)

1 Kings 11
He had seven hundred wives of royal birth and three hundred concubines, and his wives led him astray.

Not even close to 1 man and 1 woman

That's just scratching the surface.
Even Adam's son had two wives.
In another story, a man wants to marry a man's daughter, but told that he must first marry her sister.

 

[Caitlin.ann]

Yay polygamy!

 

[Beanieboy]

I was under the misapprehension that polygamy was legal in Utah, my apologies.

Isn't it not officially legal, but practiced, the second+ wives not recognized as next of kin?

That is part of their religion, and the way some Mormons live. It seems wrong to punish them legally for following their religion of polygamy. I know of many people from Somalia that came to Minneapolis, and were having problems, because the second, third, and fourth wives that the men had, that were recognized in Somalia, allowed by their religion, were not recognized in the states, making it difficult to have them covered by insurance, etc. That seems wrong.

I think if we were to make polygamy legal tomorrow, there wouldn't be any change. The Somalis believe that they are married in the eyes of Allah, and the Mormons believe that they are married in the name of God. They simply have legal struggles. But would Angelina Jolie have no problem with Brad Pitt having a harem? Like every woman, you know she would, and would never allow her husband to marry another woman without walking out the door.

 

[Merlin]

Scientific.

Oh wait...


SCIENTIFIC!!

See I can play too..ain't it fun?

indeed

 

[Garyzenuf]

Sin has passed to all men. It wouldnt change one thing I believe from the bible if it was proven to be biological. Alcoholism can be genetic too. We all have a sin nature and the sins we are most drawn to vary and i wouldnt be surprised if parts of those natures have something to do with our genetics. Sin has very far reaching effects.

Ah yes...the infinite regress of unsubstantiated claims, frustating isn't it?

The ultimate get out of jail free card, it explains everything, and nothing, all at the same time.

*

 

[Beanieboy]

sadly true

Today, any heterosexual can get married. I can meet you in Vegas, and get married to the opposite sex by an Elvis impersonator. You don't have to approve of it. It just is.

Catholics believe that if you don't get married in the Catholic Church, you aren't really married. So, they wouldn't see my Viva Las Vegas wedding as valid, and yet, I would enjoy all of the rights and privileges of marriage.

I can get married to a woman, divorced, remarry, divorce again, and get remarried, and every time, enjoy the rights of marriage, even though the Catholic Church thinks that I am living in adultery.

So, I'm unclear what it is that you are sad about.

Are you sad that if I get hit by a drunk driver, putting me in the ICU, that my partner can come and stay by my side, because he would be considered family? Are you upset that I want to entrust him with life and death decisions about me? Are you upset that we would share property rights, such as our condo, the car, our furniture, and our investments, and that his family couldn't come and demand half of everything in the event of his sudden death? Are you upset that we can put each other on our health insurance coverage? That we can put each other as the beneficiary of our life insurance?

Because that is what we would get, and can get, in Toronto. And there is no fire falling from the sky. Some gay people get married. Others refused to bow to heteronormativity, the demand that gay relationships have to at least marry, to be as similar as possible to heterosexual ones. However, Toronto has Domestic Partnerships, so that straight or gay, you can share insurance, sponsor your partner into the country, and many of the benefits of marriage rights.

What I assume that you are sad about it the fact that gays will be able to say that they are married, while not really caring that much about the Viva Las Vegas weddings, the Weddings that are more about pageantry than commitment and celebration of a union, a day for the bride to play a grown up version of "I'm a Fairy Princess." You are less bothered by the 50% divorce rate of heterosexuals, that have society on their side, the law on their side, and the church on their side.

And that is indeed sad.

 

[Merlin]

Today, any heterosexual can get married. I can meet you in Vegas, and get married to the opposite sex by an Elvis impersonator. You don't have to approve of it. It just is.

Catholics believe that if you don't get married in the Catholic Church, you aren't really married. So, they wouldn't see my Viva Las Vegas wedding as valid, and yet, I would enjoy all of the rights and privileges of marriage.

I can get married to a woman, divorced, remarry, divorce again, and get remarried, and every time, enjoy the rights of marriage, even though the Catholic Church thinks that I am living in adultery.

kewl equal rights

So, I'm unclear what it is that you are sad about.

Are you sad that if I get hit by a drunk driver, putting me in the ICU, that my partner can come and stay by my side, because he would be considered family? Are you upset that I want to entrust him with life and death decisions about me? Are you upset that we would share property rights, such as our condo, the car, our furniture, and our investments, and that his family couldn't come and demand half of everything in the event of his sudden death? Are you upset that we can put each other on our health insurance coverage? That we can put each other as the beneficiary of our life insurance?

those are legal issues but not marital based.

Because that is what we would get, and can get, in Toronto. And there is no fire falling from the sky. Some gay people get married. Others refused to bow to heteronormativity, the demand that gay relationships have to at least marry, to be as similar as possible to heterosexual ones. However, Toronto has Domestic Partnerships, so that straight or gay, you can share insurance, sponsor your partner into the country, and many of the benefits of marriage rights.

see not a marriage issue at all

 

[Merlin]

And it ain't "1 man and 1 woman" either:

Exodus 21
10 If he marries another woman, he must not deprive the first one of her food, clothing and marital rights.

2 Samuel 5
13 After he left Hebron, David took more concubines and wives in Jerusalem, and more sons and daughters were born to him.

1 Chronicles 14
3 In Jerusalem David took more wives and became the father of more sons and daughters.

(David was the "Apple of God's Eye", remember, not living a "sinful lifestyle" of polygamy.)

1 Kings 11
He had seven hundred wives of royal birth and three hundred concubines, and his wives led him astray.

Not even close to 1 man and 1 woman

That's just scratching the surface.
Even Adam's son had two wives.
In another story, a man wants to marry a man's daughter, but told that he must first marry her sister.

but do note it's about 1 man only in your examples

 

[selfinflikted]

that's where the laws came from. the Bible.

opinion

ok, how about this. I'm a gay man. I never chose it. There, not opinion.

sadly true

Too bad so sad for you. I will be celebrating!

 

[Polycarp_fan]

ok, how about this. I'm a gay man. I never chose it. There, not opinion.



Too bad so sad for you. I will be celebrating!

Why can't you gay people just admit that you like this form of behavior and be done with it.

Why the machinations over and over again to justify it by some kind of mental or congenital condition? You lay a guilt trip on people that do not care.

As an example: I desire curvy women with dark hair and snappy attitudes.

I don't care why I do, I just do.

 

[Merlin]

ok, how about this. I'm a gay man. I never chose it. There, not opinion.

sure you did
even if your unaware of that choice

 

[WhatThe]

As an example: I desire curvy women with dark hair and snappy attitudes.

I don't care why I do, I just do.

Ah see but if I said that you'd tell me it was a choice to be attracted to them.

 

[KCKID]

Why can't you gay people just admit that you like this form of behavior and be done with it.

A friend of mine knew he was 'gay' for many years before he ever involved himself in 'this form of behavior'. Whether or not he does so now is none of my business. Nor yours. As usual the construct of your sentence is condemnatory. You could have said, Why can't you gay people just admit that you're 'gay' through no choice of your own and be done with it? But you didn't. I wonder why?

Why the machinations over and over again to justify it by some kind of mental or congenital condition? You lay a guilt trip on people that do not care.

I've never known any poster on a forum who lays the guilt trip on others as you do, PC_F. However, as for not caring that is precisely what you are all about. You DON'T care for anyone who isn't you or who agrees with you. Everyone else is the enemy. All you care about is winning kudos with God by seemingly using His name to condemn others.

As an example: I desire curvy women with dark hair and snappy attitudes.

I don't care why I do, I just do.

Well, there you go. I personally don't care either. However, probably without realizing it you just made a case for the homosexual. Being homosexual is no more a choice than your desiring (choosing to desire?) curvy women with dark hair and snappy attitudes. They are 'gay' simply because they are ...um ...'gay'. Correct?

Don't you ever feel sort of ...silly?

 

[sk8Joyful]

You could have said, Why can't you gay people just admit
that you're 'gay' through no choice of your own and be done with it? But you didn't.

I wonder why?

Hello,
Do notice.. why some, especially us in the *human development...* business daily helping individuals change,
correctly state that "homosexuality IS a chosen behavior pattern.

Homosexuality is, as Merlin correctly states, 'outside of conscious awareness'; but nonetheless by the person chosen it is. As such, such people can when they want be helped... to CHANGE back.

And this was actually admitted by the OP,
in the statement "IF homosexuality is proven to be biological".
iow, the operative word here was, and continues "IF".
and
it matters not, how many posters call some of us liars, lying, or any other dysfunctional nasty thing; because
the experienced Truth remains: "homosexuality IS a chosen behavior pattern, that some have successfully changed back to
healthy emotional functioning".

Being homosexual is no more a choice , than... your

They are 'gay' simply because they are ...um ...'gay'.

Correct?

No, not correct. -

And for the wise, this serves as an invitation to learn...
some wonderful, positive, constructive new skills.

Cheers!