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Idaho doctor reports a ‘20 times increase’ of cancer in vaccinated patients

Discussion in 'The Kitchen Sink' started by JustSomeBloke, Sep 17, 2021.

  1. Original Happy Camper

    Original Happy Camper One of GODS Children I am a historicist Supporter

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    Ok about vaccines however your post indicated that they are due to lock downs, that my dear fiend is coercion thus causing harm not good
     
  2. Goonie

    Goonie Not so Mystic Mog. Supporter

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    The problem is that without lockdowns healthcare was overwhelmed by covid cases the same issue would occur but with additional covid death on top.
     
  3. A_Thinker

    A_Thinker Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Really ???

    God does not employ coercion ?

    What of the first command given to humankind ... "Of all the trees in the garden, you may eat. But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, you shall not eat, for in the day that you shall do so, ... you shall die."

    ... and that's just chapter 3 of the first of 66 books.

    Not that I have a problem with it, ... but I think that christians need to rethink the idea that God doesn't use coercion ...
     
  4. pitabread

    pitabread Well-Known Member

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  5. ThatRobGuy

    ThatRobGuy Part of the IT crowd Supporter

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    That's a reaction to the fact that the other side tends to "under-check" info before willingly accepting it when it's things that align with their stance on vaccination.

    For instance, people will search into google 5 & 6 pages deep to compile a list of all of negative things they can possible scrounge up about the vaccine (even if it's unverified anecdotes) and then pride themselves on "I did the research".

    But then when groups like "America's Frontline Doctors" shows up on the scene, or some anti-mainstream practitioner takes an anti-vaccine stance, they'll seemingly have a willingness to accept it at face value.

    For instance, this guy's claim:
    "“Since January 1, in the laboratory, I’m seeing a 20 times increase of endometrial cancers over what I see on an annual basis,”"

    Across the entire US for 2021, new cases of that cancer type was
    upload_2021-9-18_9-17-1.png

    For 2020
    upload_2021-9-18_9-16-4.png

    For 2019
    upload_2021-9-18_9-16-44.png


    This "20 times increase" that he claims he's seeing certainly isn't reflected in the national data. 2021 hasn't really deviated from past years.


    Now, of course, a much more feasible and grounded explanation would be:
    Amid covid, hospitals (and their in-house labs) - especially hospitals that already had limited capacity to do that kind of work - outsourced quite a bit of of their lab and diagnostics work to independent CLS companies (like Cole Diagnostics, the one this guys runs) that they normally would've done in-house.

    With in-house laboratory services and the larger CLS companies (like Quest Diagnostics) being heavily focused on Covid testing. Many of these smaller lab companies have started getting a lot more work in areas where they wouldn't have before.

    Think about it from a practical sense, under normal circumstances, why would a smaller independent lab (with a typical focus on dermatopathology) be handling endometrial/uterine cancer screening lab work? In most cases, they wouldn't (unless a hospitals in-house laboratory was either bogged down or short staffed...which happens to be the case amid covid)

    So the fact that he's "seeing 20 times more that he previously did" doesn't mean there are 20 times more, clearly that's not the case from the numbers.
     
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  6. hedrick

    hedrick Senior Veteran Supporter

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    Closing hospitals and doctors to non Covid treatment was brief, during real peaks. The problem isn’t lockdowns, but people not wanting to go to doctors offices. I’ve heard radio ads encouraging people to get routine treatments. Doctors offices have been taking lots of precautions. But I can understand not wanting to go to a doctor.
     
  7. FreeinChrist

    FreeinChrist CF Advisory team Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Idaho Doctor Makes Baseless Claims About Safety of COVID-19 Vaccines - FactCheck.org

    Since the pandemic began, however, politicized social media posts have featured doctors, some looking authoritative in white coats, spreading dubious claims about both vaccines and treatments for COVID-19. The most recent example in this misinformation niche is Dr. Ryan Cole, who owns a medical lab in Idaho....

    • Although there is no evidence to support this, Cole suggested that some of the COVID-19 vaccines could cause cancer or autoimmune diseases......
    To those bogus claims, Cole has now added: “mRNA trials in mammals have led to odd cancers. mRNA trials on mammals have led to autoimmune diseases — not right away, six, nine, 12 months later.”

    We asked Cole to provide support for those claims, and he referred us to a 2018 paper published in the journal Nature Reviews Drug Discovery that reviewed trials and studies of various, earlier mRNA vaccines.

    But that paper doesn’t support his statement.

    Norbert Pardi, a research assistant professor of medicine at the University of Pennsylvania, was the lead author of the paper. He told us in an email, “No publications demonstrate that mRNA vaccines cause cancer or autoimmune diseases.”....

    “Regarding autoimmunity,” he said, “this is always a concern with any medical product, but there is no evidence to date suggesting it, and it does not seem any more likely than with other vaccines. mRNA is made all the time in our bodies, and delivering it by vaccine should not be different.”

    Dr. Dean Winslow, an infectious disease physician at Stanford Health Care, concurred with the other experts with whom we spoke. In a phone interview, he characterized Cole’s claims about cancer as “fearmongering” and said, “There’s just no scientific basis for that.”
    The doctorin OP needs to provide factual proof of his claims.
     
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  8. loveofourlord

    loveofourlord Newbie

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    Right and instead you have all the states right now where people are dying because they hospitals are too full, and towns/cities are out of ambulances and such.
     
  9. loveofourlord

    loveofourlord Newbie

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    The first thing that comes to mind with this is, why would this apply to vaccines and not natural immunity itself, the body produces the same antibodies.
     
  10. Taodeching

    Taodeching Well-Known Member

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    Yep. We would need an alien who has no dog in this fight. There is no such thing an completely unbiased.
     
  11. Hank77

    Hank77 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I saw on the Denver news last night that hospitals in ID are having to send patients to hospitals out of state.
     
  12. muichimotsu

    muichimotsu I Spit On Perfection

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    Alright, how about we just say it's fallacious reasoning? Correlation doesn't equal causation, that's basic science and he's making a specious inference of an uptick in cancer and then referencing things that I'm 100% sure aren't cancers, but entirely different things that could have other factors that are not caused or even related to anything from the covid vaccines (of which it's not clear without more data how many people are getting the mRNA versus the adenovirus type, plus the possibility that we could eventually have more diversity in vaccine options eventually)
     
  13. muichimotsu

    muichimotsu I Spit On Perfection

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    Is this your only tactic? Deflection and gaslighting of the opponents to make yourself seem more rational?

    No substantive data means we can dismiss the claim out of hand pretty easily because it's a generalization and possibly even poor methodology on the part of a supposed "expert"
     
  14. Original Happy Camper

    Original Happy Camper One of GODS Children I am a historicist Supporter

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    The verse you quoted does not appear to be coercion, if you see it that way please explain it to me.

    They freely eat of it thus it was their choice, and had to suffer the consequences. Cause and effect yes but it was their choice.

    Thanks
     
  15. JustSomeBloke

    JustSomeBloke Hello AK47 Supporter

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    It isn't a bad thing. Provided it's done by people and organisations who are impartial. But it usually isn't. I know that because I often try to find out who is behind these so called factcheckers, and who is funding them, and I usually discover evidence of Left wing bias. There was already an example of this upthread. Didn't you see it? Someone posted a so-called factcheck, and I saw immediately that it was supported by Google. That's a problem, given that Google (and YouTube, which they own) are the king of internet censorship, and are vigorously deleting absolutely everything that questions the covid vaccines or suggests alternative treatments. There has also been numerous reports of Google shadow banning and demoting content they don't like, so that nearly no one can see it or find it. Why would anyone expect a factchecking website supported by Google to be impartial?

    Tell that to the Swedes. But I suppose the pro-lockdown types would probably rather not discuss Sweden. They might be forced to conclude that wrecking the economy, jobs, education and numerous other areas was all for nought.

    Can you explain what you think is meant by the term 'Estimated new cases in 2021'? In particular, what is meant by 'estimated', and as 2021 has not yet ended, are they working to a calendar that does not end on 31st December?
     
  16. A_Thinker

    A_Thinker Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Deuteronomy 28

    15 However, if you do not obey the Lord your God and do not carefully follow all his commands and decrees I am giving you today, all these curses will come on you and overtake you:

    16 You will be cursed in the city and cursed in the country.

    17 Your basket and your kneading trough will be cursed.

    18 The fruit of your womb will be cursed, and the crops of your land, and the calves of your herds and the lambs of your flocks.

    19 You will be cursed when you come in and cursed when you go out.

    20 The Lord will send on you curses, confusion and rebuke in everything you put your hand to, until you are destroyed and come to sudden ruin because of the evil you have done in forsaking him. 21 The Lord will plague you with diseases until he has destroyed you from the land you are entering to possess. 22 The Lord will strike you with wasting disease, with fever and inflammation, with scorching heat and drought, with blight and mildew, which will plague you until you perish. 23 The sky over your head will be bronze, the ground beneath you iron. 24 The Lord will turn the rain of your country into dust and powder; it will come down from the skies until you are destroyed.

    25 The Lord will cause you to be defeated before your enemies. You will come at them from one direction but flee from them in seven, and you will become a thing of horror to all the kingdoms on earth. 26 Your carcasses will be food for all the birds and the wild animals, and there will be no one to frighten them away. 27 The Lord will afflict you with the boils of Egypt and with tumors, festering sores and the itch, from which you cannot be cured. 28 The Lord will afflict you with madness, blindness and confusion of mind. 29 At midday you will grope about like a blind person in the dark. You will be unsuccessful in everything you do; day after day you will be oppressed and robbed, with no one to rescue you.

    30 You will be pledged to be married to a woman, but another will take her and rape her. You will build a house, but you will not live in it. You will plant a vineyard, but you will not even begin to enjoy its fruit. 31 Your ox will be slaughtered before your eyes, but you will eat none of it. Your donkey will be forcibly taken from you and will not be returned. Your sheep will be given to your enemies, and no one will rescue them. 32 Your sons and daughters will be given to another nation, and you will wear out your eyes watching for them day after day, powerless to lift a hand. 33 A people that you do not know will eat what your land and labor produce, and you will have nothing but cruel oppression all your days. 34 The sights you see will drive you mad. 35 The Lord will afflict your knees and legs with painful boils that cannot be cured, spreading from the soles of your feet to the top of your head.

    36 The Lord will drive you and the king you set over you to a nation unknown to you or your ancestors. There you will worship other gods, gods of wood and stone. 37 You will become a thing of horror, a byword and an object of ridicule among all the peoples where the Lord will drive you.

    38 You will sow much seed in the field but you will harvest little, because locusts will devour it. 39 You will plant vineyards and cultivate them but you will not drink the wine or gather the grapes, because worms will eat them. 40 You will have olive trees throughout your country but you will not use the oil, because the olives will drop off. 41 You will have sons and daughters but you will not keep them, because they will go into captivity. 42 Swarms of locusts will take over all your trees and the crops of your land.

    43 The foreigners who reside among you will rise above you higher and higher, but you will sink lower and lower. 44 They will lend to you, but you will not lend to them. They will be the head, but you will be the tail.

    45 All these curses will come on you. They will pursue you and overtake you until you are destroyed, because you did not obey the Lord your God and observe the commands and decrees he gave you. 46 They will be a sign and a wonder to you and your descendants forever. 47 Because you did not serve the Lord your God joyfully and gladly in the time of prosperity, 48 therefore in hunger and thirst, in nakedness and dire poverty, you will serve the enemies the Lord sends against you. He will put an iron yoke on your neck until he has destroyed you.

    49 The Lord will bring a nation against you from far away, from the ends of the earth, like an eagle swooping down, a nation whose language you will not understand, 50 a fierce-looking nation without respect for the old or pity for the young. 51 They will devour the young of your livestock and the crops of your land until you are destroyed. They will leave you no grain, new wine or olive oil, nor any calves of your herds or lambs of your flocks until you are ruined. 52 They will lay siege to all the cities throughout your land until the high fortified walls in which you trust fall down. They will besiege all the cities throughout the land the Lord your God is giving you.

    53 Because of the suffering your enemy will inflict on you during the siege, you will eat the fruit of the womb, the flesh of the sons and daughters the Lord your God has given you. 54 Even the most gentle and sensitive man among you will have no compassion on his own brother or the wife he loves or his surviving children, 55 and he will not give to one of them any of the flesh of his children that he is eating. It will be all he has left because of the suffering your enemy will inflict on you during the siege of all your cities. 56 The most gentle and sensitive woman among you—so sensitive and gentle that she would not venture to touch the ground with the sole of her foot—will begrudge the husband she loves and her own son or daughter 57 the afterbirth from her womb and the children she bears. For in her dire need she intends to eat them secretly because of the suffering your enemy will inflict on you during the siege of your cities.

    58 If you do not carefully follow all the words of this law, which are written in this book, and do not revere this glorious and awesome name—the Lord your God— 59 the Lord will send fearful plagues on you and your descendants, harsh and prolonged disasters, and severe and lingering illnesses. 60 He will bring on you all the diseases of Egypt that you dreaded, and they will cling to you. 61 The Lord will also bring on you every kind of sickness and disaster not recorded in this Book of the Law, until you are destroyed. 62 You who were as numerous as the stars in the sky will be left but few in number, because you did not obey the Lord your God. 63 Just as it pleased the Lord to make you prosper and increase in number, so it will please him to ruin and destroy you. You will be uprooted from the land you are entering to possess.

    64 Then the Lord will scatter you among all nations, from one end of the earth to the other. There you will worship other gods—gods of wood and stone, which neither you nor your ancestors have known. 65 Among those nations you will find no repose, no resting place for the sole of your foot. There the Lord will give you an anxious mind, eyes weary with longing, and a despairing heart. 66 You will live in constant suspense, filled with dread both night and day, never sure of your life. 67 In the morning you will say, “If only it were evening!” and in the evening, “If only it were morning!”—because of the terror that will fill your hearts and the sights that your eyes will see. 68 The Lord will send you back in ships to Egypt on a journey I said you should never make again. There you will offer yourselves for sale to your enemies as male and female slaves, but no one will buy you.
     

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  17. JustSomeBloke

    JustSomeBloke Hello AK47 Supporter

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    It's a reference to a fraud that has most likely occurred.

    I don't think it's a viable forum policy to pick and choose what should be allowed from a particular news site. Or say that it can only be posted in a specific sub-forum, and only if it's on a specific topic (e.g. abortion). Either all content from a news website should be allowed, or none.

    And as Lifesite says that:

    LifeSiteNews.com emphasizes the social worth of traditional Judeo-Christian principles but is also respectful of all authentic religions and cultures that esteem life, family and universal norms of morality.

    it would seem a little odd if CF were to ban news reports from that particular site.

    I did produce evidence. And then you kindly assisted by producing even more evidence that vaccines can trigger unwanted immune system side effects. And to be quite frank, there are some people, that no matter what you post as evidence, it will never be considered good enough.

    If you had watched the video to the end, you would know that he's calling for this to be studied. If I recall correctly he said 'who is studying this?'. His message is that this needs to be urgently looked into. In my opinion it's also an argument for not rolling out vaccines to entire populations, when so little is known about the vaccines.

    No. I'm genuinely interested in why these people react in the way they do. Everyone who wants a vaccine can have one, and as vaccination doesn't prevent infection and transmission to others, there's no logic in demanding that people get vaccinated to protect others. So why do they get so agitated, and why do they employ fallacious arguments such as ad-hominem and genetic logical fallacy? Whatever happened to tolerance for other people's point of view? They've had their vaccinations, but they're still ranting and raving at others who are more cautious. I'd like to know why?
     
  18. muichimotsu

    muichimotsu I Spit On Perfection

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    Except that's thoroughly untrue, we've already developed mRNA vaccines for animals, but we also cannot make conclusions based on negative aspects from animal testing in regards to our responses, that's poor science, yet we continue to act like animal testing is the golden standard, when it's really more us just using figurative guinea pigs so that we don't cull our own population by hasty testing on human subjects

    The demand is based on not overwhelming the hospital system, you seem to think it works the same as the UK, it doesn't, and I don't think you should speak as if you have even an iota of understanding when your healthcare context is decidedly different, yet still would be subject to that potential if we didn't get as many vaccinated as possible that have no legitimate medical exemptions because it is for the betterment of society. There is not an absolute right to be a willful contrarian in a civil society, some basic conformity in terms of requirements is expected unless you just selectively apply what rules you think apply arbitrarily

    You realize people are not necessarily using those fallacies as much as you keep accusing them of doing so, right? Cherry picking is a fallacy too and fixating on what you can use to discredit an argument against you is not rational, it's confirmation bias of the highest order to reconcile cognitive dissonance that would otherwise come up. The argument made is not solely based on what you think it is, you have to demonstrate and have a dialogue to show that the argument is solely based on that and not a line of argumentation that isn't utilizing fallacious reasoning.

    This is not "caution", don't dishonestly frame this like the technology is experimental, because it definitively is not, we've had studies on mRNA technology since the 90s, this is not something new except in the execution with regards to human immune systems. This is resistance and needless at that, it's hypervigilance and bordering on paranoia, none of which is rational when you grasp at straws and vague concerns about long term problems instead of recognizing that the current pandemic IS a problem and an immediate one that isn't going away because you selectively observe data to act like we're not in an epidemic surge.

    But we're not acting as if the vaccines will just end this, but will aid in reducing hospitalizations and other negative outcomes that make the fearmongering you do for the vaccine seem like child's play, or at the very least equitable in nature. This is a novel coronavirus, the possibility that this new strain may die out is trickier to determine, but the "caution" is what made this happen in no small part, because we just kept letting it mutate needlessly because "This isn't so bad, it's just like the flu" and other misinformation that was spread over the last year

    But this is a risk/benefit analysis that you seem to want to act like you have the only valid assessment and tolerance is not an absolute, so maybe don't strawman how an opposing position thinks because you want to frame yourself as more rational, which is more dishonesty and fallacious to boot
     
  19. JustSomeBloke

    JustSomeBloke Hello AK47 Supporter

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    It's called 'bodily autonomy'. Just quit telling everyone what to put in their bodies, and we'll all be happy.

    The ultimate in cherry picking is BigTech and the MSM. They exclude anything that doesn't fit the pro-vaxx narrative, and they have a lot of power.

    And it's no use complaining that 'The Science' is on your side, because we're finding out that some of the most reputable and prestigious scientific journals in the world have now effectively relegated themselves to biased-junk status.

    Now the Lancet U-turns over Covid lab leak theory and publishes 'alternative view' calling for a 'transparent debate' on the origins of the virus

    I'm selectively observing data? Really?

    I think you'll find that most vaccine sceptics are far better informed about both sides of the vaccination argument than the average pro-vaxxer. Reason is that most of the material published is pro-vaxx, so vaccine sceptics encounter all of that every single day. Whereas my experience of pro-vaxx people is that they don't seem to have encountered much vaccine sceptic material at all. It certainly explains why they have to be spoonfed so often, and keep demanding evidence that could be found in 30 seconds on duckduckgo. It's like they don't even know that it exists.

    The UK government hasn't done a single risk/benefit analysis on the impact of lockdowns on areas such as the economy, education, jobs etc. And they now want to try and coerce everyone into taking a vaccine that hasn't completed trials. Furthermore, they refused to admit that blood clotting might be a problem, until after other countries started reporting blood clots, and it became impossible to maintain a stance of complete denial. From that point of view, you ought to be able to forgive those who are cautious.

    And a reminder, good scientists are sceptical by nature. They ask questions. They are pragmatic and conservative, and they look for potential problems and possibilities for things to go wrong. The vaccinate everyone approach is the opposite of all of that. The sensible approach would be to vaccinate the most vulnerable, and then wait. And if you've never looked at the money aspects behind all of this, then you've got a lot to learn.
     
  20. muichimotsu

    muichimotsu I Spit On Perfection

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    Except that isn't an absolute in a civil society, you don't get to endanger others with a communicable disease just because you don't want to put this thing in your body that you think is somehow dangerous with cherry picked stats

    Because there's totally no one that has affluence who's also anti vax. SEem to be framing this narrative like you're a victim instead of considering that you might just be wrong instead of some conspiracy against you. Or if you don't like that term, paranoid delusions of persecution.

    No one is absolutely saying that science journals are without flaws, because they exist, especially in that replicability is difficult without a significant amount of funding, which not everyone is able to get.


    Now the Lancet U-turns over Covid lab leak theory and publishes 'alternative view' calling for a 'transparent debate' on the origins of the virus





    The UK government hasn't done a single risk/benefit analysis on the impact of lockdowns on areas such as the economy, education, jobs etc. And they now want to try and coerce everyone into taking a vaccine that hasn't completed trials. Furthermore, they refused to admit that blood clotting might be a problem, until after other countries started reporting blood clots, and it became impossible to maintain a stance of complete denial. From that point of view, you ought to be able to forgive those who are cautious.

    And a reminder, good scientists are sceptical by nature. They ask questions. They are pragmatic and conservative, and they look for potential problems and possibilities for things to go wrong. The vaccinate everyone approach is the opposite of all of that. The sensible approach would be to vaccinate the most vulnerable, and then wait. And if you've never looked at the money aspects behind all of this, then you've got a lot to learn.[/QUOTE]

    "Better informed" doesn't equate to being remotely objective, it just means your knowledge has outstripped wisdom and prudence.

    I don't have a stance of complete denial, that seems to be you far more in the idea that the risks outweigh the benefits when we're reaching even the conservative number of deaths from the 1918 flu pandemic and probably will surpass it easily by the end of this year. The virus is not harmless and it isn't overblown, that is very much in the vein of what you're saying even if you didn't explicitly say it.

    Ah, the Great Barrington Declaration strategy that treats people like they're expendable if they're not in the vulnerable group and just trudge on in spite of rampant death? Yeah, that's totally rational and not bordering on sociopathy masquerading as "science"
     
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