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i want to stop sinning. do you?

Discussion in 'Deeper Fellowship' started by endure, Apr 1, 2003.

  1. admtaylor

    admtaylor Well-Known Member

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    Married
    My assumption from this post is that you don't sin.
     
  2. Luchnia

    Luchnia Member

    262
    +4
    Whether I sin or not is not the topic, the matter is what the Spirit says about the issue. If a man sins, he knows that he is serving sin and satan and is doomed to eternal damnation as the scriptures show, unless he repents and forsakes the sin that he may have eternal life.

    Word up!
     
  3. admtaylor

    admtaylor Well-Known Member

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    So you're speaking of repenting of sin even after accepting Christ. I totally agree with that. Doesn't everyone?
     
  4. nikolai_42

    nikolai_42 Active Member

    535
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    Non-Denom
    Paul said that to will was always present with him, but the doing was the difficult part. What you must do on an ONGOING basis (not every so often) is to die. Die to yourself - take up your cross. The only thing our will is good for is to yield itself to Christ. That's why Christ told us to pray (among other things) that "...Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven...". Christ walked by faith because He only did what He saw His Father doing. We are to walk that way as well. In taking up our cross daily, we are simply submitting all to Him and yielding our bodies to the Lord for HIS use. You were bought with a price, so rest assured that as you cease from your ways and seek His ways, you will find victory. But not victory in yourself - true victory in Christ! Hosea speaks from the Lord with great authority. He makes it clear what we are to do:

    " Sow to yourselves in righteousness, reap in mercy; break up your fallow ground: for it is time to seek the LORD, till he come and rain righteousness upon you.
    Ye have plowed wickedness, ye have reaped iniquity; ye have eaten the fruit of lies: because thou didst trust in thy way, in the multitude of thy mighty men."
    Hosea 10:12,13

    ALL our righteousness is as filthy rags, says Jeremiah. We must forsake OUR ways - however noble or right they may seem - and submit totally to His ways. For:

    " Seek ye the LORD while he may be found, call ye upon him while he is near:
    Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.
    For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
    For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts."
    Isaiah 55:6-9

    We think His ways are simply higher versions of our ways. While that has some truth, the more immediate truth is that His ways ARE NOT our ways. So we must forsake our ways, our efforts and die to ourselves. Even in struggling with sin, it must be yielded up to Him - every last bit - until we are walking in perfect union with the Father.

    "He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it. "
    Matthew 10:39
     
  5. ukok

    ukok Freaked out, insecure, neurotic and Emotional

    +399
    Catholic


    yes

    no

    yes.
     
  6. Luchnia

    Luchnia Member

    262
    +4
    Can you even imagine that someone out of the same mouth would say they sin and serve God at the same time? Now that defines weird logic. Wow...makes you think just how weird some folks are.

    The man that sins is a servant of sin unto damnation and his father is the devil. As the Word states, "He that committeth sin is of the devil..." The children of God are righteous and serve God unto eternal life, thus they are sons and daughters of God. The Spirit of God does not sin, nor is there any form of darkness in God. Why the child of God would even equate the two is beyond me.

    Once again, this really isn't a difficult subject to understand and Jesus did not mingle it at all. I guess folks just don't want to give up sin. If a man wants to commit sin then he knows his eternal fate. People cling to sin like it is life eternal unto them.

    Word up!
     
  7. The Midge

    The Midge Towel Bearer

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    QUOTE=Luchnia
    Can you even imagine that someone out of the same mouth would say they sin and serve God at the same time? Now that defines weird logic. Wow...makes you think just how weird some folks are.

    Yes we are wierd. Better face up to our wierdness. Obviously I don't serve God at the same time as I sin. I don't sin all the time. When I do, I try to get back on track as soon as possible.

    The man that sins is a servant of sin unto damnation and his father is the devil. As the Word states, "He that committeth sin is of the devil..." The children of God are righteous and serve God unto eternal life, thus they are sons and daughters of God. The Spirit of God does not sin, nor is there any form of darkness in God. Why the child of God would even equate the two is beyond me.

    I believe that God will finally remove all the sin from me when he judges me. In the mean time he wants me to fight it the best I can and defeat it as often as I can. The better I do the more of me that survives into eternity. Hopefully I will be recognisable when I get there.

    Once again, this really isn't a difficult subject to understand and Jesus did not mingle it at all. I guess folks just don't want to give up sin. If a man wants to commit sin then he knows his eternal fate. People cling to sin like it is life eternal unto them.

    Yes we cling to sin. Sin has it's attractions. We have to learn that God's way is better. Jesus did not mingle it because he was sinless, the only human to be so since the fall of Adam and Eve.

    Word up!

    We need to ask ourselves why we should not sin: Is it..
    1. Because if we sin we lose our salvation and into the firey pit we go.
    2. We are trying make the grade and earn our salvation.
    3. It's a life style choice that feels good to me.
    4. There is a big payoff for being a goody goody.
    5. It is responding to Gods love as demonstrated in Christ's sacrifice and the way we show our love for Him.
    6. Other.
    I choose 5.

    Word on the level!
     
  8. ukok

    ukok Freaked out, insecure, neurotic and Emotional

    +399
    Catholic


    I find it very bizzarre, not to say illogical, that you would say that a man that sins is a servant of sin unto damnation. None of us are without sin...oh, hang on, your not a heavenly body are you ? - No ?, thought not. If you imagine that you are without sin, then you are mistaken. If you are without sin, then you have no need to repent - is that the case ? No, once again, I thought not. Case dismissed.
     
  9. Luchnia

    Luchnia Member

    262
    +4
    Actually the Word says a man that sins is a servant of sin. Even so, as it is written, the sinner is of the devil:

    Romans 6:16
    Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

    Romans 6:19
    I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.

    1 John 3:8
    He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

    1 John 3:10
    In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

    So then, who are the children of God?

    Word up!
     
  10. ukok

    ukok Freaked out, insecure, neurotic and Emotional

    +399
    Catholic
    i suppose either i interpretted your post incorrectly, or you need to clarify exactly what you are getting at, or both ?

    Are you of the belief that it is possible to live a completely sinless life while we reside on this planet ?
     
  11. endure

    endure Active Member

    656
    +20
    Christian
    midge,
    you said
    Yes we cling to sin. Sin has it's attractions. We have to learn that God's way is better. Jesus did not mingle it because he was sinless, the only human to be so since the fall of Adam and Eve.

    ok, whats taking us so long?

    the point is, the bible does preach sinlessness, and its how we all can live, and should be living, right now. anything else is away from Christ.
    and people may say they know this and dont like being away from Christ, but the truth is, its not weakness or lack of ability or wisdom, its foolishness and disobedience.


    ukok,
    well id like to answer that last question.

    YES WE CAN! ITS THE ONLY THING THOSE VERSES CAN MEAN!
    paul said in romans 6.12 to not let sin reighn in your MORTAL body.

    no you dont have to wait till you die to cease to sin, peter said those that suffer have ceased to sin.
    1 pet 4.1-2
     
  12. fully

    fully New Member

    89
    +2
    It depends on what the sin is. As a Christain , we learn not to sin and given into certain things so its not like even though we are to hate sin and as we get closer to God we hate sin yet are going to do those sins we hate. I don't think your gonna be committing all those sins God hates. If so then you should pray and ask God to set you free.
    I mean God hates all sin, but some sin is just the mistakes we make on a daily basis. And in that since we sin everyday. Yet Other sin that includes sex, drugs, violence, stealing, lieing, and so on. are sins we can choose to not do and eventually overcome them and not do them.
    So honestly I don't think that we will always be commiting sin we hate. Most of the things God hates I don't do. And yes He hates my sin whether big or small, yet the blood of Jesus covers my sin.
    :)
     
  13. ms_lizzie

    ms_lizzie New Member

    43
    +0
    Protestant
    What about the concept of freedom from sin? By freedom I am talking about the ability to live free from the effects of sin (such as guilt) because those have been nailed to the cross and dealt with.

    I read a bunch of Neil Anderson books on this subject. After reading them, I thought that being free from sin was something I desired, but wasn't something I could entirely relate to. That is why I am curious to know how to live a free life when the freedom is "rightfully" mine as an heir in Christ. I am just so confused. :scratch:
     
  14. The Midge

    The Midge Towel Bearer

    +160
    Christian
    Married
    Own pig headed stubboness and the fact that part of us remains in the fallen human condition.

    There is often a difference between what should be and what we are. Like my teachers used to write on my school reports:

     
  15. endure

    endure Active Member

    656
    +20
    Christian
    midge,
    you mentioned us being stubborn.

    well stop being stubborn and humble yourself before the Lord today.

    you mentioned us being yet fallen in certain ways.

    that isnt true. we are new creatures and ALL things are made new, and in romans 6 paul said our old man was dead and gone, hes not even kicking anymore if your living in the spirit.

    i just cant stand any excuse or reply except "yes lord, i am living holy".
    in the end, all God ever has for sin is judgment.

    like a mentor of myne said today, you cant say "well hes more commited that me" no....your either commited, or your not, theres no middle ground.
    if you could do better, you dont really care.

    mis lizzie,
    i believe that most of the body of Christ today needs to gain an understanding on many things so they can partake of them, not only in the area of sin free living.
    yes it does seem strange that we need to this help to attain something is supposed just be ours for the taking, but satan has perverted many of the pulpits of america and around the world and its like God said about isreal. he said they were so far from him that they taught heathen nations how to sin, but do to good they had no knowledge.
    it was supposed to be something that was just a simple way of life, but they had become so astranged and far from God and the truth, when they sought it out and tried to do the truth, they had no idea in the world were to start.
    it shows how brain washed and deceived even the people who are called the body of Christ today are.
    our brains have ran this sin over and over and over for so many generations and years and thought practicly nothing on sin free living, that when we see something that partains to it, it extremely confuses us.
    but praise God for the written word, that can wash and renew our minds and what we know and how we think, no matter how far we have strayed.
    but most people dont know the word very well, i would dare most people dont even study it for 30 mins on a daily consistent basis, when it is supposed to be studied night and day, the biggest thing in our lives.

    thus we have no choice but to be taught and decieved by the voices of this world instead, and when the truth is presented, we truely have no idea what we are looking at and often are afraid of it.
    and i am sad to say, that is many many pulpits, the true, pure, untainted word of God, isnt being preached.
    i have even heard that most theologians or preachers dont even claim to believe that the bible is even the infallible word of God anymore, its not even literal to them. they just take what they can stomach and forget the rest.
    thats one way to produce little baby christians, who may love the lord, but are eternally crippled and lame, becuase they have no understanding the truth and have no way to combat the battles their preachers are ignoring.

    like it says in hebrews.
    "let us go on unto perfection, not laying agian the foundation of repentance from dead works and faith in God"
    most people never do go on into the holy perfection and completeness God has for them, and they are continually turning over and over wallowing in sin and repentance from it and constantly trusting in faith and grace to save them from the very present sin in their lives.

    fully,
    are you sure its covered?
    its actually not, untill youve asked forgiveness and repented of it, meaning to you stop living that way.
    jesus said in john 8 that whosoever commits a sin, is fully the servant of sin. and that servant would not abide in the house of the lord forever.

    if you died in the act of that sin, you would not enter into the kingdom of heavon.

    this doesnt show any kind of hopeless of salvation, it only shows the greater need to spend hours alone with the Spirit of God and memorise the scriptures and live seperated from all ungodliness, and walk cautiously pondering every step, and depend on the awesome holyspirit to endue you with power from on high, to cause you to never do any of those things again.
    it is amasing, we say God is greater than all things, but we dont think hes greater and little bad habit.

    i dont care if you have to go be a monk on the backside of the desert and never speak to another humanbeing again and make a vow of silence and never do anything but pray and read the bible till you die, to keep from commiting sins, you gotta do what you gotta do.
    but thanks be to God, that isnt the only way.

    but there is only one way to serve the Lord, and that is without sin.

    1 pet 4.1
    ...those that suffer, have ceased to sin...
     
  16. Luchnia

    Luchnia Member

    262
    +4
    The Midge, what part of us remains in the fallen nature? Could you explain that, and if so, what do you use to support this opinion?

    Thanks,
    Word up!
     
  17. The Midge

    The Midge Towel Bearer

    +160
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    Dear Endure,
    You are so funny sometimes. ^_^ I make a comment that can be addressed to the entire church and you take it to mean that I'm alking about only myself. We have swapped verses about Paul battling the sin inside him before.

    Let us think about Peter. He made numerous blunders, not least His denial and faliure to take the gospel to the gentiles. Paul exposed his sin. So was Peter, who was not perfect, could have done better so therefore according to you, has only got God's judgement comming. If that is the case then there is even less hope for the Church that Peter helped to found :(.

    I'm committed. I also take sin very seriously. I'm also willing to look at my own condition on the light of the Holy Spirit.

    Yes, we are new creatures. We are a pupating caterpillar, transforming in to a butterfly. At the end times we will hatch into the fully transformed person that we will become. The Holy Sprirt will continue it's transforming work in me until the end times when it is complete and I am finally transformed into the likeness of Jesus Christ. If the Spirit is not showing up sin in you then the light may be shining. BTW that takes a certain does of humility; may the Lord give me more. There is an Eschtalogical sense to a lot of the scriptures that you refer to. The transformation will continue for the rest of my earthly life.

    Please tell me, if not perfection, when does a person cease to be holy: After one lie? After two omissions? After three lewd thoughts? Is that a hour, a day or a week?
     
  18. The Midge

    The Midge Towel Bearer

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    I hope that my last post answers this for you Luchnia.
     
  19. endure

    endure Active Member

    656
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    Christian
    migde,
    you said
    You are so funny sometimes. I make a comment that can be addressed to the entire church and you take it to mean that I'm alking about only myself.

    im surprised that you thought thats what i meant actually...
    but if it does apply to you, then yes it is to you.
    but no, it doesnt apply to everyone and doesnt have to.

    and rest...
    nah, i dont want to hear it.

    john 8.34
    "whosoever commiteth sin, is the servant of sin"

    galations 5.16
    "walk in the Spirit and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh"

    1 peter 4.1-2
    "for he that has suffered in the flesh, has ceased from sin"

    1 john 2.10
    "and there is none occasion of stumbling in him"

    phillipians 3.15
    "let us therefor as many as be perfect, be thus minded"

    james 1.4
    "that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing"

    there is a perfection and sinlessness that we can walk in today.
     
  20. The Midge

    The Midge Towel Bearer

    +160
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    :D
    You still have not defined when one ceases to be Holy.

    I know Christ has and continues to make me holy in Gods sight.

    Just one verse for you:

    Lk 6:42 Either how canst thou say to thy brother, Brother, let me pull out the mote that is in thine eye, when thou thyself beholdest not the beam that is in thine own eye? Thou hypocrite, cast out first the beam out of thine own eye, and then shalt thou see clearly to pull out the mote that is in thy brother's eye.
     
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