I found this comment in a post.

[pinacled]

Yes, that is the plain meaning. But you will need to explore further in order to fully understand what occurred.
Hence " a man sits for 6 days and calls himself king."

I've followed the thread closely, including your post.
Thankyou for sharing your personal work and studies.

In Bamidbar(numbers 28 there are many complexities to navigate. One such subject is instruction of the tenths(tithes).

With this in mind remember what ole sh'aul discussed concerning the priestly order of melkesidek.
And then further on to what he does not mention or discuss concerning the Holy of hollies.
Blessings Always

Moongiant - Moon Phase Calendar

 

[YHWH_will_uplift]

Sigh....brothers and sisters let's start by checking the foundation before building up fancy structures shall we?

We can all agree that the first mention of the Moon is an indirect one found in Genesis 1:14-19. That being said we must ask the question 'what phase was the Moon in at the beginning of its creation?' Scripture tells us that the Moon is one of the two great lights, with the Sun being the greater of the two. What makes the Sun a greater light than the Moon? When we look up at the sky the answer becomes very clear: the Sun's light is brighter than the Moon's light therefore it is greater than the Moon. Another question we must ask to arrive at the correct answer is, 'Which phase of the Moon is it brightest in order to show off it's greatness?' Another look at the sky will reveal that the full Moon is the answer. From here we may conclude brothers and sisters that the Moon was created full...not new (i.e. crescent), not black (i.e. empty), not half...only full of light.

This completely refutes the theory of the months beginning with a new moon (i.e crescent) or whatever wacky unscriptural theories exist with the Moon beginning the months.

As for the words 'month' and 'moon' the very first mention of 'month' is in the story of Noah (Genesis 7:11) while the first mention of 'moon' is from Joseph's dream (Genesis 37:9). The story of Noah proves each month is 30 Days (Genesis 7:11, 25 c.f. 8:1-4): therefore this refutes the idea of the Moon ruling the months. And if month = moon then Joseph would sound silly saying, "[...]the Sun and the Month and the eleven stars bowed down to me[...]". But because this is not the case we see that a quick check of the Hebrew words used for 'month' in the story of Noah is CHoDeSH while the Hebrew word for 'moon' used by Joseph is YeRaCH. Thus the first uses of both words will determine the correct usage for all following cases. In conclusion 'month' does not equal 'moon' in English, Hebrew, or any other language (and this I made clear in post #17).

 

[pinacled]

But where does He say to use it? We know the Torah is the foundation for scripture, so where in the Torah is the instruction to use the Moon to begin the months?

My sis already provided The Torah.
In the future please consider respecting those who freely offer a response.

And something else that is important to remember is the distinction between sons and daughters of Kingdom Torah.

If you are son, or more specifically a firstborn. Do you think there is a differential day of circumcision that sets apart the younger from the elder?

No matter the day a son is born, the 8th days is always apart of the heart.

Meditate on this for a while.

 

[YHWH_will_uplift]

My sis already provided The Torah.
In the future please consider respecting those who freely offer a response.

And something else that is important to remember is the distinction between sons and daughters of Kingdom Torah.

If you are son, or more specifically a firstborn. Do you think there is a differential day of circumcision that sets apart the younger from the elder?

No matter the day a son is born, the 8th days is always apart of the heart.

Meditate on this for a while.

Please read post #42 for the Moon discussion.

As for your comment on circumcision it has nothing to do with the way the luminaries function.

 

[pinacled]

Please read post #42 for the Moon discussion.

As for your comment on circumcision it has nothing to do with the way the luminaries function.

Wrong,
The moons phases represent a circumcicision of the heart that reveals the day star. 14 days of cleansing are for a woman to observe after having given birth to a daughter. In parralel there are two sons, the younger being the son of Sarah. Whom is the heir of a promise.
This could variably be the three tithes spoken of in bamidbar(numbers 28.
The significance to look for is eliyahu visiting a widow and orphan. If they are of the tribe of yhdh. Perhaps then the 4 pourings of water upon the alter would be likened to a witness of water. A tithe of wisdom.

Again I strongly suggest you meditate on the Holy ordinances so that your feet will be guided.

Blessed be the eternal throne.

 

[pinacled]

Shavuot is from June 8th thru the 10th.


The full moon for June is on the 17th a week later.

What are you talking about?

According to the hillel calendar the full moon is ignored. And as far as I am concerned, every full moon represents a circumcision of the heart for sons who visit three times a yr.
Where yecheskel(ezekiel) mentions 25 men, I see weeks counted from an incorrect recognition of Shavuot till a misplaced focus on another holy day.
Movement of Shavuot Shalom to a full moon will lead a person to a day hidden.

A place where latter rains are found.
A fold in time likened to tradition of a portion of bread hidden....?

I come from a school of thought that teaches time is fluid..

But what do I know.

 

[visionary]

But where does He say to use it? We know the Torah is the foundation for scripture, so where in the Torah is the instruction to use the Moon to begin the months?

New moon and the start of the months...

 

[YHWH_will_uplift]

New moon and the start of the months...

I read your thread and it seems to ignore something very key which I touch on and flush out in post #42 of this thread: the Moon in Genesis 1:1-2:3 was not created new (i.e. like a crescent) but, it was created fully illuminated. Therefore this puts a roadblock in front of any theories regarding the new moon (crescent shaped) beginning the months. Attached are the calendar files showing the phases of the Moon for seven years. It has a repeatable and observable cycle and, you will see that it never begins the months consistently after the 1st Day of the 1st Month of the 1st, 4th, and 7th Years of the Shemitah respectively. The Full Moon = Gray boxes/numbers the New Moon = Blue-gray boxes/numbers.

 

[visionary]

I read your thread and it seems to ignore something very key which I touch on and flush out in post #42 of this thread: the Moon in Genesis 1:1-2:3 was not created new (i.e. like a crescent) but, it was created fully illuminated. Therefore this puts a roadblock in front of any theories regarding the new moon (crescent shaped) beginning the months. Attached are the calendar files showing the phases of the Moon for seven years. It has a repeatable and observable cycle and, you will see that it never begins the months consistently after the 1st Day of the 1st Month of the 1st, 4th, and 7th Years of the Shemitah respectively. The Full Moon = Gray boxes/numbers the New Moon = Blue-gray boxes/numbers.

And I explained why that "key" is not accurate.

 

[pinacled]

And I explained why that "key" is not accurate.

They will not listen sis. Even if you plainly warn a supposed king as Esther had.

 

[YHWH_will_uplift]

And I explained why that "key" is not accurate.

You replied with a link to your thread which did not prove the Moon starting out as a crescent shaped scimitar at the beginning of its creation. That being said do you have any proof to the contrary of what I presented in post #42?

And I explained why that "key" is not accurate.

You do understand that I am not arguing against the Moon having a certain number of days it completes each month right? I am arguing against the view that the Moon begins all of the months.

 

[pinacled]

You replied with a link to your thread which did not prove the Moon starting out as a crescent shaped scimitar at the beginning of its creation. That being said do you have any proof to the contrary of what I presented in post #42?

You do understand that I am not arguing against the Moon having a certain number of days it completes each month right? I am arguing against the view that the Moon begins all of the months.

The moon "Is" the beginning of months.

To deny such would be a denial of water as a witness alongside the blood and spirit on earth..

With good reason and soil there is Hope.

Tradition holds that there are 4 Shabbat set aside this yr. And this yr is one to behold as a washing memorial given to yhdh by eliyahu to the widow and orphan.

I looked over your responses with care.

In return I ask that you do the same.
With a numerical composition at your disposal. Look closer at the tithe instructed in bamidbar.
This yr is special.
With a number of Shabbat still available, consider each week till pesach. The Asher Shabbat tree will be next. Then manesseh will be revealed..

Whether or not you know the name of a mothers blessing given upon each. With yisrayl all sons are visited with Joy.

Blessings Always

 

[YHWH_will_uplift]

At sister visionary and pinacled

The very first mention of the Moon is in Genesis 1:14-19: please prove where God or Moses says in this passage that it starts as a new moon (i.e. crescent moon) which signals the beginning of each month. You should be able to do this without jumping ahead or citing other sources. I will even aid you in giving you two a head start:

Month 01 (Gen 1:1-19)
01 02 03 04 05 06 07 (Gen 1:1-2:3)
29 30 31 01 02 03 04 (Gen 1:14-19)
05 06 07 08 09 10 11
12 13 14 15 16 17 18
19 20 21 22 23 24 25
26 27 28 29 30 01 02

Legend Key:
Blue-gray = New Moon
Red = End of previous month or Beginning of following month

We see that just beginning with the 1st Day of the 1st Month of the 1st Year of Creation there are two new moons within the same month...therefore this already shows a major weakness in the theory that new moons--or the Moon in any of its phases--begins each month of the year.

 

[pinacled]

At sister visionary and pinacled

The very first mention of the Moon is in Genesis 1:14-19: please prove where God or Moses says in this passage that it starts as a new moon (i.e. crescent moon) which signals the beginning of each month. You should be able to do this without jumping ahead or citing other sources. I will even aid you in giving you two a head start:

Month 01 (Gen 1:1, Ex 12:1-2, Num 28:11)
01 02 03 04 05 06 07 (Gen 1:1-2:3)
29 30 31 01 02 03 04 (Gen 1:14-19)
05 06 07 08 09 10 11
12 13 14 15 16 17 18
19 20 21 22 23 24 25
26 27 28 29 30 01 02

Legend Key:
Blue-gray = New Moon
Red = End of previous month or Beginning of following month

We see that just beginning with the 1st Day of the 1st Month of the 1st Year of Creation there are two new moons within the same month...therefore this already shows a major weakness in the theory that new moons--or the Moon in any of its phases--begins the each month of the year.

Listen closely to the blessings given to all the tribes by their mothers. From there seek the still and small voice of blessing given by two tribes(tithes) before pesach.

From pesach on consider how manesseh is neither blessed by his hidden mother nor his grandfather.

A key of yosef hidden in purity.

All provisions are in order.

 

[pinacled]

And I explained why that "key" is not accurate.

Double iron is as rare as tempered feet.

 

[YHWH_will_uplift]

Listen closely to the blessings given to all the tribes by their mothers. From there seek the still and small voice of blessing given by two tribes(tithes) before pesach.

From pesach on consider how manesseh is neither blessed by his hidden mother nor his grandfather.

A key of yosef hidden in purity.

All provisions are in order.

Double iron is as rare as tempered feet.

Post #53. Respond to that. Otherwise you're being intellectually dishonest.

 

[Lulav]

Uhhh....I never heard of that but, I wouldn't be so quick to say that the Sadducees or the Pharisees did that. Let's remember what Christ said about them:

The "first-fruits of the harvest" were offered on the 16th day of Nisan, from that fruit which ripened first in Palestine—barley (but see Men. 84a)—and with considerable ceremony, in order to emphasize dissent from the Sadducean interpretation of the Scripture text, "the morrow after the Sabbath" (Lev. xxiii. 11), which is, according to the Sadducees, always Sunday (Men. 65b).

 

[Lulav]

Since I saw this in a post, have no clue as to how they figured that out, and wanted yo' all help in understanding the "Zadok Priestly Calendar" which is the basis of this calculation. I realize that there are other calculations out there. But it was this particular "Zadok Priestly Calendar" which I never heard of before. Maybe I should have named this thread. ... Zadok Priestly Calendar

The Zadok Priestly Calendar is based on those who left Jerusalem because what was in charge there was put into place by Rome. 'Zadok' as you know comes from Tzadik, meaning 'righteous' or the rightful priests. Those in Jerusalem, including the High Priest were not, they were not from Aaron's line. I wouldn't be surprised if they were like the 'King' put in place, Herod who was not of David's line either. He was an Edomite, and like his forefather, Esau who tried to kill Jacob, he tried to kill the true King, Yeshua.

This might help explain the difference in the gospel accounts of the Passover that year. And why Yeshua was holding a seder on what looks like the day before Passover. This of course would be the workings of the Evil one, trying to keep the promised Messiah (Genesis 3:15) from coming to defeat him, basically the last hurrah in trying to stop it.

They are most likely referring to the DSS where I believe the translator was referring to the contention between the rabbi's--on or about the time of Yeshua--with the descendants of Zadok over the calendar and, the rabbi's trying to exert their control over the Temple. But we know that rabbi's have no control over any temple service as they are only 'teachers' in the literal sense of the word: therefore they would have to be descended from one of Aaron's two sons (1 Chronicles 24:1-3ff.):

1) Ithamar
2) Zadok

 

[Lulav]

As for the Feast of First fruits which also determines when Feast of Weeks falls, we know it is always on Sunday because the 50th Day will fall on the morrow (Sunday) after the Sabbath (Saturday). Therefore counting backwards we see that the morrow after the Sabbath--which is also the same day the sheaf offering was waved--is on the 26th Day of the 1st Month which you will see above as Sunday. Counting 50 Days from any of the Sabbaths before the 26th Day of the 1st Month will not qualify as the count begins with the waving of the sheaf offering.

And you said above you weren't aware of this, that is the Sadducean dating. They interpreted the instructions as the day after the Sabbath to mean the weekly Sabbath, but the Pharisees did not, they determined it to be speaking of the first day of unleavened bread which is also called a Sabbath.

 

[Lulav]

"And David said unto Jonathan, 'Behold, tomorrow is the new moon, and I should not fail to sit with the king at meat: but let me go, that I may hide myself in the field unto the third day at even.'[...]And Jonathan said unto David, 'O YHWH God of Israel, when I have sounded my father about tomorrow any time, or the third day,[...]Then Jonathan said to David, 'Tomorrow is the new moon: and thou shalt be missed, because thy seat will be empty. And when thou hast stayed three days, then thou shalt go down quickly, and come to the place where thou didst hide thyself when the business was in hand, and shalt remain by the stone Ezel.'[...]So David hid himself in the field: and when the new moon was come, the king sat him down to eat meat. And the king sat upon his seat, as at other times, even upon a seat by the wall: and Jonathan arose, and Abner sat by Saul's side, and David's place was empty. Nevertheless Saul spake not any thing that day: for he thought, 'Something hath befallen him, he is not clean; surely he is not clean'. And it came to pass on the morrow, which was the second day of the month, that David's place was empty: and Saul said unto Jonathan his son, 'Wherefore cometh not the son of Jesse to meat, neither yesterday, nor today?'
- 1 Samuel 20:5, 12a, 18-19, 24-27

We see above that the understanding between David, Jesse, and king Saul was that there was no need to use the Moon to track the beginning of the months or, the days of the year: this means that they clearly understood that Moses did not instruct anywhere at anytime to use the Moon's phases nor, the barley to track the beginning of the months or the duration of the months: this is only possible if the calendar they used was solar. And in the passages I cited in post #15 show that the ancient Israelites never had to intercalate any seconds, minutes, days, weeks, months, or years--aside from the four seasonal days at the end of the 3rd, 6th, 9th, and 12th Months--to complete the year with exact precision.

I guess I'm not seeing what you are seeing.

David said unto Jonathan, 'Behold, tomorrow is the new moon

Jonathan said to David, 'Tomorrow is the new moon

David hid himself in the field: and when the new moon was come, the king sat him down to eat meat​

You Said:

We see above that the understanding between David, Jesse, and king Saul was that there was no need to use the Moon to track the beginning of the months or, the days of the year:

However, at this time there doesn't seem to be a organization under Saul, David was the one who set it up, meaning the priests who would site the moon and other things in the temple. I think they could say Tomorrow is the New moon by observing the sky and seeing the moon disappear and then knowing that the next day it would begin to appear, even just a sliver.