- Feb 5, 2002
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I think that is the point of the reflection. I don't see one as worse than the other. We all sin & have our struggles. But that's probably my protestantism speaking.I get that, but I was thinking more along these lines...if you see two people of the same sex sharing public displays of affection, and an overweight person pushing a shopping cart loaded with junk food to the cashier, do you have the same reaction? Do we view not being able to successfully carry the cross and bear the temptation in both cases equally? Or is falling into sin worse in some cases than others?
It was a personal reflection that she shared in light of certain events. I get where you re coming from but I don't think it was a comparison but more of a tie in given recent events. Maybe not perfect but you know, I don't expect perfection. The intent was good. It was not a brazenly bigoted reflection as was first implied right down to the word 'tchotchke' being 'xenophobic'.
It's about the intent not how many politically incorrect boo boos you can catch a person in & missing the point completely.
Reminds me of our sue happy society that is just spoiling or a fight.
Oooh, goody. Yet another article comparing the life-destroying issue of same-sex attraction to someone's peccadilloes (in this case, gluttony).
The most useful thing written on the link was the following comment:
"A person with a predisposition to overeat who by whatever strategies and efforts does *not* overeat is not a glutton. But according to the Church, a man with a homosexual orientation who forever chaste in both thought and deed is "damaged goods." He may not become a priest, because he can never be a "father type." He also, according to the Church, may be barred from being a coach, a teacher, or from joining the military based on orientation *alone*. "
And this is exactly why I feel I have no place in the Church.
Yup - if it isnt one sin - it's another.She was saying we are all instrinsically disordered. Not the size of our crosses.
ROTFLOL!Well, you should hear me kvetch about having to schlep around the office looking for something to nosh on.
A gay person may become a priest - if he doesnt have 'deep seated' homosexuality.
IE - it's more of who he is rather than loving God.
If this makes sense.
Difficult to explain... but to put it frankly - deep seated would mean - that's their whole obsession in life.No, it doesn't make sense. What does it mean "deep seated" homosexuality, anyway and how does it differ from being a gay person (which I define as a person with homosexual attractions)?
They're one and the same.
Gay = homosexual attraction = no ministry of Word and Sacrament
Then it makes me wonder, "if not for that, then what is the point if me?"
Difficult to explain... but to put it frankly - deep seated would mean - that's their whole obsession in life.
They do not nor wish to allow grace to change the interior of the heart where it is no longer the pronounced part of who they are - but rather those who overcome this propensity - thru grace - can let it go [so to speak] and not dwell on it like it is their entire purpose to life.
Instead they 'let it go' and really know how to give it to God - and their hearts are able to be transformed into holiness - as occurred with many saints - who lost or never had the desire to 'be' sexual beings - but rather loving of the Lord in all things.
Deep seated - no desire to change or wont change because they cling to desires of the flesh.
SSA - is just an attraction - but it doesnt have to gauge who we are and what our lives could be.
Maybe it is hard to imagine because of bitterness and the graces offered - cannot penetrate because there is anger in the person - and with all sins - pride the grandaddy of all - makes for a shield deflecting it. Humility - contrite humbleness is the 1st step to realizing grace.
But bitterness - has to melt. Instead of pounding on one's own faults - in anger - one must learn to love themselves and their soul - and nourish the soul - the forgotten part of the body that is neither sexual or carnal. It is spiritual.
Focus on the soul - what pleases God - and a lighter heart replaces all the hardness. With that is a bounce in one's step when they let go. And no longer see themselves as anything more than a loved being that God made for a purpose to love and share His eternal heaven with.
We are all after all- made for that purpose - for God to gush His love on for always with Him. To give to us more and more as He finds happiness in His creatures.
For help in that journey - one should read the lives of Saints and how they allowed grace to overcome them and were then able to refuse the world and all the empty promises from satan.
Difficult to explain... but to put it frankly - deep seated would mean - that's their whole obsession in life.
They do not nor wish to allow grace to change the interior of the heart where it is no longer the pronounced part of who they are - but rather those who overcome this propensity - thru grace - can let it go [so to speak] and not dwell on it like it is their entire purpose to life.
Instead they 'let it go' and really know how to give it to God - and their hearts are able to be transformed into holiness - as occurred with many saints - who lost or never had the desire to 'be' sexual beings - but rather loving of the Lord in all things.
Deep seated - no desire to change or wont change because they cling to desires of the flesh.
SSA - is just an attraction - but it doesnt have to gauge who we are and what our lives could be.
Maybe it is hard to imagine because of bitterness and the graces offered - cannot penetrate because there is anger in the person - and with all sins - pride the grandaddy of all - makes for a shield deflecting it. Humility - contrite humbleness is the 1st step to realizing grace.
But bitterness - has to melt. Instead of pounding on one's own faults - in anger - one must learn to love themselves and their soul - and nourish the soul - the forgotten part of the body that is neither sexual or carnal. It is spiritual.
Focus on the soul - what pleases God - and a lighter heart replaces all the hardness. With that is a bounce in one's step when they let go. And no longer see themselves as anything more than a loved being that God made for a purpose to love and share His eternal heaven with.
We are all after all- made for that purpose - for God to gush His love on for always with Him. To give to us more and more as He finds happiness in His creatures.
For help in that journey - one should read the lives of Saints and how they allowed grace to overcome them and were then able to refuse the world and all the empty promises from satan.
Again, NG - you could be a priest - deep seated means those who refuse to see themselves as anything but a man who can act on these impulses injudiciously.
Passages that deal with the issue of the unconsecrated single for life, no choice, as a valid calling and something that God recognizes.You are in my prayers. But remember to pray for others who thru no choices or faults - have crosses. The disabled, the paralyzed for life, the blind, the deaf, the impotent, the sterile... and so many more i am sure i cannot count.
What sort of scriptures would you like? Edifying?
I will say this [i think i said it before] that we do not sin in seeing or knowing - but in enjoying where our minds take us. Delving into a fantasy and enjoying it - or letting ourselves go down the path.Are you sure it also doesn't include the attraction that no measures, except God's sovereign action alone, can mitigate?
Passages that deal with the issue of the unconsecrated single for life, no choice, as a valid calling and something that God recognizes.
As an aside, I've read the scurrilous opinion by professing Catholics, on CAF and in another comment on FirstThings that a homosexual person living a life of chastity is akin to Cain's offering because a straight giving up marriage is a sacrifice but for the homosexual, it's what's expected. I hope no one here thinks that.
Actually, I found what I needed, I think...
1 Cor. 7:7-8
I wish that all were as I myself am. But each has his own gift from God, one of one kind and one of another. To the unmarried and the widows I say that it is good for them to remain single as I am.
1 Cor 7:32-35
I want you to be free from anxieties. The unmarried man is anxious about the things of the Lord, how to please the Lord. But the married man is anxious about worldly things, how to please his wife, and his interests are divided. And the unmarried or betrothed woman is anxious about the things of the Lord, how to be holy in body and spirit. But the married woman is anxious about worldly things, how to please her husband. I say this for your own benefit, not to lay any restraint upon you, but to promote good order and to secure your undivided devotion to the Lord.
Actually, I found what I needed, I think...
1 Cor. 7:7-8
I wish that all were as I myself am. But each has his own gift from God, one of one kind and one of another. To the unmarried and the widows I say that it is good for them to remain single as I am.
1 Cor 7:32-35
I want you to be free from anxieties. The unmarried man is anxious about the things of the Lord, how to please the Lord. But the married man is anxious about worldly things, how to please his wife, and his interests are divided. And the unmarried or betrothed woman is anxious about the things of the Lord, how to be holy in body and spirit. But the married woman is anxious about worldly things, how to please her husband. I say this for your own benefit, not to lay any restraint upon you, but to promote good order and to secure your undivided devotion to the Lord.