jisaiah6113

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I have a simple question about laughter and humor in New Testament Christianity. I think it's an important subject, particularly for me because I'm writing a book for those who have mental illness and are Christians, and how such people can use Christian Faith to make their lives more enjoyable. A few things that are universally acknowledged to be good for human beings are laughter, camaraderie, smiling, and humor. However, the NT has this to say about joking:

Ephesians 5:3-4 New King James Version (NKJV)
But fornication and all uncleanness or covetousness, let it not even be named among you, as is fitting for saints; neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks.

Ephesians 4:29 New International Version (NIV)
Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.

We see here, as in the entire New Testament, that any sort of sexual immorality, defined as sex (with either gender) outside the heterosexual marriage covenant is a sin. We see the barometer for sexual behavior set by the statement that even a "hint" of sexual immorality should not exist among us, and 1 Thess 4:3-8 paints a vivid contrast between us and the "Gentiles" who do not know God and give their bodies up to lasciviousness. A case can be strongly made that "possessing your vessel in sanctification and honor" and not having a "hint" of sexual immorality would also forbid masturbation or any impure thoughts or touching of a significant other that is not a husband or wife.

We also see that coarse jesting, foolish talk, or generally any idle chatter or banter used to generate vain humor is forbidden, because it does not fall under the category of thanksgiving, edification, and building up the Body of Christ.

Jesus has this to say about the importance of our words: "by your words you will be justified, and by your words, you will be condemned." (Matt 12:37)

Recently, to lighten the emotional load in my life, lived with a mental disorder and the need to support myself by paying my own rent in my own apartment, living alone, and trying to live out the command of Jesus to avoid sexual immorality, I obtained a book of Jewish jokes to relieve some psychological pressure. I love to laugh. I figure, if I'm not allowed to have sex, at least I can laugh, right? Apparently, not according to the New Testament. Especially if that humor does not fall under the category of edifying the other person, and can be perceived as "unwholesome talk". Well, what is unwholesome talk? Pretty much any joke ever invented.

It seems to me that any joke worth its salt is at least slightly inappropriate. What would provoke laughter if the joke was not at least a bit insulting to something else or self-depreciating?

How do we reconcile the fact that humor is often foundational for human life and relationships, and that we see people immediately after church ends smiling, laughing, and joking, and yet the New Testament is a rather somber collection of documents that speaks of "trials by fire" and "persevering under trials" (as in 1 Peter and Hebrews) and yet so little speaks about enjoying life? Where do you get humor in your life, and how do you justify it in Christianity? I've heard that the New Testament is such a somber collection because it was written by people who were outcasts in the world and largely being persecuted. The author to the Hebrews states, commending the believers, that they accepted abuse (persecution) from nonbelievers and joyfully accepted the plundering of their possessions, because they knew they had a much more enduring reward in heaven. Christianity as a whole seems very much focused on the next life, and the discarding of this life as far as any personal enjoyment goes. Maybe because I'm not skilled in Scriptural interpretation, I'm reading this wrong. But does anyone else get this tone from reading the New Testament? I read a quote online, which was attributed to CS Lewis, which said, "One thing we never read in the New Testament: "Jesus laughed."

Input from Christians would be much appreciated.
 
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Chris V++

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Have you ever seen 'The Name of the Rose' with Sean Connery and Christian Slater. The premise of the book / movie was that a strict old monk was trying to suppress humor in literature and life believing laughter to be sinful:

from wikipedia 'As the monks prepare Gui's prisoners for execution, William and Adso re-enter the secret library and come face to face with the Venerable Jorge, the oldest denizen of the abbey. Having decoded the lines on the translator's parchment, William demands that Jorge turn over the book that the dead men had been reading: Aristotle's Second Book of Poetics on Comedy. Believing laughter to be sinful, Jorge killed those who had read the book by poisoning its pages, but William does not fall for this trap when Jorge "rewards" him with...'

I might be wrong but I think Jesus was funny. Some of the metaphors e.g. remove the beam in your eye so you can see clearly to remove the speck in your brother's eye, or the image of a camel passing thru the eye of a needle were probably funny in that culture. (The eye of a needle was a narrow passage thru a wall and not a sewing needle.) I think he was poking good- natured fun at Matthew's expense in a passage about tax collectors but I can't find the verse right now.
 
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Kenny'sID

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I've seen that scripture about joking as well, and am not sure what to think. I'd also be interested in the point of view of others.

I will say, I sometimes wish we could just skip over some verses, like some tend to do, but they are there and need addressing.
 
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StephenDiscipleofYHWH

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I have a simple question about laughter and humor in New Testament Christianity. I think it's an important subject, particularly for me because I'm writing a book for those who have mental illness and are Christians, and how such people can use Christian Faith to make their lives more enjoyable. A few things that are universally acknowledged to be good for human beings are laughter, camaraderie, smiling, and humor. However, the NT has this to say about joking:

Ephesians 5:3-4 New King James Version (NKJV)
But fornication and all uncleanness or covetousness, let it not even be named among you, as is fitting for saints; neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks.

Ephesians 4:29 New International Version (NIV)
Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.

We see here, as in the entire New Testament, that any sort of sexual immorality, defined as sex (with either gender) outside the heterosexual marriage covenant is a sin. We see the barometer for sexual behavior set by the statement that even a "hint" of sexual immorality should not exist among us, and 1 Thess 4:3-8 paints a vivid contrast between us and the "Gentiles" who do not know God and give their bodies up to lasciviousness. A case can be strongly made that "possessing your vessel in sanctification and honor" and not having a "hint" of sexual immorality would also forbid masturbation or any impure thoughts or touching of a significant other that is not a husband or wife.

We also see that coarse jesting, foolish talk, or generally any idle chatter or banter used to generate vain humor is forbidden, because it does not fall under the category of thanksgiving, edification, and building up the Body of Christ.

Jesus has this to say about the importance of our words: "by your words you will be justified, and by your words, you will be condemned." (Matt 12:37)

Recently, to lighten the emotional load in my life, lived with a mental disorder and the need to support myself by paying my own rent in my own apartment, living alone, and trying to live out the command of Jesus to avoid sexual immorality, I obtained a book of Jewish jokes to relieve some psychological pressure. I love to laugh. I figure, if I'm not allowed to have sex, at least I can laugh, right? Apparently, not according to the New Testament. Especially if that humor does not fall under the category of edifying the other person, and can be perceived as "unwholesome talk". Well, what is unwholesome talk? Pretty much any joke ever invented.

It seems to me that any joke worth its salt is at least slightly inappropriate. What would provoke laughter if the joke was not at least a bit insulting to something else or self-depreciating?

How do we reconcile the fact that humor is often foundational for human life and relationships, and that we see people immediately after church ends smiling, laughing, and joking, and yet the New Testament is a rather somber collection of documents that speaks of "trials by fire" and "persevering under trials" (as in 1 Peter and Hebrews) and yet so little speaks about enjoying life? Where do you get humor in your life, and how do you justify it in Christianity? I've heard that the New Testament is such a somber collection because it was written by people who were outcasts in the world and largely being persecuted. The author to the Hebrews states, commending the believers, that they accepted abuse (persecution) from nonbelievers and joyfully accepted the plundering of their possessions, because they knew they had a much more enduring reward in heaven. Christianity as a whole seems very much focused on the next life, and the discarding of this life as far as any personal enjoyment goes. Maybe because I'm not skilled in Scriptural interpretation, I'm reading this wrong. But does anyone else get this tone from reading the New Testament? I read a quote online, which was attributed to CS Lewis, which said, "One thing we never read in the New Testament: "Jesus laughed."

Input from Christians would be much appreciated.
As Christians we are to do all things to edification and Glory to the Lord(1 Cor 14:26; 1 Cor 10:31-11:1) doing all things in the name of the Lord(Colossians 3:17, 23-24). But we are also always happy(Philippians 4:4; 1 Thess 5:16; Romans 12:12; 2 Cor 6:10) rejoicing because our names are written in heaven(Luke 10:20; 1 peter 1:8-9) and just as the angles rejoice over a sinner coming to repentance(Luke 15:7-10) so should we, rejoicing in both preaching and in discussion about the Lord with our brethren(Romans 15:9-13,32; 3 John 1:4).

Speaking personally I can attest that though I believe and do not now jest, I can say that I laugh just as much if not more but not from sinful jokes but from Joy that one feels when he is in the company of his brethren in Christ and from the Joy of preaching. Our lives as Christians are not supposed to be Joyless, far from it we are to be filled with the Joy that Christ brings always.

I hope this helps brother.
 
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Doug Melven

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I love to laugh. I figure, if I'm not allowed to have sex, at least I can laugh, right? Apparently, not according to the New Testament.
That would be a complete misunderstanding of the NT and God. The verse you quoted says "coarse jesting".
Proverbs says "A merry heart does good like medicine". And God Himself has a sense of humor.
Just look at what He keeps doing to the devil. He is always turning the tables on him.
Do you know why the devil goes about like a roaring lion?
Because Jesus knocked all of his teeth out when He gave him a PHD (Permanent Head Damage)
There is an entire forum here that has clean jokes.
Clean/Christian Jokes

What would provoke laughter if the joke was not at least a bit insulting to something else or self-depreciating?
Making jokes at the devil's expense is good.
 
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Hank77

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St_Worm2

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Humor and the Christian Life
"Christian" humor doesn't violate the commands and admonishments we find in the Bible (especially if it's couched as "satire" ;)). For instance:


Or humorous videos that follow up on Lutheran Satire videos like this one does:

Then there's the Babylon Bee:

 
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jisaiah6113

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I've seen that scripture about joking as well, and am not sure what to think. I'd also be interested in the point of view of others.

I will say, I sometimes wish we could just skip over some verses, like some tend to do, but they are there and need addressing.

Thank you for your response. I'm glad to see someone wrestling with Scripture.

I read John Gill's commentary and it didn't shed much light on the issue. Surprisingly, I found a few of the jokes on the Christian joke thread quite cute and mildly funny. Not belly busting laughs like you would get from Jewish jokes, but cute jokes that might bring a smile. Humor you would expect from a Christian. Still, it seems to me that any attempt at humor we make is based on our human makeup and our need for humor, which can be directly explained without reference to religion or the Bible. I still fail to see any evidence from scripture that God wants us to laugh and enjoy foolish joking, even if it is not perverse or obscene. Also, as far as Jesus using hyperbole, He's basically "throwing shade" so it's not really meant as humor, but rather, as a convicting insult and/or rebuke it appears to me. When we are done worshiping in a Protestant church and the pastor gets on stage and says, "Turn around and shake hands with someone next to you" or "greet your neighbor" or something to that effect, what do you see? People smiling, laughing, showing affection, joking, etc. That's how humans interact. That's what we thrive on is "good vibes". Yet I don't see much evidence from the New Testament that this is how we are supposed to act. "Greet one another with a holy kiss"...maybe. "Love one another with brotherly affection." Hospitality is commanded by the New Testament repeatedly, and even to strangers. Jesus, when asked who the "neighbor" is in the "love your neighbor as yourself" commandment, refers to a person who was seen as an alien to the promises of Israel. So I guess hospitality and kindness are built into the Scripture. Maybe I just missed it. But this thread is about humor specifically. What are we to make of joking that is not specifically immoral but does not serve a godly purpose and does not build up a brother or sister? Maybe a joke about circumcision (if you're Jewish) or a joke about attraction, or marriage. Stuff that is just humor and the stuff of life, but wouldn't be appropriate for Christians to joke about.
 
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Hank77

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Thank you for your response. I'm glad to see someone wrestling with Scripture.

I read John Gill's commentary and it didn't shed much light on the issue. Surprisingly, I found a few of the jokes on the Christian joke thread quite cute and mildly funny. Not belly busting laughs like you would get from Jewish jokes, but cute jokes that might bring a smile. Humor you would expect from a Christian. Still, it seems to me that any attempt at humor we make is based on our human makeup and our need for humor, which can be directly explained without reference to religion or the Bible. I still fail to see any evidence from scripture that God wants us to laugh and enjoy foolish joking, even if it is not perverse or obscene. Also, as far as Jesus using hyperbole, He's basically "throwing shade" so it's not really meant as humor, but rather, as a convicting insult and/or rebuke it appears to me.
Did you try any other commentaries, maybe you'll find one to agree with what you already believe.
 
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jisaiah6113

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What do I "already believe", Hank? I'm asking a question. If I "already believed" something, I wouldn't ask a question or seek responses or clarity. If I saw a commentary that just agreed with what I said, it wouldn't provide anything except for a self-confirmation in my own delusion. Confirmation bias.
 
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"neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor coarse jesting"

Proverbs 15
13 A merry heart maketh a cheerful countenance: but by sorrow of the heart the spirit is broken.
15 All the days of the afflicted are evil: but he that is of a merry heart hath a continual feast.

Proverbs 17
22 A merry heart doeth good like a medicine: but a broken spirit drieth the bones.

Ephesians 4
32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

Clean humor has helped me deal with oppressive situations.
 
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Kenny'sID

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Still, it seems to me that any attempt at humor we make is based on our human makeup and our need for humor, which can be directly explained without reference to religion or the Bible. I still fail to see any evidence from scripture that God wants us to laugh and enjoy foolish joking, even if it is not perverse or obscene.

It appears those are the basics, and something that virtually no one sticks to, but something very serious just the same. A real eye opener when one thinks in terms of what the NT almost certainly is saying "You can't be that way and get to heaven too, end of story". Then the next natural step is to find holes in it, but I don't see any, or that there is any real misunderstanding there.

So, now what?
 
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Kenny'sID

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neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor coarse jesting,

Taking this one step at a time, I would think the only thing that is actually in question there would be "foolish talking", and the other two? It's a given we don't do those. So, what exactly do they mean by foolish talking?


Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.

And there is nothing there really in question, not necessarily anyway.

So maybe it's a matter of checking the actual wording out in the Strong's Concordance, and try to narrow down exactly what they mean, and then go from there.
 
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SkyWriting

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I have a simple question about laughter and humor in New Testament Christianity. I think it's an important subject, particularly for me because I'm writing a book for those who have mental illness and are Christians, and how such people can use Christian Faith to make their lives more enjoyable. A few things that are universally acknowledged to be good for human beings are laughter, camaraderie, smiling, and humor.

"I think that God, in creating man, somewhat overestimated his ability."

"The world is a stage, but the play is badly cast."

"Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them so much."

"It is absurd to divide people into good and bad. People are either charming or tedious."

"The only thing to do with good advice is pass it on. It is never any use to oneself."

"What is a cynic? A man who knows the price of everything and the value of nothing."

"A little sincerity is a dangerous thing, and a great deal of it is absolutely fatal."

"When I was young I thought that money was the most important thing in life; now that I am old I know that it is."

"There are only two tragedies in life: one is not getting what one wants, and the other is getting it."

"Work is the curse of the drinking classes."

"Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination."

"True friends stab you in the front."

"All women become like their mothers. That is their tragedy. No man does. That's his."

"Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months."

"There is only one thing in life worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about."

"Morality is simply the attitude we adopt towards people whom we personally dislike."

"How can a woman be expected to be happy with a man who insists on treating her as if she were a perfectly normal human being?"

"A gentleman is one who never hurts anyone’s feelings unintentionally."

"My own business always bores me to death; I prefer other people’s."

"The old believe everything, the middle-aged suspect everything, the young know everything."

"I like men who have a future and women who have a past."
 
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