How/Why did the Catholic Church move from burning heretics to pachamama and social justice?

Victor in Christ

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read this book, its online also. The RCC desired power, status, wealth around the 4th century, Satan crept in through man, they started to grow like a haughty cedar tree in Lebanan, the simplicity of Salvation through Christ atoning work on the cross went missing. The RCC became a Maze/puzzle to free and full Salvation and works, corruption and power took over.

The History of Protestantism by James A. Wylie (1808-1890)
 
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Inkfingers

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read this book, its online also. The RCC desired power, status, wealth around the 4th century, Satan crept in through man, they started to grow like a haughty cedar tree in Lebanan, the simplicity of Salvation through Christ atoning work on the cross went missing. The RCC became a Maze/puzzle to free and full Salvation and works, corruption and power took over.

The History of Protestantism by James A. Wylie (1808-1890)

Which part of "no anti-Catholicism" was unclear?
 
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Victor in Christ

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Which part of "no anti-Catholicism" was unclear?

The capital C part. A small c is sufficient. Capital this, Capital that, this City is the Capital, that City is the Capital. This man is Great, that man is Great, this Church is Great, that Church is Great.

The only one who is GREAT is our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Psalms 135:5
 
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Albion

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Interesting post, thank you.

So you would not put the change in Roman Catholicism down to, say, infiltration by Maxists and Freemasons (a charge often made concerning Vatican II and, with Bergoglio, increasingly looks less a matter of tinfoil hats and more a quite reasonable accusation)?

No, I don't. The facts, over the period I referred to, don't add up to anything that would support it. There is an argument that could be made about Bergoglio himself, but I think the trend or 'change' that was asked about was already evident.
 
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Redwingfan9

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I think that the question is fairly self-evident...

Does anyone have any answers to this (please, no out-right anti-Catholicism and the like, as I'm looking to see how the change occurred and not just to unleash a load of "POPERY!!!!!!" type comments)?
The Papacy has largely rejected its own historic teachings. Vatican II will probably be viewed by history as the real shift in the Papacy from its historic standing on doctrine to one that more or less rejects historic roman catholicism in favor of worldly political movements and marxism.
 
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fhansen

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I think that the question is fairly self-evident...

Does anyone have any answers to this (please, no out-right anti-Catholicism and the like, as I'm looking to see how the change occurred and not just to unleash a load of "POPERY!!!!!!" type comments)?
Society in the west had achieved a great deal of order, purpose, light, due to the spreading of Christianity, relative to previous ages. Heresy was considered to be a great evil-dangerously destructive to all that had been gained for man. The church handed public heretics over to civil authorities in some cases, who would then perform the execution. This relationship between Church and state was obviously very strong, and considered crucial at the time for the good of all even if it was ultimately learned later that such a connection was unhealthy for other reasons. But the whole immediate world was Christian back then, and growing, while enemies to society and the faith abounded outside its borders.

Now, times change and times change us as our own situation changes. IMO the light of the gospel is largely responsible, behind the scenes, for the great strides in civil rights and social justice matters that have blossomed beginning especially in the west. Knowledge has increased at the same time and, while the Enlightenment wasn't particularly enlightened in many ways, with humanism being a sort of narcissistic and myopic endeavor, it was nonetheless a necessary step involving growing pains for humanity. But when that knowledge is also coupled with humility and the truth and love revealed to man via the gospel, then light increasingly grows in our world even as darkness will always be there to oppose and grow alongside of it.

The point is that substantive change takes time for both individuals and society-it's a process-and real, positive change is only possible with the help of God's revelation and grace. And I believe that the time has become riper in the last couple of centuries for that light to take greater hold-and by no means has the Catholic Church been the only participant in any past alleged abuses; the Protestant Inquisition, for example, was a very widespread and ugly affair and also human rights in general were much less enforced than now (think sweat shops, slavery, the exploitation of labor, women's rights, etc). And at the same time, throughout church history altruism was valued as never before: feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, schools/education, hospitals, orphanages, etc. Either way I believe that we're perceiving more and broader genuine compassion, mercy, and the love of God in general flowing through many Christian Churches nowadays than ever in the past. Much of it has to do simply with better understanding and heeding of our own gospel.
 
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Thomas White

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I think that the question is fairly self-evident...

Does anyone have any answers to this (please, no out-right anti-Catholicism and the like, as I'm looking to see how the change occurred and not just to unleash a load of "POPERY!!!!!!" type comments)?

The Church has evolved overtime. People make mistakes and see the error of their ways or they make mistakes and dig in despite the consequences. The Church changed. Thankfully. The Catholic Church is the largest Christian organization in the world. Thank God it changed and continues to change. People around the world see it and judge all Christians by it.
 
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mindlight

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I think that the question is fairly self-evident...

Does anyone have any answers to this (please, no out-right anti-Catholicism and the like, as I'm looking to see how the change occurred and not just to unleash a load of "POPERY!!!!!!" type comments)?

Interesting question. There were different phases in the churches style. The original church marginalised heretics or wrote long treatises against their heresies in establishing its rule of faith. After Constantine the church did not automatically kill heretics. Nestorius or Arius were both demoted and exiled from the mainstream. The inquisition might be interpreted as a unique and rather insecure phase of church history as it responded to the threat of Protestantism rather a polar extreme to social justice which is also a new development and arguably both are signs of a slippage of actual church power over the organs of government and the need to respond to a worldly agenda. The main tools for dealing with heresy have mainly been sound teaching, marginalisation, exclusion or demotion. The church has always had a compassion for sick or hurting people so in some ways social justice is an expression of that
 
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Swag365

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I think that the question is fairly self-evident...

Does anyone have any answers to this (please, no out-right anti-Catholicism and the like, as I'm looking to see how the change occurred and not just to unleash a load of "POPERY!!!!!!" type comments)?
It is all about entertainment you see. Burning heretics got a little boring, so the Church decided to create hospitals instead.
 
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chilehed

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How/Why did the Catholic Church move from burning heretics to pachamama and social justice?
False premises and ambiguous terms:
  • The Church did not burn heretics, that was the Civil Government.
  • Not all of the actions of the Pope constitute an action of the Church in the way you seem to be implying; in fact most do not.
  • "Social justice" is an ambiguous term that covers many different policies, some of which are in alignment with Church teaching and some of which are not.
 
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Swag365

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False premises and ambiguous terms:
  • The Church did not burn heretics, that was the Civil Government.
  • Not all of the actions of the Pope constitute an action of the Church in the way you seem to be implying; in fact most do not.
  • "Social justice" is an ambiguous term that covers many different policies, some of which are in alignment with Church teaching and some of which are not.
Wait a second. The original post was serious?
 
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Danigt22

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I think that the question is fairly self-evident...

Does anyone have any answers to this (please, no out-right anti-Catholicism and the like, as I'm looking to see how the change occurred and not just to unleash a load of "POPERY!!!!!!" type comments)?

This is the most based post I ever read in this forum.
 
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Christy Owens

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What you are talking about are two extreme and opposite reactions by popes to the mandate to go and evangelize the whole world.

On the one hand, we have a pope who recognizes that command from God, and calls to everyone to come and join the Church just as they are, with no guidance and no exclusions.

On the other hand, you have a pope who, abhorring the sin found within the Church, follows the example of Jesus when He cleared the moneychangers out of the Temple, and purified it.
 
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Thomas White

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Asking why people stop "burning heretics" sounds based to me.
I dont mean to sound edgy or shabby.

Ah. That's a title the Church threw around pretty often during the dark periods of our past. I believe he used that term to show the juxtaposition between then and now.
 
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BobRyan

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Interesting post, thank you.

So you would not put the change in Roman Catholicism down to, say, infiltration by Maxists and Freemasons (a charge often made concerning Vatican II and, with Bergoglio, increasingly looks less a matter of tinfoil hats and more a quite reasonable accusation)?

Same goal - but different context in nations where RCC dominance in government no longer exists. The context of the modern world that Catholic approach would necessarily have to be much more nuanced. That is the easy part.
 
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BobRyan

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Asking why people stop "burning heretics" sounds based to me.
I dont mean to sound edgy or shabby.

history is funny that way. It does not change simply because this or that person does not like it.

Pope Benedict had a great way of putting it according to the 2005 article below.

Which church is the best?
I'm also encouraged by Pope Benedict XVI, who seems to have inherited John Paul II's humility as well as his loyalty to foundational doctrines. On Jan. 22, 1998, when he was still a cardinal and the grand Inquisitor of the Roman Catholic Church, he declared that their archives (4,500 large volumes) indicate a death toll of 25 million killed by the Catholic Church for being "heretics." And likely two-thirds of the original volumes are lost. That kind of honesty will help relations...

The historic record does show that "burning heretics" is a feature of history that "existed".
 
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Swag365

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history is funny that way. It does not change simply because this or that person does not like it.

Pope Benedict had a great way of putting it according to the 2005 article below.



The historic record does show that "burning heretics" is a feature of history that "existed".
WorldNetDaily - Wikipedia

WorldNetDaily (WND) is an American news and opinion website and online news aggregator which has been described as "fringe" and far right[6] as well as politically conservative.[7] The website is known for promoting falsehoods and conspiracy theories.[15]
 
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Biltong65

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I think that the question is fairly self-evident...

Does anyone have any answers to this (please, no out-right anti-Catholicism and the like, as I'm looking to see how the change occurred and not just to unleash a load of "POPERY!!!!!!" type comments)?

The 1960's, and a Marxist doctrine called "Liberation Theology" permeated the junior ranks of the RCC. It took some time for them to rise up the hierarchy.

Pope John Paul II would have had Francis' head on a platter, in the 1980s.
 
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