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Futurist Only How many people are saved to enter the Kingdom of heaven? ¶ Isaiah 24:6

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by black.hawk, Feb 16, 2018.

  1. black.hawk

    black.hawk Member

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    Now, both Matthew 7:13-14 and Matthew 22:14 says that "Many are called, but few are chosen"; which basically means that more people would go to hell than enter the Kingdom of heaven.

    So, in terms of percentage the actual numbers of people who are lost would exceed those who are saved. Matthew 7:13-14, 22:14

    But, at the same time we are constantly reminded by Revelation 7:9 that there will be a "great multitude of people who cannot be counted" - From every tribe and nation and people and tongue - Who will enter the Kingdom of heaven; but here, we are only referring to actual numbers (as opposed to percentage) which cannot be counted, since the numbers of people who are saved are too numerous to be counted; but in terms of percentage we know that the numbers of people who are lost will exceed those who are saved, according to Matthew 7:13-14 and Matthew 22:14.

    In other words, the numbers of people who are saved (S) will be >0 and <50%; that is, 0 < S < 50%. But the numbers of people lost (L) will be >50% and <100%; that is, 50% < L < 100%.

    But what exactly is a "few"?

    Which is like asking "How long is a piece of string?"

    Well, Isaiah 24:6 provides a more accurate guess than Matthew 7:13-14, 22:14 as regarding the numbers/percentage of people who are saved:-

    So the Lord will send a curse on the earth. Its people will pay for what they’ve done. They will be burned up. Very few of them will be left.

    So, rather than a "few" people who are saved to enter the Kingdom of heaven, we have only "very few" who are saved to enter his kingdom.

    By no stretch of the English language can "Very few people" be any greater than 1%, let alone 5 or 10 percent etc.

    Now, since Modern science tells us that ~108 billion humans have been created since Adam, then one must also infer that <1% of 108 billion can be no more than ~1.1 billion people from all 4 corners of the globe.

    But who knows?

    As it could be more or less than ~1.1 billion people who are still left alive after the Great Judgement. But it is certainly far FEWER than the actual numbers/percentage suggested by the New Testament's account of the Great Judgement and subsequent Destruction of the Old heaven and earth = Matthew 7:13-14 and Matthew 22:14.

    De facto, the Old Testament (Isaiah 24:6) provides a more accurate estimate than the New Testament does (Matthew 7:13-14, 22:14), as regarding the actual numbers or percentage of people who are saved, as opposed to those who are lost.

    Since, it is one thing to say that only "few people" (Matthew 7:13-14, 22:14) are saved to enter the Kingdom of heaven, but it is yet another thing to say that "Very few people" (Isaiah 24:6) are saved to enter his Kingdom.

    Whereas, a "few people" could be any percentage greater than Zero and less than 50%, but "Very few people" cannot be anything greater than 1%, let alone 5 or 10 percent etc.

    That is, the OT (Isaiah 24:6) provides a relatively better estimate than the NT does (Matthew 7:13-14, 22:14) as regarding the actual numbers/percentage of people who are saved to enter the Kingdom of heaven.

    Discuss.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2018
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  2. A_Thinker

    A_Thinker Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The Isaiah passage could be referring ONLY to those who are alive on Earth at the time of the Lord's coming, (about whom we read in other passages) will be fairly united AGAINST the RULE of the Lord.

    The numbers in the kingdom from other eras could be greater ...
     
  3. rockytopva

    rockytopva Love to pray! :) Supporter

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    I would think that if 7 trillion was the final number of the human populous at the end of days.... And 5 trillion were judged an eternity in hell...

    The 2 trillion in heaven would be many
    The 5 trillion in hell would be many.
     
  4. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    The world will be devastated by the terrible Day of the Lord's vengeance and wrath; prophesied over 100 times in our Bible. It will be the Day that comes like a thief; unexpectedly and will kill many. Isaiah 66:15-17, Zephaniah 1:14-18 & 2:8, Revelation 6:12-17 & 14:17-20, +

    Romans 1:18-20 Divine Retribution will be seen by all, falling from heaven on all the impiety and wickedness of men and women who deny the truth. 1 Samuel 2:10
    For all that can be known about God lies plain before their eyes. His invisible power and divine nature are knowable to any reasonable mind, so all are without excuse and their conduct is indefensible. Hebrews 11:6

    Romans 1:21-32 These ungodly people know that there must be a Creator, but they refuse to acknowledge or give thanks to Him. So now, their thinking has become futile and their misguided minds are plunged into darkness. They claim to be wise, but they have just made fools of themselves. Psalms 14:1-3
    Therefore God has given them over to all kinds of perversions and idolatries, while actually knowing God’s righteous decree that those who behave like this deserve to die, but they continue in their depravity and approve of the same conduct in others. Job 22:12-13

    Romans 2:5-11 God’s kindness and patience is allowing us time to come to repentance, but if people refuse His gift of salvation, then on the Day of Retribution, all will be justly judged according to their deeds. His wrath awaits those who are governed by selfish ambition, who refuse obedience to the truth and who take evil for their guide. Isaiah 2:12, Isaiah 29:19-21, Isaiah 65:11-12
    To both the Israelites and Gentiles who pursue glory, honour and immortality by living a righteous life, God will reward them with eternal life. Hosea 2:19 God has no favorites.

    2 Thessalonians 1:6-10 It is just that God should pay back those godless peoples and give the righteous relief. This will happen when [the power of] the Lord Jesus is seen in the sky in a blazing fire, punishment will fall upon all who do not obey the gospel and they will suffer the penalty of eternal destruction, separated from His presence. Isaiah 59:18
    On that great Day, Jesus will come and reveal His glory amongst all believers in Him. Only revealed to His believers. Jeremiah 31:2-3, Revelation 14:1

    Hebrews 10:26-27 For those who deliberately persist in sin while knowing the truth, there remains only the terrifying expectation of God’s judgement, of a fierce fire that will consume His enemies. Habakkuk 3:12, Malachi 4:1

    2 Peter 3:7 & 10 On that Day, the Lord will come as a thief, the sky will disappear with a great roar and the earth will be devastated by fire. Zephaniah 3:8, Isaiah 34:2-4, Isaiah 66:15-17, Revelation 6:14, Jeremiah 30:23-24

    None of these Bible quotes fit with or refer to the Return of Jesus in His glory, seen by all mankind, at the commencement of His Millennium reign. Revelation 19:11
    It is an event before that, where the Lord makes ‘fire fall from heaven’, His great Day of Retribution against His enemies’. It is the Lord’s Day of vengeance and wrath, the next prophesied event that we can expect. It is a terrible punishment by fire, that will punish the ungodly, a massive explosion of the suns surface, which will firstly devastate the Middle East, but also dramatically affect the whole world. Psalms 83, Micah 4:1
     
  5. Kenny'sID

    Kenny'sID Well-Known Member Supporter

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    FWIW, I've always had a sense it would be 2 to 5% saved, and I can't give any particular reasoning for that, but I'm sure there is subconscious reasoning taking several factors into consideration.

    Instinctual guess?
     
  6. dreadnought

    dreadnought Lip service isn't really service. Supporter

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    What is a futurist?
     
  7. Kenny'sID

    Kenny'sID Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Good question.

    I now see that is a requirement to post, plus I'd like to know if I'm something that I didn't know I was.
     
  8. dreadnought

    dreadnought Lip service isn't really service. Supporter

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    I get called names sometimes. I have to look them up to see what they mean.
     
  9. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    I think there will be a lot more survivors than that. because there will be enough to form a One World Govt and there will be a vast multitude of faithful Christians protected and saved.
    People will have time to scramble for cover, as they see the approaching CME mass. Isaiah 2:19, Revelation 6:15-17
    Here are some prophesies about the results of the Lord's Day of wrath by fire, earthquakes, storms and tsunamis:
    Deuteronomy 32:41 When I set my hand to judgement, My sword will devour flesh.

    Isaiah 66:16 The Lord will judge with fire and many will be slain by Him.

    Psalms 37:9-10 & 20 For evildoers will be no more, their place will be empty. Evil people will die, they will be incinerated and will go up in smoke.

    Malachi 4:1 The Day comes, burning like a furnace...on the Day the Lord takes action, all wicked peoples will be as ashes under your feet.

    Zephaniah 1:3 & 11 I shall destroy humans and animals. Dire distress will come upon all the godless peoples, their blood and guts will spill over the ground.

    Psalms 97:3-5 For My sword is ready and it descends upon those doomed for death. Fire goes ahead of the Lord and consumes His enemies on every side.

    Isaiah 63:6 The Lord stamped on peoples in His anger, their blood poured out on the ground.

    Isaiah 54:6 ...though the sky be dispersed, the earth be wasted and its inhabitants die like flies.

    Jeremiah 25:33 Those whom the Lord has slain in that Day will lie scattered from one end of the earth to the other.

    Jeremiah 9:22 Corpses will lie like dung in the fields, like swaths behind the reaper.

    Isaiah 34:3 The dead will be flung out and will cover the ground, their bodies will stink.

    Isaiah 13:12 Humans will become scarce, more rare than fine gold.
     
  10. R. Hartono

    R. Hartono Well-Known Member

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    7 Trillions in heaven will be too few
    1 man in hell will be too many
     
  11. rockytopva

    rockytopva Love to pray! :) Supporter

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    Especially if you were that man!
     
  12. black.hawk

    black.hawk Member

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    One world government?

    Can you provide evidence based on Scripture to support this?

    So, you believe that more than 5% of humankind would survive the Great Judgement, but how do you reconcile this with Isaiah 13:12, which says that "humans will become scarce, more rare than fine gold" (As any percentage greater than 5% would be far too many to befit the definition of "scarcity")?

    Edit: You have argued that there will be more than 5% since there should be enough to form a One world government, but in Ancient times the Roman empire had far fewer than the 7 billion people who are alive at this moment. But >5% of 108 billion people would be roughly equivalent to >5 billion people who would survive to be ruled by the One world government.

    However, the example of the Roman empire has demonstrated that you don't need to have 100 million people to rule over the Mediterranean world, much less 5 billion people to rule over the entire world.

    So, I think your estimate of >5% is based on specious grounds, since you don't need >5 billion people to rule over the entire world.

    The world can make do with far fewer people, which would suffice for the purpose of One world government.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2018
  13. dysert

    dysert Member

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    It's the belief that most of Revelation is yet to occur at some time in the future. This is in contrast to preterism, which is the belief that most of Revelation occurred in the 1st century. And there's the historical position, which is the belief that most of Revelation has been fulfilled throughout history.
     
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  14. R. Hartono

    R. Hartono Well-Known Member

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    Yes, we need to imagine if this one man in hell is us, it will be too many for sure.
     
  15. Kenny'sID

    Kenny'sID Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I hope I'm wrong but one thing is certain, we shall see.
     
  16. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    Daniel 7:23-24....it will devour [consume, control] the whole earth.....
    Revelation 17:12-13 & 13:1-17 ....all the world will be under his control.

    It will be the leader of the One World Govt who will come to new Israel, who initially won't be a part of the OWG and make a 7 year treaty with them. Daniel 9:27
     
  17. dreadnought

    dreadnought Lip service isn't really service. Supporter

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    What is it called when you believe that the prophesies of Revelation occur in each one of our lives?
     
  18. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    You would be a Spiritualist.
    But to think that prophesies that tell us about specific places and events that are quite possible to literally happen, then all the other theories and ideas are just so much rubbish.
    It has been said, correctly; that if what is prophesied can happen, then it will. And why not? Has God just fed us a load of fiction? No; His Plans for us are amazing, for all who stand strong in our faith!
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2018
  19. dreadnought

    dreadnought Lip service isn't really service. Supporter

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    Let me give you an example of what I am saying, when I suggest the prophesies in Revelation come true in all of our lives, though maybe not ALL of the prophecies:

    I closed out a chapter of my life in the late 1980's - I repented of sins I was committing. Then, about 20 years later, the temptations came back more powerful than ever before.

    And I remembered a prophesy in Revelation, where Satan was to be bound for 1000 years and then set free again. And it seemed symbolic of what I was experiencing when my temptations returned.
     
  20. FIRESTORM314

    FIRESTORM314 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    They cannot be counted

    That's a wonderful figure :)
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2018
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