How do you PRAY in TONGUES?

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Albion

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Neither of those "ideas" "not points" determine that angels do not have voices or languages which in the last few posts was a point of discussion and the matter to which I was responding.

And it doesn't prove that cows on Mars don't give chocolate milk. If you feel comfortable with an argument that says "It does not rule X out, so I'm going to make it a doctrine to believe in" I won't try further to convince you otherwise.

It doesn't do anything for me, however, to have you say that "this is not mentioned in Scripture, to it must be true." In fact, it seems to be very much like the Catholic doctrine of Tradition being an acceptable supplement to the Bible.
 
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CounselorForChrist

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I have never read anywhere in the Bible that we are to specifically "pray in tongues".
Shh... your not supposed to notice that! I respect everyones view but sometimes the more charasmatic christians believe you have to pray in tounges and also that if you cant speak in tounges then you must not be a christian. This is one of the problems I had with my ex-fiance.

She was a great woman. But one day we got talking about prayer and she said "I love it when I pray in tounges!". I thought that was cool even though I was a bit skeptical. Then she asked "Do you pray in tounges?". I told her no and she told me "You must not be fully christian if you have never prayed in tounges! It may explain why you are not healed because you not only do not pray hard enough but you also do not speak in tounges!".

I was like :doh:. It became very hard to have a conversation wtih her because she essentially said in not so many words that she was holier then me.

And it doesn't prove that cows on Mars don't give chocolate milk.
Actually thats been proven true, the internet told me so! :p

It doesn't do anything for me, however, to say that "this is not mentioned in Scripture, to it must be true." In fact, it seems to be very much like the Catholic doctrine of Tradition being an acceptable supplement to the Bible.
But Jesus told us the Bible is our guide. So hes right, if its not mentioned in scripture then it ISN'T true. I don't believe in denominations as much when it comes to going to a church. I more go by "Does this church go by the bible or does it pick what it wants to believe in and dismiss everything else?".
 
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briareos

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And it doesn't prove that cows on Mars don't give chocolate milk. If you feel comfortable with an argument that says "It does not rule X out, so I'm going to make it a doctrine to believe in" I won't try further to convince you otherwise.

It doesn't do anything for me, however, to have you say that "this is not mentioned in Scripture, to it must be true." In fact, it seems to be very much like the Catholic doctrine of Tradition being an acceptable supplement to the Bible.

Actually in the post to which you responded I did establish that they communicate and have voices by citing multiple scripture references. My saying your points do not prove your ideas... is by no means saying that I did not prove mine.
 
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briareos

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I have never read anywhere in the Bible that we are to specifically "pray in tongues".

I would gladly read a specific chapter and verse if someone could provide a reference saying otherwise in the Bible.

It has been quoted many times in this thread already

1 Cor 14.13-15
Therefore, one who speaks in a tongue should pray for the power to interpret. For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays but my mind is unfruitful. What am I to do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will pray with my mind also; I will sing praise with my spirit, but I will sing with my mind also.

Paul establishes that praying in tongues in manner that your own mind does not understand but is spiritual (in the context of speaking in tongues) is possible and true. He did not say you were "supposed to". It was not a command but he cited it happening and even told us what to do when it happened and how to conduct yourself while doing, this is enough to conclude that it happens.
 
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Albion

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I have never read anywhere in the Bible that we are to specifically "pray in tongues".

I would gladly read a specific chapter and verse if someone could provide a reference saying otherwise in the Bible.

Excellent point. Good luck on being given that reference. What you're going to get are a lot of verses that are about prayer and others about tongues, and you will be told that they say we are to pray in tongues.
 
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Jupiter Drops

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briareos

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As for myself I found the information in the link to be an extremely poor evaluation of the topic because the author uses some poor reasoning to assume that Paul indicated tongues without interpretation to an act of vanity in an of itself and that because angels always spoke clearly to us that that they weren't capable of languages that weren't clear to us and that because Paul is capable of "hyperbole" that he must have been using it here and using such an idea to undermine his following statements that speaking in tongues does in fact go without being understood by the speaker or the listeners.
 
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Aijalon

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The gift of toungues is for unbelievers in order that they be able to hear the Gospel. That is its purpose.

Pauls instructions on this matter are very clear, you must have an inerpreter, or in other words, those hearing must be able to understand you. "Tougues" are to be overheard and understood by your audience.

Random babbling is not tongues.

 
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briareos

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Well Paul said in 1 Cor 14 that no man understands the tongues he was talking about but they were to God and not man and that sometimes the person speaking the tongue needs to pray so they can interpret. He said you can pray and praise in tongues and that generally the mind is fruitless.
 
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Aijalon

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No, Paul did not say that sometimes you need to pray about it, he was pretty clear that anyone having the gift of tongues aught to seek both prophecy and interpretation first. The context was orderly church services. So the issue is whether or not tongues are profitable for the church. Generaly, no, they are not profitable, tongues can be praise (privately to God) or for the benefit of unbelievers. Seeking the gift of tongues aught to be for the sake of evangelism outside the church - that is what I get out of it.


18 I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you. 19 Nevertheless, in church I would rather speak five words with my mind in order to instruct others, than ten thousand words in a tongue.
20 Brothers, do not be children in your thinking. Be infants in evil, but in your thinking be mature. 21 In the Law it is written, “By people of strange tongues and by the lips of foreigners will I speak to this people, and even then they will not listen to me, says the Lord.” 22 Thus tongues are a sign not for believers but for unbelievers, while prophecy is a sign[c] not for unbelievers but for believers.
 
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briareos

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On the purpose

1 Cor 14.2
For one who speaks in a tongue speaks not to men but to God; for no one understands him, but he utters mysteries in the Spirit.

One the speaker praying to interpret

1 Cor 14.13
Therefore, one who speaks in a tongue should pray for the power to interpret.

As for prayer in tongues and worship in tongues

1 Cor 14.14
For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays but my mind is unfruitful. What am I to do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will pray with my mind also; I will sing praise with my spirit, but I will sing with my mind also.

It is easy enough to establish that tongues can be prayer, praise, are generally non-intelligible, not always for the sake of other people, not always understood by anyone and not always interpreted by someone else.

It is true that tongues need to be used orderly around other people and it is true that Paul was talking about the order of the church as well.
 
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Again, I'm just going to point out that Apostle Paul was using hyperbole when he said 'tongues of angels.' Please don't get confused.


Bless you all :clap:


By the way, did you EXPERIENCE this VERSE??

Romans 8:26
26 In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us through wordless groans.

When the SPIRIT of GOD pray for you. QUOTE : YOU ARE NOT PRAYING THE HOLY SPIRIT. You don't control your MOUTH the HOLY SPIRIT..

Again, Did you EXPERIENCE this??
 
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The gift of toungues is for unbelievers in order that they be able to hear the Gospel. That is its purpose.

Pauls instructions on this matter are very clear, you must have an inerpreter, or in other words, those hearing must be able to understand you. "Tougues" are to be overheard and understood by your audience.

Random babbling is not tongues.



The VERSE has been qouted many TIMES..
THERE ARE DIFFERENT KINDS OF TONGUES..

1 Corinthians 14:2-5
2 For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to people but to God. Indeed, no one understands them; they utter mysteries by the Spirit.
3 But the one who prophesies speaks to people for their strengthening, encouraging and comfort.
4 Anyone who speaks in a tongue edifies themselves, but the one who prophesies edifies the church.
5 I would like every one of you to speak in tongues, but I would rather have you prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be edified.

in THIS VERSE. CHURCH is the ONE BEING EDIFIED if SOMEONE INTERPRETS. If this is for PEOPLE then it MUST BE:
EDIFYING the UNBELIEVERS... and this is QOUTED MANY TIMES:

but if not interpreted YOU WILL JUST EDIFY YOURSELF

HOPE YOU GET IT>.

this verse of tongue. DOES NOT SPEAK TO PEOPLE..
 
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CounselorForChrist

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I was told tounges is often taken the wrong way. He people believe angels speak in it or some other holy langauge but there isn't any. Tounges simply means if an angel spoke to you for example, it would speak in your language so you could understand it. Not some weird divine language.

I am not sure if that applies to speaking in tounges whie at church for example. Just though I'd bring it up.
 
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Ark100

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The VERSE has been qouted many TIMES..
THERE ARE DIFFERENT KINDS OF TONGUES..

1 Corinthians 14:2-5
2 For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to people but to God. Indeed, no one understands them; they utter mysteries by the Spirit.
3 But the one who prophesies speaks to people for their strengthening, encouraging and comfort.
4 Anyone who speaks in a tongue edifies themselves, but the one who prophesies edifies the church.
5 I would like every one of you to speak in tongues, but I would rather have you prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be edified.

in THIS VERSE. CHURCH is the ONE BEING EDIFIED if SOMEONE INTERPRETS. If this is for PEOPLE then it MUST BE:
EDIFYING the UNBELIEVERS... and this is QOUTED MANY TIMES:

but if not interpreted YOU WILL JUST EDIFY YOURSELF

HOPE YOU GET IT>.

this verse of tongue. DOES NOT SPEAK TO PEOPLE..

You'd be better off not arguing this anymore. Those who will not get it will not get it. Ultimately God's work does not stop. He is always on the move whether people believe it or not.
 
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Albion

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Says who?
How do you personally know it was hyperbole? Some one said so?

Yes, that's the usual interpretation...except among Pentecostals.

And if you approach it with an open mind, it's clear that he's not meaning that angels actually have their own language when he's not saying that they do. He's saying that the hearer should not compromise his principles EVEN if something that would amaze anyone--if it were only possible--happened.

It's very much in the same category as "when hell freezes over." That's an expression that is heard in our own time. Do you believe that the speaker believes that hell WILL freeze over at some time merely because this turn of phrase was used?
 
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Albion

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Usual Interpretation?
From whom?
Man?
That is supposed to sound wise, I guess, but whatever you understand the Bible to be saying---that's an interpretation. By a human, yes.

I would believe the Bible over man anyday.
I you believe it, you've interpreted it. :doh:

I believe Angels have a language. The Heaven has its own language.[/

Since you say you'd believe your interpretation of the Bible over any man's interpretation, show us where the Bible says that "Heaven has its own language." Thanks.
 
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