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how do people who believe in eternal torture in fire

Discussion in 'Controversial Christian Theology' started by ClementofA, Dec 20, 2017.

  1. LoveofTruth

    LoveofTruth Christ builds His church from within us

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    so Jesus was not conscious after death??? But you said he preached to the spirits in prison. And I showed that he descended to the lower parts of the earth. Jesus is the Son of God God the Son. Before he came in the flesh he was God and conscious after the body Died he was also God and conscious. You may want to rethink your idea here, you don't want to say God is not conscious, ever.

    Jesus Christ also speaks in all believers. That is conscious and in Spirit. All believers have the Spirit of God in them
     
  2. he-man

    he-man he-man

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  3. LoveofTruth

    LoveofTruth Christ builds His church from within us

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    No the english word "hell" has many meanings and covers all the Greek words.

    "HELL, n.
    1. The place or state of punishment for the wicked after death. Mat 10. Luke 12.
    Sin is hell begun, as religion is heaven anticipated.
    2. The place of the dead, or of souls after death; the lower regions, or the grave; called in Hebrew, sheol, and by the Greeks, hades. Psa 16. Jonah 2.
    3. The pains of hell, temporal death, or agonies that dying persons feel, or which bring to the brink of the grave. Psa 18.
    4. The gates of hell, the power and policy of Satan and his instruments. Mat 16.
    5. The infernal powers.
    While Saul and hell cross'd his strong fate in vain.
    6. The place at a running play to which are carried those who are caught.
    7. A place into which a tailor throws his shreds.
    8. A dungeon or prison."

    we read of both by and soul cast into hell. Sorry your doctrine fails. What kind of body it is that can suffer forever is not clear in scripture but it will be a real one according to scripture.
     
  4. Almost there

    Almost there Well-Known Member

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    I agree with this post, generally thinking. But when did I say God (or Jesus) is not conscious? How about when Jesus slept? God was certainly conscious. Was Jesus?
     
  5. LoveofTruth

    LoveofTruth Christ builds His church from within us

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    they will continually be judged and burned forever and condemned and in damnation and destruction as a shame and contempt in the bodies they have. Both body and soul shall be forever and ever day and night in the fire as scripture shows.
     
  6. he-man

    he-man he-man

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    John 17:20-22
    Does that mean we are all God?
     
  7. LoveofTruth

    LoveofTruth Christ builds His church from within us

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    You said

    the "person" The Son of God who is Jesus Christ, went into God's hands and he preached after his physical death.
     
  8. LoveofTruth

    LoveofTruth Christ builds His church from within us

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    no I said God is in every believer but we are not God.

    Philippians 2:13
    For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure."

    "20 Now the
    God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant, 21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is well pleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen."(Hebrews 13:20,21 KJV)
     
  9. Soar Like and Eagle

    Soar Like and Eagle Well-Known Member

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    The Word hell is not even in the Greek language and has been mistranslated from three Greek words and one Hebrew. So even to use the word hell is a mis-translation and very bias.

    No one will suffer forever the wicked will be punished/pruned/chastised agely not forever. That SICK.

    The words Sheol, Hades, Tartarus and Gehenna have no root or meaning in the word hell another example of King James Bible mis-translation and bias. The word hell came from an Angle Saxon word meaning to bury. If you go to the UK today and you can hel your potatoes.

    She-ol (eol) [[Heb shaal , to dig]] a place in the depths of the earth conceived of as the dwelling of the dead Note: translated in KJV about haft of scriptures as hell, the other haft as grave
    Ha-des(hadez) [[Gr Haides ]] 1 Gr. Myth. a) the home of the dead, beneath the earth b) the god of the underworld 2 Bible the state or resting place of the dead: name used in some modern translations of the New Testament
    Yes there is a Tar-ta-rus (tart rs) [[ Gr Tartaros ]] Gr. Myth. 1 an infernal abyss below Hades, where Zeus hurls the rebel Titans, later a place of punishment for the demons and devils not people. (mentioned only once in the Bible)
    Those who go to Gehenna are not sinners of the world; but are sinners of God’s people. (how precious is this a type of purification outside of God’s holy city. All things that are not of God will be purified by God’s holy judgment.

    Jesus was not speaking to the world/pagan people/sinners; he was speaking to the Jews (believers during His time He walked o n this earth); when ever He used this Greek word Gehenna. With the Teutonic pagan word Hell Gehenna is not physical flames, even though Gehenna is the garbage dump outside the city of Jerusalem. Gehenna Judgment is actually spiritual in nature; it is the reaping of what Israel had sown by killing the prophets and their children in the fire to Molech and Baal at Topheth and in the Valley of Ben Hiddom (later called Gehenna). God warned that those who go to Gehenna are not sinners of the world; but are sinners of God’s people. (how precious is this a type of purification outside of God’s holy city. All things that are not of God will be purified by God’s holy judgment. This word is used not for sinner, murders or liars; it is used with the word “BROTHER”.

    Gehenna is not physical flames, even though Gehenna is the garbage dump outside the city of Jerusalem. Gehenna Judgment is actually spiritual in nature, it is the reaping of what Isreal had sown by killing the prophets and their children in the fire to Molech and Baal at Topheth and in the Valley of Ben Hiddom (later called Gehenna). God warned that He is the only God, there is no other like Him.

    Matthew 5:22

    But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell (Gehenna) fire.
     
  10. he-man

    he-man he-man

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    Butbefore he went anywhere he went to hell (the grave) and dead as a doornail, stayed there three days just like Jonah did in the belly of the whale (symbolic ofhell, the grave)
    How do I know? "The dead are silent in the grave and know nothing". Psalms 31:17
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2017
  11. Almost there

    Almost there Well-Known Member

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    I was not talking about Jesus. Look at the comment by you that I was referring to.
     
  12. he-man

    he-man he-man

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    Psalms 31:17 Sorry bu the dead Jesus was silent in the grave and knew nothing for three days. It also says no man hath ascended unto heaven but he who came down from his father. It says not even David has yet ascended unto heaven
     
  13. LoveofTruth

    LoveofTruth Christ builds His church from within us

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    wrong, the body sleeps in the grave the spirit goes to God. Snd Jesus descended to the lower parts of the earth to a place called "paradise" or Abrahams Bosom, where the Ot saints were until he finished the work on the cross. He preached (proclaimed not evangelized) them and took captivity captive and brought them out of there.
     
  14. Almost there

    Almost there Well-Known Member

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    I was making the argument that my post was not about Jesus. That's all I was saying.
     
  15. LoveofTruth

    LoveofTruth Christ builds His church from within us

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    yes they were in paradise. Jesus said to the thief who repented that this day he would be with him in paradise. This is the paradise side of hell, or the place of departed spirits. Jesus descended to that part and led captivity captive.

    These are basic things in scripture I marvel at how confused some get when listening to heresies all over the net.
     
  16. LoveofTruth

    LoveofTruth Christ builds His church from within us

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    I showed you very clearly that the word The KJV uses for al the Greek words is hell. It covers all the meanings. Plain and simple.

    the translation is in english. When you translate you take english words that are equivalent and as close to the meaning as we have.
     
  17. he-man

    he-man he-man

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    Wow! Have you been decieved. Jesus said unto the thief, "Today, you shall be with me in paradise. NOTICE the comma. If he meant that day then they would both be in the grave for 3 days together.
     
  18. LoveofTruth

    LoveofTruth Christ builds His church from within us

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    wrong again

    Luke 23:43
    And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with mein paradise."(KJV the only bible any should use in english) yes its a 45 hour talk too much for here. You have been deceived by the corrupted versions it seems.
     
  19. Almost there

    Almost there Well-Known Member

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    Yep. The problem is that there is too much word mincing going on. I invoke my tag line.
     
  20. LoveofTruth

    LoveofTruth Christ builds His church from within us

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    and like I showed you Jesus descended to the lower parts of the earth and preached to the spirits in prison

    scripture is clear on this
     
  21. LoveofTruth

    LoveofTruth Christ builds His church from within us

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    "8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men. 9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth? 10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)"(Ephesians 4:8-10 KJV)

    1 Peter 3:19
    By which also he went and preached unto the spirits inprison;"( KJV)

     
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