How did all of the Coelophysis at Ghost Ranch die?

[joshua 1 9]

We are looking at the evolution of carnivores before and after the breakup of Pangea.

Ghost Ranch is a 21,000-acre retreat and education center located close to the village of Abiquiú in Rio Arriba County in north central New Mexico, United States. There are a lot of things to study that are associated with the Ghost Ranch. This thread has to do with the Coelophysis at Ghost Ranch. This is the point in time when Creationists and Evolutionists begin to go their own way. The question is: "Was Coelophysis a cannibal?" The Bible talks about: "If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other." (Galatians 5:15)

Paleontologists are not sure how the Coelophysis in the Ghost Ranch bone bed died. There is no real evidence on the fossils themselves of the cause of death. However, the fact that hundreds of complete skeletons are jammed together in one rock layer suggests a fast and catastrophic death of the dinosaurs. Furthermore, there is no evidence of weathering or scavenging of the fossil bones, so they must have been buried rapidly after death.

The paleontologist Edwin H. Colbert helped prove the theory of continental drift. This discovery was based in part on the work that Colbert did at Ghost Ranch and with the discovery of Coelophysis remains at the ranch and all the way through the rocky mountains. As a Creationists I point out that this is when creation began to devour itself, and that was followed by the breakup of Pangea to the point where we find the world in the current state that we are now in.

The Bible talks about shadows and types. There is a strong connection between what happened with Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden and what happened 200 million years ago with the Coelophysis. This is why school children today are so fascinated with the dinosaurs: because they began to develop teeth and they began to devour one another. This thread has to do with the evolution of meat eating carnivores. We are looking at the evolution of carnivores before and after the breakup of Pangea. The question is what was the change in the atmosphere at this point in time and what effect did that have on evolution?

We are also looking at the evolution of mammals and what impact the breakup of Pangea had on this chapter in the book of evolution having to do with mammals.

How did all of the Coelophysis at Ghost Ranch die?

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

<staff edit>Are you interested in how the Coelophysis at Ghost Ranch died?
Are you interested in the evolution predators?
Are you interested in the evolution of mammals?

What do you want to talk about?

 

[joshua 1 9]

What do you want to talk about?

A good place to start would be to look at changes in the atmosphere that took place at the breakup of Pangea and what impact or effect this could have had on the evolution of Mammals. My understanding is that the dinosaurs and mammals need a different atmosphere in order to evolve (survive). For example, the ancestor of the alligators goes back 200 million years. We know that alligators live in very wet conditions. Creationists claim that the breakup of Pangea had an effect on the atmosphere and that had a impact on evolution.

Genesis 7:11b "the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened".

We do not know what this means: The Fountains of the Deep and the Windows of Heaven. There are four words here we would need to study, Fountains, Deep, Windows & Heaven. Still there are people that believe this is the cause of the break up of Pangea that took place around 200 million years ago. It is suggested that the Jurassic period had five times more CO2 and the climate during the Jurassic Period was extremely humid and warm.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

A good place to start would be to look at changes in the atmosphere that took place at the breakup of Pangea and what impact or effect this could have had on the evolution of Mammals. My understanding is that the dinosaurs and mammals need a different atmosphere in order to evolve (survive). For example, the ancestor of the alligators goes back 200 million years. We know that alligators live in very wet conditions. Creationists claim that the breakup of Pangea had an effect on the atmosphere and that had a impact on evolution.

Genesis 7:11b "the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened".

We do not know what this means: The Fountains of the Deep and the Windows of Heaven. There are four words here we would need to study, Fountains, Deep, Windows & Heaven. Still there are people that believe this is the cause of the break up of Pangea that took place around 200 million years ago. It is suggested that the Jurassic period had five times more CO2 and the climate during the Jurassic Period was extremely humid and warm.

No, what are you talking about? What is the topic of this thread supposed to be?

 

[joshua 1 9]

<staff edit>

A good place to start would be "Ghost Ranch". There is a LOT to study about Ghost Ranch. Hollywood has gone there to make movies, that is interesting. As I mentioned paleontologist Edwin H. Colbert did a lot of his research on continental drift at the ranch. Nowadays we call this plate tectonics. "Continental drift" and "plate tectonics" are words that we can run a google search so you can study a little bit about this topic and be better able to contribute something to the discussion.

Most of the words I use it would take a whole book to explain the meaning of that word. If you were to use the word: Evolution there are whole libraries with over 200,000 books dedicated to explaining the meaning of the word Evolution.

The ONLY limit here is a point in time 200 million years ago when Pangea broke up and continental drift began. The question is what impact did the break up of Pangea have on the atmosphere and as a result what was the impact on evolution. Esp the evolution of mammals and that will include primates also.

<staff edit>

 

[joshua 1 9]

<staff edit>

What is the topic of this thread supposed to be?

We can talk about whatever you want to talk about. As long as it has to do with Ghost Ranch or the breakup of Pangea 200 million years ago. Yes I know that there are lots and lots of things to talk about within this parameter. I can give you some suggestions on how we can begin to narrow it down by areas of study that maybe more interesting. You have to do your own study and your own research so you have to determine what you are interested in and what your are willing to put some effort into doing a study and a google search on.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

<staff edit>
So PLEASE. Help me understand the topic.

 

[Jimmy D]

We are looking at the evolution of carnivores before and after the breakup of Pangea.

Ghost Ranch is a 21,000-acre retreat and education center located close to the village of Abiquiú in Rio Arriba County in north central New Mexico, United States. There are a lot of things to study that are associated with the Ghost Ranch. This thread has to do with the Coelophysis at Ghost Ranch. This is the point in time when Creationists and Evolutionists begin to go their own way. The question is: "Was Coelophysis a cannibal?" The Bible talks about: "If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other." (Galatians 5:15)

Paleontologists are not sure how the Coelophysis in the Ghost Ranch bone bed died. There is no real evidence on the fossils themselves of the cause of death. However, the fact that hundreds of complete skeletons are jammed together in one rock layer suggests a fast and catastrophic death of the dinosaurs. Furthermore, there is no evidence of weathering or scavenging of the fossil bones, so they must have been buried rapidly after death.

The paleontologist Edwin H. Colbert helped prove the theory of continental drift. This discovery was based in part on the work that Colbert did at Ghost Ranch and with the discovery of Coelophysis remains at the ranch and all the way through the rocky mountains. As a Creationists I point out that this is when creation began to devour itself, and that was followed by the breakup of Pangea to the point where we find the world in the current state that we are now in.

The Bible talks about shadows and types. There is a strong connection between what happened with Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden and what happened 200 million years ago with the Coelophysis. This is why school children today are so fascinated with the dinosaurs: because they began to develop teeth and they began to devour one another. This thread has to do with the evolution of meat eating carnivores. We are looking at the evolution of carnivores before and after the breakup of Pangea. The question is what was the change in the atmosphere at this point in time and what effect did that have on evolution?

We are also looking at the evolution of mammals and what impact the breakup of Pangea had on this chapter in the book of evolution having to do with mammals.

How did all of the Coelophysis at Ghost Ranch die?

I've never seen those Ghost Ranch fossils, although I'm sure I've heard them mentioned on here.

I found this possible explanation: Geology and Taphonomy of the Coelophysis Quarry, Upper Triassic Chinle Formation, Ghost Ranch, New Mexico on JSTOR

Skeletons, partial skeletons, and bones are crudely aligned and show little evidence of predator or scavenger disturbance or surface weathering. Geologic and taphonomic evidence suggests that the dinosaurs preserved in the Ghost Ranch quarry were transported to the site as carcasses by fluvial currents. The carcasses blocked a small channel and were subsequently buried by silts. Petrographic study and neutron activation analysis reveal no evidence of volcanic ash, paleopathologic osteology, or unusual chemistry in the quarry bone and sediments. The virtual monospecificity, taphonomy, and ecology of the assemblage suggest that the dinosaurs perished due to a regional environmental crisis, such as drought.


It's a shame the full article isn't available (to me at least).

I am struggling to see why you suggest that they were cannibals though?

 

[joshua 1 9]

Help me understand the topic.

You and me have not agreed on a topic to talk about yet. I am waiting to see what is of interest to you. I could suggest that we could talk about the evolution of carnivores. This was my very first sentence in the first post. This is the point in time when evolutionists and creationists have a parting of the way. Evolutionists say SO WHAT? Flesh eating carnivores is just a part of evolution, no different than bacteria feed on decaying matter. At least they do not see a difference. As creationists we do not see carnivores as an extension of bacteria.

Creationists say that Creation is in a fallen condition and in need of redemption. This is something that Evolutionists do not accept. Unless they are Theistic Evolutionists. Because Theistic Evolutionists like Francis Collins can see the plan and purpose that God has in and through evolution.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

You and me have not agreed on a topic to talk about yet. I am waiting to see what is of interest to you. I could suggest that we could talk about the evolution of carnivores. This was my very first sentence in the first post. This is the point in time when evolutionists and creationists have a parting of the way. Evolutionists say SO WHAT? Flesh eating carnivores is just a part of evolution, no different than bacteria feed on decaying matter. At least they do not see a difference. As creationists we do not see carnivores as an extension of bacteria.

Creationists say that Creation is in a fallen condition and in need of redemption. This is something that Evolutionists do not accept. Unless they are Theistic Evolutionists. Because Theistic Evolutionists like Francis Collins can see the plan and purpose that God has in and through evolution.

And how does that tie in to the Coelophysis of Ghost Ranch? What's your... let's go with hypothesis. What's your hypothesis on how that ties in with the discovery of the fossils of Coelophysis at Ghost Ranch?

 

[joshua 1 9]

It's a shame the full article isn't available (to me at least).

I am struggling to see why you suggest that they were cannibals though?

I can get the whole article, the abstract says: "Geologic and taphonomic evidence suggests that the dinosaurs preserved in the Ghost Ranch quarry were transported to the site as carcasses by fluvial currents". We have the term "fluvial currents". Fluvial is a term used in geography and geology to refer to the processes associated with rivers and streams and the deposits and landforms created by them. When the stream or rivers are associated with glaciers, ice sheets, or ice caps, the term glaciofluvial or fluvioglacial is used.

This is why in 1947 Edward Coban was able to use this site at the Ghost ranch for his theory on Continental drift that today we refer to as plate tectonics. When I was in grade school back in the 60's Coban's theory was just an unproven theory. Now Plate Tectonics is widely accepted and no longer disputed. Edward Coban's work is a now a small part that actually deserves more attention then what he is getting because children love to learn about dinosaurs. So this is something that can find it's way into the grade school science books and be of interest to young students and a way to teach them about both evolution and geology. At one point in time I was very upset that they do not teach more about geology in grade school. I spent most of my time when I was not in school out hiking along the river and some classes on how that river was formed would have been very interesting.

At the time of Darwin he learned a lot from his good friend Charles Lyell considered to be the father of geology. Perhaps Darwin did not study as much geology as he should have because evolution is more of a theory of biology and they leave out just how much geology and climate change has an impact on evolution.

The suggestion that the Coelophysis was a cannibal is considered to be a myth busted. The bones found inside of a Coelophysis was not another Coelophysis. They belonged to a different species. This is evidence that the Coelophysis was carnivorous and not herbivorous.

Myth Busted: Dinosaur Not a Cannibal

 

[SkyWriting]

However, the fact that hundreds of complete skeletons are jammed together in one rock layer suggests a fast and catastrophic death of the dinosaurs.

Most all fossils are started fast and catastrophic. Amber encapsulation is a bit slower.

 

[Original Happy Camper]

they died in the flood because they were not one of God's creation they were mans creation. thus they were not on the ark.
The antediluvian were a lot smarter than Hollywood portrays them

Mixing evolution and Christianity (200 million years) in the OP is
Theistic evolution

Are the Bible and Evolution Compatible?
Jesus, the Creator, made it clear that the first marriage between man and woman (Adam and Eve) came within the creation week. If the earth is indeed billions of years old, then the first male and female came nowhere near the creation week. This is a major theological problem.

Choose you which you will serve God or man. For Me I choose God's word, the earth is about 6,000 years old. Genealogy is in the Bible for several reasons one is to dispel the lies of Satan about the creation week ending in the Sabbath of the LORD.

 

[Truthfrees]

MOD HAT

Posts have been removed for going off topic and discussing each other.

 

[joshua 1 9]

Most all fossils are started fast and catastrophic. Amber encapsulation is a bit slower.

You're saying that most of the extinction events are catastrophic? Most of the population events are considered to be an explosion although they prefer to use the term radiation.

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

You're saying that most of the extinction events are catastrophic? Most of the population events are considered to be an explosion although they prefer to use the term radiation.

There's a difference between an extinction event and the population explosion.
An extinction is when populations die out.
A population explosion is when a population of animals/humans grows in a fairly quick period of time.

 

[PsychoSarah]

<staff edit>Are you interested in how the Coelophysis at Ghost Ranch died?
Are you interested in the evolution predators?
Are you interested in the evolution of mammals?

What do you want to talk about?

At first, I thought he was asking if some group of dinosaurs cannibalized each other to death (unlikely for them all to fossilize in one spot from that, and animals that die that violently have scratches and tooth marks on their bones to indicate it, so I'd say no, the dinosaurs were possibly communal, and that group got caught in a land slide).

Then he went with atmospheric pressure and predator evolution? Atmospheric pressure influences evolution of plants and other stationary organisms, since pressure isn't consistent on this planet and varies by elevation. It'd take a pretty extreme change in atmospheric pressure to do much to predatory creatures that can move around.

 

[SkyWriting]

You're saying that most of the extinction events are catastrophic? Most of the population events are considered to be an explosion although they prefer to use the term radiation.

I'm saying that nearly all fossils are due to rapid
burial and encapsulation after a sudden event.

"So, at present, the best inference is that a flash
flood killed all the Coelophysis at Ghost Ranch."

The idea that anything can die and slowly
sink to the ocean or lake bottom is ridiculous.

Exceptions are tar pits and such.
La Brea Tar Pits and Museum

 

[joshua 1 9]

I'm saying that nearly all fossils are due to rapid burial and encapsulation after a sudden event.

Kat Kerr has an explaination for what happened at the time Pangea broke up. Kat Kerr - Powerful Testimonies of Heaven

 

[Ophiolite]

Kat Kerr has an explaination for what happened at the time Pangea broke up. Kat Kerr - Powerful Testimonies of Heaven

An explanation that ignores contrary facts is not an explanation it is an unsubstantiated and flawed assertion.