LDS How a Cult Works

He is the way

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5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him

There is that 5th verse you did not put in bold and it is a further test of sorts. How would you truly know what His word is if you do NOT trust the Bible? Remember 'we believe in the Holy Bible, insofar as it is translated correctly".

Just going by some of your conflicting beliefs.

Matthew 7:21-23
21 “Not everyone who says to Me,‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 Then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

These people think they know God in Christ as well, and yet what does He say to them?
There was no change in those scriptures so we know that they were translated correctly. I would ask you to look at the last four words of Matthew 7:23. Obviously Jesus was talking about people who did not keep the commandments.
 
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topher694

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You are still saying that we are NOT saved by faith alone. That was what I stated first and even if it is by grace and faith, it is not faith alone. However even grace and faith are still not enough. It MUST be accompanied by works because dead faith will not save. Also we know that life eternal is given to those who know God:

(New Testament | John 17:3)

3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

And in order to know God we need to keep the commandments:

(New Testament | 1 John 2:4)

4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

Jesus also told us what we need to do to have eternal life:

(New Testament | Luke 10:25 - 28)

25 ¶ And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?
26 He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou?
27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.
28 And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.

Then there is this:

(New Testament | John 3:3)

3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

And this:

(New Testament | John 6:53 - 56)

53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
56 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.

Faith alone is a false teaching and may cause many to err.
What you are teaching is false and causing many to err. Evidenced by your dishonest behavior, regardless of your attempts to spin and deflect from it.

I'll make this simple. Grace is God's part of us being saved. Faith is our part. Works do not get you saved. We are saved so that we can be empowered to do good works. So, NO, I am NOT saying it requires more than faith alone from man to be saved. I'm saying it also requires action from God. Which He is always faithful to perform.

None of the scriptures you have posted relating to works actually also talk about being saved, that's only your implication. What you are doing is a bait and switch... just more dishonest behavior. I'm growing tired of it.

These word games and verbal "gotchas" are the type of thing the Pharisees did. Ironically, if Jesus Himself were on these forums He'd get banned for some of the things He said to the Pharisees, as would I, so I'll just direct you to the statements Jesus made about them and leave it at that.
 
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He is the way

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What you are teaching is false and causing many to err. Evidenced by your dishonest behavior, regardless of your attempts to spin and deflect from it.

I'll make this simple. Grace is God's part of us being saved. Faith is our part. Works do not get you saved. We are saved so that we can be empowered to do good works. So, NO, I am NOT saying it requires more than faith alone from man to be saved. I'm saying it also requires action from God. Which He is always faithful to perform.

None of the scriptures you have posted relating to works actually also talk about being saved, that's only your implication. What you are doing is a bait and switch... just more dishonest behavior. I'm growing tired of it.

These word games and verbal "gotchas" are the type of thing the Pharisees did. Ironically, if Jesus Himself were on these forums He'd get banned for some of the things He said to the Pharisees, as would I, so I'll just direct you to the statements Jesus made about them and leave it at that.
Our part is more than just faith:

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 12:13 - 14)

13 ¶ Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
 
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Nancy Hale

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It's yet another round of anti-Mormon conspiracy theories.

For at least 20 years now people have been spreading it around that the church owns such-and-such cola company, and it's made the rounds so many times that Snopes has had to get involved.

It's all false, but so many people hate us that they aren't willing to let the facts get in the way of the narrative. They spread their poison from their pulpits and let their unquestioning audiences do their work for them.
It is not a conspiracy theory. I saw it with my own two eyes. I heard it with my own two ears. It's interesting that the Mormon church has the largest PR department and budget of any corporation in the world. They need it to cover up their constant changes and lies.
Just the fact that you can't stand on the Truth proves you are not what you say you are. Jesus IS the Truth.
 
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Jamesone5

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There was no change in those scriptures so we know that they were translated correctly. I would ask you to look at the last four words of Matthew 7:23. Obviously Jesus was talking about people who did not keep the commandments.

Obviously?--that is all you got? No proof of what He actually said but go with assumptions?

Matthew 7:23
23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’


So, according to you and obviously JS [who only the Mormons rely on] verse 23 cancels out the first 2 verses?
This about people who [casually] use His Name. "Have we not done this or that ---in your Name"?

Absolutely nothing about the 10 commandments.
 
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Nancy Hale

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Our part is more than just faith:

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 12:13 - 14)

13 ¶ Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
And all the law did for anyone was show them they were a sinner in need of a Savior. Satan is still hard at work.
Roman's 3:20
Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
Did Jesus create the world? You say you believe in Jesus, you say you are followers of Christ, your church recently announced it wants to be called something different than Mormon. So, if this is all true you should have no issues answering this one simple question: Did Jesus create the world and everything in it?
 
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Nancy Hale

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Our part is more than just faith:
More than just faith? Just faith?
So, your righteous isn't like filthy rags? The bible applies to everyone but you and the ones you say because you're g.. just like some other character the Bible warns against.
 
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He is the way

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Obviously?--that is all you got? No proof of what He actually said but go with assumptions?

Matthew 7:23
23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’


So, according to you and obviously JS [who only the Mormons rely on] verse 23 cancels out the first 2 verses?
This about people who [casually] use His Name. "Have we not done this or that ---in your Name"?

Absolutely nothing about the 10 commandments.
What exactly does lawlessness mean to you? It is about those who are a law unto themselves. They do not obey Christ or keep His commandments.
 
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He is the way

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And all the law did for anyone was show them they were a sinner in need of a Savior. Satan is still hard at work.
Roman's 3:20
Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
Did Jesus create the world? You say you believe in Jesus, you say you are followers of Christ, your church recently announced it wants to be called something different than Mormon. So, if this is all true you should have no issues answering this one simple question: Did Jesus create the world and everything in it?
Everyone is in need of the atonement of Jesus Christ. If not for the atonement we would all be lost. It is our duty to keep the commandments. In doing so we are still unprofitable servants and fall short of the glory of God. Our church although called the Mormon church as a nickname. The church was first called the Church Of Christ from 1830 to 1834. It was then changed to The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints so as not to be mixed up with other churches of the same name. The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints is still the correct name. Jesus did create or formed the earth:
(Old Testament | Isaiah 45:18)

18 For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else.
 
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He is the way

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More than just faith? Just faith?
So, your righteous isn't like filthy rags? The bible applies to everyone but you and the ones you say because you're g.. just like some other character the Bible warns against.
Faith is important and so is charity:

(New Testament | 1 Corinthians 13:2 - 8)

2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,
5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked, thinketh no evil;
6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth in the truth;
7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.
8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
 
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Jamesone5

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What exactly does lawlessness mean to you? It is about those who are a law unto themselves. They do not obey Christ or keep His commandments.

Lawlessness means:

Not having the law of Faith

Romans 3:27-28
27Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? Of works? No, but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is ]justified by faith apart from the deeds of the law.
 
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topher694

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Our part is more than just faith:

(Old Testament | Ecclesiastes 12:13 - 14)

13 ¶ Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
14 For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
More dishonesty, twisting and bait and switch. If you truly believe your personal salvation is based on faith and good works, I'm afraid you are in trouble.
 
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He is the way

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Lawlessness means:

Not having the law of Faith

Romans 3:27-28
27Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? Of works? No, but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is ]justified by faith apart from the deeds of the law.
(New Testament | Romans 3:31)

31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
 
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He is the way

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More dishonesty, twisting and bait and switch. If you truly believe your personal salvation is based on faith and good works, I'm afraid you are in trouble.
Eternal life is based on keeping the commandments. True Christians do this because they LOVE Jesus:

(New Testament | 1 John 2:3)

3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

(Old Testament | Exodus 20:6)

6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

(New Testament | John 14:15)

15 ¶ If ye love me, keep my commandments.

NO twisting necessary.
 
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topher694

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Eternal life is based on keeping the commandments. True Christians do this because they LOVE Jesus:

(New Testament | 1 John 2:3)

3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

(Old Testament | Exodus 20:6)

6 And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.

(New Testament | John 14:15)

15 ¶ If ye love me, keep my commandments.

NO twisting necessary.
Really? Those scriptures say nothing about salvation. It is twisting them to suggest otherwise. We are empowered to keep His commandments after we are saved, because we are saved. Regardless, you just avoid your deceptions and keep beating the same drum. I recall that one of those commandments was about bearing false witness, which you have done several times now. Tell me, where in scripture does it say it's ok to use deceptive tactics as long as you are "right"? Why should anyone listen to someone who behaves in such a way?
 
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Ironhold

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It is not a conspiracy theory. I saw it with my own two eyes. I heard it with my own two ears. It's interesting that the Mormon church has the largest PR department and budget of any corporation in the world. They need it to cover up their constant changes and lies.
Just the fact that you can't stand on the Truth proves you are not what you say you are. Jesus IS the Truth.

Gonna need more than that for something this big.

...Like a statement from Pepsi (et al) noting their stock holders.
 
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Jamesone5

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(New Testament | Romans 3:31)

31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

I think you are tying to cancel out what other sculpture is saying and making a mess of it. We will go back to what I originally inserted

Matthew 7:21-23
21 “Not everyone who says to Me,‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 Then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

These people HE will condemn had no faith to begin with. They tell Him they are doing things In His Name. or really try to put the mark of "Jesus Christ" on all they do and expect entrance into His Kingdom.

You have heard the term "Christians in Name Only". right?
It sadly is a reality.

This is the very simple truth of John 3:16:

John 3:16

16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

And,Without believing in Him {Faith] you have nothing--only filthy rags to show for the work efforts that only appear to be righteous acts.

Isaiah 64:6
But we are all like an unclean thing, And all our righteousnesses are like filthy rags; We all fade as a leaf, And our iniquities, like the wind, Have taken us away.


Now the question to you is does the Mormon Church [in it's doctrines] only use His Name without Faith? And,is it Faith in self or Faith in Christ? It appears to me to be the former--as I was a Mormon for 40 years.
 
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He is the way

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Really? Those scriptures say nothing about salvation. It is twisting them to suggest otherwise. We are empowered to keep His commandments after we are saved, because we are saved. Regardless, you just avoid your deceptions and keep beating the same drum. I recall that one of those commandments was about bearing false witness, which you have done several times now. Tell me, where in scripture does it say it's ok to use deceptive tactics as long as you are "right"? Why should anyone listen to someone who behaves in such a way?
So you don't believe that eternal life is necessary for salvation? That is an interesting concept, but not a very good one. So how about this scripture:
(New Testament | Hebrews 5:8 - 9)

8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

Now you will will you say that obeying Jesus Christ has nothing to do with keeping the commandments?

What about this:

(New Testament | James 1:19 - 24)

19 Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak, slow to wrath:
20 For the wrath of man worketh not the righteousness of God.
21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
23 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:
24 For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.

And this:

(New Testament | John 14:12)

12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
 
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He is the way

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I think you are tying to cancel out what other sculpture is saying and making a mess of it. We will go back to what I originally inserted

Matthew 7:21-23
21 “Not everyone who says to Me,‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 Then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

These people HE will condemn had no faith to begin with. They tell Him they are doing things In His Name. or really try to put the mark of "Jesus Christ" on all they do and expect entrance into His Kingdom.

You have heard the term "Christians in Name Only". right?
It sadly is a reality.

This is the very simple truth of John 3:16:

John 3:16

16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

And,Without believing in Him {Faith] you have nothing--only filthy rags to show for the work efforts that only appear to be righteous acts.

Isaiah 64:6
But we are all like an unclean thing, And all our righteousnesses are like filthy rags; We all fade as a leaf, And our iniquities, like the wind, Have taken us away.


Now the question to you is does the Mormon Church [in it's doctrines] only use His Name without Faith? And,is it Faith in self or Faith in Christ? It appears to me to be the former--as I was a Mormon for 40 years.
Members of The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints do believe that it is necessary to believe in Jesus Christ, however just believing is not enough:

(New Testament | James 2:19)

19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.


(New Testament | Luke 8:28)

28 When he saw Jesus, he cried out, and fell down before him, and with a loud voice said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God most high? I beseech thee, torment me not.


(New Testament | John 14:12)

12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
 
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Jamesone5

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Members of The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter Day Saints do believe that it is necessary to believe in Jesus Christ, however just believing is not enough:

(New Testament | James 2:19)

19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.


(New Testament | Luke 8:28)

28 When he saw Jesus, he cried out, and fell down before him, and with a loud voice said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God most high? I beseech thee, torment me not.


(New Testament | John 14:12)

12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.

So what do you do with these set of verses?
Matthew 7:21-23
21 “Not everyone who says to Me,‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ 23 Then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’

These people obviously casually thought they believed in Christ as the used His Name
 
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