honoring the law or honoring my husband

lambkisses

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As of late my husband has been on a. "No one is going to tell me what to do bender". His resentment at being told to live a certain way to be a considered a good Christian has exploded and now he doesn't seem to care what people think of him. As a result he is now doing things that are actually illegal and he justifies with "if hillary doesn't have to follow the law why should i?".
Yesterday we were visited by the sheriff's office because my husband was suspected of cutting a Denver Boot off of his truck two days ago. Of course when the deputies were at the door he denied doing the deed and was extremely disrespectful towards the officers. He kept insisting he had no idea what they were talking about and insinuated that the deputies' time was better served staking out the local Shipley's. He further insinuated that on the day in question he was at the home of the mother of one of the deputies servicing her in a sexual nature, there by preventing him from parking in the area in question. His theory was this was just the "man" trying to hold him down.
The officers to their credit let my husband's disrespectful remarks just roll off but they confronted him with the observation that an angle grinder was in pain view in his vehicle on the floor boards. Again he denied the allegations and asked that the officers return only if they have a warrent.
When the deputies left I asked him what the hell was wrong with him and if he didn't do it he should just answer the questions without any unsolicited commentary. That's when he took me into his workshop and showed me the boot. He told me that he parked at the local university and was booted due to unpaid tickets (why was my husband at the University? He was representing his company for a career fair, I am sure that his company would find this extremely amusing if it got back to them:swoon:).
So yeah, not only did he break the law but he lied to law enforcement. What would be the right thing to do? On our wedding I swore before our families and God to Love, HONOR, and OBEY my husband. But on the other hand Jesus taught us to obey the laws of man and to have reverence for civil authorities. Do I turn my husband in for this? Do I just close my eyes and consider this not my problem?
My husband isn't a bad guy, I understand why he is acting up right now. In all honesty what he is doing is childish rather than malicious or wicked. So would it be better in the long run for me to turn him in or be a party to his lies?
 

lambkisses

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Turn him in. Saying in wedding vows that you'll "honor and obey" your husband doesn't mean you should just stand by while he does illegal things.
I don't know, cause he could just have easily lied to me about the situation yet he had enough faith in me to share with me. I am conflicted over who our first loyalty should lay, with the family or with the state. I guess that's the question I am asking.
 
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Hank77

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As of late my husband has been on a. "No one is going to tell me what to do bender". His resentment at being told to live a certain way to be a considered a good Christian has exploded and now he doesn't seem to care what people think of him. As a result he is now doing things that are actually illegal and he justifies with "if hillary doesn't have to follow the law why should i?".
Yesterday we were visited by the sheriff's office because my husband was suspected of cutting a Denver Boot off of his truck two days ago. Of course when the deputies were at the door he denied doing the deed and was extremely disrespectful towards the officers. He kept insisting he had no idea what they were talking about and insinuated that the deputies' time was better served staking out the local Shipley's. He further insinuated that on the day in question he was at the home of the mother of one of the deputies servicing her in a sexual nature, there by preventing him from parking in the area in question. His theory was this was just the "man" trying to hold him down.
The officers to their credit let my husband's disrespectful remarks just roll off but they confronted him with the observation that an angle grinder was in pain view in his vehicle on the floor boards. Again he denied the allegations and asked that the officers return only if they have a warrent.
When the deputies left I asked him what the hell was wrong with him and if he didn't do it he should just answer the questions without any unsolicited commentary. That's when he took me into his workshop and showed me the boot. He told me that he parked at the local university and was booted due to unpaid tickets (why was my husband at the University? He was representing his company for a career fair, I am sure that his company would find this extremely amusing if it got back to them:swoon:).
So yeah, not only did he break the law but he lied to law enforcement. What would be the right thing to do? On our wedding I swore before our families and God to Love, HONOR, and OBEY my husband. But on the other hand Jesus taught us to obey the laws of man and to have reverence for civil authorities. Do I turn my husband in for this? Do I just close my eyes and consider this not my problem?
My husband isn't a bad guy, I understand why he is acting up right now. In all honesty what he is doing is childish rather than malicious or wicked. So would it be better in the long run for me to turn him in or be a party to his lies?
I suppose if you want to end your marriage you could turn him in. It's not as if he committed a violent crime or even destroyed a significant amount of personal property.
Jesus said for us to not break the law and You haven't. It does not say to have reverence for civil authorities. In a court of law a spouse cannot be forced to testify against their spouse. There are good reasons for this. Under Moses' Law a close relative was not even allowed to testify for or against their relative in a court case.

What you could do is find out what a replacement boot costs. Buy a gift card and anonymously send it and a note saying what it was for. That way the deputy's property value has been returned to him.
 
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Anguspure

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While I agree with @CrystalDragon about your marriage vows, and consider that this problem is every bit yours, I would be hesitant to turn any friend of mine into the Law for these things without first pursuing other avenues.

The guideline for dealing with sort of thing is given by Jesus:
“If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

and Paul:If any of you has a dispute with another, do you dare to take it before the ungodly for judgment instead of before the Lord’s people?
 
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lambkisses

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Just wait until they come back with the warrant, then escort them to the workshop.
He took the thing to work with him today. He said that he was going to "Natalie Holloway" it.
I suppose if you want to end your marriage you could turn him in. It's not as if he committed a violent crime or even destroyed a significant amount of personal property.
Jesus said for us to not break the law and You haven't. It does not say to have reverence for civil authorities. In a court of law a spouse cannot be forced to testify against their spouse. There are good reasons for this. Under Moses' Law a close relative was not even allowed to testify for or against their relative in a court case.

What you could do is find out what a replacement boot costs. Buy a gift card and anonymously send it and a note saying what it was for. That way the deputy's property value has been returned to him.
That actually is a really good idea. So you do believe that the bible calls us to loyalty to kin over state correct? I have heard so much on both sides concerning issues of loyalty to family/clan versus loyalty to state as it applies to Christians and frankly I find it extremely confusing and at times hypocritical. I live in the south and have always gone to a bible church. It seems that the church I go to both condemns and venerates scoff laws depending on the nature of the offense and the political leanings of the perpetrator. Literally I have heard the pastor demonize nonviolent drug offenders simply because "Jesus taught us to give unto Caesar what is Caesars" but then on the other hand praise the guys in Oregon who were occupying the wildlife scanturary as heros for disobedience to "new Babylon " I find that very confusing. To me either Jesus taught follow the law or he didn't, but never have I received a straight answer.
 
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lambkisses

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“If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church,
Please read my last two threads, I tried this exact thing when my husband did something I thought was sinful and wrong and I had many people on this board jump all over me for trying to bully my husband to go my way.
 
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Anguspure

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Please read my last two threads, I tried this exact thing when my husband did something I thought was sinful and wrong and I had many people on this board jump all over me for trying to bully my husband to go my way.
Its a good thing that you are free in Christ to act according to where He leads you then.
Without wishing to drive another wedge into an already difficult relationship, it seems to me that given your previous problems, Mr.Plod might be an option.
 
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lambkisses

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Its a good thing that you are free in Christ to act according to where He leads you then.
Without wishing to drive another wedge into an already difficult relationship, it seems to me that given your previous problems, Mr.Plod might be an option.
What is Mr. Plod?
 
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Anguspure

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What is Mr. Plod?
upload_2017-1-21_12-0-6.jpeg
 
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Hank77

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. So you do believe that the bible calls us to loyalty to kin over state correct? I have heard so much on both sides concerning issues of loyalty to family/clan versus loyalty to state as it applies to Christians and frankly I find it extremely confusing and at times hypocritical.
No, not necessarily. As I said he did not commit a violent crime or something that cannot restore his victim to their original state.
frankly I find it extremely confusing and at times hypocritical.
Yes it is confusing at times. I have actually found that studying the Law of Moses has helped me sort out SOME of the dilemmas.
 
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lambkisses

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No, not necessarily. As I said he did not commit a violent crime or something that cannot restore his victim to their original state.

Yes it is confusing at times. I have actually found that studying the Law of Moses has helped me sort out SOME of the dilemmas.
But aren't we free of the laws of Moses? As stated in both Romans and Paul? I ask because I an genuinely trying to understand. A Lot had occurred lately that brings up very interesting questions.
 
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Anguspure

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But aren't we free of the laws of Moses? As stated in both Romans and Paul? I ask because I an genuinely trying to understand. A Lot had occurred lately that brings up very interesting questions.
We are free from the written Law of course. Nevertheless IMO @Hank77 is right, the Law gives great guidance and deep insight into the nature of things and can shine a light and bring confirmation as to the way the Spirit is leading you.
 
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Hank77

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But aren't we free of the laws of Moses? As stated in both Romans and Paul? I ask because I an genuinely trying to understand. A Lot had occurred lately that brings up very interesting questions.
Yes we are freed from the Law of Moses', but that does not change the fact that we can learn from it. Common law contains some of the very same principles found in the Law of Moses'.
 
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Kenny'sID

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The guideline for dealing with sort of thing is given by Jesus:
“If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church. And if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

I'm not sure that works here. A case could be raised this is not the OP's brother, and it's not possible for her to treat him as as a tax collector and still go to bed with him...if for no other reason. The mentioned laws against testifying against a spouse kind of substantiates that.
 
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Kenny'sID

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As of late my husband has been on a. "No one is going to tell me what to do bender". His resentment at being told to live a certain way to be a considered a good Christian has exploded and now he doesn't seem to care what people think of him. As a result he is now doing things that are actually illegal and he justifies with "if hillary doesn't have to follow the law why should i?".
Yesterday we were visited by the sheriff's office because my husband was suspected of cutting a Denver Boot off of his truck two days ago. Of course when the deputies were at the door he denied doing the deed and was extremely disrespectful towards the officers. He kept insisting he had no idea what they were talking about and insinuated that the deputies' time was better served staking out the local Shipley's. He further insinuated that on the day in question he was at the home of the mother of one of the deputies servicing her in a sexual nature, there by preventing him from parking in the area in question. His theory was this was just the "man" trying to hold him down.
The officers to their credit let my husband's disrespectful remarks just roll off but they confronted him with the observation that an angle grinder was in pain view in his vehicle on the floor boards. Again he denied the allegations and asked that the officers return only if they have a warrent.
When the deputies left I asked him what the hell was wrong with him and if he didn't do it he should just answer the questions without any unsolicited commentary. That's when he took me into his workshop and showed me the boot. He told me that he parked at the local university and was booted due to unpaid tickets (why was my husband at the University? He was representing his company for a career fair, I am sure that his company would find this extremely amusing if it got back to them:swoon:).
So yeah, not only did he break the law but he lied to law enforcement. What would be the right thing to do? On our wedding I swore before our families and God to Love, HONOR, and OBEY my husband. But on the other hand Jesus taught us to obey the laws of man and to have reverence for civil authorities. Do I turn my husband in for this? Do I just close my eyes and consider this not my problem?
My husband isn't a bad guy, I understand why he is acting up right now. In all honesty what he is doing is childish rather than malicious or wicked. So would it be better in the long run for me to turn him in or be a party to his lies?

I wouldn't minimize this too much, but you are the one in the situation so, maybe you are seeing something else in him not really being a bad guy.

I agree with not turning him in..just not a good idea. And the idea you liked by another poster, I agree. Not only will that handle it, but they might very well figure out who sent it to them and calm down over the issue.

As to what to do to fix the overall problem, I want to say patience, at least for now, but that doesn't seem like enough...maybe though...at least for the immediate future.
 
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What a strange situation to be in ...

You say that you know why your husband is acting this way? You don't need to tell us here, but such a strong sense of rebellion growing within him is spiritually not good for him. And as his wife, your highest priority where he is concerned should be what is best for him spiritually.

Stopping whatever is motivating the rebellion, getting him to come to his senses, and take responsibility for his actions in general is the best thing you can do for him.

But as for how to work toward that, without knowing what is motivating him or what kind of personality either of you have, that's difficult for anyone to advise online. And it sounds like your church is too confused to offer concrete guidance.

Would you be open to a Christian counselor? Someone in another church who might be better at giving guidance? Do you already know how to help him? I don't have a suggestion, but that should be the first priority.

And ideally, if he gets himself straightened out, that may be evidenced by his willingness to make things right.

But without real tools at your disposal, I don't know how to tell you to proceed. And if this kind of behavior continues, it probably won't be long before he has real run-ins with the law. But to disrespect the officers and break the law in the way you describe is a SERIOUS red flag regarding his spiritual state, in my opinion.
 
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evoeth

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As of late my husband has been on a. "No one is going to tell me what to do bender". His resentment at being told to live a certain way to be a considered a good Christian has exploded and now he doesn't seem to care what people think of him. As a result he is now doing things that are actually illegal and he justifies with "if hillary doesn't have to follow the law why should i?".

Reading your posts the last few weeks, it sounds like you have been watching your husband come off the rails.

So yeah, not only did he break the law but he lied to law enforcement. What would be the right thing to do? On our wedding I swore before our families and God to Love, HONOR, and OBEY my husband. But on the other hand Jesus taught us to obey the laws of man and to have reverence for civil authorities. Do I turn my husband in for this? Do I just close my eyes and consider this not my problem?
My husband isn't a bad guy, I understand why he is acting up right now. In all honesty what he is doing is childish rather than malicious or wicked. So would it be better in the long run for me to turn him in or be a party to his lies?

I wouldn't necessarily turn him in, but you should decide how much it's bothering you, to what degree this behavior would effect your relationship with him, and talk to him about it. Oh, and maybe talk to a therapist too.
 
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lambkisses

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What a strange situation to be in ...

You say that you know why your husband is acting this way? You don't need to tell us here, but such a strong sense of rebellion growing within him is spiritually not good for him. And as his wife, your highest priority where he is concerned should be what is best for him spiritually.

Stopping whatever is motivating the rebellion, getting him to come to his senses, and take responsibility for his actions in general is the best thing you can do for him.

But as for how to work toward that, without knowing what is motivating him or what kind of personality either of you have, that's difficult for anyone to advise online. And it sounds like your church is too confused to offer concrete guidance.

Would you be open to a Christian counselor? Someone in another church who might be better at giving guidance? Do you already know how to help him? I don't have a suggestion, but that should be the first priority.

And ideally, if he gets himself straightened out, that may be evidenced by his willingness to make things right.

But without real tools at your disposal, I don't know how to tell you to proceed. And if this kind of behavior continues, it probably won't be long before he has real run-ins with the law. But to disrespect the officers and break the law in the way you describe is a SERIOUS red flag regarding his spiritual state, in my opinion.
The breaking point it seemed was when I asked him for money to help a friend in need. I detailed what happened in my first thread here. He did agree to go to marriage counseling and we did go to a Christian counselor who is also a psychologist. We delved into why he felt the way he felt and it turns out he was feeling very resentful towards Christian expectations. His parents are Chinese Christians who were very poor and practiced a very strict interpretation of evangelical Christianity. So now that he is an adult he is extremely bitter over some of the things he missed out on due to his strict upbringing. I guess when I asked him to put off a purchase to free up some money to help a friend the dam just burst and he realized that everything he was doing was out of sheer habit and that he wasn't going to do it anymore. It really is a shame because before his break every one in the church loved him.
 
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