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Help cure my Catholic ignorance!

Discussion in 'One Bread, One Body - Catholic' started by New Creation, Aug 17, 2003.

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  1. pax

    pax Veteran

    That series is unbelievably good. The first time I thought it was kind of boring because if the camera stays in one place for too long I start to lose focus while watching television, but he is an amazing preacher. The way he explains it makes the stuff in the Catechism seem easier to grasp.
  2. Benedicta00

    Benedicta00 Well-Known Member

    You can listen to the entire series on EWTN's web site, audio library, you can listen to any series they have at any time.
  3. Avila

    Avila Boohoo moomoo, cebu

    New Creation - I'm sorry that your heart got heavy when your friend mentioned that you were interested in Catholicism just to study it. I have a feeling you probably won't think that way, once you've studied it more!! ;) The Holy Spirit has a way of leading people to the Catholic Church that way! :D Good luck on your quest!
  4. Filia Mariae

    Filia Mariae Senior Contributor

    New Creation,

    You've already gotten some excellent responses, but I just wanted to add that www.scripturecatholic.com provides excellent scriptural support for Catholicism.

    Keep us updated on your journey!

    In Christ,
  5. New Creation

    New Creation *Practise Promiscuous Charity*

    Hi folks, me again. I'm so excited I feel like a little kid.

    Ok, clarification this time. Genesis 1:22 is referring to animals only, is it not? I just saw Gen. 1:28 where God tells man and maid to multiply and fill the earth and subdue it. Is that it?

    Thank you Jeffrey for those books. I"m so looking forward to reading them. I printed out the Pillar of Fire Pillar of truth booklet and will be reading that tonight before I go to sleep. which is real soon.

    God bless you all.
  6. panterapat

    panterapat Praise God in all things!

    New Creation,

    As Catholics we believe:

    Peter was our first pope and there is a sucession of popes from Peter to the present John Paul II.

    For 1000 years after Jesus ascended, there was only one Christian Church and it is the Catholic Church. The Earstern and Western Churches split at this time but both were and are Catholic.

    In the year 300AD the Catholic Council of Hippo gathered the Jewish Scriptures and the letters written to various churches as well as the many gospels written by that time (including the gospel of Thomas). This Council then determined which of these writings were inspired of God. (Thomas' gospel did not make the cut) These inspired writings were then compiled into one book which was called the Bible. So you see, the Catholic Church existed before the Bible and created the Bible.

    In the 16th Century the first non-Catholic Christian churches formed when Martin Luther broke away. Others broke away from him and on and on it went until today we have thousands of Christian churches. Christ prayed that we may all be one as He and the Father are one. So we Catholic call our seperated brethern home to the Catholic Church.

    The very core of Catholic belief is the real presence of Jesus' Body, Blood, soul, and Divinity in the Most Holy Eucharist. There is nothing so sublime on earth as receiving Jesus in the Eucharist.

    Prayerfully read John 6. People walked away when Jesus talked of eating His Flesh and drinking His Blood. Jesus did not call them back, but repeated Himself several times. "Unless you eat my Flesh and drink My blood, you have no life in you." Jesus then turned to his apostles and said, "will you leave me also?" Peter answered, "To whom shall we go? You have the words of Eternal Life."

    Catholics believe that the Catholic Church has the words of Eternal Life. And we are guided by three things: Sacred Tradition, The Bible, and the Holy Spirit.

    In Christ, Patrick
  7. KennySe

    KennySe Habemus Papam!

    Peace be with you, New Creation.

    22 IS about animals and 28 IS about people.

    By the way, somewhere on this thread you posted about wanting a complete Bible.
    Here's one online, the Douay-Rheims, for you to peruse. http://www.scriptours.com/bible/
  8. New Creation

    New Creation *Practise Promiscuous Charity*

    Thank you Kenny, I'll read that Bible tonight. (funny girl, isn't she?)

    I have another question, though it seems stupid.
    I"m reading the Pillar of Fire booklet. I am at the part about penance.
    "Through our confession of sins to a priest, God's minister, we have our sins forgiven, and we receive grace to help us resist future temptations."

    Can we only be forgiven through a priest? Can we not just confess to Jesus? that is what I have been doing these last 6 months. Although, psychologically,it makes more sense to me to confess to another person as well. and I know it does say to confess your sins to one another in the Bible.
  9. nyj

    nyj Goodbye, my puppy

    I must've grabbed the wrong verse. Sorry about that. I see someone else has correct my mistake though.
  10. JeffreyLloyd

    JeffreyLloyd Ave Maria, Gratia plena! Supporter

    What was the main reason Jesus came to Earth? Why did God take on human flesh and become a man? - We were all in need of salvation. So, Jesus, God in flesh became a man, to save us from our sins, when you come down to it, He came to forgive our sins. That was God's sole reason for sending Jesus, correct?

    Now, let me set the scene. It's right after Jesus' resurrection. Jesus has died on the cross and has risen from the grave. He has concurred death! He then appears to his disciples and says, "Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, so I send you." (John 20:21). Then Jesus did something VERY important. Something God did way back in Genesis: He breathed on them, and said "Receive the holy Spirit." (John 20:22).

    So what has happened to far? We have Jesus, right after his glorious resurrection. Telling his disciples (the very first priests), he is going to send them as God has sent Him. He then breathes on them and says, "Receive the holy Spirit." You know something very important is about to happen. but what? Sacred Scripture tells us in the very next verse:

    In order for the apostles to exercise this gift of forgiving sins, the penitents must orally confess their sins to them because the apostles are not mind readers. The text makes this very clear.

    Sacred Scripture tells us there is, "..one mediator between God and the human race, Christ Jesus.." (1 Tim. 2:5), As Catholics we acknowledge, Christ is the only mediator, but He was free to decide how His mediation would be applied to us. The Lord chose to use priests of God to carry out His work of forgiveness.

    The Old Testament law is a shadow of the new things to come (Hebrews 10:1). What is a shadow? An outline of the actual thing! We can see that the Old Covenant, God used priests to forgive and atone for the sins of others. (Lev. 5:4-6; 19:21-22). Now we have Jesus under the New Covenant showing us the fulfillment of this by granting the authority to forgive sins to his disciples.

    St. James also tells us the confession must be done orally in James 5:16. We also see this in Acts 19:18, Matt. 3:6; Mark 1:5

    We have something called venial sins and mortal sins. Venial sins are minor ones, like those mentioned in 1 John 5:16-17; Luke 12:47-48, this has been the teaching of the Catholic Church for over 2,000 years, but, today, most Protestants no longer agree that there is such a distinction. Mortal sins lead to death and must be absolved in the sacrament of reconciliation. Venial sins do not have to be confessed to a priest, but the pious Catholic practice is to do so in order to advance in our journey to holiness.

    Again in Matt. 5:19 Jesus teaches that breaking the least of commandments is venial sin (the person is still saved but is least in the kingdom), versus mortal sin (the person is not saved).

    There is a lot more to it then this, and if you really want to understand why Catholics believe it is biblical to confess your sins to a priest, check out Scott Hahn's book: "Lord Have Mercy."
  11. JeffreyLloyd

    JeffreyLloyd Ave Maria, Gratia plena! Supporter

    Church fathers and Confession

    Are all of our sins—past, present, and future—forgiven once and for all when we become Christians? Not according to the Bible or the early Church Fathers. Scripture nowhere states that our future sins are forgiven; instead, it teaches us to pray, "And forgive us our debts, as we also have forgiven our debtors" (Matt. 6:12).

    The means by which God forgives sins after baptism is confession: "If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness" (1 John 1:9). Minor or venial sins can be confessed directly to God, but for grave or mortal sins, which crush the spiritual life out of the soul, God has instituted a different means for obtaining forgiveness—the sacrament known popularly as confession, penance, or reconciliation.

    This sacrament is rooted in the mission God gave to Christ in his capacity as the Son of man on earth to go and forgive sins (cf. Matt. 9:6). Thus, the crowds who witnessed this new power "glorified God, who had given such authority to men" (Matt. 9:8; note the plural "men"). After his resurrection, Jesus passed on his mission to forgive sins to his ministers, telling them, "As the Father has sent me, even so I send you. . . . Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained" (John 20:21–23).

    Since it is not possible to confess all of our many daily faults, we know that sacramental reconciliation is required only for grave or mortal sins—but it is required, or Christ would not have commanded it.
    Over time, the forms in which the sacrament has been administered have changed. In the early Church, publicly known sins (such as apostasy) were often confessed openly in church, though private confession to a priest was always an option for privately committed sins. Still, confession was not just something done in silence to God alone, but something done "in church," as the Didache (A.D. 70) indicates.

    Penances also tended to be performed before rather than after absolution, and they were much more strict than those of today (ten years’ penance for abortion, for example, was common in the early Church).

    But the basics of the sacrament have always been there, as the following quotations reveal. Of special significance is their recognition that confession and absolution must be received by a sinner before receiving Holy Communion, for "[w]hoever . . . eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord" (1 Cor. 11:27).

    The Didache
    "Confess your sins in church, and do not go up to your prayer with an evil conscience. This is the way of life. . . . On the Lord’s Day gather together, break bread, and give thanks, after confessing your transgressions so that your sacrifice may be pure" (Didache 4:14, 14:1 [A.D. 70]).

    The Letter of Barnabas
    "You shall judge righteously. You shall not make a schism, but you shall pacify those that contend by bringing them together. You shall confess your sins. You shall not go to prayer with an evil conscience. This is the way of light" (Letter of Barnabas 19 [A.D. 74]).

    Ignatius of Antioch
    "For as many as are of God and of Jesus Christ are also with the bishop. And as many as shall, in the exercise of penance, return into the unity of the Church, these, too, shall belong to God, that they may live according to Jesus Christ" (Letter to the Philadelphians 3 [A.D. 110]).
    "For where there is division and wrath, God does not dwell. To all them that repent, the Lord grants forgiveness, if they turn in penitence to the unity of God, and to communion with the bishop" (ibid., 8).

    "[The Gnostic disciples of Marcus] have deluded many women. . . . Their consciences have been branded as with a hot iron. Some of these women make a public confession, but others are ashamed to do this, and in silence, as if withdrawing from themselves the hope of the life of God, they either apostatize entirely or hesitate between the two courses" (Against Heresies 1:22 [A.D. 189]).

    "[Regarding confession, some] flee from this work as being an exposure of themselves, or they put it off from day to day. I presume they are more mindful of modesty than of salvation, like those who contract a disease in the more shameful parts of the body and shun making themselves known to the physicians; and thus they perish along with their own bashfulness" (Repentance 10:1 [A.D. 203]).

    "[The bishop conducting the ordination of the new bishop shall pray:] God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ. . . . Pour forth now that power which comes from you, from your royal Spirit, which you gave to your beloved Son, Jesus Christ, and which he bestowed upon his holy apostles . . . and grant this your servant, whom you have chosen for the episcopate, [the power] to feed your holy flock and to serve without blame as your high priest, ministering night and day to propitiate unceasingly before your face and to offer to you the gifts of your holy Church, and by the Spirit of the high priesthood to have the authority to forgive sins, in accord with your command" (Apostolic Tradition 3 [A.D. 215]).

    "[A final method of forgiveness], albeit hard and laborious [is] the remission of sins through penance, when the sinner . . . does not shrink from declaring his sin to a priest of the Lord and from seeking medicine, after the manner of him who say, ‘I said, "To the Lord I will accuse myself of my iniquity"’" (Homilies on Leviticus 2:4 [A.D. 248]).

    Cyprian of Carthage

    "The apostle [Paul] likewise bears witness and says: ‘ . . . Whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord’ [1 Cor. 11:27]. But [the impenitent] spurn and despise all these warnings; before their sins are expiated, before they have made a confession of their crime, before their conscience has been purged in the ceremony and at the hand of the priest . . . they do violence to [the Lord’s] body and blood, and with their hands and mouth they sin against the Lord more than when they denied him" (The Lapsed 15:1–3 (A.D. 251]).

    "Of how much greater faith and salutary fear are they who . . . confess their sins to the priests of God in a straightforward manner and in sorrow, making an open declaration of conscience. . . . I beseech you, brethren, let everyone who has sinned confess his sin while he is still in this world, while his confession is still admissible, while the satisfaction and remission made through the priests are still pleasing before the Lord" (ibid., 28).

    "inners may do penance for a set time, and according to the rules of discipline come to public confession, and by imposition of the hand of the bishop and clergy receive the right of Communion. [But now some] with their time [of penance] still unfulfilled . . . they are admitted to Communion, and their name is presented; and while the penitence is not yet performed, confession is not yet made, the hands of the bishop and clergy are not yet laid upon them, the Eucharist is given to them; although it is written, ‘Whosoever shall eat the bread and drink the cup of the Lord unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord’ [1 Cor. 11:27]" (Letters 9:2 [A.D. 253]).

    "And do not think, dearest brother, that either the courage of the brethren will be lessened, or that martyrdoms will fail for this cause, that penance is relaxed to the lapsed, and that the hope of peace [i.e., absolution] is offered to the penitent. . . . For to adulterers even a time of repentance is granted by us, and peace is given" (ibid., 51[55]:20).
    "But I wonder that some are so obstinate as to think that repentance is not to be granted to the lapsed, or to suppose that pardon is to be denied to the penitent, when it is written, ‘Remember whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works’ [Rev. 2:5], which certainly is said to him who evidently has fallen, and whom the Lord exhorts to rise up again by his deeds [of penance], because it is written, ‘Alms deliver from death’ [Tob. 12:9]" (ibid., 51[55]:22).

    Aphraahat the Persian Sage
    "You [priests], then, who are disciples of our illustrious physician [Christ], you ought not deny a curative to those in need of healing. And if anyone uncovers his wound before you, give him the remedy of repentance. And he that is ashamed to make known his weakness, encourage him so that he will not hide it from you. And when he has revealed it to you, do not make it public, lest because of it the innocent might be reckoned as guilty by our enemies and by those who hate us" (Treatises 7:3 [A.D. 340]).

    Basil the Great
    "It is necessary to confess our sins to those to whom the dispensation of God’s mysteries is entrusted. Those doing penance of old are found to have done it before the saints. It is written in the Gospel that they confessed their sins to John the Baptist [Matt. 3:6], but in Acts [19:18] they confessed to the apostles" (Rules Briefly Treated 288 [A.D. 374]).

    John Chrysostom
    "Priests have received a power which God has given neither to angels nor to archangels. It was said to them: ‘Whatsoever you shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatsoever you shall loose, shall be loosed.’ Temporal rulers have indeed the power of binding; but they can only bind the body. Priests, in contrast, can bind with a bond which pertains to the soul itself and transcends the very heavens. Did [God] not give them all the powers of heaven? ‘Whose sins you shall forgive,’ he says, ‘they are forgiven them; whose sins you shall retain, they are retained.’ What greater power is there than this? The Father has given all judgment to the Son. And now I see the Son placing all this power in the hands of men [Matt. 10:40; John 20:21–23]. They are raised to this dignity as if they were already gathered up to heaven" (The Priesthood 3:5 [A.D. 387]).

    Ambrose of Milan
    "For those to whom [the right of binding and loosing] has been given, it is plain that either both are allowed, or it is clear that neither is allowed. Both are allowed to the Church, neither is allowed to heresy. For this right has been granted to priests only" (Penance 1:1 [A.D. 388]).

    "If the serpent, the devil, bites someone secretly, he infects that person with the venom of sin. And if the one who has been bitten keeps silence and does not do penance, and does not want to confess his wound . . . then his brother and his master, who have the word [of absolution] that will cure him, cannot very well assist him" (Commentary on Ecclesiastes 10:11 [A.D. 388]).

    "We read in Leviticus about lepers, where they are ordered to show themselves to the priests, and if they have leprosy, then they are to be declared unclean by the priest. . . . Just as in the Old Testament the priest makes the leper clean or unclean, so in the New Testament the bishop or presbyter binds or looses not those who are innocent or guilty, but by reason of their office, when they have heard various kinds of sins, they know who is to be bound and who is to be loosed" (Commentary on Matthew 3:16:19 [A.D. 398]).


    "When you shall have been baptized, keep to a good life in the commandments of God so that you may preserve your baptism to the very end. I do not tell you that you will live here without sin, but they are venial sins which this life is never without. Baptism was instituted for all sins. For light sins, without which we cannot live, prayer was instituted. . . . But do not commit those sins on account of which you would have to be separated from the body of Christ. Perish the thought! For those whom you see doing penance have committed crimes, either adultery or some other enormities. That is why they are doing penance. If their sins were light, daily prayer would suffice to blot them out. . . . In the Church, therefore, there are three ways in which sins are forgiven: in baptisms, in prayer, and in the greater humility of penance" (Sermon to Catechumens on the Creed 7:15, 8:16 [A.D. 395]).
  12. JeffreyLloyd

    JeffreyLloyd Ave Maria, Gratia plena! Supporter

    oh and I mailed your books today New Creation. I also added in an extra gift! Hope they all help!

    God Bless!
  13. Zephyr

    Zephyr New Member



    I highly recommend "Conversations With God" by Neale Donald Walsh
  14. New Creation

    New Creation *Practise Promiscuous Charity*

    If (when) I go to a Catholic Mass this weekend, will a priest hear my confession even though I am not Catholic?
    I was baptized on Palm Sunday this year- not by a Cathoic priest. I gave myself to Christ. Were my sins up to that point forgiven? What is my current status?
  15. New Creation

    New Creation *Practise Promiscuous Charity*

    Thanks Jeff!
  16. JeffreyLloyd

    JeffreyLloyd Ave Maria, Gratia plena! Supporter

    Yes all your sins were forgiven. So when the time is right for confession, all you have to confess is all mortal sins you make from the time of your baptism until yout confession.

    However, you can't go to a priest just yet.
  17. Aaron-Aggie

    Aaron-Aggie Legend

    New Creation, Most churches do confession on a different day the Sunday.

    However Jeffery is right, although any priest would be more then glad to talk to you about your sins, you can not receive the sacrament of forgiveness. Non Catholics can only receive the sacrament is do to appending death or just prior to entering the church. The main reason for this is that to receive forgiveness you must completely profess your sins to the priest. If are not instructed in the teachings of the church it is impossible for you to submit to its teachings and thus profess your sins. Hopeful some one else can make a better description of this.
  18. JeffreyLloyd

    JeffreyLloyd Ave Maria, Gratia plena! Supporter

    Going to confession will be one of the last steps in RCIA right before you make your first communion.
  19. KennySe

    KennySe Habemus Papam!

    Peace of Christ to you, New Creation. :)

    (I'm Catholic and this post might be a bit awkward for the readers.)

    Don't worry about Catholic Confession right now; everything happens on God's time and not our own.

    I applaud your eagerness, but there's no neeed to "panic" or rush things. Go to a Mass, and speak with a priest, read God's Holy Word, read all the websites and books, watch some EWTN on the tube, ask questions, ... and most of all, PRAY to the Lord that He will guide you and protect you and hold you in His Love and Peace.

    Go with the flow.

    God bless you,
  20. New Creation

    New Creation *Practise Promiscuous Charity*


    Jeffery Lloyd did a great thing in sending me those books and a rosary. I read them voraciously and knew I was hearing the truth.

    I backed away from it all though, only months later because I was afraid that I would not be able to marry my boyfriend, Lloyd as I had been previously married and was not divorced.

    I knew what Scripture said and I didn't want to hear it. I listened to my (also previously divorced) Anglican priest and divorced my first husband and then married Lloyd in the Anglican Church.

    Fast forward two years. We had a beautiful little girl Meaghan, a wonderful church life and I discovered I was pregnant again. But before you know it, my fallopian tube burst, and because we live in a remote area, I almost bled to death. We lost our son. As I lay awake on the operating table, wondering if I'd wake up again, I wished for a priest. I prayed for mercy.

    God really used this episode to jolt me into reality. Within a very short time, I knew I had to come home to the Church. And we did. We began going to Mass in Dec. 2007. My daughter was baptized Catholic in Jan. 2008. I have been in RCIA since last June. A friend from Opus Dei comes monthly to teach me and other friends faith formation classes. I love the Catholic Church so very very much. I have never been so rich.

    The annulment process was started immediately but we don't know if the first marriage will be annulled. No matter. We know the truth and finally live it. Lloyd and I live as brother and sister and will continue to do so even if the marriage is not annulled. We are hopeful that it WILL happen and that we will be married in the Church.

    Most importantly, I will be received into the Church at the Easter Vigil. I am so close, I am physically longing for His body. God used this forum, One Bread, One Body and the people here to bring me home and I am eternally grateful. :crossrc:

    Better late than never. ;)
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