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Hebrews 8 shows us that Christ gave the TEN Commandments - Christ's Commandments

Discussion in 'Sabbath and The Law' started by BobRyan, Jul 29, 2021.

  1. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    How do you interpret the following verse?

    1 Corinthians 14:37
    If anyone thinks he is a prophet or spiritual, let him recognize that the things which I write to you are the Lord’s commandment.
     
  2. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    It is a problem when reference to Hebrews 8:7-12 is made, but the verse which ends the passage is ignored.

    Heb 8:13 In that He says, "A NEW COVENANT," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.


    .
     
  3. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member Supporter

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    I think your problem is not reading the posts each time I answer that point.

    I have made it really easy to see the point.

    1. All lost people are lost under the old Covenant stated in Gal 3 as "obey and live". It was the same covenant Adam and Eve lived under and it condemned them instantly once they fell into sin. It still does that same thing today as Rom 3:19-20 points out.

    (I don't see how this could be made any simpler)

    2. All the saved - are saved under the one Gospel covenant - the Jer 31:31-34 "New Covenant" that provides for forgiveness of sins.

    Only 1 Gospel Gal 1:6-9, that Gospel was "preached to Abraham" Gal 3:8 and this is the only way Moses and Elijah stand "with Christ in glory" in Matt 17 - before the cross even happens.

    That means that the saved are no longer condemned under the old "obey and live" covenant - the old Covenant - and they are now born again saints under the New Covenant. So it has nothing at all to do with "deleting the command to not take God's name in vain for Christians" - as we can all see clearly

    Each time you ignore this and then claim that Heb 8:13 somehow refutes it - your logic is shown to have a gap in it.
     
  4. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member Supporter

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    As fully inline with Paul's command to OBEY God's commandments which he quotes from in Rom 13 declaring them into include "Do not covet" Rom 7, and declares to have "' Honor your father and mother' as the first commandment WITH a promise" Eph 6:2 since as we see in Heb 8 it is Christ the LORD giving HIS Commandments at Sinai.

    When Christ quotes from Moses in Matt 22 "Love God with all your heart" Deut 6:5 and "Love your neighbor as yourself" Lev 19:18 all the Jews fully agree with him that all of scripture is firmly grounded in those two commandments.

    No wonder Christ teaches people not to imagine He came to delete His Commandments in Matt 5.
     
  5. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member Supporter

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    Not for those who read Heb 8 as the OP points out.

    Since you are avoiding those details - would you like me to quote the text again?
     
  6. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

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    Absolutely not.

    The verse below reveals the fact that the Sinai Covenant was not given at an earlier time.

    Deu 5:3 The LORD did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us, those who are here today, all of us who are alive.


    .
     
  7. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    CLUE: THE TEXT DOES NOT SAY WHAT YOUR EDIT AND COMMENTARY IS SAYING. Post the text without your edit.
    I don't agree with your edit and commentary of the Heb 8 to say that Christ gave the law at Sinai.
    Heb 8:1 Say "Here is what we're talking about: Jesus is Our High Priest and Mediator of the better Covenant.

    Somehow, you're talking about Jesus being the lawgiver at Sinai and not one text say that.


    Heb 8:1¶Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens;

    Heb 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.

    It's talking about the post cross and current ministry of Jesus Christ, who resurrected from the dead, and became Mediator and High Priest to make intercession at the right hand of the throne.

    The fact also that Heb 8:8-12 is a direct quote from Jer 31:31-34, exposes your edit to argue that Jesus Christ gave the law at Sinai.

    You got to be joking.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2021
  8. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    So your saying Bob, that what Paul preached in 1 Corinthians was not the Lord's commandment?

    We are not talking about Romans or Ephesians, rather what Paul addressed in 1 Corinthians.
     
  9. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    I accept the fact that I'm being constantly being reported. I'll try to be less personal. No one should be able to constantly edit the scriptures. Commenting before or after posted text seems reasonable, but editing words from the bible should also be a violation.
     
  10. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    Paul was chosen by the resurrected Christ as an Apostle, to write and teach all the doctrines of Christianity. Paul's epistles contains all the commandments of Jesus Christ.
    The answer to your question is, We must acknowledge that Paul was chosen to teach and write Jesus commandments.
    Paul's letters to the Corinthians are not isolated partail quotes that contradicts the gospel.
     
  11. guevaraj

    guevaraj an oil seller in the story of the ten virgins Supporter

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    Brother, God with Paul has continued in the new covenant the Sabbath in Hebrews 3 and 4 as I highlight in my thread titled: "Hebrews 3 and 4 is God's weekly Sabbath for everyone!". Those before Jesus "whose corpses lay in the wilderness" could not have entered what was still future. We must enter the "rest" in which they had not entered for 40 years by "oath" due to their disobedience. The only "rest" available to them as for us is the "rest" on the Sabbath.

    And who made God angry for forty years? Wasn’t it the people who sinned, whose corpses lay in the wilderness? And to whom was God speaking when he took an oath that they would never enter his rest? Wasn’t it the people who disobeyed him? So we see that because of their unbelief they were not able to enter his rest. (Hebrews 3:17-19 NLT)​

    The "rest" they could have entered into as we "can" is the Sabbath "rest".

    For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” (Hebrews 4:3-4 NLT)​

    United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
     
  12. guevaraj

    guevaraj an oil seller in the story of the ten virgins Supporter

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    Brother, Jesus reveals below: He is the one they heard on the mountain and Moses saw the finger writing the ten commandments. The ten commandments are commandments of Jesus.

    And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form, (John 5:37 NIV)​

    According to Jesus, the law remains until accomplished is "everything", giving us the plural commandments.

    “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven. (Matthew 5:17-20 NIV)​

    Therefore, His commandments (plural) include the previous ten commandments and whatever else He adds to them: the singular commandment below. What's "new" about this added commandment below: Jesus gave His life for His friends. I think of missionaries who give up a privileged life to live and help the less privileged among us. This added commandment is part of the commandments of His Father, that Jesus now adds to His own ten commandments written by His own finger before the incarnation.

    A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” (John 13:34-35 NIV)​

    United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge
     
  13. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member Supporter

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    BobRyan said:
    1. All lost people are lost under the old Covenant stated in Gal 3 as "obey and live". It was the same covenant Adam and Eve lived under and it condemned them instantly once they fell into sin. It still does that same thing today as Rom 3:19-20 points out.

    (I don't see how this could be made any simpler)

    Read Gal 3.

    Then come back and let us know if you still feel that way.

    That verse did NOT say "it used to be just fine to - take God's name in vain.. until Sinai"
    That verse did NOT say "it used to be ok to steal and dishonor parents -- until Sinai"

    What it says is that God did not setup a nation covenant - a theocracy before Sinai. It did NOT say "it used to be ok to take God's name in vain".

    It is hard to see how this detail would be at all confusing.
     
  14. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member Supporter

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    What I am saying is that "ALL scripture is given by inspiration from God AND is to be used for doctrine" 2 Tim 3:16.

    Is this not in line with your POV???

    Hint: exegesis includes the same writer writing on the same topic in his other letters. I assume you are opposed to exegesis from your apparent rejection to it.
     
  15. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member Supporter

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    Not for those who read Heb 8 as the OP points out.

    Since you are avoiding those details - would you like me to quote the text again?

    1 Now the main point in what has been said is this: we have such a high priest, who has taken His seat at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens, 2 a minister in the sanctuary and in the true tabernacle, which the Lord set up, not man... 6 But now He (Christ) has obtained a more excellent ministry, to the extent that He (Christ) is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises.

    A New Covenant
    7 For if that first covenant had been free of fault, no circumstances would have been sought for a second. 8 For in finding fault with the people, He (Christ) says,

    “Behold, days are coming, says the Lord (Christ),
    When I (Christ) will bring about a new covenant
    With the house of Israel and the house of Judah,
    9 Not like the covenant which I (Christ) made with their fathers
    On the day I (Christ) took them by the hand
    To bring them out of the land of Egypt;
    For they did not continue in My covenant,
    And I (Christ) did not care about them, says the Lord (Christ).
    10 For this is the covenant which I (Christ) will make with the house of Israel
    After those days, declares the Lord:
    I (Christ) will put My (Christ) laws into their minds,
    And write them on their hearts.
    And I (Christ) will be their God,
    And they shall be My (Christ) people.
    11 And they will not teach, each one his fellow citizen,
    And each one his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’
    For they will all know Me (Christ),
    From the least to the greatest of them.
    12 For I (Christ) will be merciful toward their wrongdoings,
    And their sins I (Christ) will no longer remember.”

    ==========================

    you have free will and can reject everything in the text as you wish. I am simply posting the obvious.
     
  16. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    You must recognize the commandments of Christ are a different set to the ten commandments.

    Paul the apostle delivers the commandments of Christ to the church in Corinth.

    Let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord. (1 Corinthians 14:37)

    If one is truly a prophet, a spiritual man, he will clearly see that, concerning speaking with tongues and prophesying, morality and love. That these commands of Christ, and are to be esteemed as such, being delivered under the influence of the Holy Spirit.

    1 Corinthians 7:19-20
    Circumcision (the law) is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but what matters is the keeping of the commandments of God.

    If anyone rejects these commandments of Christ, then they themselves are to be rejected by the church! (1 Corinthians 14:38)

    Do you recognize the commandments of the Christ?
     
  17. SabbathBlessings

    SabbathBlessings Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The commandments of God include God's Ten Commandments. A new commandment does not automatically delete previous commandments and the verse you quote from does not say "these are the only commandments"

    Jesus and the disciples quote directly from the Ten Commandments Matthew 19:16-18, James 2:10-11, Revelations 22:15. Jesus said we break the least of the commandments and teach others you will be least in heaven Matthew 5:19 I do not agree least means you will be there, not a gamble I would want to take. God's will for us is the same in heaven as it is on this earth

    Matthew 6:9
    Our Father in heaven,
    Hallowed be Your name.
    10 Your kingdom come.
    Your will be done
    On earth as it is in heaven.

    Psalms 40:8 I delight to do Your will, O my God, And Your law is within my heart.”

    Revelations 11:19 Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple.

    We all know what is in the ark of the covenant. God's holy laws that He both spoke and wrote with His own finger. This is God's will for us and if you do not agree you're argument is not with anyone on this forum. We all have will have to answer to Jesus upon His return. We have time to change our ways and walk in the path that Jesus left for us. Jesus taught all about the Sabbath, said it was made for us, went to Temple on the Sabbath reading scriptures.

    Luke 4:16 So He came to Nazareth, where He had been brought up. And as His custom was, He went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up to read. 17 And He was handed the book of the prophet Isaiah. And when He had opened the book, He found the place where it was written:
    18 “The Spirit of the Lord is upon Me,
    Because He has anointed Me
    To preach the gospel to the poor;
    He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted,
    To proclaim liberty to the captives
    And recovery of sight to the blind,
    To set at liberty those who are oppressed;
    19 To proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord.”
    20 Then He closed the book, and gave it back to the attendant and sat down. And the eyes of all who were in the synagogue were fixed on Him. 21 And He began to say to them, “Today this Scripture is fulfilled in your hearing.” 22 So all bore witness to Him, and marveled at the gracious words which proceeded out of His mouth.

    Which is why the Sabbath will continue to be the holy day of the Lord thy God and the day we will worship our Lord and Savior every Sabbath in Heaven and the New Earth Isaiah 66:23

    Scripture teaches us to follow Jesus and His ways. The whole bible the Sabbath is the only day God blessed and sanctified and the day God calls His holy day. Jesus didn't teach us about the Sabbath to have the day of worship change as soon as He leaves. This is not a doctrine of the Holy Spirit given to those who obey the laws of God Acts 5:32, John 14:15-18 Jesus tells us to obey the commandments over traditions Mathew 15:3-9. There is no commandment to keep holy the first day, but there is the seventh day spoken and written by our Savior. Exodus 20:8-11
     
    Last edited: Sep 15, 2021
  18. Cribstyl

    Cribstyl Veteran

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    You are correct, but some people can only see the law and the Sabbath as the commandments. They discard Paul's subject and use his partial quotes for isolated words for their commentary.
    YES, I do and I agree with your comments.
     
  19. BobRyan

    BobRyan Junior Member Supporter

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    Paul said they include the TEN - having "'honor your father and mother' as the first commandment with a promise" Eph 6:2.

    You keep posting that we should not pay attention to this inconvenient Bible detail ... why?


    1 Corinthians 7:19-20
    Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but what matters is the keeping of the commandments of God.

    Is a contrast between ceremonial law - and that law which "defines what sin is" 1 John 3:4 that includes (as Paul says) - "do not covet" -- Romans 7.
     
  20. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    What they do not notice is that the law was given to the nation of Israel. The law merely granted the knowledge of sin and condemnation.

    Where as the Lord's commandments were given to the church and they reflect the fruit of the Holy Spirit.

    A powerful difference between these two sets of commandments.
     
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