Having the Holy Spirit, does that mean I am saved?

BNR32FAN

He’s a Way of life
Supporter
Aug 11, 2017
22,131
7,245
Dallas
✟874,307.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Are we following Christ?

Yes we fail. We all do. What do we do? If we sincerely repent, try to do better, get back up and keep following Christ, we are doing what we are supposed to be doing.

If we start thinking God is somehow obligated to overlook our sins or He will accept us anyway, and we presume on God's grace by sinning without really being concerned about it - we are starting into dangerous territory.

But if we try not to sin and repent, that is the right attitude. As long as our heart and conscience are tender and turned toward God, we know we are on the right path.

Yes there is a difference between stumbling in sin and being a slave to sin. :oldthumbsup:
 
Upvote 0

Hazelelponi

I'm back
Supporter
Jun 25, 2018
9,210
8,689
55
USA
✟676,936.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Yes I answered the question in a previous post. I believe I may have misunderstood your position. I thought your reference to Ephesians was suggesting that once we receive the Holy Spirit we are sealed into salvation. Many OSAS believers often use this passage to support their belief. Please forgive my mistake.

That's okay, I was simply responding to the OP who specifically asked this not be made into an OSAS debate, therefore, I answered in accordance to truth, and the thread creators wishes. Its a very simple question, with a clear and simple answer.
 
Upvote 0

charity1

Active Member
Aug 27, 2018
107
24
56
Caney, KS
✟9,755.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Celibate
You're using "saved" past tense. If we are still in this life, we are not yet "saved" in the way we will be when (hopefully) God speaks to each of us saying, "well done, good and faithful servant".

To "have the Holy Spirit" - would mean the grace of God is at work within a person. God wants to save people. So if we cooperate with that grace, we are being saved. We are on the path to salvation, yes. God does not abandon us. But we can abandon Him, or even refuse to cooperate and choose our selfish desires (whatever those may be) instead during life. What that might mean when we are judged could be a problem.

It's difficult to have such a discussion without the possibility of "loss of salvation" coming up, if one believes salvation to be a moment in time event that is already accomplished. We understand conversion is necessary, yes. But that is not the moment of judgement fulfilled.

But we must remember that God does desire to save people and will do so whenever He can, working patiently with each of us in our particular way.
It is hard to be saved because we humans want our own way and NOW, and 24/7

canonized saints say very few make it to Heaven. I don't have a hard time believing that at all because everywhere you look you see grievous violations of God's law in the Christian community. I think that as much as people rail against the OSAS teaching, most tend to believe in it just the same (subliminally?)... I mean, if you look around, that is what it seems.. or you have people thinking their sins are OK, but oh my.. that other person's are HORRIBLE... and etc..
 
Upvote 0

Hazelelponi

I'm back
Supporter
Jun 25, 2018
9,210
8,689
55
USA
✟676,936.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Do you believe that if the Holy Spirit leaves you, you can be renewed in the Holy Spirit?

Just because we are saved doesn't mean we won't sin. We are still imperfect man until fully reunited with God, so we are going to mess up sometimes, it's a given. Don't listen to the sinless perfection people.

When I was saved God wanted me to quit smoking, but, I was an addict. Quitting smoking was something I'd tried a 100 times and failed every time before I was saved, so in short, God asked the impossible of me.

Yet, slowly but surely I learned, learned to lean on HIS strength and not my own. I backslid a time or two, once for about 6 months and another time for a day...

But, four years down the road I am a non-smoker, which is, quite frankly, nothing short of a miracle

Was I saved during that 6 months? Yes I was still saved, and how smoking made me feel then (I felt guilty) plus the fact I did put it down again and overcome the temptation through His Help is proof of my salvation.

God is our help, He doesn't simply give up on us and walk away over spilled milk. He's not like us...

Watch this video in its entirety.

 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

aiki

Regular Member
Feb 16, 2007
10,874
4,348
Winnipeg
✟236,528.00
Country
Canada
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
I agree, but that person may have been saved.

Well, I don't hold to the notion that one can be genuinely born-again and then not. What Scripture teaches of the means and consequences of one's salvation precludes, I think, such a notion.

The question is really if a person goes back to this kind of life after being saved, is the Holy Spirit still in him?

As I've already pointed out, if a man claiming to be saved goes back to his former life of sin, in doing so he makes it clear the Holy Spirit was never in him. One is not indwelt by the Holy Spirit only to end up living like the devil. Those who believe otherwise have made the Holy Spirit entirely too weak and small in their thinking.

I'm of the belief that the Holy Spirit won't leave unless you blaspheme him. But having the Holy Spirit won't save you if you live an unrighteous life.

Who was it who blasphemed the Holy Spirit and why did they do so? No one who has trusted in Christ as their Saviour, and submitted to him as their Lord, and has been indwelt by the Holy Spirit would ever do as the wicked Pharisees did in blaspheming the Holy Spirit. It was precisely because the Pharisees hated Christ that they accused him of casting out demons by the power of Beelzebub. Those who know and love Christ - born-again believers - would never say such things.

It is entirely false to say that an unrighteous life "unsaves" a genuinely born-again person. Read 1 Corinthians 6. Paul harshly condemned the wicked behaviour of the Corinthian believers but he never described them as being unsaved. Instead, he referred to them as "saints," and "members of Christ," and "temples of the Holy Spirit," and those "bought with a price." Clearly, Paul did not think unrighteous living meant a believer had lost his salvation. Why, then, do you?

The Holy Spirit makes it possible to walk in the light, but you can choose to walk in darkness.

One can always choose the darkness. But when they have chosen the Light and are truly filled with it in the Person of the Holy Spirit, the darkness is no longer an attractive option.

Thank you for pinpointing it for me ... Actually I think you describe exactly how it is:

You are not saved by works but by faith, but you remain saved by works. No works and your faith is counted as dead.

As I said, this is not the truth. If your works keep you saved, then it is really your works that are your salvation, not Christ. Scripture, though, rejects this thinking entirely and explicitly.
 
Last edited:
  • Agree
Reactions: Hazelelponi
Upvote 0

zoidar

loves Jesus the Christ! ✝️
Supporter
Sep 18, 2010
7,164
2,606
✟877,432.00
Country
Sweden
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Actually James 2:14-26 explains this. James mentions two types of faith. A saving faith that produces works and a dead and useless faith that does not produce works and is not a saving faith. We are not saved by the works but by the type of faith that produces works. A faith that produces works is a true and genuine faith. A faith that does not produce works is not a genuine faith. The word faith is translated from the Greek word pistis which not only means to believe but also faithfulness, trustworthiness, fidelity, and loyalty. This has to do with our devotion to God. Devotion is not works it is sincerity. Our works are not attributed to us because they are from the Holy Spirit so that others may see God’s glory. Our works are attributed to God although we do receive rewards in heaven according to our deeds. Salvation being from God’s grace cannot be earned.

The thing is the same faith can in one man produce work and in another not. So as much as the Holy Spirit enables us, we still have to choose obedience. I don't think it's automatic.

A question that arise is, if we are saved by faithfulness can I then put all my trust in the cross, aren't some of that trust going to be on my own effort?

To me it seems that we are saved by trusting on the cross, but we have to be obedient for our faith to be counted as real. If so it's not the obedience that saves us but trusting on the cross of Christ.
 
Upvote 0

zoidar

loves Jesus the Christ! ✝️
Supporter
Sep 18, 2010
7,164
2,606
✟877,432.00
Country
Sweden
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
As I said, this is not the truth. If your works keep you saved, then it is really your works that are your salvation, not Christ. Scripture, though, rejects this thinking entirely and explicitly.

If you are offered a treatment for cancer, and you are obedient to go along with it. Is it you or the treatment that saves you?
 
Upvote 0

Hazelelponi

I'm back
Supporter
Jun 25, 2018
9,210
8,689
55
USA
✟676,936.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
The thing is the same faith can in one man produce work and in another not. So as much as the Holy Spirit enables us, we still have to choose obedience. I don't think it's automatic.

A question that arise is, if we are saved by faithfulness can I then put all my trust in the cross, aren't some of that trust going to be on my own effort?

To me it seems that we are saved by trusting on the cross, but we have to be obedient for our faith to be counted as real. If so it's not the obedience that saves us but trusting on the cross of Christ.

We are saved by the life, death, and resurrection of our Lord - HE paid the price that was ours to pay

Our response to that LOVE, the love given us in the gift of salvation, is our love in return.

When you love your wife you do the things that please her. Take her out to dinner sometimes, help around the house. Your whole life changes to include making her happy, as much as possible and to the best of your ability.

We respond similarly to salvation - with love. Our life changes to be considerate of what our beloved, our Savior, would be pleased with.

Top that off with the change in heart the indwelling of the Holy Spirit gives us along with a new understanding of His Word and we see a life change...

But that life change doesn't mean we stop being human... sometimes we give in to selfishness, or vanity, or a lack of humility etc.

However, a saved person will feel guilt, check themselves, if not today then at some point and with God's help get back on track. Those are things an unsaved person won't do - ever.

The prodigal son never stopped being a son.. even when he was squandering his inheritance. It was his own stubborn pride that kept him from coming home sooner.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

zoidar

loves Jesus the Christ! ✝️
Supporter
Sep 18, 2010
7,164
2,606
✟877,432.00
Country
Sweden
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
We are saved by the life, death, and resurrection of our Lord - HE paid the price that was ours to pay

Our response to that LOVE, the love given us in the gift of salvation, is our love in return.

When you love your wife you do the things that please her. Take her out to dinner sometimes, help around the house. Your whole life changes to include making her happy, as much as possible and to the best of your ability.

We respond similarly to salvation - with love. Our life changes to be considerate of what our beloved, our Savior, would be pleased with.

Top that off with the change in heart the indwelling of the Holy Spirit gives us along with a new understanding of His Word and we see a life change...

But that life change doesn't mean we stop being human... sometimes we give in to selfishness, or vanity, or a lack of humility etc.

However, a saved person will feel guilt, check themselves, if not today then at some point and with God's help get back on track. Those are things an unsaved person won't do - ever.

The prodigal son never stopped being a son.. even when he was squandering his inheritance. It was his own stubborn pride that kept him from coming home sooner.

Then what if a saved person starts living in, let say fornication. He knows it's wrong, but the temptation is too strong and he gives in to it. He wants out, but can't since he is afraid his girlfriend will leave him if he says no. So time goes by and the sense of guilt and sadness over this get less and less, and his conscience is numbed. He starts to accept that his life will be like this. Is this man still saved? This person was me.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Hazelelponi

I'm back
Supporter
Jun 25, 2018
9,210
8,689
55
USA
✟676,936.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Then what if a saved person starts living in, let say fornication. He knows it's wrong, but the temptation is too strong and he gives in to it. He wants out, but can't since he is afraid his girlfriend will leave him if he says no. So time goes by and the sense of guilt and sadness over this gets less and less, and his conscience is numbed. He starts to accept that his life will be like this. Is this man still saved? This person was me.

You said "was"... so i take it you've seen the wrong?

Certainly If you ignore the Holy Spirit long enough you eventually stop hearing Him..

There is still a path home.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

zoidar

loves Jesus the Christ! ✝️
Supporter
Sep 18, 2010
7,164
2,606
✟877,432.00
Country
Sweden
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
You said "was"... so i take it you've seen the wrong?

Certainly If you ignore the Holy Spirit long enough you eventually stop hearing Him..

There is still a path home.

This was a few years back. I know why this happened, but the important thing is that I will never again let such a thing happen. I also got some poor advice from a Christian ... I know it doesn't take away my responsibilty, but we Christians are to help each others to do the right thing.

I have been thinking about this, if I was saved during this time. I know I had the Holy Spirit all along (if anyone wonders how I know, I won't tell you, because then you won't understand). This is kind of the reason for this thread.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Hazelelponi

I'm back
Supporter
Jun 25, 2018
9,210
8,689
55
USA
✟676,936.00
Country
United States
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
This was a few years back. I know why this happened, but the important thing is that I will never again let such a thing happen. I also got some poor advice from a Christian ... I know it doesn't take away my responsibilty, but we Christians are to help each others to do the right thing.

I have been thinking about this, if I was saved during this time. I know I had the Holy Spirit all along (if anyone wonders how I know, I won't tell you, because then you won't understand). This is kind of the reason for this thread.

You were still saved.

Take good care. Start putting HIM first, because you love Him.
 
  • Friendly
Reactions: zoidar
Upvote 0

JIMINZ

Well-Known Member
Apr 13, 2017
6,600
2,358
79
Southern Ga.
✟157,715.00
Country
United States
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
OSAS contradicts John 15:1-10. Can you please explain your interpretation of John 15:1-10?

.
All I can say is, for some reason, you are Interpreting these verses to say, a Christian can walk away from his Salvation, that he can decide to not abide in Christ.

In order for you to have such a belief about these verses, someone must have taught it to you, because anyone reading these verses for the first time would not come to the same conclusion you have.

Here is the Definition for you.

ABIDE: Greek

G3306
μένω
menō
men'-o
A primary verb; to stay (in a given place, state, relation or expectancy): - abide, continue, dwell, endure, be present, remain, stand, tarry (for), X thine own.

Now, where in this definition is there any mention of ceasing to abide?

Your belief of a Christian ceasing to Abide, comes from your Assumption that when Jesus said what He did, He Alluded to not Abiding.

I do not happen to read these verses with that Interpretation, therefore , OSAS does not Contradict anything.
 
Upvote 0

BNR32FAN

He’s a Way of life
Supporter
Aug 11, 2017
22,131
7,245
Dallas
✟874,307.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
The thing is the same faith can in one man produce work and in another not. So as much as the Holy Spirit enables us, we still have to choose obedience. I don't think it's automatic.

A question that arise is, if we are saved by faithfulness can I then put all my trust in the cross, aren't some of that trust going to be on my own effort?

To me it seems that we are saved by trusting on the cross, but we have to be obedient for our faith to be counted as real. If so it's not the obedience that saves us but trusting on the cross of Christ.

I don’t see it that way my friend. Obedience can be considered work but devotion is not. To me devotion has to do with our love and sincerity towards God. If we sincerely love someone we want to please that person. Salvation isn’t about works it’s about the devotion, love, and sicerity towards God. Works are a result of love, sincerity, and devotion.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

JIMINZ

Well-Known Member
Apr 13, 2017
6,600
2,358
79
Southern Ga.
✟157,715.00
Country
United States
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Yes there is a difference between stumbling in sin and being a slave to sin. :oldthumbsup:

.
No there isn't, Jesus did not make such a distinction.

John 8:34
Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

So you see, it is the Committing of sin even in stumbling as you say, which MAKES you a Servant (Slave) of sin.
 
Upvote 0

BNR32FAN

He’s a Way of life
Supporter
Aug 11, 2017
22,131
7,245
Dallas
✟874,307.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
.
All I can say is, for some reason, you are Interpreting these verses to say, a Christian can walk away from his Salvation, that he can decide to not abide in Christ.

In order for you to have such a belief about these verses, someone must have taught it to you, because anyone reading these verses for the first time would not come to the same conclusion you have.

Here is the Definition for you.

ABIDE: Greek

G3306
μένω
menō
men'-o
A primary verb; to stay (in a given place, state, relation or expectancy): - abide, continue, dwell, endure, be present, remain, stand, tarry (for), X thine own.

Now, where in this definition is there any mention of ceasing to abide?

Your belief of a Christian ceasing to Abide, comes from your Assumption that when Jesus said what He did, He Alluded to not Abiding.

I do not happen to read these verses with that Interpretation, therefore , OSAS does not Contradict anything.

Why would Jesus say abide (remain) in me and I will abide (remain) in you. If you do not produce fruit you are not abiding (remaining) in my love and anyone who doesn’t abide (remain) in me is tossed away and burned if a believer is unable to turn away from Him or not abide in Him?
 
Upvote 0

BNR32FAN

He’s a Way of life
Supporter
Aug 11, 2017
22,131
7,245
Dallas
✟874,307.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
.
No there isn't, Jesus did not make such a distinction.

John 8:34
Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

So you see, it is the Committing of sin even in stumbling as you say, which MAKES you a Servant (Slave) of sin.

Who never sins?
 
  • Agree
Reactions: Hazelelponi
Upvote 0

BNR32FAN

He’s a Way of life
Supporter
Aug 11, 2017
22,131
7,245
Dallas
✟874,307.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
.
No there isn't, Jesus did not make such a distinction.

John 8:34
Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

So you see, it is the Committing of sin even in stumbling as you say, which MAKES you a Servant (Slave) of sin.

Here’s a short list of sins. Can you say that you never do any of these things?

http://www.wogim.org/sinlist.htm
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

JIMINZ

Well-Known Member
Apr 13, 2017
6,600
2,358
79
Southern Ga.
✟157,715.00
Country
United States
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
Why would Jesus say abide (remain) in me and I will abide (remain) in you. If you do not produce fruit you are not abiding (remaining) in my love and anyone who doesn’t abide (remain) in me is tossed away and burned if a believer is unable to turn away from Him or not abide in Him?

.
You see right there is your problem, you not understanding what it is your reading, you read something and at the same time interject you own belief on what it is saying rather than understanding what has been said.

Now listen to the words, the very ones you have quoted as a proof of your misunderstanding.

John 15:1,2
1) I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.

Do you see it, YOU are not the one who can walk away.

It is the Husbandman (The Father) who takes them away, for not producing.

Your reading something into theses Verses which they clearly do not say.
 
Upvote 0