Has Your OT View Changed?

kenrapoza · Sep 21, 2006

I am curious to know if any of you have changed your view of OT or if you have always held the view that you currently hold. If you have changed your view what did you previously believe? (This includes the distinctions within Creationism, e.g., from YEC to OEC or PC.) If you have changed, what was the reason? For you, what is the foundational conviction, presupposition, or fact for you holding to your current view? One more thing Id like to know: were you baptized into Christianity as a child or did you enter the faith and join the church later on after a conversion experience or similar decision?

This question is intended as an informational/fellowship thread for Christians of all OT persuasions. As such, I hope that it doesnt turn into a debate thread (i.e., lets not argue with each other about why their reason for changing their view is wrong). We have no lack of debates here in the OT forum (which is perfectly fine).

I look forward to the responses and getting to understand everybody a little better!

Melethiel · Sep 21, 2006

I used to be YEC, because that is what my church taught (Southern Baptist at the time), and I was never taught differently. When I entered college and started taking actual science courses though, I began to see the inconsistencies in what I had be taught and moved over to OEC, and then TE.

I was baptized as an infant and raised in Christianity.

shernren · Sep 21, 2006

Before I came here, I was a YEC. Now I'm a TE. 'Nuff said.

Mallon · Sep 21, 2006

I used to subscribe to YEC because that's what I was taught in Sunday School and church. I wasn't brainwashed, though.
Then I went to university, where I was brainwashed, and became a TE.

Jadis40 · Sep 21, 2006

Well, as far as the first part, I've always accepted that the earth is around 4.6 billion years old.

Where I've changed my views is in regard to the flood. Up through the time I was close to graduating from college (back in 1997) I did believe that the flood was global.

Now, as I review the mountains of geological, historical and archeological evidence (for starters) that indicates it never happened, I believe firmly that the flood was local in scope.

kenrapoza · Sep 21, 2006

Jadis40 said:
Well, as far as the first part, I've always accepted that the earth is around 4.6 billion years old.

Where I've changed my views is in regard to the flood. Up through the time I was close to graduating from college (back in 1997) I did believe that the flood was global.

Now, as I review the mountains of geological, historical and archeological evidence (for starters) that indicates it never happened, I believe firmly that the flood was local in scope.

Similar to Hugh Ross' view?

kenrapoza · Sep 21, 2006

This is interesting, so far everyone who has modified their OT beliefs has done so in the direction of incorporating more scientific influence and a less literal reading of Genesis.

Has anyone here gone in the opposite direction and felt the conviction to take a more literal approach to Genesis from what they may have previously held?

Jadis40 · Sep 21, 2006

kenrapoza said:
Similar to Hugh Ross' view?

I've read his book The Creator and the Cosmos (3rd Expanded Edition - 2001) and found myself agreeing with a lot of what he presents, thinking "Yeah, this guy is definitely on the same wavelength as I am." He basically confirmed what I'd believed all along.

I guess you could say I lean towards old earth progressive creationism with a little bit of evolution thrown in, allowing for genetic drift and such, minus the literal interpretation (day-age, I think) of Genesis 1.

www.answersincreation.org is one site I owe a lot to in showing geologically how a global flood isn't borne out in the stratigraphy of the Grand Canyon.

philadiddle · Sep 21, 2006

I was YEC. And quite of fire about it too. I knew i was right, and that the bible was literal. I loved to debate. But the more i debated the more i saw the evidence of the TE mount, and i saw the evidence for YEC dissolve away. Needless to say, i'm TE now.

gluadys · Sep 22, 2006

I never received any teaching on evolution in my church, but via religious literature from other sources I was introduced to OEC. On taking a course in biology in university I switched to TE though I didn't know there was a name for this position at the time.

Although my denomination baptizes infants, my parents did not arrange baptism in my infancy and so I was baptized and confirmed as an adult.

Mick116 · Sep 22, 2006

I became a Christian in my early teens and was baptised a few years later.

I was first taught YEC and a world-wide flood at the brethren assembly I attended, and I assumed it to be true.

I have always been interested in science, and in 2nd year of a science degree, I changed my beliefs to TE. Just made more sense to me. Since then, I have also adopted belief in a local flood, and in pre-Adamic people (I think Adam & Eve/Garden of Eden was a legend, probably based on real people though. This might also be true of other figures described in Genesis, e.g. Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob etc. - legendary figures based on real people). I don't think Genesis can be read as a science textbook, or even as a reliable account of history.

I think the creation account is symbolic, although I find interesting the fact that, according to the story, creation occurred over a series of "days" (not instantaneously), began with the creation of matter, then ocean creatures, then plants, then land animals, and finally humans; loosely describes a simple process of "evolution". Similarly, it is written that the earth "brought forth" vegetation, and that Adam was created from "dust". This implies that life was created (evolved) from physical matter that already existed, and not created ex nilo (out of nothing). This could be a coincidence, however.

laptoppop · Sep 22, 2006

I pretty much went with the mainstream scientific view until the late 1970s. At that time I read "scientific creationism" and was exposed to YEC for the first time. It seemed to fit the Scriptures and the physical evidence much better than the alternatives. I haven't seen anything yet to persuade me otherwise.

I was baptised as an infant. The church my family was going to was extremely liberal. For example, I remember a "sermon" on how to give CPR. In 7th grade, I was exposed to the gospel for the first time and responded. About 7 years later I was baptized in the ocean, because I came to believe that it was to be done by believers as an act of obedience (but not salvific).

stumpjumper · Sep 22, 2006

I never really doubted evolution. Through High School and College, I would say I was a nominal Christian. After I got married and started having kids, I made an inward turn towards an active faith.

I quickly picked up a couple of books about a historical-critical exegesis and kept my faith and my subscription to the Science channel... I would say I read an ID book in that time and found it made some good points but I really understood it to be saying the same thing as TE books just with a more upfront attack on evolution.

Philosophically, I really don't have a problem with Behe. I just don't think it's science, per se...

chaoschristian · Sep 22, 2006

I cannot recall a time in my life when I ever seriously doubted or questioned the veracity of evolutionary theory, though as I got older and more edumacated I have been able to ask better questions.

Bee orchids still give me a headache though.

Raised a Christian, I was baptised and confirmed into the Methodist church at 12. I then almost immediately rejected god and become an atheist. A rather militant one. And stayed that way for 15 years.

Then about 8 years ago I had a conversion experience and have since then embraced my faith in Christ.

Pats · Sep 24, 2006

I was born to Southern Baptist parents, raised a Christian. I accepted Jesus Christ as savior and was Baptised in a Baptist church at the age of 12.

I was raised YEC and never knew any other Christian Origins theologies until I first came to CF almost two years ago. I was sent to Baptist private schools in elementary school and trained to basiclly ignore any evolutionary theory taught to me in High School.

After I began looking into these things as an adult, I first pursuaded more by a theological standpoint and then with scientific evidence to leave the YEC point of view. I then began to accept more of a TE theological standpoint.

kenrapoza · Sep 24, 2006

Pats said:
After I began looking into these things as an adult, I first pursuaded more by a theological standpoint and then with scientific evidence to leave the YEC point of view. I then began to accept more of a TE theological standpoint.

Out of curiosity, what was the theological standpoint that first began to move you away from YEC?

Calminian · Sep 25, 2006

kenrapoza said:
I am curious to know if any of you have changed your view of OT or if you have always held the view that you currently hold. If you have changed your view what did you previously believe? (This includes the distinctions within Creationism, e.g., from YEC to OEC or PC.) If you have changed, what was the reason? For you, what is the foundational conviction, presupposition, or fact for you holding to your current view? One more thing Id like to know: were you baptized into Christianity as a child or did you enter the faith and join the church later on after a conversion experience or similar decision?

This question is intended as an informational/fellowship thread for Christians of all OT persuasions. As such, I hope that it doesnt turn into a debate thread (i.e., lets not argue with each other about why their reason for changing their view is wrong). We have no lack of debates here in the OT forum (which is perfectly fine).

I look forward to the responses and getting to understand everybody a little better!

I went full circle in this area, but I would expect that there shouldn't be very many converts to YEC, as that is the straight reading of the text. The main converts should be to PC or TE or some other view that differs from the plain reading, unless of course one goes full circle like me. I went from YEC, to Gap, to PC and then back to YEC. I was of course convinced that science falsified the plain reading. One doesn't just read Genesis and put the book down and say, "Wow, partial flood and millions of years!" That has to come from outside. But when I went back and examined these other theories in light of the text I found them wanting.

shernren · Sep 25, 2006

Calminian said:
I went full circle in this area, but I would expect that there shouldn't be very many converts to YEC, as that is the straight reading of the text. The main converts should be to PC or TE or some other view that differs from the plain reading, unless of course one goes full circle like me. I went from YEC, to Gap, to PC and then back to YEC. I was of course convinced that science falsified the plain reading. One doesn't just read Genesis and put the book down and say, "Wow, partial flood and millions of years!" That has to come from outside. But when I went back and examined these other theories in light of the text I found them wanting.

I have a very impolite reply to your first sentence and a general niggling question as to what assumptions you would use to defend your conclusion that there is such a thing as "plain meaning" of the Bible, especially in passages as contentious as Genesis 1-11. But this is not the thread for such things. I'll be waiting in OT when you feel like demolishing my musty four-month-old arguments.

Calminian · Sep 25, 2006

shernren said:
I have a very impolite reply to your first sentence and a general niggling question as to what assumptions you would use to defend your conclusion that there is such a thing as "plain meaning" of the Bible, especially in passages as contentious as Genesis 1-11. But this is not the thread for such things. I'll be waiting in OT when you feel like demolishing my musty four-month-old arguments.

I'm sure I'll have a polite by firm response to your reply.

Pats · Sep 25, 2006

kenrapoza said:
Out of curiosity, what was the theological standpoint that first began to move you away from YEC?

Here's a link to my blog page where I explain my reasons for changing from YEC in depth. If you have any further questions that are not answered there, then let me know.

Has Your OT View Changed?

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