"Gray" morality?

Anguspure

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I don't say it just because my avatar is Jean Gray but have you thought that some concepts are in a gray area? For example, one might think empathy is good but it might not always be?

Any thoughts?
According to the Spirit, and this is why we need the Spirit and to be able to discern what He is saying in a given situation.
Needless to say, however, the practice of Love from Faith is always the right thing to do.
But I can't think of a situation where empathy would not be beneficial. Being able to see a situation through the eyes of another will always enable us to understand them better and so make our Love more effective.
 
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Not David

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According to the Spirit, and this is why we need the Spirit and to be able to discern what He is saying in a given situation.
Needless to say, however, the practice of Love from Faith is always the right thing to do.
But I can't think of a situation where empathy would not be beneficial. Being able to see a situation through the eyes of another will always enable us to understand them better and so make our Love more effective.
Neglecting your family in order to help others?
 
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Anguspure

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Neglecting your family in order to help others?
Understanding that "neglect" will be viewed by different people in different ways, I don't see that as a Loving thing to do, and besides in Biblical terms this is not a grey area. Paul inspired by the Spirit made the position very clear: Give the people these instructions, so that no one may be open to blame. Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever. 1 Timothy 5
 
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zippy2006

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I don't say it just because my avatar is Jean Gray but have you thought that some concepts are in a gray area? For example, one might think empathy is good but it might not always be?

Any thoughts?

Socrates: Now is there any thing that isn't either good, or bad, or, what is between these, neither good nor bad?
Polus: There can't be, Socrates.
Socrates: Do you say that wisdom, health, wealth and the like are good, and their opposites bad?
Polus: Yes, I do.
Socrates: And by things which are neither good nor bad you mean things which sometimes partake of what's good, sometimes of what's bad, and sometimes of neither, such as sitting or walking, running or making sea voyages, or stones and sticks and the like? Aren't these the ones you mean? Or are there any others that you call things neither good nor bad?
Polus: No, these are the ones.
 
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Not David

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Understanding that "neglect" will be viewed by different people in different ways, I don't see that as a Loving thing to do, and besides in Biblical terms this is not a grey area. Paul inspired by the Spirit made the position very clear: Give the people these instructions, so that no one may be open to blame. Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever. 1 Timothy 5
Unfortunately that happens. My grandma was a Pastor who neglected her family
 
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Not David

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Socrates: Now is there any thing that isn't either good, or bad, or, what is between these, neither good nor bad?
Polus: There can't be, Socrates.
Socrates: Do you say that wisdom, health, wealth and the like are good, and their opposites bad?
Polus: Yes, I do.
Socrates: And by things which are neither good nor bad you mean things which sometimes partake of what's good, sometimes of what's bad, and sometimes of neither, such as sitting or walking, running or making sea voyages, or stones and sticks and the like? Aren't these the ones you mean? Or are there any others that you call things neither good nor bad?
Polus: No, these are the ones.
Yes, Wisdom can be good if used to exhibit the faith but bad if done to despise "unmodern Church Fathers".
 
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Anguspure

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Unfortunately that happens. My grandma was a Pastor who neglected her family
It is all to easy to do. The call towards the "greater" works of God looks more attractive than the "lesser" work that He gives us, that of nurturing our family. I also had to learn this lesson. Not because I neglected them, but because I was frustrated that because I was (and am) providing for them I was unable to do thing thing that I saw as more important.
 
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thecolorsblend

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I don't say it just because my avatar is Jean Gray but have you thought that some concepts are in a gray area? For example, one might think empathy is good but it might not always be?

Any thoughts?
Christians have adhered to a wide variety of moral codes over the last two-thousand years.

There are quite a few common elements of modern "Christian morality" that I find negotiable at best and completely wrongheaded at worst.

In the Christian world today, I see a lot of Christians empathizing with groups which deserve little empathy. So yes, specifically, empathy is not always a good thing. I remind myself that not everybody is cut out to be a leader in Christian thought. And I lament that so many people involved in promulgating Christian thought are unaware of their supreme lack of qualification.

Nobody said it was easy.
 
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Not David

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Christians have adhered to a wide variety of moral codes over the last two-thousand years.

There are quite a few common elements of modern "Christian morality" that I find negotiable at best and completely wrongheaded at worst.

In the Christian world today, I see a lot of Christians empathizing with groups which deserve little empathy. So yes, specifically, empathy is not always a good thing. I remind myself that not everybody is cut out to be a leader in Christian thought. And I lament that so many people involved in promulgating Christian thought are unaware of their supreme lack of qualification.

Nobody said it was easy.
I feel you. Some ideas I found as "Christian" but then I had to change them. Not a lot of fun doing that though.
 
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Jonaitis

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I don't say it just because my avatar is Jean Gray but have you thought that some concepts are in a gray area? For example, one might think empathy is good but it might not always be?

Any thoughts?
Neglecting your family in order to help others?

How about lying about hiding Jews under your floorboard? Is it better to lie to save a life, or to be truthful? I believe even under such circumstances morality is still "black and white."

"Rescue those who are being taken away to death; hold back those who are stumbling to the slaughter" (Proverbs 24:11).

Jesus broke the Sabbath to heal, because acts of mercy are greater and weightier.

I suppose if it had to be what is perceived to be an act of mercy by breaking another act of mercy, is it still good? If such circumstances forces you to commit the lesser crime for the greater good, if that was possible, then the greater good vindicates you from the lesser wrong.

If we mean "gray" as in this, then I agree. If we mean "gray" as in there is no wrong or right answer, I disagree.
 
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thecolorsblend

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I feel you. Some ideas I found as "Christian" but then I had to change them. Not a lot of fun doing that though.
Indeed.

In the end, I found myself devising a moral code which I can respect but which is also compatible with the teachings of the Catholic Church. Frankly, I had expected the task to be more difficult than it actually is. It's an ongoing process.

The breakthrough moment was recognizing that a certain political party's platform may be okay in its place but it is not something upon which somebody should base his moral worldview.
 
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bèlla

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Greetings,

Support has become a mechanism for group think.

Now it means agreement and validation no matter what. People expect you to go along and when you don’t you’re against them, under the devil’s sway, or an enemy.

This flies in the face of Paul’s words:

For am I now seeking the approval of man, or of God? Or am I trying to please man? If I were still trying to please man, I would not be a servant of Christ. —Galatians 1:10

~Bella
 
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Not David

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How about lying about hiding Jews under your floorboard? Is it better to lie to save a life, or to be truthful? I believe even under such circumstances morality is still "black and white."

"Rescue those who are being taken away to death; hold back those who are stumbling to the slaughter" (Proverbs 24:11).

Jesus broke the Sabbath to heal, because acts of mercy are greater and weightier.

I suppose if it had to be what is perceived to be an act of mercy by breaking another act of mercy, is it still good? If such circumstances forces you to commit the lesser crime for the greater good, if that was possible, then the greater good vindicates you from the lesser wrong.

If we mean "gray" as in this, then I agree. If we mean "gray" as in there is no wrong or right answer, I disagree.
Or like the priests giving holy bread to King David.
 
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Not David

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Greetings,

Support has become a mechanism for group think.

Now it means agreement and validation no matter what. People expect you to go along and when you don’t you’re against them, under the devil’s sway, or an enemy.

This flies in the face of Paul’s words:

For am I now seeking the approval of man, or of God? Or am I trying to please man? If I were still trying to please man, I would not be a servant of Christ. —Galatians 1:10

~Bella
Agree, I tried to keep friends even when my beliefs changed. It didn't work
 
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bèlla

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Agree, I tried to keep friends even when my beliefs changed. It didn't work

It can be difficult to maintain connections when expectations of compromise are present. I’ve experienced it with Christians and non believers. Holding firm to your convictions is a must.

Orthodoxy has been a blessing for you. I’m sure you’ve gained far more than you relinquished. :)

~Bella
 
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2PhiloVoid

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I don't say it just because my avatar is Jean Gray but have you thought that some concepts are in a gray area? For example, one might think empathy is good but it might not always be?

Any thoughts?

...sometimes, there can be such a thing as "too much of a good thing." For instance, empathy is usually a good thing to offer another person, but offering too much empathy to him or being permissive with that other person's 'bad choices' could become a form of unhealthy enabling, one that allows the other person to continue along on a disastrous course of actions.
 
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stevevw

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I don't say it just because my avatar is Jean Gray but have you thought that some concepts are in a gray area? For example, one might think empathy is good but it might not always be?

Any thoughts?
For me we are lucky as we have a clear example of what God wants us to do in his son Jesus. He came to us to show us the way, truth and life. When we look at his life he practiced what he preached. Jesus said there are two commandments that cover all the laws. The first is
“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. ... And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself (Matthew 22:37-40). Jesus also said to love your enemies
43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? You therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect. (Matthew 5:43-48).

At first this seems unreal and is harder to do in reality. But when I look out what what is happening in the world with the hate, revenge and rage I think maybe there is some wisdom to this that Christ was trying to get across. Despite Jesus being unfairly crucified he forgave those who persecuted him. He often held back from attacking others for what they said and did. Though it is important to stand up for the rights of people and the wrongs done against them there is a way to do it. I think to be able to hold back and have the wisdom and understanding of the wrongs others do takes great empathy for which Jesus displayed plenty of.
 
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I don't say it just because my avatar is Jean Gray but have you thought that some concepts are in a gray area? For example, one might think empathy is good but it might not always be?

Any thoughts?
I try to filter my actions through what Jesus said:

“Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?” And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment. And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”

Two greatest commands: Love God. Love Others. Jesus said that the entire law and the Prophets depended on those two commands. The entire law. Everything the prophets said. Everything rests upon those two commands: Love God. Love Others. Look at the 10 commandments, at their heart they can be broken down into either a failure to love God or a failure to love others.

All sin is essentially, at its core, either a failure to love God or a failure to love others.

Loving God is the first and greatest command.
Loving others is the second greatest command.

If you filter your actions through that framework, you'll know what sin is and you'll know what right and wrong is.
 
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Not David

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It can be difficult to maintain connections when expectations of compromise are present. I’ve experienced it with Christians and non believers. Holding firm to your convictions is a must.

Orthodoxy has been a blessing for you. I’m sure you’ve gained far more than you relinquished. :)

~Bella
Yes, it was worthy.
 
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