GOD'S WORD vs TRADITIONS OF MEN; Sabbath vs Sunday

[Marco70]

Then you get deflection, rather than addressing the question posed.

 

[Marco70]

The question posed in post 813:

Now I'm sure you will not criticise Jesus for failing to say the law hangs on obeying the TC, but rather the law hangs on loving God with all your heart, soul and mind, and love your neighbour as yourself. And there are many dirivites of this. are you now asking me to give an inexhaustible list of dirivites of love God and love your neighbour? Do you wish to do the same where the TC are concerned?

I will give you one example, of love your neighbour, hows that?
Paul wrote:
Carry each others burdens(love them) and so fulfil the law of Christ Gal6:2

Is it in your heart and mind to love your neighbour as yourself, to carry their burdens in love for them?
If it is, would you agree with what is in my heart and mind, that to reel off the partial letter of scripture, and to demand of others by doing so, what you do not demand of yourself/you fail to practice in your own life, is to go against the heart of the law that must be in the believers heart and mind. And therefore, you must, if you have truly been born again be conscious you do wrong by doing so? For you would not be carrying your brothers burdens in love, but crushing him with burdens you yourself do not even try to carry. And, Jesus called that hypocrisy.
Hope you will answer the question. Thanks in advance

 

[The7thColporteur]

Then you get deflection, rather than addressing the question posed.

Not from me Marco70, you would have to show where I or any others have done that explicitly. Otherwise it is just empty charges Marco70.

Therefore, again:

Marco70, did the Ten Commandments exist before being written upon stone tables at Mt. Sinai, according to scripture [KJB]?

Why should anyone obey this command? - Ephesians 6:2 KJB - Honour thy father and mother; (which is the first commandment with promise

as a PS question, where is the "promise" in that commandment found to be written?​

 

[Marco70]

And so the evasion goes on and on.

 

[The7thColporteur]

I gave you 3 beautiful opportunities to shed forth the wisdom of years in direct response to such important questions.

 

[Marco70]

So why do people have to evade answering questions put to them?

A most important question to, for it goes to the very heart of Christ's law/his teaching

 

[The7thColporteur]

The questions will remain on file to be asked again in future.

 

[Marco70]

People who fill their posts with the partial letter and insist you must fully obey it, are always reluctant to answer many questions put to them, especially when it goes to the very heart of Christ's teaching, the law that matters most.
For there is no love for others, in reeling off the letter and insisting you fully obey it to remain in a saved state. Just hypocrisy, preaching what you do not practice in your own life. No love in that

 

[The7thColporteur]

As a Seventh-day Adventist, I honour my Father in Heaven by keeping His commandment, the 7th Day the Sabbath of the LORD thy God.

Others, through their 'tradition' have set aside the 4th commandment, thus nullifying it. They acknowledge they have no commandment for what they do, and they acknowledge that they disregard the 4th commandment in its explicit words as written in Exodus 20:8-11 KJB.

 

[Marco70]

Its interesting, that some choose to follow the letter of the fourth commandment, but ignore the ninth commandment, or justify breaking it. They also demand of others what they do not demand of themselves. Do they really believe God will accept that as obedience?

 

[The7thColporteur]

Jesus said that if we love him, we are to keep his commandments in John 14:15 KJB, which he cited from Exodus 20:6 KJB. As Jesus has said, that He and His Father are of one accord. The Holy Spirit, who wrote the Ten Commandments upon stone, in the New Covenant writes those same laws, which are spiritual, upon the fleshy tables of the heart. Through the shed blood and sacrifice of Christ Jesus, and the Holy Ghost which He sent as promised, we gained strength to walk in God's Law, in perfect love.

 

[Marco70]

Many people quote John 14:15

However, when you then ask them if they try and obey each and every literal command of Christ in the Gospels, they refuse to answer your question. The best that can be said is, silence is better than bearing false witness

 

[The7thColporteur]

We can know what laws are written upon the heart, as we can go to God's word and read the very laws that were to be written, in Jeremiah 31:31-34 KJB, for all things must be verified by God's word, as it is written in Isaiah 8:20 KJB, etc. These "my laws" of God, as Jeremiah mentions throughout his book, are also all through the scripture [KJB] as God's Ten Commandments, spoken from Heaven, before they were ever written upon stone tables at Mt. Sinai.

In them, we can see written:

Exodus 20:12 KJB - Honour thy father and thy mother: that thy days may be long upon the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee.
​

Which is where the "promise" was explicitly written.

 

[Marco70]

The comment below was part of what was written in response to me saying:

But you agree with me, you cannot obey the TC:

Quote

Couldn't disagree with you more. Such theology espoused, seconds the first great apostates' in Heaven [Revelation 12:7-9; Isaiah 14:12-23; Ezekiel 28:12-19 KJB]. Scripture [KJB] itself disagrees with you, as usual:


Presently, those who believe that they can never keep God's Ten Commandments [even with Christ Jesus and the indwelling of the Holy Ghost], are like unto those in the days of Moses, Joshua and Caleb, who resisted the faithful. Instead of believing the word, as it is given/written, they instead made excuses, pointing to others, the giants of sin, and their own feeble weaknesses, their old age [unlike Caleb later], instead of to God's almighty strength and promises. T
All who teach that they cannot, even with Christ Jesus [who being the power of God, who overcame all temptation] keep God's Ten Commandments, surely will not ever, and they will never even try, but they will make excuses as to why they could not, or do not have to.

Unquote

Concerning the TC, Paul wrote to Christians: The letter kills(present tense)
He did not state:

Because Christ dwells in you through the Holy Spirit you can obey the letter of the TC, he simply stated to believers: The letter kills.

Therefore, the posts of some are just reeling off the letter, and making pat statements from their heads that have no bearing on the reality of their own lives. Weak and misguided to put it at best. Hypocrisy at worst

 

[The7thColporteur]

Yet, even though we have these Ten Commandments [Exodus 20:1-17 KJB], why should anyone obey any of them?

 

[Marco70]

Why can some only reel off the partial letter without understanding the message the letter contains?

But now, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit and not the old way of the written code/law Rom 7:6

Those who relentlessly preach law/you must look to the law and obey it, follow after the written code, not the Holy Spirit, for it can only be one or the other. And only the Holy Spirit can lead you into truth

Is it possible to endlessly quote the letter of scripture without understanding the true message the letter contains? Oh yes, the Pharisees of Jesus day were a perfect example of this. They themselves endlessly quoted the letter and insisted the people must fully obey it. However, they did not understand the message contained in the letter

 

[The7thColporteur]

As we look through the Ten Commandments themselves, we can see that there is a particular name given who is authoring them, JEHOVAH ["the LORD" KJB], in verse 5. Even so, why should we obey the Ten Commandments [Exodus 20:1-17 KJB] from JEHOVAH? Afterall, did not Pharaoh, a great and mighty king of an great empire say, "Who is the LORD, that I should obey his voice ...?" [Exodus 5:2 KJB]

For if these Ten Commandments were from merely some person of mankind, we might as well all go by how we feel about them individually. So why obey them at all? Can anyone pick and choose among them like a salad bar, a buffet table? to cast them all aside at whim without any serious repercussions?

Who is JEHOVAH Elohiym? Where do we find out? How shall we know? Perhaps the Law [these Ten Commandments] of JEHOVAH will tell us.

 

[klutedavid]

Both... depends on the situation and individual.

Do you regard these words of God as a commandment?

Matthew 5:31-32
It was said, ‘Whoever sends his wife away, let him give her a certificate of divorce’; but I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except for the reason of unchastity, makes her commit adultery; and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

 

[Marco70]

Some say:


We can know what laws are written upon the heart, as we can go to God's word and read the very laws that were to be written,


The problem with the above is twofold. Firstly, people who follow this advice then come up with varying lists of which laws have been written on the mind and placed in the heart. So how is that reliable? And, for example, the sda believe avoiding the Levitical unclean foods is written in the heart. The problem there is, as the leaders of the NT church did not ask Gentile converts to abstain from such food, when they met to decide which laws they be asked to follow, this of course would have to mean the leaders of the first century church gave gentile converts a licence to sin. Ridiculous notion isn’t it

Secondly, God himself writes the law in the mind and places it on the heart of believers. Did he fail to make it watertight?

Only, sda relentlessly quote:

The law is in your heart and mind

Sin is the transgression of the law

And, therefore, through the law we become conscious of sin


However, where the law written in the mind and placed in the heart is concerned, they seem to stray from what they relentlessly state. Apparantly this law, though it is in your mind, will not bring knowledge in your mind as to what it is. And the law placed in your heart, will not necessarily result in you being conscious you sin by wilfully transgressing it.


Hmmmmm

 

[The7thColporteur]

Can we know by the First Commandment?

Exodus 20:3 KJB - Thou shalt have no other gods before me.​

This JEHOVAH seems to be claming to be God. Well, that would be greater than an earthly king or monarch like Pharaoh. Perhaps Pharaoh should have obeyed JEHOVAH and he would have lived. It would be important to listen to and obey God.

Ok? But which one? For Pharoah had many gods, and claimed to be one himself, and there were gods of river, gods of crops, gods of sun, gods of beasts, gods of death, etc. For as scripture says:

1 Corinthians 8:5 KJB - For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)​

And even JEHOVAH, by the very first Commandment, seems to indicate that there are others called "gods". Since so, why is JEHOVAH requiring that no other "gods" are to be before him? How shall we find out? Perhaps we need to look further in the Ten Commandments themselves.