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GOD'S WORD vs TRADITIONS OF MEN; Sabbath vs Sunday

Discussion in 'Sabbath and The Law' started by LoveGodsWord, Nov 4, 2017.

  1. The7thColporteur

    The7thColporteur Well-Known Member

    +265
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    Is it sin for a Christian to transgress the specific words in 4th Commandment [Exodus 20:8-11 KJB] in regards the 7th Day the Sabbath of the LORD thy God? Yes/no please.
     
  2. EastCoastRemnant

    EastCoastRemnant I Must Decrease That He May Increase Supporter

    +1,469
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    Instead of no productive slurs, why not try and reason with me and tell me why what I posted is wrong?

    Also,you are skirting the question again. Was there no transgression before Sinai?
     
  3. Marco70

    Marco70 Well-Known Member

    +260
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    To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law.
    Rom5:13
     
  4. The7thColporteur

    The7thColporteur Well-Known Member

    +265
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    Which means there was God's Law in existence, the Ten Commandments:

    The TEN COMMANDMENTS known from the Beginning:

    FIRST TABLE:

    [01]
    For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. [Genesis 3:5] And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed [is] the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat [of] it all the days of thy life; [Genesis 3:17] And I bowed down my head, and worshipped the LORD, and blessed the LORD God of my master Abraham, which had led me in the right way to take my master's brother's daughter unto his son. [Genesis 24:48] Then Jacob said unto his household, and to all that [were] with him, Put away the strange gods that [are] among you, and be clean, and change your garments: [Genesis 35:2] And let us arise, and go up to Bethel; and I will make there an altar unto God, who answered me in the day of my distress, and was with me in the way which I went. [Genesis 35:3] And they gave unto Jacob all the strange gods which [were] in their hand, and [all their] earrings which [were] in their ears; and Jacob hid them under the oak which [was] by Shechem. [Genesis 35:4]

    [02] Then Jacob said unto his household, and to all that [were] with him, Put away the strange gods that [are] among you, and be clean, and change your garments: [Genesis 35:2] And they gave unto Jacob all the strange gods which [were] in their hand, and [all their] earrings which [were] in their ears; and Jacob hid them under the oak which [was] by Shechem. [Genesis 35:4]

    [03] For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. [Genesis 3:6] And he said, Blessed [be] the LORD God of Shem; and Canaan shall be his servant. [Genesis 9:26] And he said, Blessed [be] the LORD God of my master Abraham, who hath not left destitute my master of his mercy and his truth: I [being] in the way, the LORD led me to the house of my master's brethren. [Genesis 24:27] And it was so, when the days of [their] feasting were gone about, that Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings [according] to the number of them all: for Job said, It may be that my sons have sinned, and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually. [Job 1:5] Then said his wife unto him, Dost thou still retain thine integrity? curse God, and die. [Job 2:9] But he said unto her, Thou speakest as one of the foolish women speaketh. What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil? In all this did not Job sin with his lips. [Job 2:10] And Pharaoh said, Who [is] the LORD, that I should obey his voice to let Israel go? I know not the LORD, neither will I let Israel go. [Exodus 5:2]

    [04] And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. [Genesis 2:2] And God blessed the seventh day [now mentioned 3 times], and sanctified it [Qadash, meaning: to consecrate or set aside for holy use or purpose, the "Sabbath was made for man"; see Mark 2:27]: because that in it he had rested from all his work [GOD is the Example; see Hebrews 4:10] which God created and made. [Genesis 2:3] Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws. [Genesis 26:5] And the king of Egypt said unto them, Wherefore do ye, Moses and Aaron, let the people from their works? get you unto your burdens. [Exodus 5:4] And Pharaoh said, Behold, the people of the land now [are] many, and ye make them rest [Shabath, same word used in Genesis 2:2-3, meaning: to cease, or keep Sabbath] from their burdens. [Exodus 5:5] And said, If thou wilt diligently hearken to the voice of the LORD thy God, and wilt do that which is right in his sight, and wilt give ear to his commandments, and keep all his statutes, I will put none of these diseases upon thee, which I have brought upon the Egyptians: for I [am] the LORD that healeth thee. [Exodus 15:26] Then said the LORD unto Moses, Behold, I will rain bread from heaven for you; and the people shall go out and gather a certain rate every day, that I may prove them, whether they will walk in my law, or no. [Exodus 16:4] [GOD already has a LAW, and it is not called the “Hebrews Law”, but GOD calls it “MY LAW”] And he said unto them, This [is that] which the LORD hath said, To morrow [is] the rest of the holy sabbath unto the LORD: bake [that] which ye will bake [to day], and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning. [Exodus 16:23] And Moses said, Eat that to day; for to day [is] a sabbath unto the LORD: to day ye shall not find it in the field. [Exodus 16:25] Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day, [which is] the sabbath [this does not say that the 7th day now becomes the Sabbath, but it says that the 7th day is the Sabbath already, as it always had been], in it there shall be none. [Exodus 16:26] And it came to pass, [that] there went out [some] of the people on the seventh day for to gather, and they found none. [Exodus 16:27] And the LORD said unto Moses, How long refuse ye to keep my commandments and my laws? [Exodus 16:28] See, for that the LORD hath given you the sabbath, therefore he giveth you on the sixth day the bread of two days; abide ye every man in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day. [Exodus 16:29] So the people rested on the seventh day. [Exodus 16:30] [Exodus 16 takes place 2 weeks before Mt. Sinai] And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: [Mark 2:27] And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly; [2 Peter 2:5] [All of God's commandments are righteousness, see Psalms 119:172; see also that Noah preached against those who continually bought and sold, planted and builded upon God's holy day; Matthew 24:37-39; Luke 17:26-30]

    FIRST TABLE
     
  5. The7thColporteur

    The7thColporteur Well-Known Member

    +265
    United States
    Protestant
    Single
    Which means there was God's Law in existence, the Ten Commandments:

    The TEN COMMANDMENTS known from the Beginning:

    SECOND TABLE:

    [05] And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: [Genesis 2:16] But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. [Genesis 2:17] And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without. [Genesis 9:22] And Shem and Japheth took a garment, and laid [it] upon both their shoulders, and went backward, and covered the nakedness of their father; and their faces [were] backward, and they saw not their father's nakedness. [Genesis 9:23] And Noah awoke from his wine, and knew what his younger son had done unto him. [Genesis 9:24] Now therefore, my son, obey my voice according to that which I command thee. [Genesis 27:8] And his mother said unto him, Upon me [be] thy curse, my son: only obey my voice, and go fetch me [them]. [Genesis 27:13] Now therefore, my son, obey my voice; and arise, flee thou to Laban my brother to Haran; [Genesis 27:43] Gather yourselves together, and hear, ye sons of Jacob; and hearken unto Israel your father. [Genesis 49:2]

    [06] But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. [Genesis 2:17] Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? [Genesis 3:1] And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: [Genesis 3:4] And when the woman saw that the tree [was] good for food, and that it [was] pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make [one] wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. [Genesis 3:6] In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou [art], and unto dust shalt thou return. [Genesis 3:19] But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell. [Genesis 4:5] And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen? [Genesis 4:6] If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee [shall be] his desire, and thou shalt rule over him. [Genesis 4:7] And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him. [Genesis 4:8] And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground. [Genesis 4:10] O my soul, come not thou into their secret; unto their assembly, mine honour, be not thou united: for in their anger they slew a man, and in their selfwill they digged down a wall. [Genesis 49:6]

    [07] Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh. [Genesis 2:24] The princes also of Pharaoh saw her, and commended her before Pharaoh: and the woman was taken into Pharaoh's house. [Genesis 12:15] And the LORD plagued Pharaoh and his house with great plagues because of Sarai Abram's wife. [Genesis 12:17] And Pharaoh called Abram, and said, What [is] this [that] thou hast done unto me? why didst thou not tell me that she [was] thy wife? [Genesis 12:18] Why saidst thou, She [is] my sister? so I might have taken her to me to wife: now therefore behold thy wife, take [her], and go thy way. [Genesis 12:19] And the LORD said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous; [Genesis 18:20] But God came to Abimelech in a dream by night, and said to him, Behold, thou [art but] a dead man, for the woman which thou hast taken; for she [is] a man's wife. [Genesis 20:3] But Abimelech had not come near her: and he said, Lord, wilt thou slay also a righteous nation? [Genesis 20:4] Said he not unto me, She [is] my sister? and she, even she herself said, He [is] my brother: in the integrity of my heart and innocency of my hands have I done this. [Genesis 20:5] And God said unto him in a dream, Yea, I know that thou didst this in the integrity of thy heart; for I also withheld thee from sinning against me: therefore suffered I thee not to touch her. [Genesis 20:6] Now therefore restore the man [his] wife; for he [is] a prophet, and he shall pray for thee, and thou shalt live: and if thou restore [her] not, know thou that thou shalt surely die, thou, and all that [are] thine. [Genesis 20:7] Then Abimelech called Abraham, and said unto him, What hast thou done unto us? and what have I offended thee, that thou hast brought on me and on my kingdom a great sin? thou hast done deeds unto me that ought not to be done. [Genesis 20:9] For the LORD had fast closed up all the wombs of the house of Abimelech, because of Sarah Abraham's wife. [Genesis 20:18] [There is] none greater in this house than I; neither hath he kept back any thing from me but thee, because thou [art] his wife: how then can I do this great wickedness, and sin against God? [Genesis 39:9] And it came to pass, as she spake to Joseph day by day, that he hearkened not unto her, to lie by her, [or] to be with her. [Genesis 39:10] Unstable as water, thou shalt not excel; because thou wentest up to thy father's bed; then defiledst thou [it]: he went up to my couch. [Genesis 49:4]

    [08] And when the woman saw that the tree [was] good for food, and that it [was] pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make [one] wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. [Genesis 3:6] And Laban went to shear his sheep: and Rachel had stolen the images that [were] her father's. [Genesis 31:19] And now, [though] thou wouldest needs be gone, because thou sore longedst after thy father's house, [yet] wherefore hast thou stolen my gods? [Genesis 31:30] With whomsoever thou findest thy gods, let him not live: before our brethren discern thou what [is] thine with me, and take [it] to thee. For Jacob knew not that Rachel had stolen them. [Genesis 31:32] Now Rachel had taken the images, and put them in the camel's furniture, and sat upon them. And Laban searched all the tent, but found [them] not. [Genesis 31:34] And Jacob was wroth, and chode with Laban: and Jacob answered and said to Laban, What [is] my trespass? what [is] my sin, that thou hast so hotly pursued after me? [Genesis 31:36] Whereas thou hast searched all my stuff, what hast thou found of all thy household stuff? set [it] here before my brethren and thy brethren, that they may judge betwixt us both. [Genesis 31:37] [And] when they were gone out of the city, [and] not [yet] far off, Joseph said unto his steward, Up, follow after the men; and when thou dost overtake them, say unto them, Wherefore have ye rewarded evil for good? [Genesis 44:4] [Is] not this [it] in which my lord drinketh, and whereby indeed he divineth? ye have done evil in so doing. [Genesis 44:5] And they said unto him, Wherefore saith my lord these words? God forbid that thy servants should do according to this thing: [Genesis 44:7] Behold, the money, which we found in our sacks' mouths, we brought again unto thee out of the land of Canaan: how then should we steal out of thy lord's house silver or gold? [Genesis 44:8] With whomsoever of thy servants it be found, both let him die, and we also will be my lord's bondmen. [Genesis 44:9]

    [09] Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? [Genesis 3:1] And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: [Genesis 3:4] And the LORD said unto Cain, Where [is] Abel thy brother? And he said, I know not: [Am] I my brother's keeper? [Genesis 4:9] My father peradventure will feel me, and I shall seem to him as a deceiver; and I shall bring a curse upon me, and not a blessing. [Genesis 27:12] And Jacob said unto his father, I [am] Esau thy firstborn; I have done according as thou badest me: arise, I pray thee, sit and eat of my venison, that thy soul may bless me. [Genesis 27:19] And he said, [Art] thou my very son Esau? And he said, I [am]. [Genesis 27:24] And Esau hated Jacob because of the blessing wherewith his father blessed him: and Esau said in his heart, The days of mourning for my father are at hand; then will I slay my brother Jacob. [Genesis 27:31]

    [10] And when the woman saw that the tree [was] good for food, and that it [was] pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make [one] wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. [Genesis 3:6] And Abraham said, Because I thought, Surely the fear of God [is] not in this place; and they will slay me for my wife's sake. [Genesis 20:11] And his brethren envied him; but his father observed the saying. [Genesis 37:11] Moreover thou shalt provide out of all the people able men, such as fear God, men of truth, hating covetousness; and place [such] over them, [to be] rulers of thousands, [and] rulers of hundreds, rulers of fifties, and rulers of tens: [Exodus 18:21] Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season; [Hebrews 11:25]

    SECOND TABLE
     
  6. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

    +3,226
    Australia
    SDA
    Married
    Goodness you nearly make the same types of studies as I do. Here is mine from a different perspective, same outcome.

    GOD'S LAW (TORAH) IN GENESIS AND THE SABBATH PART 1

    Gen 26:5
    Because Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

    Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries w/TVM, Strong LAWS - H8451; תּורה תּרה; tôrâh tôrâh; to-raw', to-raw'
    From H3384; a precept or statute, especially the Decalogue or Pentateuch: - law.

    Abraham kept God's TORAH which includes God's LAW (10 Commandments) and the sacrificial laws for remission of SIN and SIN offerings.

    Genesis 22
    6,
    And Abraham took the wood of the burnt offering, and laid it on Isaac his son; and he took the fire in his hand, and a knife; and they went both of them together.
    7, And Isaac spoke to Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering?
    8, And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

    13, And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns: and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son.

    Burnt offereings were made for remission of SIN. What is SIN? Sin is disobedience to God's WORD and includes breaking God's Commandments (Romans 7:7; James 2:9-11; 1 John 3:4). It is God's WORD and his LAW that give us a KNOWLEDGE of SIN (Romans 3:20)

    Romans 3
    19,
    Now we know that what things soever the law said, it said to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.
    20, Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

    NOW if GOD tells us that Abraham kept his TORAH (LAWS) then is God's 4th Commandment not part of the TORAH?

    Indeed it is. Where does it say in God's WORD that Abraham or any of God's people before MOSES did NOT Keep God's Sabbath?

    God says Abraham kept TORAH (10 Commandments and sin offereings). You say Abraham DID NOT keep TORAH (This includes God's 4th Commandment). Who do we believe God or man?

    Now if you BELIEVE Abraham did NOT keep God's SABBATH (part of TORAH) then please show the scriptures proving that Abraham did not keep the Sabbath which is part of the TORAH?

    God's WORD shows God's LAW (10 Commandments) and the CEREMONIAL laws and ORDINANCES for SIN offerings (TORAH) were kept BEFORE Mt Sinai.

    Let's look at God's WORD....

    Genesis 26
    5,
    Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

    Genesis 5
    24, And Enoch walked with God:
    and he was not; for God took him.

    Genesis 6
    8,
    But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD. 9, These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.


    CONCLUSION: God's people before Mt Sinai followed him and kept his laws (TORAH). God's Sabbath is a part of God's law (TORAH). There is NO scripture that says God's people including Abraham did NOT keep God's Sabbath. Genesis shows that God's people including Abraham kept his law (TORAH) which includes the Sabbath.

    ..................

    God destroys mankind because of sin......

    Genesis 6
    5,
    And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that EVERY IMAGINATION OF THE THOUGHTS OF HIOS HEAT was only EVIL CONTINUALLY.
    6, And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
    7, And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.
    8, But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD.


    What are these CONTINUAL EVIL THOUGHTS?

    Matthew 15
    19,
    For out of the heart proceed EVIL THOUGHTS, MURDERS, ADULTERIES, FORNICATION, THEFTS, FALSE WITNESS, BLASPHEMIES
    20, These are the things which defile a man:

    Evil is breaking God's Commandments in thought and actions.

    Genesis 6
    8,
    But Noah found grace in the eyes of the LORD. 9, These are the generations of Noah: Noah was a just man and perfect in his generations, and Noah walked with God.

    Genesis 8:20 And Noah built an altar to the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar.

    CONCLUSION: SIN existed BEFORE Mt Sinai, SIN is disobeying God's WORD and breaking his law (Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; James 2:9-11). The WORLD was destroyed because of SIN (breaking God's LAW). Noah walked with God and was perfect in God's eyes not destroyed because he and his family did NOT practice sin. Noah followed God's LAW and offered SIN offerings for forgiveness of SIN (TORAH)

    ..................

    Cain was punished by God for Murder (6th Commandment Exo 20:13)

    Genesis 4
    8,
    And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him.
    9, And the LORD said unto Cain, Where is Abel thy brother? And he said, I know not: Am I my brother's keeper?
    10, And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground.
    11, And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand;
    12, When thou tillest the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth.
    13, And Cain said unto the LORD, My punishment is greater than I can bear.

    links to....

    1 John 3
    12,
    Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.
    13, Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you.
    14, We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.
    15, Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

    CONCLUSION: SIN existed BEFORE Mt Sinai, SIN is disobeying God's WORD and breaking his law (Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; James 2:9-11). CAIN was punished for the SIN of MURDER when he slew his brother Abel.

    ..................

    In Genesis we also read about Joseph in Egypt as a servant being tempted to commit adultery with Potifer’s wife

    Genesis 39
    7, And it came to pass after these things, that his master's wife cast her eyes upon Joseph; and she said, Lie with me.
    8, But he refused, and said unto his master's wife, Behold, my master wotteth not what is with me in the house, and he hath committed all that he hath to my hand;
    9, There is none greater in this house than I; neither hath he kept back anything from me but thee, because thou art his wife: how then can I do this great wickedness, and sin against God?

    If Joseph did NOT know God’s LAW then how did he know he was SINNING against God by committing adultery with Potifer’s wife?


    CONCLUSION: SIN existed BEFORE Mt Sinai, SIN is disobeying God's WORD and breaking his law (Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; James 2:9-11). Joseph knew that to commit ADULTERY (7th Commandment; Exodus 20:14) was SIN against God and refused not to SIN.

    ..................

    The Mosaic laws for remission of sin (SACRIFICIAL SIN OFFERINGS) were practiced BEFORE Sinai....

    Genesis 4
    4,
    And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering.

    Genesis 8
    20,
    And Noah builded an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar

    SIN is the transgression of God's LAW (10 Commandments) please read Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4 and James 2:11. God's LAW gives us a KNOWLEDGE of SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS (Romans 3:20) SIN offereings were only practiced in the OLD Covenant for the remission or forgiveness of SIN (Breaking God's 10 Commandments) If God's people did not have God's LAW why are they offering SIN offereings to God if these laws were only known about in Mt Sinai?

    Abraham and his son practiced and knew about sin offerings...

    Genesis 22
    7,
    And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering?
    8, And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

    Exodus 10
    25,
    And Moses said, Thou must give us also sacrifices and burnt offerings, that we may sacrifice unto the LORD our God.

    CONCLUSION: SIN existed BEFORE Mt Sinai, SIN is disobeying God's WORD and breaking his law (Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; James 2:9-11). From Abel through to Abraham before MOSES we see God's people obeying God's LAW and providing sin offerings to God for breaking his law. If there was no law (TORAH) there would be no sin and no need for sin offerings.

    ..................
     
  7. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

    +3,226
    Australia
    SDA
    Married
    GOD'S SABBATH IN GENESIS AND THE SABBATH PART 2

    The Sabbath was also kept by our first parents and also others BEFORE Sinai. The reason God gave the 10 Commandments again was being His people had been slaves in Egypt for 430 years (Exodus 12:40). God delivered his people from Egypt (the World) and needed to re-teach them his ways which were mostly forgotten by this time.

    So yep God's LAW and the laws for remission of sin and burnt offerings of the OLD Covenant were indeed practiced BEFORE Sinai.
    The Sabbath was made at the 7th Day of the creation week and given to Adam and Eve.

    Let's look at the scriptures........

    Genesis 2
    1,
    Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
    2, And ON THE SEVENTH DAY God ended his work which he had made; and he RESTED ON THE SEVENTH DAY from all his work which he had made.
    3, And GOD BLESSED THE SEVENTH DAY, and made it HOLY <the 7th day>: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

    RESTED H7673שָׁבַת shabath
    (shaw-ɓath') v.to repose, i.e. to cease from exertion.
    {used in many implied relations (causative, figurative or specific)}[a primitive root]KJV: (cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, keep Sabbath, suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away. Some points to note from the scriptures...............

    v1 God completed creation in 6 days and RESTED on the 7TH DAY
    v2 God RESTED on the 7TH DAY
    v3 God SET APART the 7TH DAY and made THE 7TH DAY a HOLY DAY
    v2 The 7TH DAY is part of the FINISHED WORK of the CREATION WEEKLet's now look at God's 4th commandment............

    Exodus 20
    8,
    Remember the SABBATH DAY, to KEEP IT HOLY. <Why?> Because God made it Holy for mankind and commands us to keep it as a Holy day)
    9, Six days shalt thou labor, and do all thy work:
    10, But the SEVENTH DAY IS THE SABBATH of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: <WHY>
    11, For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested theSEVENTH DAY: wherefore the LORD BLESSED THE SABBATH, and HALLOWED IT.

    SABBATH H7676 שַׁבָּת shabbath
    (shab-bawth') n-e. 1. intermission, a period of temporary rest.2. (specifically) the Sabbath, the seventh day being the day of rest.[intensive from H7673]KJV: (+ every) Sabbath. Root(s): H7673Now who did God make the 7th day a Holy day for? Is he making that day a Holy day for himself? Of course NOT God is already Holy. He has made the day for MANKIND as a HOLY DAY.

    Let’s see what Jesus says…………

    Mark 2
    27,
    And he said unto them, THE SABBATH WAS MADE FOR MAN, and not man for the Sabbath.
    The Sabbath was made for WHO? The Sabbath was made for MAN. So here we have the God of creation telling us why the 7th Day was made a Holy day. It was made for MANKIND

    STRONGS Greek MAN
    G444 ἄνθρωποςanthropos (an'-thrō-pos) n.
    1. (literally) man†-visage (i.e. a man-faced being, a man who has visibly come of age).
    2. (concretely, in Hebrew) a clay being (a classification of beings made in the image of God, who made them male and female). 3. (generically, in English) a human being. 4. (indefinitely) a certain man (i.e. someone).
    [from G435 and ops “the countenance” (from G3700)] KJV: certain, man Root(s): G435, G3700

    So the Sabbath was made for Human beings; clay beings (we are made out of the dust); male and female

    So God made the 7th day of the week a HOLY day and blessed it for MAN this now ties in very nicely with the 4th commandment (Exodus 20:8-11) God says that it is a specific day which is the 7TH DAY OF THE WEEK that he has made to be a HOLY DAY.

    Jesus says it was made Holy in the creation week for mankind. All scriptures connect and are in harmony. Genesis where God made the Day a HOLY DAY;

    God’s 4th commandment to His people that says to REMEMBER the Sabbath day to KEEP it a HOLY DAY and Jesus stating that the Sabbath was made for MANKIND (Human beings; male and female).

    Now if God made the Sabbath for mankind then obviously Adam and Eve had the Sabbath. The GREEK Word for MAN G444 ἄνθρωποςanthropos (an'-thrō-pos) n. is a clay being (a classification of beings made in the image of God, who made them male and female).

    There is only two people made out of clay (dust) and that is Adam and Eve
    .

    Yep God's Sabbath was given to mankind in the Garden of Eden and made in the Creation WEEK. Only God's Word is true and we should BELIEVE it. Those that do not BELIEVE God's Word are UNBELIVERS and UNBELIEVERS have no part in God's Kingdom.

    God's WORD says that it is by God's LAW that we have a KNOWLEDGE of SIN and that ALL God's Commandments are RIGHTEOUSNESS. Adam and Eve ate from this tree.

    Then God says; v22, And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever:<When? After they broke God's Commandment and ate of the fruit of the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL>

    KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL

    PSALMS 119
    [172], My tongue shall speak of your word: for ALL YOUR COMMANDMENTS ARE RIGHTEOUSNESS. (GOOD)

    ROMANS 3 [19], Now we know that whatsoever things the law says, it says to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. [20], Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: FOR BY THE LAW IS THE KNOWLEDGE OF SIN. (EVIL)

    ................

    CONCLUSION
    : The tree of the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL fits the description of God's LAW. GOD'S LAW GIVE THE KNOWLEDGE OF SIN (Romans 3:20) and OBEDIENCE to GOD'S LAW is RIGHTEOUSNESS. Therefore God's LAW is the KNOWLEDGE of GOOD and EVIL (SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS)

    ................
     
  8. The7thColporteur

    The7thColporteur Well-Known Member

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    Holy Spirit leads us into the truth of God's word together. A pure unity, though not all is uniformity.
     
  9. The7thColporteur

    The7thColporteur Well-Known Member

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    As a PS, did you notice that the adversaries of God's Law, His Ten Commandments, especially the 4th aren't unified on their various positions? They all say something different from each other, and the only unity is in the antagonism against the 7th Day the Sabbath of the LORD [and possibly Ellen G White, as if what she wrote about sin came from her...].

    Examples:

    BobS writes "... Paul writes that indeed Jesus did put an end to the Law. ..." - [Link].

    1stcenturylady writes, "... All who follow Jesus do not sin 1 John 3:9, so what laws would they be breaking? None! ..." - [Link]

    Marco70 writes, "... People who relentlessly state: You must obey the TC, have little understanding of the core truth on which the Christian faith stands. The law God desires you to follow is within you, it is part of your dna, it s part of who you are. Telling people they must observe law that is in their mind and heart is pointless. And that law, is the law you sin by transgressing. ... If one wants to know which law is written on their mind and placed on their heart, the simple response is: Anything that makes you conscious you sin by doing it. ..." - [Link & Link]

    drjean writes, "... I see no reason one couldn't keep Sabbath AND Sunday sacred for God though ..." - [Link]

    listed writes, "... Not sinning isn't keeping the law ... Some of us here understand we've been excused from the law. ..." - [Link]​
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2018
  10. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    GOD'S LAW IN GENESIS ROMANS 5:13 PART 3

    ROMANS 5:13 is used by some to teach that sin was around when God's LAW was not present yet we have been able to show that God's LAW (TORAH) which is a KNOWLEDGE of what sin is (10 Commandments) and the MOSAIC laws for remission of sin (SIN offerings) have been around since Adam and Eve. Let's now look at ROMANS 5:13..

    ...................

    ROMANS 5:12-14 [12], [12], Why, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed on all men, for that all have sinned: [13], For UNTIL the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. [14], Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

    Romans 5:12-14 is clearly teaching that sin and death was present, from Adam to Moses apart from the Law (Torah) and confirming that the Law was not present until Moses.

    The GREEK word UNTIL ἄχρι, ἄχρις; achri achris; akh'-ree, akh'-rece Akin to G206 (through the idea of a terminus); (of time) until or (of place) up to : - as far as, for, in (-to), till, (even, un-) to, until, while. Compare G3360.

    So the meaning of the scripture is...

    1. for while the law sin was in the world
    2. for till the law sin was in the world
    3. for untill the law sin was in the world

    ...................

    Young's Literal Translation of the Greek ROMANS 5:13
    for till law sin was in the world: and sin is not reckoned when there is not law; but sin is not imputed were there is no law.

    ...................

    This agrees with ACTS 17 [30], And the times of this ignorance God overlooked; but now commands all men everywhere to repent. The scripture is saying that if someone does not know something is sin and has no KNOWLEDGE of God's LAW he is not held accountable until he has been given a KNOWLEDGE of the truth.

    The Book of Romans was written for gentile believers who had no knowledge of God's Laws or requirements.

    The Children of Israel in Egypt however had lost sight of God's LAW through 400 years of slavery to the Egyptians. Hence the LAW given by God (10 Commandments) and Moses (book of the law) again. Scripture support below.

    ...................

    Some questions to think about...

    If the interpretation of Romans 5:12-14 is that God's people before MOSES did not have God's TORAH then you will need to explain the following scriptures and questions that disagree with your interpretation of God's WORD...

    Why was the world destroyed by a flood in the days of Noah as well as the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah if God's LAW was not known? (you will need to reconcile Romans 5:13)

    As well as you need to answer the question above and your need to reconcile Romans 5:13; the following scriptures also show that God's people before Moses have God's TORAH (commandments and laws for sin offerings).

    Gen 26:5
    Because Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

    Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries w/TVM, Strong LAWS - H8451; תּורה תּרה; TORAH tôrâh; to-raw', to-raw' From H3384; a precept or statute, especially the Decalogue or Pentateuch: - law.

    The scripture says Abraham kept God's TORAH which includes God's LAW (10 Commandments) and the sacrificial laws for remission of SIN and SIN offerings.

    Genesis 22
    6,
    And Abraham took the wood of the burnt offering, and laid it on Isaac his son; and he took the fire in his hand, and a knife; and they went both of them together.
    7, And Isaac spoke to Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering?
    8, And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

    13, And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns:and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son.

    Burnt offereings were made for remission of SIN. What is SIN? Sin is disobedience to God's WORD and includes breaking God's Commandments (Romans 7:7; James 2:9-11; 1 John 3:4). It is God's WORD and his LAW that give us a KNOWLEDGE of SIN (Romans 3:20)

    Genesis 39
    7,
    And it came to pass after these things, that his master's wife cast her eyes upon Joseph; and she said, Lie with me.
    8, But he refused, and said unto his master's wife, Behold, my master wotteth not what is with me in the house, and he hath committed all that he hath to my hand;
    9, There is none greater in this house than I; neither hath he kept back anything from me but thee, because thou art his wife: how then can I do this great wickedness, and sin against God?

    If Joseph did NOT know God’s LAW then how did he know he was SINNING against God by committing adultery with Potiphar’s wife?

    The TORAH laws for remission of sin (SACRIFICIAL SIN OFFERINGS) were practiced BEFORE MOSES....

    Genesis 4
    4,
    And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering.

    Genesis 8
    20,
    And Noah builded an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar

    SIN is the transgression of God's LAW (10 Commandments) please read Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4 and James 2:11. God's LAW gives us a KNOWLEDGE of SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS (Romans 3:20) SIN offerings were only practiced in the OLD Covenant for the remission or forgiveness of SIN (Breaking God's 10 Commandments) If God's people did not have God's LAW why are they offering SIN offerings to God if these laws were only known about in Mt Sinai?

    Abraham and his son practiced and knew about sin offerings...

    Genesis 22
    7,
    And Isaac spoke unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering?
    8,
    And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together.

    Exodus 10
    25,
    And Moses said, Thou must give us also sacrifices and burnt offerings, that we may sacrifice unto the LORD our God.

    Seems God's WORD disagrees with you GNP.

    Bottom line.

    ................

    SIN is the breaking of God's Commandments (James 2:9-11; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4)

    Those who CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will NOT enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN.

    ................

    God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12).

    If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

    Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has led many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if
    we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

    There is not one scripture in all of God's Word that says that God's 4th Commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to KEEP Sunday as a Holy day.

    Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God?

    In times of ignorance God winks at but now ,<when a KNOWLEDGE of the truth has come> calls all men everywhere to REPENT (FOLLOW) (Acts 17:30-31).
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2018
  11. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely, :oldthumbsup: I might grab yours and add it to mine. It may be useful for a bigger study on the topic or maybe a new thread.
     
  12. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    This is why all of us can only find safety in God's WORD. The only test to know if someone is following God or not is from the scriptures...

    1 JOHN 2:4 [3], And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
    [4], He that said, I know him, and keeps not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

    What is that person promoting? Are they teaching a dontrine that promotes breaking ANY of God's 10 Commandments? If they are the above scripture applies. Do any of us have KNOWN UNPREPENTANT SIN in our lives? The above scripture applies.

    The above scripture is a safegaurd to help us to know if we are following God or not.

    It links very nicely with

    1 JOHN 3:3-10 [3], And every man that has this hope in him purifies himself, even as he is pure. [4], Whoever commits sin transgresses also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law. [5], And you know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
    [6], Whoever stays in him sins not: whoever sins has not seen him, neither known him. [7], Little children, let no man deceive you: he that does righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.[8], He that commits sin is of the devil; for the devil sins from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
    [9], Whoever is born of God does not commit sin; for his seed remains in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. [10], In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whoever does not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loves not his brother.

    This is the difference between those who follow God and those who do not.

    The GOOD NEWS however is that what a blessing these scriptures are for all mankind? If I find myself on the wrong side by believing God's WORD.

    Then God has indeed blessed me to help me find my way back to him. If I ignore God's WORD sent to help me then his WORD that I have rejected will bear witness against me in the judgement.

    JOHN 12:47-48 [47], And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world. [48], He that rejects me, and receives not my words, has one that judges him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

    It all comes down to SIN...

    ................

    SIN is the breaking of God's Commandments (James 2:9-11; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4)

    Those who CONTINUE in UNREPENTANT SIN will NOT enter into the KINGDOM of HEAVEN.

    ................

    God's 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:8-11) If we knowingly break it when God asks us not to we stand guilty before God of committing sin (James 2:8-12). If we do not seek him in repentance and forgiveness we are in danger of the Judgement (Hebrews 10:26-27)

    Sunday worship is a tradition and teaching of man that has led many to break the commandments of God. Jesus says that if we follow the traditions of man that break the commandments of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

    There is not one scripture in all of God's Word that says that God's 4th Commandment is now ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to KEEP Sunday as a Holy day.

    Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of men or the Word of God? Who should we believe the Words of men or the Word of God?

    In times of ignorance God winks at but now ,<when a KNOWLEDGE of the truth has come> calls all men everywhere to REPENT (FOLLOW) (Acts 17:30-31).
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2018
  13. Bob S

    Bob S Well-Known Member Supporter

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    You keep tell us that the 10 commandments were not the word of the Sinai covenant. Did not God speak the words of the covenant to Moses as seen starting in EX 20 shortly after He told Moses the Israelites would be a Holy people if they kept the covenant He was about to give them? If those were not the words of the covenant please show us what the words were. You seem to be the only one that I know of that believes what you are trying to portray.
     
  14. LoveGodsWord

    LoveGodsWord Well-Known Member

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    Hello Bob, I do not think T7C is saying that at all. I think all he is saying from reading his posts, and I agree with the scriptures presented that God's LAW; both God's ETERNAL LAW (10 Commandments) and the laws for remission of sin (sin offereings) of the OLD COVENANT were well known to God's people since Genesis.

    Read the scriptures presented from God's WORD in the linked posts # 524; post # 525; post # 526; post # 527 and post # 530 for proof.

    There are too many scriptures. Worth a read so check them out. God's ETERNAL LAW and the SHADOW laws existed since the beginning.
     
  15. Bob S

    Bob S Well-Known Member Supporter

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    You both could have fooled me.

    7 wrote:
    "The disagreement is in what that "covenant" at Mt. Sinai consisted of. It was not the Ten Commandments"......
     
  16. The7thColporteur

    The7thColporteur Well-Known Member

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    There are two covenants mentioned at Mt. Sinai, not just one.

    The words of "the covenant", are the words of God's "My covenant", which already existed from eternity [Exodus 19:5 KJB], which is the "Everlasting [aka: New] Covenant".

    The words that the people entered into with God, is the 'old covenant':

    Exodus 19:8 KJB - And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.​

    They did not so "do". They sinned at the Golden Calf, thus immediately breaking their word, just as a sinner would do, having no strength of themselves to overcome. They needed to realize the promises of Abraham [and before, Genesis 3:15] and have the "My covenant" of God through the Promise that God "will" put enmity [hatred for sin through the Seed, Christ Jesus] in them, and give them strength. They made an agreement [a 'covenant'] with God and relied upon their own efforts to keep God's "My covenant". They did not keep their side of the agreement, as no sinner could. We, as they, all need the promise of the Seed fulfilled, to be able to obey God. God's "My covenant" is from everlasting, called in scripture several things, the "Everlasting Covenant", the "Counsel of Peace", the "covenant ... of life and peace", "new covenant" etc. It was made between the Father and Son, witnessed by the Holy Ghost/Spirit in eternity should sin arise, that the plan of redemption would be carried out by the Godhead. The Father would give His Son. The Son would live a perfect life and give His life. The Holy GHost would make effectual that which was worked out by the Son, etc. They would "do". We need to "believe" their promise, and walk in it as reality.

    Keep in mind that their agreement was entered into 3 days before God spoke aloud the Ten Commandments.

    Notice two things, God's "My covnenant" [Everlasting covenant, Ten Commanments all of which are eternal unfailing promsies], and their agreement [old covenant, their faulty failing promises to keep] about how they would keep.

    Exodus 19:1 KJB - In the third month, when the children of Israel were gone forth out of the land of Egypt, the same day came they into the wilderness of Sinai.

    Exodus 19:2 KJB - For they were departed from Rephidim, and were come to the desert of Sinai, and had pitched in the wilderness; and there Israel camped before the mount.

    Exodus 19:3 KJB - And Moses went up unto God, and the LORD called unto him out of the mountain, saying, Thus shalt thou say to the house of Jacob, and tell the children of Israel;

    Exodus19:4 KJB - Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself.

    Exodus 19:5 KJB - Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth is mine:

    Exodus 19:6 KJB - And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

    Exodus 19:7 KJB - And Moses came and called for the elders of the people, and laid before their faces all these words which the LORD commanded him.

    Exodus 19:8 KJB - And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.

    'old covenant' entered into between the peoples and God, with Moses as the Mediator. The patriarchs, or the fathers Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, etc never had entered into such an arrangement with God before, as a national covenant, but each of them did have the original promise of God [Genesis 3:15] and God's "My Covenant", the Ten Commandments.
    Exodus 19:9 KJB - And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever. And Moses told the words of the people unto the LORD.

    Exodus 19:10 KJB - And the LORD said unto Moses, Go unto the people, and sanctify them to day and to morrow, and let them wash their clothes,

    Exodus 19:11 KJB - And be ready against the third day: for the third day the LORD will come down in the sight of all the people upon mount Sinai.

    When God spoke the words of His "My covenant" [the Ten Commandments], Moses was not at that Mediating. God spoke directly to all the people and no more was added. Afterwards, when those were spoken, then other words were added through the Mediator Moses.
    Notice that God's "My covenant" is always the Ten Commandments dealing with His promises in regards the Salvation He offers, see Exodus 20:1-2 KJB, dealing with the requirement for obedience which is "love", Exodus 20:6, and God Himself is Love, which is the requirement, the Seed. Citing the KJB:

    Exodus 25:21 - “... in the ark thou shalt put the testimony that I shall give thee ...”
    Exodus 25:22 - “... ark of the testimony … I will give thee in commandment ...”
    Exodus 31:18 - “... two tables of testimony ...”
    Exodus 32:15 - “... two tables of the testimony ...”
    Exodus 34:28 - “... the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.”
    Exodus 34:29 - “... the two tables of testimony ...”
    Exodus 40:20 - “... he took and put the testimony into the ark ...”
    Leviticus 16:13 - “... the mercy seat that is upon the testimony ...”
    Deuteronomy 4:13 - “And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.”
    Deuteronomy 5:22 - “These words the LORD spake unto all your assembly in the mount out of the midst of the fire, of the cloud, and of the thick darkness, with a great voice: and he added no more. And he wrote them in two tables of stone, and delivered them unto me.”
    Deuteronomy 7:9 - “Know therefore that the LORD thy God, he is God, the faithful God, which keepeth covenant and mercy with them that love him and keep his commandments to a thousand generations;”
    Deuteronomy 9:9 - “... the tables of stone, even the tables of the covenant ...”
    Deuteronomy 9:11 - “... the two tables of stone, even the tables of the covenant.”
    Deuteronomy 10:2 - “And I will write on the tables the words that were in the first tables which thou brakest, and thou shalt put them in the ark.”
    Deuteronomy 10:4 - “And he wrote on the tables, according to the first writing, the ten commandments, which the LORD spake unto you in the mount out of the midst of the fire in the day of the assembly: and the LORD gave them unto me.”
    Deuteronomy 10:5 - “... the tables in the ark ...”
    Joshua 4:9 - “... the ark of the covenant ...”
    Joshua 4:16 - “... the ark of the testimony ...”
    Joshua 4:18 - “... the ark of the covenant ...”
    1 Kings 8:9 -There was nothing in the ark save the two tables of stone, which Moses put there at Horeb, when the LORD made a covenant with the children of Israel, when they came out of the land of Egypt.”
    1 Kings 8:21 - “And I have set there a place for the ark, wherein is the covenant of the LORD, which he made with our fathers, when he brought them out of the land of Egypt.”
    1 Chronicles 16:15 - “Be ye mindful always of his covenant; the word which he commanded to a thousand generations;”
    1 Chronicles 16:17 - “And hath confirmed the same to Jacob for a law, and to Israel for an everlasting covenant,”
    2 Chronicles 5:10 -There was nothing in the ark save the two tables which Moses put therein at Horeb, when the LORD made a covenant with the children of Israel, when they came out of Egypt.”
    2 Chronicles 6:11 - “And in it have I put the ark, wherein is the covenant of the LORD, that he made with the children of Israel.”
    Psalms 19:7 - “The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.”
    Psalms 78:5 - “For he established a testimony in Jacob, and appointed a law in Israel, which he commanded our fathers, that they should make them known to their children:”
    Psalms 78:10 - “They kept not the covenant of God, and refused to walk in his law;”
    Psalms 89:34 - “My covenant will I not break, nor alter the thing that is gone out of my lips.”
    Psalms 105:8 - “He hath remembered his covenant for ever, the word which he commanded to a thousand generations.”
    Psalms 105:10 - “And confirmed the same unto Jacob for a law, and to Israel for an everlasting covenant:”
    Psalms 119:85 - “The proud have digged pits for me, which are not after thy law.”
    Psalms 119:86 - “All thy commandments are faithful: they persecute me wrongfully; help thou me.”
    Psalms 119:87 - “They had almost consumed me upon earth; but I forsook not thy precepts.”
    Psalms 119:88 - “Quicken me after thy lovingkindness; so shall I keep the testimony of thy mouth.”
    Psalms 119:89 - “LAMED. For ever, O LORD, thy word is settled in heaven.”
    Hebrews 9:1 - “... the ark of the covenant … wherein … the tables of the covenant ...”
    Revelation 11:19 - “... in heaven … the ark of his testament ...”
    Revelation 15:5 - “... of the testimony in heaven ...”
    Notice gain the contrasting covenants:

    Galatians 4:24 KJB - Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.

    Galatians 4:25 KJB - For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.

    Galatians 4:26 KJB - But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.​

    The agreement entered into by the peoples, was made from "earth" below, "All that the LORD hath said we will do." Notice:

    Hebrews 9:1 KJB - Then verily the first covenant had also ordinances of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary.​

    The Ten Commandments on stone were merely copies of that which already existed in Heaven. The Law is spiritual, was was always meant to be in the heart, the place of spirit.

    Hebrews 10:16 KJB - This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;​

    Yet God's Ten Commandments are from the Heavenly Sanctuary above, as Moses, Paul, John etc show.

    Deuteronomy 5:22 KJB - These words the LORD spake unto all your assembly in the mount out of the midst of the fire, of the cloud, and of the thick darkness, with a great voice: and he added no more. And he wrote them in two tables of stone, and delivered them unto me.

    Exodus 20:22 KJB - And the LORD said unto Moses, Thus thou shalt say unto the children of Israel, Ye have seen that I have talked with you from heaven.​

    God's Eternal "My covenant", Ten Commandments was spoken from Heaven above, from New Jerusalem.

    Psalms 89:34 KJB - My covenant will I not break, nor alter the thing that is gone out of my lips.
    Notice, Abraham had this same Ten Commandments, because it exists in Heaven:

    Genesis 17:7 KJB - And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.

    Revelation 15:5 KJB - And after that I looked, and, behold, the temple of the tabernacle of the testimony in heaven was opened:
    The Ark is typical/type of God's own heart, and our heart [Psalms 40:8 KJB]. Our bodies are a Temple. The inmost place, the Most Holy Place within, is the Heart. God's Law would be written upon the Heart, as it is on His own, since it is His character. Mankind was originally made in the "image" of God. Adam sinned and marred that "image". Through the Seed, we could be restored.

    There are two kinds of mediation, two glories, as 2 Corinthians 3 states, but only one eternal Law. External Law was good for keeping people somewhat in check from fear and for condemning sin so that there would be no excuse, but internal Law is far exceeding better since it is now obeyed from love, and through God's promises actually eradicates sin/ning.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2018
  17. JLB777

    JLB777 Newbie Supporter

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    Bob,

    Why are you still repeating the same ole arguments?

    I agree and teach the Ten Commandments are eternal and the Church Is to keep them.

    My question to you is where are the scriptures in the New Testament that instruct us how to observe the Sabbath under the New Covenant.


    JLB
     
  18. JLB777

    JLB777 Newbie Supporter

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    Again Acts 18:4.


    And he reasoned in the synagogue every Sabbath, and persuaded both Jews and Greeks. Acts 18:4

    Yes Paul a Pharisee of Pharisee’s went to the synagogue where he knew unsaved Jews were gathering to read the Old Testament to reason with them from the scriptures.

    This scripture certainly doesn’t say the Church gathered in a synagogue to worship Jesus on the Sabbath.


    Where in all the Bible does it command the Church to gather on the Sabbath to worship Jesus or it’s a sin?


    JLB
     
  19. JLB777

    JLB777 Newbie Supporter

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    So it’s your belief that the Church is to gather outside a synagogue on the Sabbath to worship Jesus and hear preaching?

    That’s the hidden message?


    JLB
     
  20. JLB777

    JLB777 Newbie Supporter

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    There’s no scripture in your link that shows that the Church was commanded to gather on the Sabbath to worship Jesus.

    [Staff edit].
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 6, 2018
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